Nate Robinson blew by Ray Allen again

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    Re: Nate Robinson blew by Ray Allen again

    In response to Karllost's comment:

    In response to snakeoil123's comment:

     

    In response to Karllost's comment:

     

    In response to snakeoil123's comment:

     

    In response to Karllost's comment:

     

    Look at these morons calling people haters... they take things so personally, like having a different opinion is insulting to them..  Little kids and spoiled brats act this way.

    Whoever said Ray is old and a defensive liability is accurate.. Nothing to be ashamed about, its the truth.

    I also dont think its a big deal nate blew past Ray... this goes on in games all the time.. Its tough to stop most any decent nba player 1on1, let alone a super quick guard like Nate. Why anyone makes a thread about this is beyond me...

     




     

    Do you always comment three times on threads you don't care about dummy?

     



    Have you always had this problem with reading comprehension??

     

    I wondered why someone, who'd have to be as stupid as you, would make a thread about this. Where did you glean the insight it was a thread I didnt care to comment on?

    Now slither away SFB's

     

     



    And that's 4 comments now.

     

    How many more comments are you going to have to write to process this post you don't care about in your extremely slow brain?

    I bet it takes you at least 2 more.

     




    Thanks for reacting so quickly, lets me know you care..a lot. ROFL

     

    Its no fun when its this easy.. cya chump lol



    If you look at the time stamps you reacted just as quickly. So your idea of a good insult is to react quicly and tell the other person they must care more than you because they reacted quickly.

     

    Karl. You are incredibly stupid.

     

     
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    Re: Nate Robinson blew by Ray Allen again

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

    1. Terry didn't come up big in the playoffs for the Celts?

    15 3-pointers in 6 games, 12.0 ppg, and raised his FG% in the playoffs. If you're saying Terry didn't come up big for the Celts in the playoffs then you're the hater.

    2. Last night was not the first time Nate Robinson embarrassed Ray Allen. Nate did the same thing to Ray when the Bulls snapped the Heat's 27-game winning streak.

    3. Ray is a defensive liability. That's all I'm saying. If you say Terry is also a defensive liability then I agree.

    4. All I'm saying is the Celts made the right decision not to give Ray a contract with a no trade clause. The Celts would've been stuck with Ray and it would have hurt the Celts' salary cap situation.



    1. No I'm not a Terry hater. I like Terry cause he helped DIrk to win a title, but he didn't come
        up big in this playoffs. He had 2 good games, 3 bad games and 1 mediocre game. That is not coming up big ecpecially if you compare the numbers to Ray's in the first round:

    Terry

    6 31.5 .444 .441 .818 2.2 2.0 0.3 0.7 1.5 0.8 12.0

    Ray

    4 28.8 .467 .464 1.000 4.3 2.3 0.0 1.0 1.3 1.3 16.5

    More points, higher shooting percentage in all categories, twice the rebounding numbers, more assists and more total FTs in less minutes for Ray. And lets not start to discuss about Lee.

    2. Even a young Ray at 6.5 could not contain a 5.7 Nate Robinsion. Cole and Chandler couldn't defend Nate either.

    3. No one can seriously believe that a 37 year old Ray can defend smaller and quicker guards. Even a great defender like Kidd couldn't do that at the age of 37. But Ray is still a fair defender against bigger guards (Bryant, Evans types) and a fair rebounder for his position, that was credited several times at ESPN. Terry is just a bad defender and a bad rebounder. Even when he was young, he was a bad defender. That is why he never started in Dallas.

    4. A 3 year deal for Ray would have hurt the Cs long term, you are right. But THIS year Terry cost us much more (salary cap wise). Next year we will be most likely a lottery team anyway, with or without Ray. And if we can trade Terry remains to be seen.

    A hater is a guy who is starting a threat every team Ray has a bad game or even a bad possesion in a game. Or celebrates when Ray getting blocked. Especially when Terry was worse than Ray all season long, cost us more this season, and our guards were getting blocked time and time again.

    A hater claims that because we got rid of Ray, we were a better rebounding team, which is crazy if the replacement is Terry.

    I tell you the same like I did to Kirk:

    Time to men up! Terry was worse than Ray this year (as a player and against the cap). There is no way to spin that, after the facts are on the table. You were voting for Terry at the beginning of the season, and you came up short. Not a big deal, no one can predict the future. But there is no way to deny the facts. Next year, next chance...

