RAY ALLEN....

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from KGLove. Show KGLove's posts

    RAY ALLEN....

    He hasn't been right since he made that record.... and then losing the 3 point contest didnt help either... -___-
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from truth-torpedo34. Show truth-torpedo34's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    He hasn't been the same since we stopped setting crisp screens. Earlier this year doc remarked that baby had become a jump shooter, rather than a pick setter. Without players that understand that they are role players, ray gets screwed. Our offense is also running slow and deliberately, so you can see where ray is headed to.
     
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    Re: RAY ALLEN....


    I think Ray needs to come off the bench as a 6th man type; he's looking more like Willie Mays with the Mets the way he's fumbling the ball at times..He needs more rest and to play against a 2nd tier player to be effective for us..My opinion
     
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    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN....:
    [QUOTE]He hasn't been the same since we stopped setting crisp screens. Earlier this year doc remarked that baby had become a jump shooter, rather than a pick setter. Without players that understand that they are role players, ray gets screwed. Our offense is also running slow and deliberately, so you can see where ray is headed to.
    Posted by truth-torpedo34[/QUOTE]

    If DOc said that, then how come he hasnt corrected it??

    If its true and a reason why Ray isnt getting shots, then it sounds like Doc isnt doing his job to make sure BBD does his.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from terrrapin. Show terrrapin's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    Forget the offense. He, Rondo and Pierce have played zero defense on the three point line. Again, last night, 2-10 for us and 9-22 for them. It makes a heck of a difference. By my count 21 points.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from SoCalCeltFan. Show SoCalCeltFan's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN....:
    [QUOTE]I think Ray needs to come off the bench as a 6th man type; he's looking more like Willie Mays with the Mets the way he's fumbling the ball at times..He needs more rest and to play against a 2nd tier player to be effective for us..My opinion
    Posted by tomobo[/QUOTE]

    Mine also. It would give the second unit some firepower, since Ray would be playing against the other team's bench. It would give Green a chance to play the 2, where he should be able to post up other twos on offense, and prevent the other team's twos from posting him up. It would give Ray a chance to go all out and not worry about pacing himself. It would make the Cs starting 5 more athletic. Maybe Doc will try this over the last 4 games. As for Ray's feelings? Even HE should know that shooting 3 hours before games doesn't help in getting to 50 -50 balls [which he doesn't], boxing out [which he doesn't], and making good passes [which he doesn't]. He's a designated shooter who went to the All Star Game as a Legacy. Now, it's time to go to work.
     
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    Re: RAY ALLEN....


    Yes, good ideas. It is time to see if the big 3 are as selfless has advertised (Ray seems to me to be the most emotionally equipped to handle such a move).
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from terrrapin. Show terrrapin's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN....:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN.... : Mine also. It would give the second unit some firepower, since Ray would be playing against the other team's bench. It would give Green a chance to play the 2, where he should be able to post up other twos on offense, and prevent the other team's twos from posting him up. It would give Ray a chance to go all out and not worry about pacing himself. It would make the Cs starting 5 more athletic. Maybe Doc will try this over the last 4 games. As for Ray's feelings? Even HE should know that shooting 3 hours before games doesn't help in getting to 50 -50 balls [which he doesn't], boxing out [which he doesn't], and making good passes [which he doesn't]. He's a designated shooter who went to the All Star Game as a Legacy. Now, it's time to go to work.
    Posted by SoCalCeltFan[/QUOTE]

    In this scenario, Paul goes to the two. They were doing it last night for awhile.
    Jeff goes to the three.
     
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  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Celtsfan4life. Show Celtsfan4life's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN....:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN.... : Mine also. It would give the second unit some firepower, since Ray would be playing against the other team's bench. It would give Green a chance to play the 2, where he should be able to post up other twos on offense, and prevent the other team's twos from posting him up. It would give Ray a chance to go all out and not worry about pacing himself. It would make the Cs starting 5 more athletic. Maybe Doc will try this over the last 4 games. As for Ray's feelings? Even HE should know that shooting 3 hours before games doesn't help in getting to 50 -50 balls [which he doesn't], boxing out [which he doesn't], and making good passes [which he doesn't]. He's a designated shooter who went to the All Star Game as a Legacy. Now, it's time to go to work.
    Posted by SoCalCeltFan[/QUOTE]

    Sorry, but I couldn't disagree more.  If Ray is with the bench, then he is not with guys who pass the ball as much (Green, BBD, and others don't move the ball around like KG and Paul and Rondo).   In addition, the defense knows Ray will be the main scorer with the bench and they play him tighter because he's not with 2 or 3 other real offensive threats.   

