Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaCeltics. Show DaCeltics's posts

    Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    He's probably not going to be here next year.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from BiasLewis. Show BiasLewis's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    BBD starting trying to get aggressive last night but still his lack of rebounding is killing us.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Indiansbacker. Show Indiansbacker's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    In Response to Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?:
    He's probably not going to be here next year.
    Posted by DaCeltics


    You are not getting Andy V.  He is the face of the Cavaliers franchinse now and beloved in Cleveland.  They will not trade him, period!   
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from concord27. Show concord27's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    He's a free agent.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaCeltics. Show DaCeltics's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?:
    He's a free agent.
    Posted by concord27


    Let's revisit this topic!S & T for Nick Young or a rebounding specialist.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Red-16Russ-11. Show Red-16Russ-11's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?:
    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young? : Let's revisit this topic!S & T for Nick Young or a rebounding specialist.
    Posted by DaCeltics


    I like either young, Thaddeus or Nick - the former may be more available!
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaCeltics. Show DaCeltics's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?:
    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young? : I like either young, Thaddeus or Nick - the former may be more available!
    Posted by Red-16Russ-11


    I prefer Nick, but Thaddeus is a BAAAAD BOY!

    I think Nick at around 8 mil a year doesn't prevent the pursuit of a max player next year, but that's pure speculation.

    I would even say if we had to trade Jeff for Nick, that it would still be a win for us.

    Why? Because Jeff is solid with a little star potenetial while Nick is solid with a LOT of star potential.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    I already mentioned multiple sign and trade options involving guys like Baby and Varajao.

    I also dissected how terribly selfish Young is and how pointless his acquisition would be to DaCeltics a month ago. Yet he still sweats this mediocre player when the Celts are desperate for size and (if we keep DWest) BEYOND fine at SG-SF. I would rather have 28 minutes of Ray Allen, 12 minutes of DWest and 8 mins of Pierce at SG than 24 of Allen and 24 of Young.

    The best sign and trade would be for Chris Kaman and his 1 year contract. Danny clearly values the 2012 cap space, and despite my many awesome trade scenarios that could land us Varejao and Baron Davis for virtually nothing but cash and low draft picks, posters here like Fierce are quick to remind me that Danny's game plan to this point (no TA last summer) has been all about the cap space.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    I would love some scenario like this:

    JON, 1st rd pick Cavs owe Celts in 2013 and Ryan Gomes to Cleveland.

    Chris Kaman to Boston

    Big Baby (S&T at say 4 years 20-24 million), Boobie Gibson, Celtics 2012 1st rd pick (even the one the Clips own if that is a major sticking point is worth it to me) and Anderson Varajao to the Clippers.

    Clippers won't want to pay Kaman 10-12 million a year when they have to pay  Jordan that. Both guys deserve to start and play 30+ mins. They should want a defensive minded veteran backup like Varajao at 6-8 million, who they can justify only giving 18-24 mins per game.

    Baby backs up Griffin. Joins a young team w/ lots of upside. Blake will play more mins at SF next year. Boobie gives them a shooter w/ an exp contract.

    Cavs, intent on getting top 5 lotto picks next 2-3 years, save some money b/c Gomes is cheaper than Varajao, become a worse team, and get a good 2nd rd pick back. They buyout JON and he comes back here.

    Celts get Kaman, who would likely have won us titles in '10 and '11 had he been here. missing peice for 1 last big title push. His contract is exp and he becomes the backup plan to Howard not coming here in 2012.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ortiz123. Show Ortiz123's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    JO, 1st pick, and BB for Kaman??? Must have Jo back...That would give us some heigth and length..i like..
     
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    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    Justin Guarini would be perfect for the Celtics

    He's a rich man's Glen Davis who understands his role and his limitations a little better, and is 4 inches taller
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?:
    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young? : JO is worth 6.2m, that means BB must be signed for 6m in order for the trade to work. Are the Clips willing to give BB 6m per year just to backup Blake Griffin?
    Posted by Fiercest34


    how about Big baby sign and trade to Cavs (no more Hickson), JON to Cavs (buyout), boobie and Varajao to  Clips. Kaman to Celtics. Draft picks by us tossed around to whoever... I like it for all 3 teams....
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?:
    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young? : JO is worth 6.2m, that means BB must be signed for 6m in order for the trade to work. Are the Clips willing to give BB 6m per year just to backup Blake Griffin?
    Posted by Fiercest34


    and no... Kaman makes 12.2, We have to come up with 75% of that (under old CBA) to make trade work. So that is 9.2 million. Baby can be signed for the same 3.3 million he made this year and it work cap wise (old CBA of course).

