Calling all Laker fans where are you?

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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you? : I'll give my thoughts here and then probably depart for a while.  I'm absolutely a Lakers fan first, but also a NBA fan in general, and it seems this site is full of too many people who are only Celtics fans....exhausting!!!  I really don't know about the MN Lakers place in history.  I consider them to be part of "Lakers" history.  I grew up in the 80s as a Lakers fan, and I was always aware of the history of George Mikan and the MN Lakers.  It was never "hidden" or ignored among Lakers fans, so I always assumed that the Lakers tradition included both the L.A. and MN days.  If you consider the MN Lakers to be separate, then I suppose they would be the first "dynasty", but that's a better question for you and your peers who watched the NBA before it had 20 teams.  As to why the MN titles were not recognized with a banner until recently, I don't think anyone can be sure.  I personally think it's due to Dr. Buss' ego.  He took over a team that had a history of underachieving, and he wanted his stamp to be on the franchise.  You don't do that by hanging 5 banners from the MN days and celebrating someone else's success.  I think once he got 6 of his own and surpassed the MN titles, it was okay for his ego to embrace and officially acknowledge the MN titles.  So, perhaps you might say that Lakers management (particularly Dr Buss) did not embrace the MN titles until recently, but myself and other fans have always considered George Mikan a Laker, and the Lakers tradition to include the 1950s teams.  Only recently did the Lakers number of titles approach Boston's, and we all considered the MN titles to belong to the "Lakers" long before that.
    Posted by ItsNot1966anymor[/QUOTE]
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Duke4. Show Duke4's posts

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    Fair enough my friend.....I think we both appreciate where each of us is coming from and where we are both headed to....I respect that.....peace!

    B
     
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    We come here to badger you because of your constant name-calling and belittling the Lakers. Fakers, rapist, etc, and so yout great loss tonight is music to our ears. You never get bad mouthed at clublakers or lakernation. In fact, you're discussed no more than any other team. But you never hear these outrageous, Archie Bunker, knuckleheads that you hear here. You got beat bad, like us, but difference is we will be back much sooner than you and the inevitable fact is we will get to 18 before you. Do you realize how deliriously happy us Laker fans are your defeat. I had gone out earlier to buy a cheap cigar to light up at the defining moment. See you in 20 years.

     
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    [QUOTE]We come here to badger you because of your constant name-calling and belittling the Lakers. Fakers, rapist, etc, and so yout great loss tonight is music to our ears. You never get bad mouthed at clublakers or lakernation. In fact, you're discussed no more than any other team. But you never hear these outrageous, Archie Bunker, knuckleheads that you hear here. You got beat bad, like us, but difference is we will be back much sooner than you and the inevitable fact is we will get to 18 before you. Do you realize how deliriously happy us Laker fans are your defeat. I had gone out earlier to buy a cheap cigar to light up at the defining moment. See you in 20 years.
    Posted by lakersavenger[/QUOTE]

    You're deliriously happy about another team losing? And then you brag about it?Seriously?  Why do you think you are so bitter and angry about things?  By the way I never call the Lakers "fakers' or "rapists".  I also never troll other teams boards.  You seem kind of unhealthy.

     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you? : Didn't mention the Celtics - just YOUR problems.  AND, Buss has nothing to do with it, it's Kupchak.  Buss signs off on it, in between 16 yr old cheerleaders, but Kupchak makes all the decisions.  AND, no one wants to deal with the guy!  Many GM's have waited a long time for this day, and he must pay for his arrogance.  You're "not sure" how the pieces will fit together?"  You need a coach and a PG, according to you all you need to do is "tweak."  HOW will you pay for one?
    Posted by hedleylamarr[/QUOTE]

    Hedley, you've made this preposterous statement several times. THIS IS A BUSINESS...and any team that thinks the Laker's have players that they can use WILL open themselves to negotiations. Mitch just happens to be better at making the trades to keep HIS team on top. The Lakers track record speaks for itself. If you believe the Lakers franchise is going to go 20 years without being a title contender, then I have some "swamp" land for sale that you might be interested in. YOU GUYS are the ones who have Danny Ainge for a GM. If he can keep your team from becoming irrelevant for the next decade, then that would be an accomplishment. However, he hasn't gotten off to the best start with his recent trades/signings.
     
