Examples Of Mediocrity

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    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

    The point is in professional sports, being mediocre is worse than being bad.




    You are right, but this last point is only valid in the system of US sport. In european soccer, handball, icehockey and BB it is totally different.

     
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    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity

    In response to Gasthoerer's comment:

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    The point is in professional sports, being mediocre is worse than being bad.

     




    You are right, but this last point is only valid in the system of US sport. In european soccer, handball, icehockey and BB it is totally different.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    +1

     
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    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity

    In response to Gasthoerer's comment:

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    The point is in professional sports, being mediocre is worse than being bad.

     




    You are right, but this last point is only valid in the system of US sport. In european soccer, handball, icehockey and BB it is totally different.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    It really only applies to basketball.  Mediocre teams have won the World Series and Stanley Cup.  Football teams do not need to descend to the lowest depths either.  Basketball is an entirely different animal.  Everyone was crying about parity in basketball.  Parity is not an economic issue in basketball.  It's a talent issue.  There will never be parity in basketball because the talent it requires to win an NBA championship is soooooo exceedingly rare.  Think about it.  What percentage of the population is 6'9 or over.  Pretty small, right?  Now what percentage of those 6'9 and over people are world class athletes?  Smaller still.  Now what percentage are world class basketball players?  Even smaller.  The point is that there is an extremely small talent pool from which to find players, so when a team gets one of the unique talents it is set up for success for years to come.  In order to have a good shot at one of the unique talents, you must be bad first.  This is why mediocrity is death in the NBA.

     
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    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity

    In response to teejaytee70's comment:

    The point is that there is an extremely small talent pool from which to find players, so when a team gets one of the unique talents it is set up for success for years to come.  




    Good point, BB is all about phyisical gifts. If you are a great player but you lack size, (lateral) speed or even arm lenght or hand size you will be a lesser player.

    But what I was referring to: The US system with a pro league and the draft makes mediocrity the worst position to be in. In european soccer the worst team is relegated to the 2nd league --> less money from TV etc. --> No chance to hire talented players. Very often this is the death of an entire franchise/club. In this system mediocre is better than bad.

     
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    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity

    In response to teejaytee70's comment:

    In response to Gasthoerer's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    The point is in professional sports, being mediocre is worse than being bad.

     

     




    You are right, but this last point is only valid in the system of US sport. In european soccer, handball, icehockey and BB it is totally different.

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    It really only applies to basketball.  Mediocre teams have won the World Series and Stanley Cup.  Football teams do not need to descend to the lowest depths either.  Basketball is an entirely different animal.  Everyone was crying about parity in basketball.  Parity is not an economic issue in basketball.  It's a talent issue.  There will never be parity in basketball because the talent it requires to win an NBA championship is soooooo exceedingly rare.  Think about it.  What percentage of the population is 6'9 or over.  Pretty small, right?  Now what percentage of those 6'9 and over people are world class athletes?  Smaller still.  Now what percentage are world class basketball players?  Even smaller.  The point is that there is an extremely small talent pool from which to find players, so when a team gets one of the unique talents it is set up for success for years to come.  In order to have a good shot at one of the unique talents, you must be bad first.  This is why mediocrity is death in the NBA.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I wonder if the'star system'(where stars get all the calls) plays a part in this as well. This diminishes the game in my opinion, making it just barely above wrestling in its credibilty. That is why I enjoy the college game more...

     

     
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    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity

    I thought this thread was about Doc Rivers.

     
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    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity

    The whole Laker organization is in bad shape.  It culdn't happen to a nicer bunch.  They have Kobe Bryant, Pau Gasol and literally nothing else.  Who is their coach again?  I don't even remember who their coach is.

     
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    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity


    reality check

     

    in the last 10 NBA seasons

     

    SIX  DIFFERENT TEAMS have won the NBA  title!!

    worst yet, only NONE different teams have even PLAYED in Championship series!!

    now I know everyone wants to talk about "playing for a championship", but the REALITY of the NBA is that only 7% of the 30  teams each year WILL play for the title.