    If u want to be a stickler and have it be cash even... yea it is 6. I see no prob giving baby 4 years 20 million in slightly decending salary. 6-5-5-4 to make it equal.

    I am thinking the Cavs (who lost Hickson) would be more likely to pay baby that then the Clips (who can give Gomes 12-16 mins a game at 4 million). Baby going there for 5-6 mil and wanting 24-32 minutes w/ Griffin is a tight squeeze. Not in the cards for Baby nto be big time in LA... but def in Cleve.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from NickFaldo. Show NickFaldo's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    Big Baby is a 20 minute backup power forward who can cause the opponents fits on offense.

    The people who rag on Baby, including me, should have understood that the guy was injured. His spaghetti and pancake diet didn't help.

    He's your Leon Powe energy guy off the bench. You really need another backup power forward to complement him, someone taller and faster.

    Both Danny and Doc had a subpar last year. Some of that was due to bad luck with injuries, but a lot of their moves were questionable.

    If Big Baby doesn't have structural damage, the C's should resign him. He won't be commanding big bucks. You could probably get him to sign a two year deal.

    The problem is he might no longer want to be Doc's b****. The biggest fallacy of them all is that Doc is a player's coach, and that he attracts free agents. He might attract a superstar or two. However, word is probably getting around that unless you are a proven vet, playing for Doc Rivers could be a dead end.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?:
    Big Baby is a 20 minute backup power forward who can cause the opponents fits on offense. The people who rag on Baby, including me, should have understood that the guy was injured. His spaghetti and pancake diet didn't help. He's your Leon Powe energy guy off the bench. You really need another backup power forward to complement him, someone taller and faster. Both Danny and Doc had a subpar last year. Some of that was due to bad luck with injuries, but a lot of their moves were questionable. If Big Baby doesn't have structural damage, the C's should resign him. He won't be commanding big bucks. You could probably get him to sign a two year deal. The problem is he might no longer want to be Doc's b****. The biggest fallacy of them all is that Doc is a player's coach, and that he attracts free agents. He might attract a superstar or two. However, word is probably getting around that unless you are a proven vet, playing for Doc Rivers could be a dead end.
    Posted by NickFaldo


    great assessment of davis.  he may never be more than a 20-25 minute guy.  but he can do things that few others can do.  including sliding over to the 5 and throwing weight around against bigger guys who nobody else on the team can keep off their sweet spot.

    woudln't it have been nice if doc rivers didn't go to the press with big baby nuggets the 4th through 6th times?  honestly he could have stopped after the first time if he wasn't going to include anyone else on the team who was also screwing up.

    i don't think davis will be back and i think a lot of people will miss him when he's gone.  yes, he's a limited player, and yes, a unique player who was a very positive force for us on offense and defense, until the patellar tendon injury this last year.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    and whoever came up with "nick young" as some sort of solution to our problems.  man oh man!!  talk about an all time anti-celtic.  nick averages .4 assists a game.  he's a gunner.  he plays no D.  he's not a team guy.  can anyone see that fitting in on this celtic team with 2 of the 3 or all 3 of the big 3 left hanging around?  i can't.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaCeltics. Show DaCeltics's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?:
    Big Baby is a 20 minute backup power forward who can cause the opponents fits on offense. The people who rag on Baby, including me, should have understood that the guy was injured. His spaghetti and pancake diet didn't help. He's your Leon Powe energy guy off the bench. You really need another backup power forward to complement him, someone taller and faster. Both Danny and Doc had a subpar last year. Some of that was due to bad luck with injuries, but a lot of their moves were questionable. If Big Baby doesn't have structural damage, the C's should resign him. He won't be commanding big bucks. You could probably get him to sign a two year deal. The problem is he might no longer want to be Doc's b****. The biggest fallacy of them all is that Doc is a player's coach, and that he attracts free agents. He might attract a superstar or two. However, word is probably getting around that unless you are a proven vet, playing for Doc Rivers could be a dead end.
    Posted by NickFaldo


    I'd like to replace Baby with a vet rebounder that plays 7 feet tall not 6-1 like Baby does at times.

