Delonte West - Am I missing something?

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    This is the most beautiful sign I want to see this year: Celtics defeat Lakers in 6 107-96 Boston Celtics 2010-2011 NBA Champions!
    Posted by RaulAlvarez1969


    www.nba.com/media/suns/0401den_shaq_dunk_300.jpg" alt="" width="300" height="307" />

    I want Shaq to dunk over Kobe!
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

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    In Response to Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something? : Are we watching the same team? Nate cannot play effectively with the ball in his hands. How many times has he gotten into the lane this year? To my eye, he is a much better player when someone else is getting him the ball in a position to score rather than him having the ball in his hands trying to score.
    Posted by rkarp


    rkarp, to answer your question... NO, we're apparently not watching the same team.

    Nate may be the most talented player on the team (next to PP) in creating his own shot. If you dont realize this, you dont know Nates game. 

    Your post said "Nate cannot create his own shot".. Sorry but thats just not an accurate statement.
     
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    In Response to Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something? : mem.... Perhaps the tone and text of this comment would have been better received yesterday instead of your "I really take offense to people .... I wish the cheap shots toward Delonte ..... Once it ends, I'll end my defense of Delonte in regards to his mental disorder" threat.  You've been biting posters heads off of late. Take it down a notch, please. Pud
    Posted by puddinpuddin

        I agree Pud. Thanks for making me aware of that in a polite manner. My apologies to those who didn't deserve a sharp response. I will make an attempt to tone it down.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

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    I think West will be a major contributor, spelling both Rondo and Ray Allen.  Just hope he can keep his mental state on an even keel.
    Posted by paulliu


    even if he keeps things together with the bipolar, which i hope he does, west has had a history of being injured a lot.  so the last few games he's missed a lot of time with both the mental issues and physical issues.  so in recent history he has been able to contribute in 40 to 50 games.  he is no sure bet to be around for our 83rd-100th games!  i sure hope he is but you have to be realistic and prepared to do other things if he's not.  REALLY prepared.  this is why nate should not be choked out of the minute rotation no matter what goes on and we have to have someone lined up (marquis or someone else) to spell ray. 

    this is what has really concerned me about doc and danny so far.  ray has been run about 40 a game early on.  there is no reason to have played him that much with marquis able to take some minutes, even if it's just 5 at the #2 spot.  rigid thinking combined with aged core is going to get us into a lot of trouble.  what happens when delonte gets injured this year?  there's a HIGH chance of it!  does ray just go back to 40 a game?
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

    Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something?

    meant to say YEARS instead of games (obviously)

    so the last few games he's missed a lot of time with both the mental issues and physical issues

     
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    In Response to Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something? : rkarp, to answer your question... NO, we're apparently not watching the same team. Nate may be the most talented player on the team (next to PP) in creating his own shot. If you dont realize this, you dont know Nates game.  Your post said "Nate cannot create his own shot".. Sorry but thats just not an accurate statement.
    Posted by Karllost

    It appears J Benbow was watching the same thing that I was, as his lead article mentions how much more effective Nate will be once the ball is taken out of his hands. Benbow also quotes Rivers as saying the same thing that I said yesterday.
    Look, Nate is not a point guard. He gets confused when he has the ball in his hands. Let West get Nate the ball in a position to score. Without a true point, Nate shooting percentage this season is terrible. (8 for 33).
    To say Nate is the 2nd best player on the team able to get create own shot is idiotic. NAte is a high energy jump shooter, and a great free throw shooter. He doesn't do much else above average.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

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    In Response to Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something? : It appears J Benbow was watching the same thing that I was, as his lead article mentions how much more effective Nate will be once the ball is taken out of his hands. Benbow also quotes Rivers as saying the same thing that I said yesterday. Look, Nate is not a point guard. He gets confused when he has the ball in his hands. Let West get Nate the ball in a position to score. Without a true point, Nate shooting percentage this season is terrible. (8 for 33). To say Nate is the 2nd best player on the team able to get create own shot is idiotic. NAte is a high energy jump shooter, and a great free throw shooter. He doesn't do much else above average.
    Posted by rkarp


    Where did Nate playing PG come into this? The part of your post I took issue with was your saying "Nate cannot create his own shot"

    You are wrong and I doubt you can find very many NBA experts to agree with you. Nate has built his rep on creating his shots...some believe way too often. Theres not many people that can stay with him...

    If you want to bring up the article today about Nate being "more effective" in the 2 rather than Point...no argument here... but whats that got to do with Nate having the ability to create his own shot?  It doesnt... 