     
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    Re: Nate Robinson blew by Ray Allen again

    Yes, Ray was better in the RS AND much better in the post season. 2 good games in the series we lost in 6 is "Coming up big"? Where was that defensive liability Ray yesterday by the way? Where are the guys who claimed that Ray can only shoot 3s?

    Our rebound percentage increased by a freaking 0.02 and our rebounding differential went from -4.4 to -4.3. Wow, I'm really sure that is statistically relevant. Most likely if you take the "Sully factor" out of that equation, we would have been worse than last year. These number are significantly worse than 2 years ago by the way.

    But ok, I thought you are, unlike Kirk, a guy who admits when he was wrong. I was mistaken.

     
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    Re: Nate Robinson blew by Ray Allen again

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

     

    In response to OneOnOne's comment:

     

    Somebody gets beat by someone else every game.  To pick out a single play is absurd.  The  Heat didn't get Ray to play defense against point guards. Ray just happened to be the one matched up with Nate.  Nate pretty much scorched everyone he played against.

    Funny getting rid of Ray and adding Terry and Lee didn't make us a better rebounding team with the addition by subtraction rule that was laid on us.  We were still the next to last rebounding team in the league.  Nothing changed other than Terry turned out to be not as good as Ray. I thought JT would be a big help.  Turned out he did more talking than playing.

     



    Celts averaged 38.8 rebounds per game in 2011-12.

     

    This season the Celts averaged 39.35 rpg even when KG's rebounding numbers went down from 8.2 to 7.8 and Sully, the Celts best rebounder, was out for the season after January 30.

    Simple math from 38.8 to 39.35, a sight improvement but an improvement nonetheless.

     



    You my friend are grasping for straws.  You know as well as I know that is not what you meant when you said they would improve their rebounding.  Also when you made that comment you had no idea whether Sully would ever get off the bench or not let alone be out best rebounder.  It was basically getting rid of Ray would make us a better rebounding team because of their youth and hustle to the ball.  I believe one comment was,  "when was the last time you saw Ray dive for a loose ball".   Addition by substraction had nothing to do with Sully.

     

    Again if you think we improved in rebounding I have a bridge that is quite nice I would like to sell.  Moving up to next to last in the league is not what I call improvement.  If it is we can look at a 30 year rebuilding program around here.

     
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    Re: Nate Robinson blew by Ray Allen again

    Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction

    posted at 7/26/2012 8:02 PM EDT

    • Fiercest34
    • Posts: 15670
    • First: 3/24/2011
    • Last: 4/27/2013

     

     

    The Celtics averaged 38.8 rebounds per game last season. Dead last in the NBA!   This season that will change. With Ray gone, the Celts will surely get 40 rebounds per game.                 The C's were again next to last in rebounding with the Heat last (and under 40 rebounds.  More than likely the Heat win the title this year to put this argument to bed.
     
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    Re: Nate Robinson blew by Ray Allen again

    Our rebound percentage in the RS increased by a freaking .002 (forgot a zero before) and our rebounding differential went from -4.4 to -4.3. Wow, I'm really sure that is statistically relevant. Most likely if you take the "Sully factor" out of that equation, we would have been worse than last year.

    These number are significantly worse than 2 years ago by the way (rebound rate + .020 compared to this season, differential absolute -0.8).

    In the postseason we had a rebounding rate of .480 this year although KG channeld that inner Rodman for 3 games (with a dreadfull .140 on the offensive glass = 5.2 boards /game), last year we were at .486 !

    Fierce, similiar to Kirk, you are wrong and the numbers shows it. Stopt this nonsense and honor your word that you can admit it when you are wrong.

    http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/team/_/stat/rebounds-per-game/sort/avgOffensiveRebounds/seasontype/2

    EDIT:

    You ask what you were wrong about?

    1. We are better of with Terry than Ray as a player.

    2. Wer are better of with Terry salray cap wise (at least for this season, for the next season the jury is still on).

    3. We would be a better rebounding team without Ray

    4. We only got Lee cause we got rid of Ray (has nth to do with each other AND Lee was worseless in the postseason anyway) 

    5. Ray can only shoot threes and Terry is a better defender and all the other nonsense...

    Basically you were wrong with everything in this aspect, cause you were blinded from your emotions.

    And don't try to spin the case, with the question about our championship hopes. That has nothing to do with this case. I mentioned several time we are no contenders this season, and had the knicks in 6 by the way. But that doesn't change the fact that we were better off with Ray instead of Terry.

     
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    Re: Nate Robinson blew by Ray Allen again

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

    Gas

    What was I wrong about?