    Juwan Howard (pick n pop PF/C with solid defense and rebounding)

    Tony Battie (pick n pop PF/C with solid defense and rebounding)

    Troy Murphy ( may still be a pick n pop PF/C with solid defense and rebounding)

    Hopefully we can use Baby in a S&T combo to get Jamal Crawford, Deandre Jordan and/or Nick Young. 

    My Dream: Jamal Crawford for MLE
    Nick Young for Big Baby + ( pick or another player)
    I think DeAndre will be kept in LA  otherwise I'd say goodbye to Nick)

    Second team could be Bradley,Crawford,Young,Green and Battie. That's the starting five for Philly right?

    Crawford and Young take turns beating players off the dribble to create or score.

    Green,Young and Crawford are good 3 point shooters and good rebounders for their positions.

    Green beats PF's off the dribble all day( He can't do it to players as quick as he is at SF)

    Bradley plays sound D and has a decent mid range shot. 

    Battie is a good pick setter and ALWAYS boxes out.

     
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?:
    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young? : I'd like to replace Baby with a vet rebounder that plays 7 feet tall not 6-1 like Baby does at times. Juwan Howard (pick n pop PF/C with solid defense and rebounding) Tony Battie (pick n pop PF/C with solid defense and rebounding) Troy Murphy ( may still be a pick n pop PF/C with solid defense and rebounding) Hopefully we can use Baby in a S&T combo to get Jamal Crawford, Deandre Jordan and/or Nick Young.  My Dream: Jamal Crawford for MLE Nick Young for Big Baby + ( pick or another player) I think DeAndre will be kept in LA  otherwise I'd say goodbye to Nick) Second team could be Bradley,Crawford,Young,Green and Battie. That's the starting five for Philly right?  
    Posted by DaCeltics


    deandre in green is a pipe dream given our cap and how much the clips like him.

    i'd say even jamal crawford is optimistic for our cap structure. 

    all i have to say is i wish they kept clifford ray.  so much big man work that could have been done with davis on rebounding.

    there are many smaller guys who have been excellent rebounders- fortson, silas, etc.  davis has extremely fast footwork on defense, i don't understand how he couldn't transform himself into a better rebounder given rigorous big man coaching.  take the big man coach out of the picture and there goes the project.
     
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    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?:
    and whoever came up with "nick young" as some sort of solution to our problems.  man oh man!!  talk about an all time anti-celtic.  nick averages .4 assists a game.  he's a gunner.  he plays no D.  he's not a team guy.  can anyone see that fitting in on this celtic team with 2 of the 3 or all 3 of the big 3 left hanging around?  i can't.
    Posted by aciemvp


    I was thinking the same thing

    I think Dalembert is the ideal Celtic free agent target (well, Tyson Chandler is out of our price range), along with Shane Battier and/or Grant Hill

    Anderson Varejao also rebounds and D's up

    Nick Young would be a disaster
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from cavaliersfan. Show cavaliersfan's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    Cavs need a center.  Andy V. is not really a center, even though he has played the position, and is about 3 years older and a little injury prone.  Big Baby can play center and play Dwight Howard.   Possibly, Cavs take that trade in a heartbeat.
     
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    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?:
    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young? : great assessment of davis.  he may never be more than a 20-25 minute guy.  but he can do things that few others can do.  including sliding over to the 5 and throwing weight around against bigger guys who nobody else on the team can keep off their sweet spot. woudln't it have been nice if doc rivers didn't go to the press with big baby nuggets the 4th through 6th times?  honestly he could have stopped after the first time if he wasn't going to include anyone else on the team who was also screwing up. i don't think davis will be back and i think a lot of people will miss him when he's gone.  yes, he's a limited player, and yes, a unique player who was a very positive force for us on offense and defense, until the patellar tendon injury this last year.
    Posted by aciemvp


    Thanks. Big Baby has simply gotten bad or no advice for how to shape his body. I think he needed to trim down. He will always be strong, and he's not going to forget that martial arts center of gravity approach.

