Kobe is no MJ
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Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/15/2012 8:45 AM EDT
- pschuller
- Posts: 411
- First: 11/19/2007
- Last: 8/9/2012
It's great to see Kobe, as his career winds down, proving that he should not be mentioned in the same breath as MJ. A few days ago, he says the only one on his team he can count on is a known nut case (nice leadership!), and last night he showed once again that he cannot consistently lead a relatively talented bunch of players through playoff pressure. Kobe has always struck me as a very selfish person and not worthy of being held up as a paragon of athletic virtue, so I am glad that he is leaving a legacy that befits his true character. -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/15/2012 9:06 AM EDT
- concord27
- Posts: 7708
- First: 6/16/2009
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Kobe is not Bird or Magic either. -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/15/2012 9:26 AM EDT
- Skins and Heart
- Posts: 88
- First: 5/15/2012
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He's not even a Jerry West.
Magic is in a totally different catagory to Bryant. -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/15/2012 9:51 AM EDT
- LloydDobler
- Posts: 12011
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Kobe is no MJ. But in all fairness, nobody is. -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/15/2012 12:45 PM EDT
- OC-CeltsFan
- Posts: 480
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- Last: 4/29/2013
One MVP, dismal career Finals shooting percentage, too many slefish antics, and too many elimination game blow outs to be considered in the Bird/Magic/MJ league. I've always said that he's in that second tier of all time greats, with the likes of Olajuwon, Barkley, etc. -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/15/2012 12:59 PM EDT
- FlobusMcNugget
- Posts: 1736
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MJ was no MJ towards the end of his career either. -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/15/2012 1:23 PM EDT
- LloydDobler
- Posts: 12011
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In Response to Re: Kobe is no MJ:MJ was no MJ towards the end of his career either.
Posted by FlobusMcNugget
You're obviously referring to his ill-advised comeback at the age of 38 with the Wizards. A better comparison would be Jordan's final year with the Bulls, when at the age of 34 -- a year older than Kobe -- he averaged 28.7 ppg and won his sixth ring.
Don't get me wrong, Kobe is one of the all-time greats. He's just not in MJ's league. In my opinion, nobody is. -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/15/2012 1:30 PM EDT
- cole-ely
- Posts: 2710
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Personally I loved that he came back with the wiz. I don't think it was ill advised at all. I thought he played great for his age. He averaged like 26 points a game if I remember right.
I even enjoyed the year that magic came back to the lakers. Gave me a chance to remember what great passing looked like.
The mj vs kobe comparison by age isn't exactly fair. Kobe came onto a team at 18 (actually it was 17 huh?) where he was already playing a ton of playoff minutes. MJ came in a couple years later and didn't see a WHOLE lot of playoff minutes for a few years. -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/15/2012 2:35 PM EDT
- antiqueman1
- Posts: 2363
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In Response to Re: Kobe is no MJ:MJ was no MJ towards the end of his career either.
Posted by FlobusMcNugget
Exactly. Just what I was thinking. I would take Kobe over Lebron. -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 3:37 AM EDT
- Skins and Heart
- Posts: 88
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In Response to Re: Kobe is no MJ:Personally I loved that he came back with the wiz. I don't think it was ill advised at all. I thought he played great for his age. He averaged like 26 points a game if I remember right. I even enjoyed the year that magic came back to the lakers. Gave me a chance to remember what great passing looked like. The mj vs kobe comparison by age isn't exactly fair. Kobe came onto a team at 18 (actually it was 17 huh?) where he was already playing a ton of playoff minutes. MJ came in a couple years later and didn't see a WHOLE lot of playoff minutes for a few years.
Posted by cole-ely
I loved Magic returning as well. Saw him play against the Sonics. Lakers lost, but to actually see Magic play live in a meaningful game was special. Really was sad that he was forced into retirement after the '90/91 season. Certainly still had years left in him.
MJ's comeback was fine too. He wasn't the player he was, but it's impossible to measure up to his previous standards.