    I stand by that statement and the one where I said next to PP, Nate is prob the most effective on the this on creating his own shot 
     
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    In Response to Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something? : Where did Nate playing PG come into this? The part of your post I took issue with was your saying "Nate cannot create his own shot" You are wrong and I doubt you can find very many NBA experts to agree with you. Nate has built his rep on creating his shots...some believe way too often. Theres not many people that can stay with him... If you want to bring up the article today about Nate being "more effective" in the 2 rather than Point...no argument here... but whats that got to do with Nate having the ability to create his own shot?  It doesnt...  I stand by that statement and the one where I said next to PP, Nate is prob the most effective on the this on creating his own shot 
    Posted by Karllost

    i dont consider settling for a bad shot creaing his own shot. nate has been the defacto point and is shooting 8 for 33. he has shown zero ability to take anyone off of the dribble, and settles for low percentage jump shots.have you seen his limited minutes when he has played with Rondo and that has been when he is most effective. Rondo created the shot, nate made the shot.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

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    In Response to Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something? : i dont consider settling for a bad shot creaing his own shot. nate has been the defacto point and is shooting 8 for 33.
    Posted by rkarp


    if my eyes didn't mislead me in the playoffs last year- nate came in FOR rondo and ran point with an amazing effectiveness for a guy considered a shrunken #2- i mean he had some great passes and set ups of other people.  just an anomaly?

     
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    In Response to Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something?:
    In Response to Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something? : if my eyes didn't mislead me in the playoffs last year- nate came in FOR rondo and ran point with an amazing effectiveness for a guy considered a shrunken #2- i mean he had some great passes and set ups of other people.  just an anomaly?
    Posted by aciemvp



    Even Nate wants Delonte to run the show.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

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    In Response to Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something? : i dont consider settling for a bad shot creaing his own shot. nate has been the defacto point and is shooting 8 for 33. he has shown zero ability to take anyone off of the dribble, and settles for low percentage jump shots.have you seen his limited minutes when he has played with Rondo and that has been when he is most effective. Rondo created the shot, nate made the shot.
    Posted by rkarp


    rkarp, I think we may be having a communication problem.   I think youre mixing up the word "create" to mean setting up players and getting assists, like Rondo creates shots for others. .

    In basketball jargon, when asked if someone can "create" their own shot, it means can that player, on his own, get himself a good shot... like Pierce, MJ & Kobe... these guys can almost always create shots for themselves.. Nate unquestionably falls into this same category.

    On the contrary, Ray Allen would not. For the most part Ray needs picks & screens to get some daylight.

    When you watch a game on TV you'll sometimes hear an announcer say the Pistons (for ex) have only 2 guys that can create their own shots... hes not referring to a set up or assist guy... hes referring to a player that has the skills to create a shot without the need of the rest of the team setting him up
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

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    In Response to Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something? : rkarp, I think we may be having a communication problem.   I think youre mixing up the word "create" to mean setting up players and getting assists, like Rondo creates shots for others. . In basketball jargon, when asked if someone can "create" their own shot, it means can that player, on his own, get himself a good shot... like Pierce, MJ & Kobe... these guys can almost always create shots for themselves.. Nate unquestionably falls into this same category. On the contrary, Ray Allen would not. For the most part Ray needs picks & screens to get some daylight. When you watch a game on TV you'll sometimes hear an announcer say the Pistons (for ex) have only 2 guys that can create their own shots... hes not referring to a set up or assist guy... hes referring to a player that has the skills to create a shot without the need of the rest of the team setting him up
    Posted by Karllost

    Yes, I know what create his own shot means. And I contend that Nate cannot beat anyone off of the dribble, cannot get to the hole, and mostly the shots he does get are low percentage (hence, the 8 for 33).
    I also state that Nate moves well without the ball, and can put himself in position to score, as long as someone gets him the ball. If the ball is in Nate's hands, he is a worse offensive player than if the ball is in someone else's hands.
    Nate has played his best ball this year when he has been paired with Rondo (albeit for a very limited amount of time).
    I actually compare Nate to Eddie House. Cant do much with the ball in his hands, but get him the ball in a certain spot, and he is open on the court, he will hit the open jumper.
    If you think Nate is so good at creating his own shot, why does he settle for so many poor shots?
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something?