    I think Ray's problems stem from his own moving slow - he has to move more but just doesn't seem to have the fire.....and from Rondo not setting him up like he did earlier in the year.  Rondo and Ray aren't even looking at each other to run plays for Ray most of the game.  Watch the two of them when Rondo brings it up - Ray goes to a spot and stands and Rondo looks the other way.  Not blaming one of them - I'm blaming BOTH of them.   This used to be a Rondo strength - getting everyone the ball.  Now its a weakness.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Celtsfan4life. Show Celtsfan4life's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN....:
    [QUOTE]ever notice ..this happens to Ray about this time every year? Shots just don't seem to happen?
    Posted by sday4x4[/QUOTE]

    You're perception is incorrect, my friend.

    That's a common perception, but I went back to the stats to check.  Last year, Ray shot 47% from the field, but shot 51% for the last 15 games of the season.  His number of shots per game went down from 12.1 to 10.8 (essentially one shot a game less) but he shot 4 % points better.  The year before (08/09 season), Ray shot 48% for the full season and 47% in the last 15 games (same percentage).  His number of shots was 13.1 for the season and 12.9 for the last 15 games (0.2 shots less per game).  His 3 point % went from 41% for the season to 42% for the last 15 games that year.

    By the way, his minutes were 36.4 per game in 08/09, 35.2 in 09/10, and 36.1 in 10/11).   So his minutes are the same.

    So, he shot the same or better at the end of the year than he did the rest of the season for the last 2 years and his minutes are the same!!

    So, this year's end of season swoon is NOT like Ray's last two years.  He's underperforming much differently than previous years.  I hope he gets out of the funk because he gets points in bunches when he's on and makes the scoring easier for the team.  We need him to do that and people will double team him as he comes off the pick - allowing KG and Paul to get more open lanes to the basket.  Ray and Paul help each other in that way - so we need Ray!


    All stats above can be obtained from this site:  http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/a/allenra02/gamelog/2009/
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Gasthoerer. Show Gasthoerer's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    Wow,
    Ray played a great season. He is in a slump for a couple of weeks now (like almost the entire team). And suddenly he is old and washed up. Even his work around before games is wrong now. Some weeks ago the board was yelling at Rondo to join Ray to training before the game...
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from KGLove. Show KGLove's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    I definitely don't think Ray is washed up but he's been wayyyy off lately, they've been giving him the ball more like he asked and he's still missing.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from genaro008. Show genaro008's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    J/O and Shaq setting picks will only help
     
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  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from teh-n00b. Show teh-n00b's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    I think he misses having perk set screens for him. sure, some of them were illegal, but there were also some real good, bone-crunching ones.

    getting shaq back should solve this. don't underestimate the value of a good screen
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN....:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN.... : Sorry, but I couldn't disagree more.  If Ray is with the bench, then he is not with guys who pass the ball as much (Green, BBD, and others don't move the ball around like KG and Paul and Rondo).   In addition, the defense knows Ray will be the main scorer with the bench and they play him tighter because he's not with 2 or 3 other real offensive threats.    I think Ray's problems stem from his own moving slow - he has to move more but just doesn't seem to have the fire.....and from Rondo not setting him up like he did earlier in the year.  Rondo and Ray aren't even looking at each other to run plays for Ray most of the game.  Watch the two of them when Rondo brings it up - Ray goes to a spot and stands and Rondo looks the other way.  Not blaming one of them - I'm blaming BOTH of them.   This used to be a Rondo strength - getting everyone the ball.  Now its a weakness.
    Posted by Celtsfan4life[/QUOTE]

    I've noticed the same thing...have been watching for it.

    On one play Ray brought the ball up, ROndo signaled for Ray to give it up & Ray looked away from him.

    On the next trip down Ray circled off a screen and was momentarily open when Rondo just turned his head away.

    I think theres some friction btw the 2 of them
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from OneOnOne. Show OneOnOne's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN....:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN.... : I've noticed the same thing...have been watching for it. On one play Ray brought the ball up, ROndo signaled for Ray to give it up & Ray looked away from him. On the next trip down Ray circled off a screen and was momentarily open when Rondo just turned his head away. I think theres some friction btw the 2 of them
    Posted by Karllost[/QUOTE]

    Another thing I have noticed is when Ray has the ball outside, Pierce will have someone posted up, even a smaller guy and Ray will flat not throw the ball. He whips it back to the top of the key to Rondo and the runs baseline wanting a pick to get a shot on the other side.   I just wonder is Ray worried about his PTS?  I sure which Doc would play him about 20 minutes a game the rest of the year.  We lose to Miami and the who team may get a break.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from futbal. Show futbal's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    Ray was the best of the Big 3 this year until he took that hard knock to the head in New York couple weeks back. He's probably suffering from that but both he and the coaching/management aren't saying anything; just going to macho it out. That, or Doc really has burnt him out. But the sharp drop off in his running and speed suggest it was the blow that slowed him. Also, last night he absolutely missed catching and easy ball that was passed to him; when I saw that I thought, wow, this guy can't even see the ball right. I think they have to get him some real rest and give him a chance to get right before the playoff.
     