    He's not going to get any taller. He needs a hippety-hoppity in his step to survive the NBA. The less weight he puts on his legs, the better.

    He's amazing around the basket. I think if he trims some baby fat and gets his knees working, he really could be a Baby Shaq around the rim on offense.

    There's only so much ribbing one will take. I agree. Once or twice, fine, make your jokes. Like John Candy said in Planes, Trains, and Automobiles, "I know I'm an easy target."

    But Doc never closed his yapper.He was the opposite of a player's coach the way he treated Davis.

    I recall you're not a big fan of Perk's game. What happened with Perk the year we almost stole a title from the Lakers was similar to how Baby fell apart last year. The first half, Perk was trim and fast. He stayed within himself, and I think he was somewhere around a 10 pts., 10 rebounds, and 2 blocks. Then he got tendinitis, and it all fell apart.

    Of course with Perk's knee and shoulder troubles, Danny was not going to resign him for 9 million or whatever it would have taken.

    So I'm not too upset about that trade. But I will be, if Doc doesn't start growing as a coach and get the most out of the roster. Could a different coach have better utilized Jeff Green, Nenad Krstic, and Von Wafer? Of course. We could've beaten the Heat. I'm not sure about Dallas, but a good coach would have gotten us past Lebron and Wade. Once it became clear our Big Three wasn't going to be able to get it done, Doc had a deer in the headlights routine going.

    Doc's an excellent coach in a few ways. Unfortunately he's awful when it comes to the most important duties of a head coach. He has no clue how to manage minutes, make substitutions, and come up with alternatives when facing adversity. He doesn't run an open shop. He is not a player's coach. He is a star's coach. Jordan and Kobe would have loved playing for Doc Rivers. I'm not so sure their teammates would have agreed.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?:
    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young? : Thanks. Big Baby has simply gotten bad or no advice for how to shape his body. I think he needed to trim down. He will always be strong, and he's not going to forget that martial arts center of gravity approach. He's not going to get any taller. He needs a hippety-hoppity in his step to survive the NBA. The less weight he puts on his legs, the better. He's amazing around the basket. I think if he trims some baby fat and gets his knees working, he really could be a Baby Shaq around the rim on offense. There's only so much ribbing one will take. I agree. Once or twice, fine, make your jokes. Like John Candy said in Planes, Trains, and Automobiles, "I know I'm an easy target." But Doc never closed his yapper.He was the opposite of a player's coach the way he treated Davis. I recall you're not a big fan of Perk's game. What happened with Perk the year we almost stole a title from the Lakers was similar to how Baby fell apart last year. The first half, Perk was trim and fast. He stayed within himself, and I think he was somewhere around a 10 pts., 10 rebounds, and 2 blocks. Then he got tendinitis, and it all fell apart. Of course with Perk's knee and shoulder troubles, Danny was not going to resign him for 9 million or whatever it would have taken. So I'm not too upset about that trade. But I will be, if Doc doesn't start growing as a coach and get the most out of the roster. Could a different coach have better utilized Jeff Green, Nenad Krstic, and Von Wafer? Of course. We could've beaten the Heat. I'm not sure about Dallas, but a good coach would have gotten us past Lebron and Wade. Once it became clear our Big Three wasn't going to be able to get it done, Doc had a deer in the headlights routine going. Doc's an excellent coach in a few ways. Unfortunately he's awful when it comes to the most important duties of a head coach. He has no clue how to manage minutes, make substitutions, and come up with alternatives when facing adversity. He doesn't run an open shop. He is not a player's coach. He is a star's coach. Jordan and Kobe would have loved playing for Doc Rivers. I'm not so sure their teammates would have agreed.
    Posted by NickFaldo


    you're right, i wasn't a fan of perkins, UNTIL the first half of that last full year he played with the team.  man was he good.  everything was as good as it could be.  his hands somehow got better.  he scored and rebounded like a dirty work 5 in THIS league should- 10 and 10- i know from the old days 20 years ago a 10 and 10 center was a dog, but perk's 10 and 10 for this team was great in this new league style of play.