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    In Response to Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something? : Yes, I know what create his own shot means. And I contend that Nate cannot beat anyone off of the dribble, cannot get to the hole, and mostly the shots he does get are low percentage (hence, the 8 for 33). I also state that Nate moves well without the ball, and can put himself in position to score, as long as someone gets him the ball. If the ball is in Nate's hands, he is a worse offensive player than if the ball is in someone else's hands. Nate has played his best ball this year when he has been paired with Rondo (albeit for a very limited amount of time). I actually compare Nate to Eddie House. Cant do much with the ball in his hands, but get him the ball in a certain spot, and he is open on the court, he will hit the open jumper. If you think Nate is so good at creating his own shot, why does he settle for so many poor shots?
    Posted by rkarp


    You've got to be kidding.  Comparing Nate to Eddie House  that both cant do much with the ball in their hands..lol  Ridiculous!!

    First off, just because Nate has been shooting poorly, doesnt mean he hasnt had alot of wide open shots.

    Second, Nate can handle the ball and create his own shot 50x better than Eddie House.

    I thought maybe we were having a misunderstanding but I now realize your assessement of Nate is very misguided. You couldnt be more wrong! 
     
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    Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something?

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    In Response to Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something? : You've got to be kidding.  Comparing Nate to Eddie House  that both cant do much with the ball in their hands..lol  Ridiculous!! First off, just because Nate has been shooting poorly, doesnt mean he hasnt had alot of wide open shots. Second, Nate can handle the ball and create his own shot 50x better than Eddie House. I thought maybe we were having a misunderstanding but I now realize your assessement of Nate is very misguided. You couldnt be more wrong! 
    Posted by Karllost

    Lets agree to disagree. I will continue to watch Nate not get to the line, take poor jumpers with plenty of time on the clock, and never watch any defender "switch" off onto Nate because he never beats his defender off of the dribble, which Doc has commented on repeatedly. (even last nights game Nates assist to Semih was his first assist from the paint this year)
    I will also watch as Nates game is elevated once Delonte gets into shape, and Nate only has to be concerned with getting open and taking good shots.
    Explain to me what was the difference offensively between Nate and Eddie House last night, other than Eddie making his shots? I saw Lebron with the ball finding an open House for easy jump shots. I saw Nate failing as a pg, taking poor shots and beating his man off of the dribble ONE TIME.
    Explain to me other then the pass to Semih, ONE TIME last night that Nate created his own shot?
     
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    Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something?

    Hate to interject again, but I think the thing being overlooked is that Nate has been playing very conservatively since he's had to play more PG than he wants to.  He is trying to set guys up and having the primary responsibility of running the offense is NOT his strong point.  The extra duty has affected his game no doubt.  When not having to play PG and with a bit more freedom, Nate can play pick and pop, or he can take his man off the dribble and either take it to the hole or get his own shot.  Be prepared to see this early and often once Delonte is back.  Nate will be Nate, and he'll do what they expect, which is break down the defense and score the ball.   

    In my opinion, there is no analyst who would say that House and Nate have similar games.  In fact, I think Nate is a completely different skill set than House, with the exception that neither is a full time PG.  They are both undersized 2's, and House made his living for years using picks, while Nate's offensive arsenal is considerably more well rounded.  

    Just my opinion.    

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from cole-ely. Show cole-ely's posts

    Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something?

    Yeah, nate is a scorer more than dwest is a scorer.  Problem is, I've never seen nate in a situation where he doesn't have the ball in his hands.  I don't know if he's a guy that can run around off pics.  I still think he ends up with teh ball in his hands scoring off the dribble a lot.  I still like dwest better at 2, and he can get his assists off the wing.  I dont think you'll see nate at 2 like everybody is saying.
     
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    Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something?

    I am not ready to appoint DW anything.  This guy needs to get his act together.  Bipolar or not carrying loaded weapons is just stupid plain and simple.  He could be one incident away from being shipped out of here.  As far as talent goes I do agree he could help our second unit and help defend for RA at the 2 guard spot.  I hope being with the C's helps him stay focused and out of trouble.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Delonte West - Am I missing something?

    where is Karlost? Have you seen the past 5 games of Nate the Great? Do you still think this is a guy who can create his own shot? I see a guy settling for poor shots, not taking anyone off of the dribble, not even a pump fake to get the defender off of him....
    If Nate is hot, he hits the poor shots taken. If Nate is not hot, he is worthless. He is what he is...a 4th or 5th guard that can come off the bench time to time and make a few baskets. To think Nate is an offensive player capable of getting his own shot, getting to the rim and dishing, or getting to the line is foolish.
    I am writing this comment, after Nates "hottest" game, and he still did not creat his own shot. He simply hit some deep jump shots pretty much uncontested.
     
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