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    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN....:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN.... : Another thing I have noticed is when Ray has the ball outside, Pierce will have someone posted up, even a smaller guy and Ray will flat not throw the ball. He whips it back to the top of the key to Rondo and the runs baseline wanting a pick to get a shot on the other side.   I just wonder is Ray worried about his PTS?  I sure which Doc would play him about 20 minutes a game the rest of the year.  We lose to Miami and the who team may get a break.
    Posted by OneOnOne[/QUOTE]

     Says the Ray hater!!
     
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    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN....:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN.... : True that.
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]

    I wonduh-r, does it have anything to do with ray averaging MORE MINUTES PER GAME than any other season as a Celtic?  We had Marquis for a good part of the year, Von Wafer molding on the bench for the other half.  Still Ray gets tons and TONS of minutes. 

    Welcome to the roster management hell that is doc rivers.  zero innovation, zero experimentation.  I've been saying for over a year that Ray should be spear heading the bench unit.  Things are very stale in our offense right now.  Don't blame it on Davis "being a jump shooter and not a pick setter".  That is foolish.

    The problem is that these old guys have been over-used with the exception of KG maybe.  Add in Doc's lack of imagination to mix things up and we are looking at another Coffin-Ray heading INTO the playoffs.  It used to be that Ray would make it to the palyoffs and a series or two in before he cashed out for an extended nap in a coffin.

    This year looks like an early and potentially extended nap.

    You can go up and down the line with Rivers and this bullcrap with the roster.  He played most of the year with a short playoff-like rotation, letting the too-old-for-these-minutes vets sweat it out on the floor for loads of minutes.  Going to be a fun playoffs.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from concord27. Show concord27's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    Acie,
    Right again, Ray has been played more minutes and even when unproductive Doc plays him anyway.  His ballhandling had become a problem and his much lower number of three point attempts is glaring recently.   

    Play Jeff Green cut Ray's minutes.  
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from RosalieTCeltics. Show RosalieTCeltics's posts

    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    Better that this bump in the road happens now, let's see what Miami brings to the table tomorrow afternoon.  Ray could probably use a few less minutes as he and Paul are really being played too much.  Obviously, with West gone last night, Doc really didn't trust Arroyo to be the second guard off the bench. He played short minutes and they were unimpressive. However, here we go again with Doc not playing the players he has on that bench.  I was shocked Murph
    got the minutes he did last night.  We had to have him, but, even when the ankle was cleared, we ddn't see him until last night. Why?  Give the guy a break, let him play some meaningful minutes and let's see why it was so important to sign him.  Maybe signing Leon would have been the answer, nothing to teach, he knew the system, and as of right now is healthy

    Ray still is am important cog in this offense so it is up to the coaches to come up with an answer.

     
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    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    In Response to Re: RAY ALLEN....:
    [QUOTE]Better that this bump in the road happens now, let's see what Miami brings to the table tomorrow afternoon.  Ray could probably use a few less minutes as he and Paul are really being played too much.  Obviously, with West gone last night, Doc really didn't trust Arroyo to be the second guard off the bench. He played short minutes and they were unimpressive. However, here we go again with Doc not playing the players he has on that bench.  I was shocked Murph got the minutes he did last night.  We had to have him, but, even when the ankle was cleared, we ddn't see him until last night. Why?  Give the guy a break, let him play some meaningful minutes and let's see why it was so important to sign him.  Maybe signing Leon would have been the answer, nothing to teach, he knew the system, and as of right now is healthy Ray still is am important cog in this offense so it is up to the coaches to come up with an answer.
    Posted by RosalieTCeltics[/QUOTE]

    A couple years ago you called me a troll for asking whether Ray was hurt or a choker.

    I'm not a troll but admit I can come off as one at times.

    I now see how wrong I've been to ever ask if Ray Allen chokes. I watched him this year defy the physics of age and carry this team for most of the season. When Ray has faded, it has been the fault of Doc Rivers. I see how well Popavich has preserved Tim Duncan over the years and see that Doc has been the opposite with Ray. The funny thing is Doc has been a genius in keeping down KG's minutes. Maybe the problem was Ray only hurt his ankles and didn't have a knee blow out. If his injury had been more serious, maybe Doc would have protected Ray the same way he has KG.

    We need the Ray from earlier in the season and not the Ray we've seen the last month. Doc has treated Wafer the same way he has Murphy, and even Marquis and Tony at times over the last years. So if Ray doesn't snap out of his funk, there will be no viable alternatives. He hasn't really developed Green to go with Pierce as a swing men combination. West is good, but if he plays shooting guard with Rondo, that leaves us kind of small in the backcourt. If the O'Neals aren't up to the task of protecting the paint, Doc will probably go with the short Big Baby extra minutes, and that is a recipe for disaster. It seems too late to get Murphy into the rotation. I'm glad Doc is being careful with Jermaine. I think this team will eventually live or die with Shaq. He might only be a 20 minute player at this point in his career, but we need those 20 minutes.
     
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    Re: RAY ALLEN....

    Where is Ray Allen.....
     
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