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    http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u176/zrider1_photos/CelticsBlankBanner.png
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you? : If by Troll, you mean someone who offers objective opinions, doesn't live their life in the past, and dares to offer something more than the standard old herd mentality of "Celtics are the best thing in the world", then yes, I guess I am.  I always thought a Troll was a narrow-minded person with no perspective who answers reasoned opinions with mere insults.  In that case, you're right, you don't need me, because there are plenty of trolls here calling themselves Celtics fans.
    Posted by ItsNot1966anymor[/QUOTE]

    1966, you're going to find a lot of "narrow minded" fans on this site, both Laker AND Celtics. You'll probably be called a lot of names, troll being the most common. Feel free to come back as often as you like. (I'm sure I'm pissing off a lot of these fans by inviting you, since I AM a Laker fan, but if you remain fairly pleasant, they'll grudgingly welcome you.)

    There's a few (Fiercest...AKA Sybil) who don't offer much to the conversation, but most are a pretty good bunch...even though they are Celtics fans...on a Celtics forum. Hah!
     
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    [QUOTE]'66.....not true as far as my opinion goes......if the Lakers surpass us by one championship I will still point out the 9-3 disparity and our overall dominant winning percentage in the Finals....but if they go on a roll and really get ahead of us then I will give them their due and place them at #1.....one thing I have to ask....based on the info I produced regarding the early NBA....do you think the 5 Minny championships rank up there with the LA 11 and the Boston 17, both set in the modern era (as defined by the overwhelming opinion of most fans and the media)?I'm just asking you....because, in reality, right now....that is what is fueling this debate....I respectfully await your reply....by the way, I do mean respect....you seem to be a knowledgeable poster and certainly, in my opinion, you are definitely not a troll!!!
    Posted by Duke4[/QUOTE]

    I'm gonna chime in here and say that a LOT of Lakers fans want to see that 9-3 gap closed up as well :). 

    I personally have never stood behind 'only counting certain titles'.  If a franchise moves, it's still the same franchise.  When I drive my car across a state border, the odometer doesn't flip back to 0. 

    Well, now it's only counting Texas miles. 
     
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    [QUOTE]to our friend "it's not 1966 anymor"......a few things to consider... since the advent of the modern NBA (shot clock era) Celtics 17 titles....Lakers 11 Finals winning percentages....Celtics .809 (17-4) Lakers .423 (11-15) ....and this brings up the notion of great closers....you know, how you guys love to say the mamba is the best closer in the league (not, by the way...check out the last 5 years stats)...anyway...my point is...how good have the modern Lakers been at "closing" in the Finals...? (see 11-15) ....not really very good were they...? You hang your hat on Phil and his 11 titles (5 with LA)...who retired at 65? ....we hang our hat on Red who retired at 50 with 10...and then was GM and President who oversaw the next 6....and who built the team from the ground floor ...are you really sure that you want to continue the comparisons?  ....because I can give you more if you'd like.... Celtics vs. Lakers in the Finals........9-3 Celts (including 8 straight spanning 25 years) Finals being swept 4 straight...?   Lakers 3 (once by Boston)....Celtics...nope!! ....and as far as the long drought after '86.....please consider this and give me an honest answer....how would your franchise history book look if (1)Worthy died before he ever played a game for your franchise and (2)say Byron Scott died a few years later....would this have altered the Laker landscape...methinks the answer is an overwhelming YES! Lastly.....Q said we only won one with the Big #3.....correct....but we destroyed the league in year #1 (and LA in the Finals)....were on a roll until KG was lost for the season the next year....we went to the final two minutes of game 7 on the road last year (with Perk out)...and we gave a better showing in the playoffs this year than your team did... Remember....our team never QUIT.....your team did twice...in '08 in Boston and this year in Dallas....39 and 33 point losses if I'm not mistaken....the Celtics have never embarrassed themselves in the Finals like LA did....lost in OT with our floor leader playing with a dislocated elbow (ouch).....need I say more...?
    Posted by Duke4[/QUOTE]

    Duke, you definitely have a weird perspective in sports. You are cherishing failure and actually bragging about failure.

