Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from hedleylamarr. Show hedleylamarr's posts

    Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction

    In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction : What a moron. Wasn't 2010 when Kobe played with a torn ligament in his shooting hand and broken pinky finger for the ENTIRE season including that game 7 in which his team won the title? Not to mention the other injuries incurred throughout that year. You need to research more before you post, as you look very foolish. http://dimemag.com/2010/01/kobe-bryants-mounting-injuries-raising-red-flags/
    Posted by BynumizaHERO[/QUOTE]

    So.....it only bothered him the one game??
     
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    Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction

    In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction : So.....it only bothered him the one game??
    Posted by hedleylamarr[/QUOTE]

    My guess would be no, but he did come through in the end of that game with a nice jumper over PP and some clutch free throws.
     
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    Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction

    In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction : That's why by getting younger the Celts solved part of the rebounding problem. I mean how many times have we seen JO and Ray just stand there not going after a rebound or a loose ball. Last season I never saw Ray dive on the floor to fight for a loose ball.
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]

    1. Lee and AB are not better rebounders than Ray.
    2. Ray did rebound very well last post season (Pierce didn't by the way)
    3. You better watch the pictures in the thread you opened more carefully than you watch the games.

    Why do you always go overboard about Ray that much? Do you really think a new SG will solve our rebounding issues? It won't. Changing the SG is not the answer for rebounding issues. Especially not if our former SG was a above average rebounder at his position (and one of your future SG guards is only 6.2). Our rebounding issues were on the 5, until KG moves to 5 and at the 4 afterwards. In the postseason, especially against miami it was also the SF position were we get killed on the boards.
     
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    Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction

    In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction : It's even more exclusive if you factor in only two of them did it in a league with more than 10 teams and a 3pt line.
    Posted by LAL 32[/QUOTE]


    Yes, but we dont' factor in what you want, just the truth!
     
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    Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction

    In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction : Let's just revisit this subject in November. There's no point in arguing over a Miami Heat player. Ray Allen best shooter in NBA history. But other than shooting he doesn't do anything else. Not a good defender, not a good passer, shaky ball-handler, and he doesn't even hustle! I asked everyone to find a video of Ray Allen on the floor, diving for a loose ball, in last season's playoffs. Nobody found one. I mean it's a highlight if you see Ray on the floor because that rarely happens. And I watched every playoff game the Celts played in last season.
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]
    Of course we can discuss in november. But it is a fact that Ray (as great shooter he is) shot horrible last postseason until he went back to his routine. Not even his biggest supporter can say different. It is also a fact:
    1) Ray rebounded well last post season (Pierce didn't). And is a better rebounder than Lee and AB so far.
    2) Ray played above average defense for most games last postseason. (Was mentioned several times from the broadcasters, users of this forum and can be seen from the stats of his opponents)
    3) If you had watched the games, or just some pictures in your thread you see him on the floor winning a loose ball.
    4) He had VERY FEW turnovers (he always had low #'s for the Cs but last post season was really impressive low). Ray the turn over machine (like folks here used to call him) is just a fairy tale.

    These are the facts. You are a Ray hater for years, so it is clear that you don't admit it, now or in november. But facts are facts.

    To claim a SG will solve our rebounding issues (and especially Lee and AB instead of Ray) is pure hate.
     
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    Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction

    In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction : The point is the Lakers of 2010 and the Heat of 2012 found ways to beat the Celts even if they were not 100%.  In 2008 Pierce got hurt but he stepped up. The Celts got a title even when Pierce wasn't 100%, right? So it's not true that if you suffer an injury, in the Finals or playoffs, you can't win. And please, a bruised leg? I also showed you how the "no rebounds, no rings" theory was proven right in 2010 and 2012. Leading 3-2 heading into both Game 6s and the Celts couldn't close it out. In both Games 6 and 7 in both 2010 and 2012 the Celts lost the rebounding battle and eventually the game.  The bottomline is if you're put in a position to win, you rise to the occasion. Not make excuses about a bruised leg or that Jeff Green was injured. In fact, Jeff Green was never even a part of the Celts team last season. You keep making excuses. Championship teams don't make excuses, they just win!
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]

    Speak to ray allen about how he was historically good in game 2 and then 4-28 after the dirty Artest play from 3, I love when the average joe's pretend they can tell the pro's what can and cannot be played thru. slight miniscus tears to PP/Bynum, based on their solid performances, are obv. not as big a deal as what Artest did to Ray... he had 14 years worth of stats to prove this... an MRI said I tore my miniscus (stupidly sprinting in sandals) but I could play ball with a brace despite the cartiledge damage right after and just had to deal with some swelling, what ray went thru was apparently was much worse

    as I have and will always continue to say, injuries kept us from more banners way more than being a poor rebounding team... Ainge put together a champion squad that wasn't a great rebounding team but was elite in many other ways... then they got hurt, thats why they lost... the rebounding issues were secondary by far, and thats not debatable
     
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    Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction

    In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction:
    [QUOTE]Another 2010 Finals FACT The Lakers outrebounded the Celts in 4 of the 7 games of that Finals series. That means the Lakers won the rebounding battle 4 times out of the 7 total games. And in ALL THE 3 CELTIC WINS, the Celts outrebounded the Lakers in all those wins!
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]