     

    add in how many different teams get ther over the past 10 years and you are at 3%!!

     

    SO IF your measure of having a "good" team is getting to the NBA championship series....MOST will be disappointed each and every year.

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     
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    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity


    I would add

     

    Not sure how eaither Dallas or LA could be considered "examples of Mediocrity".

     

    seems like wishful thinking to me

     

    I know you are HOPEFUL of that for the future of both franchises (though we both know LA's cap situation next season makes them ripe for a QUICK rebuild).

     

    FACT is in the past 10 NBA seasons, this is the teams who have played for the championship.

     

    Miami- 4 times

    LA- 4 times

    SA- 3 times

    Bos- 2 times

    Dal- 2 times

    Det- 2 times

    Okl- 1 time

    Orl- - 1 time

    Clev- 1 time

     

    if any of those franshises are mediocre, the rest of the NBA is playing D-league ball I suppose.

     

    the NBA continues to follow the baseball model of salary cap/ super elite teams, with the majority of the league "feeder  minor teams" to the elites.

    LA and Dallas Mediocre....I might wish it, but it's not true...more like a couple of the NBA's ELITE teams.\ ( at least until the NBA decides to have a REAL NFL style salary cap).

     

     

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Gasthoerer. Show Gasthoerer's posts

    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity

    In response to MelWitt's comment:

    HANDBALL? REALLY?

     




    Funny pic, but I don't get the joke!

     
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    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity

    In response to Fierce34's comment:



    I'm talking about the now, not the past 10 seasons.

     

     

    Let's get the facts right.

    Right now the Mavs and Lakers are examples of teams that are mediocre.

    Why?

    Because everybody knows they will make the playoffs but never make it to the Finals.

    That means both the Lakers and Mavs are middle of the pack teams. 

    What's worse than being a lottery team?

    A middle of the pack team!

     




    well I am not sure that either of those teams make the playoffs next year.

    If Kobe ca'tt get back to at least 80%, LA is in trouble.

     

    who knows with Dallas (though they do have Dalembert!).....Cool

     

    they seem to have a mis-match of a roster there.

     

    you feel it's better to tank and get an elite player through the draft. and that makes sense as one way to build a team.

     

    but we're gonna see next season IF LA can build a team with CAP SPACE and DOLLARS!!

     

    I don't like it, but I think that LA becomes a contender for a Championship before we do (if we only build by drafting).

    I HOPE that Ainge does some of both (and I think you do also, after reading your thoughts on Aldridge).

     

     

     

     

     

     

     
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    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

    In response to kdp59's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     


    I would add

     

    Not sure how eaither Dallas or LA could be considered "examples of Mediocrity".

     

    seems like wishful thinking to me

     

    I know you are HOPEFUL of that for the future of both franchises (though we both know LA's cap situation next season makes them ripe for a QUICK rebuild).

     

    FACT is in the past 10 NBA seasons, this is the teams who have played for the championship.

     

    Miami- 4 times

    LA- 4 times

    SA- 3 times

    Bos- 2 times

    Dal- 2 times

    Det- 2 times

    Okl- 1 time

    Orl- - 1 time

    Clev- 1 time

     

    if any of those franshises are mediocre, the rest of the NBA is playing D-league ball I suppose.

     

    the NBA continues to follow the baseball model of salary cap/ super elite teams, with the majority of the league "feeder  minor teams" to the elites.

    LA and Dallas Mediocre....I might wish it, but it's not true...more like a couple of the NBA's ELITE teams.\ ( at least until the NBA decides to have a REAL NFL style salary cap).

     

     

     

     



    I'm talking about the now, not the past 10 seasons.

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    So instead of basing talking points on past data and educated facts you would like to make assumptions and speculations with no history to back up what you are saying?

    That doesn't sound like you Fierce.

    Being a treadmill team is more about the age of your core than about where you place.

     Should OKC blow it up because they haven't won a championship yet?  They are worse than they were two years ago when they were beat by the Heat, so should they start over and tank? Of course not, because the core is still in their prime. 

    The idea that you have to be a top 4 team or you should just give up is way overblown and incredibly unrealistic.