    1) Is the NBA only about the finals? what about the years that the Celtics don't reach the finals? Are those failures counted or not? or are you rewarding teams for NOT reaching the finals?

    Bottom line:

    Celtics: 17-48

    Lakers: 16-47

    Look at how they do it in baseball standings. Tell me the 16-47 team is how many games behind.

    2) 16-15 is of course very good, it means they won the conference 31 times (31-9 in conference finals). Is it better or worse than the Celtics’ 21-11 in conference finals?

    3) As of Worthy died, how do you know Bias was Worthy? He’s an unproven talent in the NBA. He could be Worthy, but he could also be LaRue Martin or David Greenwood.

    And Worthy had a 11-year career. Had Worthy been lost, they probably wouldn't have won in 85, 87 and 88. The Lakers still won 5 titles after the Worthy era. How many did the Celtics win from 1997-2011?

    4) Yes, you destroyed LA in the finals. Maybe you think reaching the final is worse than losing in the 2nd round, but you are definitely in the minority, given how your fellow fans reacted last year.

    I’ll take a Game 6 blowout loss in the final ANYTIME over a 2nd round elimination. Your fellow fans’ response after the game 7 loss last year (“proud of the Celtics”, “job well done”, “beyond expectations”, ...) definitely refute the notion that losing in the finals is worse than losing in the 2nd round.

     In other words, losing in the 2nd round is a much BIGGER FAILURE than losing in the finals, whether you like it or not.

    5) As for getting swept in the finals. Nope, the Celtics never got swept in the finals, because they are used to getting swept in the 1st round or the 2nd round. I mean, The Lakers still got swept fewer times than the Celtics did in this millenium. Remember 2003 and 2004? Maybe you like to cherish those sweeps because it didn’t happen in the finals...

    Of course, the years you cherish the most should be the ML Carr/Rick Pitino years, when they missed the playoffs. No sweeps, no losses in the finals. Keeping your 17-3 record intact...

    6) Well, the Celtics never embarrassed themselves in the finals like the Lakers did. They know full well how to do it some other way: missing the playoffs altogether.

    7) As of this year, yep, your team give a “better” showing, when you brag about a 1-4 loss in the 2nd round over your rival's 0-4 loss, it’s just solid proof that the Lakers’ past 3 decades have got to your nerve. Of course, that’s what 21 years of drought do to your psyche.

    8) I really wonder your perspective of quitting. A team that won 14 games in the playoffs is quitting, while a team that won 7 games, including a 19-point loss at home in game 7, is “NEVER QUIT”.

    9) the Lakers is a franchise, regardless of whether it's in Minny or LA. Haven't you heard of the Minneapolis Lakers?

     

     


     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from MajicMVP. Show MajicMVP's posts

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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you? : Manipulating the facts?  Don't forget to mention that the Finals head to head record is: Celtics - 9 Lakers - 3 The Lakers only beat the Celtics in 1985, 1987, and 2010. Every decade the Celtics and the Lakers faced each other the Celts beat the Lakers. HAHAHA!!!
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]

    A 9-3 head2head led to similar records in success/failure?

    In that case, you just proved that the Celtics are inferior.

    Based on last year's posts, all you Celtics fans have already shown the true color that reaching the finals /> failing to reach the finals. In other words, a 9-3 head-to-head lead but only equal in success-failure record means that the Lakers performed better than the Celtics. At least we reached the finals, you didn't.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from kybested. Show kybested's posts

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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you? : If the head to head matters, why don't the Celtics have a 6-title lead over the Lakers? What's the #times they succeed and the #times they failed? Trying to manipulate the facts?
    Posted by MajicMVP[/QUOTE]

    The Lakers went to the Finals 31 times and won 16 times. The Celtics went to the Finals 21 times and won 17 times. That means the Lakers are 16-15 in the Finals while the Celtics are 17-4. The records speak for itself, the Lakers get to the finals more often because the west was the weaker conference in the past.


     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from kybested. Show kybested's posts

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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you? : A 9-3 head2head led to similar records in success/failure? In that case, you just proved that the Celtics are inferior. Based on last year's posts, all you Celtics fans have already shown the true color that reaching the finals /> failing to reach the finals. In other words, a 9-3 head-to-head lead but only equal in success-failure record means that the Lakers performed better than the Celtics. At least we reached the finals, you didn't.
    Posted by MajicMVP[/QUOTE]

    In the 2k era the west won 7 championships while the east only won 3. In the 90s it was the east that won 7 championships while the west only won 3. The 80s was a tie with both the east and west getting 5 championships each. 