    That the Celts are better off with Ray Allen on a multi-year contract, at 37-years old, and with a no trade clause?

    The Celts were and are better off without Ray Allen because he would have only made the situation worse.

    Did you really expect the Celts to win a championship this season?


    You said at the earlier we were contenders,  I read that on a post this morning from earlier in the year.

    Here is your Ray Allen Post.

    Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction

    posted at 7/26/2012 8:02 PM EDT

    • Fiercest34
    • Posts: 15670
    • First: 3/24/2011
    • Last: 4/27/2013
    The Celtics averaged 38.8 rebounds per game last season. Dead last in the NBA!   This season that will change. With Ray gone, the Celts will surely get 40 rebounds per game.
     
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    Re: Nate Robinson blew by Ray Allen again

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

     

    1) Let's compromise. I agree that Terry is better salary cap-wise because he doesn't have a no trade clause on his contract. And I agree that Ray was the better player in the regular season. 

    2) Ray leaving was the best thing that happened to the Celtics. If Ray stayed then the Celts' salary cap situation this summer would screwed up.

    3)

    Celts averaged 7.71 offensive rebounds per game last season.

    This season the Celts are averaging 8.07 offensive rebounds per game.

     Last season the Celts were averaging 31.08 defensive rebounds per game.

    This season the Celts are averaging 31.27 defensive rebounds per game.

    4) I'm just a realistic Celtic fan.

     

     

    1) That is a start, but: Ray was also better than Terry when (according to you) it counted most: The Play Offs.  He was the second best player yesterday, when the game was on the line in the beginning.

    2) We don't know that, but you might be right. This year Terry cost us the MLE which we could have used for a PG. Next year IMO doesn't matter at all. We will most likely be a lottery team and won't attract big FAs. Ray or no Ray IMO is not important. But I will give you the benefit of doubt here, even though we don't know if we can trade Terry. And there was the chance that KG, PP and Ray would have retired all together, after the would have lost in the first or second round off the play offs after a hard fight.

    3) We got more rebounds cause we shot earlier in the clock after Rondo went down AND we had Sully in stretches. This were the only parts of the season, were had had higher rebounding totals. In the other parts of the season, we had lower totals then the season before. Anyway, that totals doesn't make us a better better rebounding team. It is the rebounding rate (and differential)! As I proved, our rate and the differential this season is similiar to last season and significantly worse that 2 years ago.


    4) No you are not in this case, otherwise you are IMO. You already admitted, that you feel betrayed by Ray. A realistic fan doesn't start a threat at every mistake Ray does on the court.

     
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    Re: Nate Robinson blew by Ray Allen again

    Sad, instead of sticking to your word and admit being wrong you act like Kirk. Actually you act worse, cause you bring up this nonesense videos when you have no arguments any more. I really overestimated you.

    But you are right once in this dicussion and I will give you credit as well. You found an area were Terry was better than Ray, both or among the best players in the league at their position by the way.

    All data from Hoopdata:

    Terry 0.2 times/game blocked equals 2.4 % of his shoot attemps.

    Ray 0.25 and 3.1%

    But like I said in a previous discussion, and you denied it, AB gets blocked much more:

    AB 0.68 and 7 %. Lee and Crawford are at 0.28/0.29 and 4.2/4.2 %.

    Well, looks like you should get used to see our SG getting blocked.

     
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    Re: Nate Robinson blew by Ray Allen again

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

    Gas

    Haven't it occurred to you that I'm just pulling your strings?

    You can bet that the next time Ray does something funny I'll make another thread about it because it's fun seeing your reaction.

    Why do you think I'm making these threads about Ray Allen?



    Yes, you said that before. Like you said that you hate Ray, cause he cheated on you with another girl (or better another man --> Lebron). If it is fun for you to get embarrassed all the time, when I have aruments and you have basically ... well, you have nothing but nonsense, so be it. Be my guest. As long I have some arguments, and some facts, I'm gonna present them. Like the facts that AB gets more than twice as much blocked as Ray. Or like the facts I presented to Kirk that the Spurs are not going for offensive rebounds.

    For me it is fun to share some arguments here and prove my opinion with some facts. If it is fun for you just to discuss for the sake of getting in a fight with fellow Celtics fans (and badmouth former players who brought us a title), so be it.

    I just don't think that is very mature. Actually I think it is stupid, as you have many things to contribute in this forum. Like your knowledge about salary cap rules and so on. But I won't change your personality by posting in a forum. What is making me sad, that I thought you are a guy, who honors his word. Thats all.

     

     

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