    Its ok to be a 6 or 7 seed as long as your core guys are under 28 or so, have the potential to get better, AND ownership is willing to pay to make the team better.  

    Right now the Celts have two out of three, I just think these owners aren't willing to pay as much as the true conTenders are. Theyd rather get a young stud on the cheap through the draft to sell some jerseys. We'll see if they are serious when his first contract is up.  But luckily (for them) their wallets will stay nice and fat for a few years before that happens.

     

     

     
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    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity

    In response to Gasthoerer's comment:

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    The point is in professional sports, being mediocre is worse than being bad.

     



    You are right, but this last point is only valid in the system of US sport. In european soccer, handball, icehockey and BB it is totally different.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Could this be because of the relatively small rosters?  The other major sports have larger rosters in proportion to the number of players on the field at any time.  Basketball rosters might appear to be in the 3:1 ratio, but once teams get past the eighth or ninth player (eight in the playoffs, generally), the bench doesn't play that much, especially the end of the bench guys.  I'm sure that comparing minutes/innings (position players), there are more minutes shared among more players in games in every sport than in basketball over the course of a season.  If a team has just a few(er) quality players on the entire roster in the NBA, it bodes badly for the team.  Conversely and obviously, if a team has players who can effectively replace others/starters, it can be more successful.  An example might be in the NFL; teams are said to have a "linebacker corp", but NBA teams don't have a "point guard corp" of interchangable players.  If a team has two decent PGs, it's doing well.  Same with every other position.  The players in the NHL can play on different and mixed up lines to better match opposing lines - players are somewhat more interchangable than in the NBA.  

    It's easier for teams to fall than to rise in basketball; smaller rosters where comparable committment, ability, and bb IQ contribute to team chemistry and wins.  Larger rosters can absorb minor downgrades more easily than smaller rosters.  

    I think the question has less to do with European vs. USA and more to do with relative roster numbers.

     
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    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

     

    This summer Dwight Howard had to the option of staying with the Lakers and getting an additional 1 year worth 30m. But Dwight chose leave the 30m and jump to Houston.

     

    Alvin Gentry had a choice of joining the Lakers or the Clippers.

    He chose to join the Clippers.

     

    The Lakers are not same since Jimmy Buss took over.

    Right now being a Laker means being part of a dysfunctional organization.

     



    Well you are right that they wont be competing this year or next.  They will probably get Melo next offseason.  But they will make their big moves in 2015.

     

    Here is a list of some free agents they may target  in that offseason.

    Rajon Rondo, Jeremy Lin, Evan Turner, Louis Williams, Wesley Mathews, Marcus Thornton, Kevin Love (player), LaMarcus Aldridge, Chris Bosh (player), Amar’e Stoudamire, Zach Randolph, Luis Scola, Andrea Bargnani, Thaddeus Young (ETO), Marc Gasol, Kevin Garnett, Roy Hibbert (player), Wilson Chandler, Brook Lopez (player), DeAndre Jordan, Anderson Varejao, Omer Asik.

    I can see them picking up one prime guy (Rondo, Love, Hibbert, Aldridge, Lopez, M. Gasol) then 2 middle guys (Chandler, Young, Scola, Turner, ugh! Garnett)

    If they were smart it would be either Rondo or Hibbert because both guys don't need to score to be effective.  With Kobe and Melo there wouldn't be many touches left for anyone else.  

    But they could easily be comprised with a core of

    Lin, Kobe, Melo, Young, Hibbert.

    Or Rondo, Kobe, Melo, Scola, Varejao.  

    Both teams would be dangerous, and Kobe is the only really old guy in those lineups.

     That is 2 offseasons from now.  How would the Celts get to that point in 2 years? Wiggins? I don't think so.

     
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    Re: Examples Of Mediocrity

    And before you say "oh Kobe will be too old!".  Melo will take a lot of the scoring load, and Kobe will spend his offseason with his dealer, oh I mean doctor in Germany.  He'll go in for his "treatments" and come back miraculously stronger!  Cough Cough (he's on huge amounts of HGH) Cough sputter

     
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