    Let's continue, in the 70s the east won 6 championships while the west got 4. In the 60s it was a sweep, 10-0, the west never won a single championship even when the Lakers made it to the Finals 6 times. If we count the 50's then that's where your other 5 championships came from. But in the form of the Minneapolis Lakers. 

    After seeing these facts clearly the eastern conference is the stronger conference. And it is a fact that the city of Los Angeles only has 11 NBA championships while the city of Boston has 17 NBA championships. 


     
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    In Response to Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you? : The Lakers went to the Finals 31 times and won 16 times. The Celtics went to the Finals 21 times and won 17 times. That means the Lakers are 16-15 in the Finals while the Celtics are 17-4. The records speak for itself, the Lakers get to the finals more often because the west was the weaker conference in the past.
    Posted by kybested[/QUOTE]

    Yep, the record speaks for itself. The Lakers made more playoffs and did better in the playoffs.

    The west was a weak conference in the past is just your illusion. You can't prove it. And besides, they don't count strength of schedule. This isn't college football.


     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from MajicMVP. Show MajicMVP's posts

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    In Response to Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you? : In the 2k era the west won 7 championships while the east only won 3. In the 90s it was the east that won 7 championships while the west only won 3. The 80s was a tie with both the east and west getting 5 championships each.  Let's continue, in the 70s the east won 6 championships while the west got 4. In the 60s it was a sweep, 10-0, the west never won a single championship even when the Lakers made it to the Finals 6 times. If we count the 50's then that's where your other 5 championships came from. But in the form of the Minneapolis Lakers.  After seeing these facts clearly the eastern conference is the stronger conference. And it is a fact that the city of Los Angeles only has 11 NBA championships while the city of Boston has 17 NBA championships. 
    Posted by kybested[/QUOTE]

    And you are counting # championship teams as the stronger conference? What logic.

    This illogic is best illustrated in 2004. The Lakers got to the finals and lost to the Pistons, the Celtics were in the east alright, but this #8 seed got swept in the first round by the Pacers.  So the Celtics couldn't get to the final only because the east is strong? while the Lakers got to the final only because the west is weak? Good grief...

    Oh, now it's the city of Los Angeles? Look at the title of this thread:

    "Call all Lakers fans where are you?"

    not "calling all Los Angeles fans where are you?"
     
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    [QUOTE]Q... I knew that you would be here......the difference in our teams...we knew we were on our last legs....Laker fans believed their team was still the class of the league...I listened to all the talk shows today.....Magic and Jerry West both stated that the Lakers were in a world of hurt...the team is too old and not athletic enough to compete with the young teams...in addition....West, on the Dan Patrick show, said that the Lakers were in trouble for a few reasons: They are way over the salary cap, which will decrease big time with the new CBA....putting it simply....the Lakers cannot sign free agents Also, as far as trades.....West was quoted as saying....wait for it (and you can google it or go to Youtube)......no teams are interested in players that the Lakers could offer in a trade....think of it: Kobe....winding down with miles on his legs and a "me first attitude" Artest..a nut case with a huge contract Fisher, Blake, and Barnes.....worthless Pau....huge contract and a horrible showing Bynum......a good trade chip....but another huge contract with injury issues and character issues as well (likely looking at a minimum 10 game suspension) Odom....maybe....but he has his issues as well (as in Mr Lamar Kardashian) Face it....Dr Buss and Mitch may very well want to make deals....but with your players' issues and the salary cap....do you really think Mitch is in a position to re-tool...?  ....you may....but from what I am hearing......nobody in the media agrees....
    Posted by Duke4[/QUOTE]

    Duke its called "sunshine pumping"
     
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    [QUOTE]I don't think the Celtics record of beating the Lakers 8 straight times, from 1959 to 1984, can be broken. I mean beating 1 team 8 straight times in the Finals? Wowzers! HAHAHA!!!
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]

    Sybil, by your posts, I'd be willing to bet you weren't even alive for any of those games during that streak. In fact, I'd be surprised if you were even old enough to remember the Bird vs. Magic rivalry. So you're living off the past that you know little or nothing about.