Golden rule for comebacks though is that they are seldom worth it. -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 3:47 AM EDT
- dirty52
- Posts: 570
- First: 3/25/2011
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In Response to Kobe is no MJ:It's great to see Kobe, as his career winds down, proving that he should not be mentioned in the same breath as MJ. A few days ago, he says the only one on his team he can count on is a known nut case (nice leadership!), and last night he showed once again that he cannot consistently lead a relatively talented bunch of players through playoff pressure. Kobe has always struck me as a very selfish person and not worthy of being held up as a paragon of athletic virtue, so I am glad that he is leaving a legacy that befits his true character.
Posted by pschuller
I do not think MJ made his team better as they were already a pretty good team -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 10:12 AM EDT
- hedleylamarr
- Posts: 7791
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The Bulls were a terrible team - JUST adding MJ made them a playoff team....THEN they added the other pieces. Anyone who thinks anything else doesn't know basketball!!! -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 11:15 AM EDT
- cole-ely
- Posts: 2710
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Remember, MJ retired for 18mo while the rest of the team was in peak shape. Pippen had a chance to prove he was a franchise player. I had to laugh when people said he was the 2nd best player in the world. As I recall, tony kukoc had to become the go to guy.
Later pippen played well with portland, but he was always a robin, never a batman.
My point being, that team was a .500 team without MJ. MJ was just that good. -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 11:23 AM EDT
- Mark from Ct
- Posts: 1231
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In Response to Re: Kobe is no MJ:The Bulls were a terrible team - JUST adding MJ made them a playoff team....THEN they added the other pieces. Anyone who thinks anything else doesn't know basketball!!!
Posted by hedleylamarr
Adding Jordan didn't make Chicago a playoff team.
In Jordan's first 3 seasons they finished under .500 every season.
It wasn't until his 4th season when Pippen joined him that Chicago finished over .500. -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 11:27 AM EDT
- hedleylamarr
- Posts: 7791
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In the summer of 1984 the team's fortunes changed forever when it received the third pick of the 1984 NBA Draft, after Houston and Portland. The Rockets selected Hakeem Olajuwon, the Blazers jumped on Sam Bowie, and the Bulls grabbed shooting guard Michael Jordan. The team, with new management in owner Jerry Reinsdorf and General Manager Jerry Krause, decided to rebuild around Jordan. Jordan set franchise records during his rookie campaign for scoring (3rd in the league) and steals (4th in the league), and led the Bulls back to the playoffs, but lost in four games to the Milwaukee Bucks. For his efforts, he was rewarded with a selection to the All-NBA Second Team and the NBA Rookie of the Year Award.
Mark is wrong.............again!!! -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 11:30 AM EDT
- cole-ely
- Posts: 2710
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I distinctly remember MJ playing the c's in the playoffs of 1986. That would be MJ's what, 2nd year? I suppose it's more than possible they made it in with a sub 500 record. They would have been in 7th or 8th spot as c's would have had the first or second (maybe phili) record in the east.
Jordan had some of his best games that series, going for like 60pts. Seems like he averaged maybe 50 in that series. Boy, those were the days. -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 11:49 AM EDT
- hedleylamarr
- Posts: 7791
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In Response to Re: Kobe is no MJ:I distinctly remember MJ playing the c's in the playoffs of 1986. That would be MJ's what, 2nd year? I suppose it's more than possible they made it in with a sub 500 record. They would have been in 7th or 8th spot as c's would have had the first or second (maybe phili) record in the east. Jordan had some of his best games that series, going for like 60pts. Seems like he averaged maybe 50 in that series. Boy, those were the days.