    Fortunately, we only play the twin tower Lakers twice in a season, once on each court. They usually shoot 35-40% and we a better 35-45% but their 10+ rebounds gives their mediocre shooters, except for Kobe, extra chances.  Now with Nash, they have one less mediocre shooter. One of the reasons we shot well was Ray's 3s...won't have that anymore.  Yup, I agree with many posts that with younger players & good wing rebounders, Wilcox, Lee, Green, Bass etc. & now, hopefully, Sully, we'll not be last in rebounding. Plus we have the best rebounding guard in the game, Rondo...and AB ain't a bad rebounder either.  Of course, we still have KG but he's thin, older & not a Banger & probably plays best away from under the basket offensively so he can shoot those deadly 5-15 footers. But, the pressure will be on us to shoot 40-45% and then we need not worry so much about rebounds !!! Still would have liked a big man..even if he fouled out but caused some havoc under the basket offensively & defensively. !!!

     
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    Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction

    In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction:
    [QUOTE]Another 2010 Finals FACT The Lakers outrebounded the Celts in 4 of the 7 games of that Finals series. That means the Lakers won the rebounding battle 4 times out of the 7 total games. And in ALL THE 3 CELTIC WINS, the Celts outrebounded the Lakers in all those wins!
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]

    I agree that rebounding the ball is very important. But when you win the match and at the same time you're the winner of the rebounding battle i think the latter is only a consequence of many other factors. Yes, in certain situations it could be the decisive factor. But you win mainly because you're better than your opponent.
    Every team has its own liabilities and i don't think that rebounds are more important than some other facets of the game. In my opinion if you have a very good team it all comes down to who is your team's best player.

    And i didn't make any research but i can name a few examples:

    91-93: Best Player in th Finals - Jordan, the winner - the Bulls
    94-95: Olajuwon, the Rockets
    96-98: Jordan, the Bulls
    99,03,05,07: Duncan, the Spurs
    00-02: O'Neal, LA
    04: oopsSmile
    06: Wade, the Heat
    08: Pierce (Garnett), the Celtics
    09-10: Bryant (Gasol), LA
    11: Nowitzki, the Mavs
    12: James, the Heat
     
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    Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction

    Fierce spin it any way you want, The Celtics were not a good rebounding team but that wouldn't have kept them from a title if they were healthy or even if they got a fair shake from the refs.

    Teams that were talented enough to win it all but were facing injuries don't go back and blame a specific skill they underperformed in all season as the reason they came up 12 minutes short of a title. 'Oh if only we had a better rebounder we'd be a champion' give me a break... and each and every player knows in his own mind if he gave 100% or not and will live with that.

    But when you have a 40% 3 point shooter reduced to a 0% one in a series deciding home game, and then a 15% one the last 5 games of a 7 game series, are missing your starting center for 90 of the series last 96 minutes and your best player is a shadow of the guy he was 2 years earlier b/c of an injury AND you see a FT parade in the end off of fouls that didn't even feature contact... well.... a rebounding weakness is further down on the list of reasons you lost than everything I said above

    nothing you say can change that and make rebounding more of the reason we were defeated, so time to move on
     
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    Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction

    In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction : That's not true. All you have to show for is your opinion.  * In 2008 the Celts won a championship even when Pierce suffered an injury in Game 1 of the Finals. * Ray Allen is not the #1 go to guy of the Celts. In fact, KG and Rondo are more important than Ray. Proof of this is when Ray went 0% from 3pt land in Games 3, 4, and 5 in Boston. The Celts won 2 out of the 3 games in that series, remember? So there goes your theory of 40% to 0%. * Last season the Celts lost the regular season series to the Lakers. In Boston the Celts lost 88-87 in OT. Ray had 22 pts and 2-6 3pt FGs. At LA the Celts lost also, 94-97. Ray had 17 pts and 3-8 3pt FGs. One thing is consistent in both losses, the Celts got outrebounded in both games. Again, rame, the Heat and Lakers won even when one of their key players got hurt. But you're saying the reason why the Celts lost in 2010 is because of a bruised leg.  I think it's you that should move on. I'm giving you facts and actual data and you're just giving me your opinion. You can't even back it up! I mean you're saying it's because of Ray's bruised leg and yet the Celts won 2 out of 3 games in Boston. Ray made ZERO 3-pointers in Games 3, 4, and 5 and the Celts still won 2 out of 3. Andrew Bynum had a partially torn meniscus, he had to take injections before every game in the 2010 Finals. And just because Ray's leg got bruised it was the end of the Celts? Ha Ha Ha
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]

    I don't know why I bothered to try again but we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one, I feel I provided the superior evidence and most of the other people on this board agree and understand that injuries were a bigger issue/reason we lost than rebounding

    But rebounding was a big deal as well, it is a waste of time to continue talking to you about this but the only reason I did was b/c you speak in absolutes about things that are your opinions and need to stop doing that
     
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  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: Rebounding: Addition by Subtraction

    I said injuries as in taken as a whole, not just Ray's

    But Allen's charliehorse/deep bruise kept us from winning game 3, and taking the series in 5

    pretty much a bigger deal than rebounding issues that never would have been magnified in a 5 game series that never made it back to LA...
     

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