    I can respect guys like Duke who ACTUALLY KNOW and can discuss this rivalry...but you know nothing about it. What you do know is that since 1984, the Lakers have won 3 of the 5 meetings in the Finals. So during YOUR lifetime, the Lakers own a winning record against Boston. Yes, Boston dominated the Lakers in the 50's and 60's. But for you, that's ANCIENT history. I've been able to see the Lakers move from those disappointing losses, to the brink of tying the C's. And it's been special.
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you? : Duke its called "sunshine pumping"
    Posted by OneOnOne[/QUOTE]

    No...it's called "history". Look at the history of the past 25 years and you'll see a trend for both teams.

    The Lakers ownership/management doesn't live in the past...they learn from it.

    The C's can't seem to keep an ownership group together long enough to create or learn from their history. The one era that they WERE able to keep stability on their team was during Red Auerbach's leadership. He's since passed and the C's haven't been the same since. Only the most avid "sunshine pumper" would argue that.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Duke4. Show Duke4's posts

    Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you?

    It is a fact that the East historically had the stronger teams......that is why a sub .500 team was able to make it to the Finals (see '59 Lakers)....in fact, the Lakers made the playoffs with losing records in '58/'59, '59/'60, '60/'61, and again in '66/'67....when the league expanded the Hawks (Lakers' top rival) moved East while the West got the expansion Suns.....again, no Laker fan has replied to the topic of "the Big Four" of the '80's.....and I am sure many of you remember it well.....while the East had centers like Parish, Malone, and Lanier to name a few going head to head....the Lakers had to battle the likes of Kevin Duckworth.....getting to the Finals doesn't prove anything....there has to be a team representing each conference.....Boston may have fielded stronger teams that lost out to stronger competition, while the Lakers had an easier time getting out of their conference..no one can prove either side of this issue...but the two biggest factors that favor the Celtics.....?

    .809% in the Finals (17-4) vs .516% (16-15) .......and in the modern NBA it becomes .423% (11-15)

    9-3 head to head.....8 straight over a 25 year span.....when LA finally broke through they beat Celtic teams with key players playing injured....think a healthy Bird and Maxwell might've helped out in '85..? .....and we won't even talk about '87...

    lastly, I refer to the modern NBA (shot clock)....the Lakers were 5-0 in a league where a team could lose because they were outscored 3-1 in the 4th quarter...or in a league where a game could go six overtimes with one shot being taken in each period....that was the NBA that produced almost one third of the Laker titles....you are certainly entitled to them....I have no problem with them occuring in another city....but it certainly was another era....one that had to change in order for the young league to survive...coincidence that Mikan retired....?

    By the way......this is just my opinion....I respect posters like Worthy, jofc, and QDaddy....although I may not always agree.....that is what makes this forum interesting....
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from icnd. Show icnd's posts

    Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you?

    All good, thought-out points guys, but if you're already set on your ways, no amount of argument is going to change anyone's mind.  All I know is that you have to get the Finals in order to win the title.  Someone saying his team is better because of winning percentages in the Finals is not unlike a Baltimore Ravens fans bragging about a 1.000 percentage in the Super Bowl (1-0) and using this argument to say they're better than the Steelers (6-2 in the Super Bowl).
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Duke4. Show Duke4's posts

    Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you?

    I can see where you are coming from.......in fact, you could make a case for the Bulls as the greatest team with multiple titles since they are 1.000 if I'm not mistaken......(6-0).....however, if you asked any sports fan which preference he/she would have given those three teams....I think the Celtics at 17-4 would be the choice, followed by LA/Minn 16-15 and Chicago's 6-0.....Celts & Lakers titles were spread over 60 years or so.....Chicago's came over an 8 year period....heck, the Celts actually on 8 years in a row....again....I agree....nobody of a strong opinion is likely changing theirs because we are posting our own...I enjoy discussing issues with intelligent and informed fans....and there are very many representing both teams....I'm sure we can agree that it is the trolls (mostly kids I would expect) that we can all do without.....cheers
     
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    Re: Calling all Laker fans where are you?

    celtics/lakers fans have some of the dumbest debates
     
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