Posted by cole-ely
It is irrelevant what their record was - I said they were NOT a playoff team, then they drafted him and became a playoff team just by adding him. Not arguing with you, but he is known for technicalites and semantics. I just want to be very clear on my premise
Before Jordan - NOT a playoff team
1984 - his rookie year - a playoff team - record is irrelevant!! -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 12:06 PM EDT
- tjwoods
- Posts: 235
- First: 2/22/2005
- Last: 8/21/2012
You guys are wrong. Kobe is in the same discussion with MJ: he has five rings, for god's sake.Forget this personality. He has FIVE rings! He's an awesome player and has been for a long time.Now, as an old guy: none of these guys measure up to Bill Russell, who has his well known 11 rings.But tell me, why doesn't anyone ever mention Sam Jones, who has 10 rings? -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 4:24 PM EDT
- dirty52
- Posts: 570
- First: 3/25/2011
- Last: 6/19/2013
In Response to Re: Kobe is no MJ:I distinctly remember MJ playing the c's in the playoffs of 1986. That would be MJ's what, 2nd year? I suppose it's more than possible they made it in with a sub 500 record. They would have been in 7th or 8th spot as c's would have had the first or second (maybe phili) record in the east. Jordan had some of his best games that series, going for like 60pts. Seems like he averaged maybe 50 in that series. Boy, those were the days.
Posted by cole-ely
So if he averaged 50 , he must have been a ball hog -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 4:37 PM EDT
- hedleylamarr
- Posts: 7791
- First: 1/16/2010
- Last: 5/16/2013
In Response to Re: Kobe is no MJ:I distinctly remember MJ playing the c's in the playoffs of 1986. That would be MJ's what, 2nd year? I suppose it's more than possible they made it in with a sub 500 record. They would have been in 7th or 8th spot as c's would have had the first or second (maybe phili) record in the east. Jordan had some of his best games that series, going for like 60pts. Seems like he averaged maybe 50 in that series. Boy, those were the days.
Posted by cole-ely
He had just recovered from a broken foot - Bird said after the game it was "God, disguised as Michael Jordan." -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 6:06 PM EDT
- JamLock
- Posts: 973
- First: 8/30/2009
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In Response to Kobe is no MJ:It's great to see Kobe, as his career winds down, proving that he should not be mentioned in the same breath as MJ. A few days ago, he says the only one on his team he can count on is a known nut case (nice leadership!), and last night he showed once again that he cannot consistently lead a relatively talented bunch of players through playoff pressure. Kobe has always struck me as a very selfish person and not worthy of being held up as a paragon of athletic virtue, so I am glad that he is leaving a legacy that befits his true character.
Posted by pschuller
Concur. KoMe will go out in the manner he is accustomed: selfish, aloof from teammates, critical of teammates, and one of the greatest whiners of all time (he may not lead in this category but is close to number 1).
As Always, -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 8:41 PM EDT
- dirty52
- Posts: 570
- First: 3/25/2011
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In Response to Re: Kobe is no MJ:
[QUOTE]In Response to Kobe is no MJ : Concur. KoMe will go out in the manner he is accustomed: selfish, aloof from teammates, critical of teammates, and one of the greatest whiners of all time (he may not lead in this category but is close to number 1). As Always,
Posted by JamLock[/
And you think Jordan is perfect?
http://thehoopdoctors.com/online2/2011/01/michael-jordan-thinks-women-faint-in-his-presence/ -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 8:53 PM EDT
- Duke4
- Posts: 2781
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Kobe may have 5 titles but Shaq was the man for the first 3 and Pau was really the man the year they beat us........MJ was THE MAN period!!!!....each and every year.....that is the difference between the two.... -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 10:35 PM EDT
- dirty52
- Posts: 570
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In Response to Re: Kobe is no MJ:Kobe may have 5 titles but Shaq was the man for the first 3 and Pau was really the man the year they beat us........MJ was THE MAN period!!!!....each and every year.....that is the difference between the two....
Posted by Duke4
Sorry Duke
I have to disagree Kobe had just as much to do with the first three championships as Shaq
some stats
http://www.lakersuniverse.com/seasons/2000_2001_playoff_stats.htm
Who do you think carried them when Shaq on the bench due to poor foul shooting? -
Re: Kobe is no MJ
posted at 5/16/2012 10:53 PM EDT
- LloydDobler
- Posts: 12011
- First: 7/13/2009
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In Response to Re: Kobe is no MJ:In Response to Kobe is no MJ : I do not think MJ made his team better as they were already a pretty good team
Posted by dirty52
Uh ... what???