    and then he fell apart.  by the playoffs he was unwatchable and very unproductive, just as he was for OKC in their playoff run where ibaka had to do EVERYTHING at the 5 spot while perkins basically watched.

    trading perkins was very smart- his shoulder was a career long issue and perhaps it played a big role in his tendency to taper off as time/seasons went on.  i am fairly certain that OKC is already regretting throwing 30 million at the guy, you can get a good locker room guy for less, if that's all he's going to be.

    davis, on the other hand, would be a real shame to see walk away as a healthy player, who had more development left in him, and had functioned so well with this team, embodied so much celtic lunch pail and hustle type that every celts fan SHOULD look for and value.

    if some team gets him and gets him the big man rebounding coaching that he needs to become an adequate rebounder per minute played then ainge and rivers are going to look the fools big time.  boards are a deficiency in his game but i can't imagine it's insurmountable given the right tutoring.  i think once we miss the superior gap closing team defense of davis, ONE LONE ASPECT OF HIS GAME, on this aged, increasingly not quick team, people will rue the day that doc blithers rode him out of town on a boston globe reporter microphone.

    nobody on this board has ever explained away why doc trashed davis to the press as much as he did, it was downright frikkin habitual in nature.  totally unprofessional behavior toward a kid that, if anything, seemed TOO good natured for his size and you almost wished he would get mean sometimes and floor some people.  made no sense and still makes no sense.  but this is doc, it's who he is.  hates young players, probably hates anyone young who is good natured twice as much.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?:
    In Response to Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young? : Doc's an excellent coach in a few ways. Unfortunately he's awful when it comes to the most important duties of a head coach. He has no clue how to manage minutes, make substitutions, and come up with alternatives when facing adversity. He doesn't run an open shop. He is not a player's coach. He is a star's coach. Jordan and Kobe would have loved playing for Doc Rivers. I'm not so sure their teammates would have agreed.
    Posted by NickFaldo


    i get so angry thinking about doc rivers that i often times cannot put it down in words like you just did.  that's the best assessment of this idiot that we've just signed for another 5 years of the same blank look at press conferences after he just got out coached or managed to under-motivate his team.

    HOW EASY IS IT to do what doc does well- he's a STAR PLAYER"S COACH- give me a break.  he sure as heck hasn't motivated rondo to get the stripe shot nailed down. hasn't punished him for not doing it either.  the rotations and lack of use across multiple players was astonishing this last year.

    i mean we had marquis for when we had him, didn't get enough minutes.  then wafer, the same thing, before and after the injury you never saw him again.  i am of the belief that troy murphy had something left to give, and we could have used that something once davis struggled.  one track mind doc couldn't say "hey troy, get in there", why not?!  the number of playoff games where delonte had 1 to 3 FGA's and a totally ridculously small role compared to his skill level, was staggering.

    and then the biggest malfeasance of all- the "blending in" (LOL!!) of jeff green.  it just didn't happen.  green seems casual by nature in his demeanor but i did not see a lack of trying or lack of concentration.  this was only his second team in the nba, young kid, needed to be brought up to speed quickly.  by my estimation, jeff green was JUST starting to hit some of his potential on a consistent basis when we got our arses handed to us by miami.  great job doc!!

    can't wait for this five more years of shitte sandwiches coming up from the dokster.  this team WILL get younger, and doc does not relate well to young players, their development, their rotations.  so unless danny is going to trade for the next trio of 31 year old "never won it's" who are HOF material as long as they win a ring, i don't see this being a good five years at all.  i can't think of the next 3 "never won it's" that would be worth putting together. 

    michael redd, steve nash and (?)....... i mean really.
     
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    Re: Big Baby for Andy V or Nick Young?

    We do not know what happened in that locker room.  Perhaps Doc tried privately counseling the lardarse!  Maybe that didn't work, so he had to get on the lardarse publicly.  We don't know.  Wasn't the knock on KC Jones that he was  not good with rookies either?  Doc would be fine, if we had young players who were any good.  He played and praised Rondo, didn't he?  Said he's thinking of starting 24 yr old Jeff Green?  GUARANTEED JJJ plays some this year- not sure about Moore!

    I think Doc gets a bad rep from some Celtics fans!!  Would Blake Griffin have played last year, if we had him?
     
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