Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from BaileyPowe. Show BaileyPowe's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    come on, petey. you're objective, that's fine. i'm objective, too. but it's not the team that makes rondo this good. it's rondo that makes the team this good. rondo's not racking up dimes at this obscene rate because his teammates are such sharpshooters. rather, the Cs dwarf the rest of the league in FG% because rondo is just this good a playmaker.  
     
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    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?! : im pretty sure that there are things that every player in the nba needs to work on. noones great at EVERYTHING. the problem with you guys is there is ONE area rondo needs to work at, his ft shooting, and your trying to put an unproven late-game player on the court for bigtime FT over a player that makes them when it counts. you can say he needs to work on 3's, but he really doesnt. its a luxury if you can shoot them. his midrange shot is good and improving. Doc said this about rondo yesterday: "We wanted him to take shots; that's the next step for him," Rivers said after Monday's game. "He can make those shots. That's what's so frustrating to our guys: [Rondo] passed up at least six of them today, maybe seven. Rondo can make those shots. We just have to get him to take them after a miss. Because the way [the Timberwolves] guarded him tonight is the way they're going to guard him in the playoffs.   "I see him every day in practice make that shot. Two years ago, I didn't say that. He's an elbow shooter. He can make them all day. He will make them all day. We've just got to make him keep shooting."   last nights late game misshap had NOTHING to do with rondo being unable to shoot ft..thats just a stupid idea bc robinson was passing rondo the ball and rondo got knocked over by ginobli. then the play before they stole the ball from pierce, not bc rondo couldnt shoot ft, but bc pierce was trying to draw an intentional foul. lets not try to pin everything on rondo just bc theres things about him you dont approve of. the guys an all-world pg, his FT shooting will come along, just like every other part of his game has.
    Posted by JamezHill24


    Sorry Jamez... the opps will let us all know when Rondo's midrange game is "good and improving" because they will start guarding him. Trust me on this.

    To my knowledge, Rondo has never made a FT "when it counted."

    Pierce got doubled at the end leading to the TO when CPP felt it unwise to pass the ball to Rondo who would have been immediately fouled. And who could blame CPP?

    Nate's pass to Rondo that resulted in a TO was Rondo's fault because Rondo didn't come to the ball. He didn't want it.

    I think I know why.

    Pud
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from jeezem. Show jeezem's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    Rondo made shots at the end of the last 2 close games and they won both games.  I might cring a little bit if he had to shoot free throws at the end of the game, but as we saw last night even Ray Allen can miss a couple free throws at the end of a game.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

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    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    Rondo made shots at the end of the last 2 close games and they won both games.  I might cring a little bit if he had to shoot free throws at the end of the game, but as we saw last night even Ray Allen can miss a couple free throws at the end of a game.
    Posted by jeezem


    Those shots did not win games.  They helped.... like any other made shot late in a close game but Rondo has yet to win a game with a shot or a FT.

    Pud
     
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    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    come on, petey. you're objective, that's fine. i'm objective, too. but it's not the team that makes rondo this good. it's rondo that makes the team this good. rondo's not racking up dimes at this obscene rate because his teammates are such sharpshooters. rather, the Cs dwarf the rest of the league in FG% because rondo is just this good a playmaker.  
    Posted by BaileyPowe


    I do think its a combination though. great shooters/scorers AND a really good playmaker. Don't think he would have 14-something apg on the Kings.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Driscoll92587. Show Driscoll92587's posts

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    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    You are definitely not idiots.  But if you are a Celtic fan you need to give Rondo his due.  If you watched that game you didn't have to check stats to see he was the most dominant player.
    Posted by concord27


    You don't even need to be a Cetlics fan to appreciate what Rondo's been doing this season and especially last night.  Every basketball fan I know (boston fan to Lakers fan) has been drooling over Rondo's game.  But in lieu of the dense competition within the NBA PG position, it's still a tough call to make when defining the best player at the point.  Clearly Rondo has established himself as one of the best defensive PG, rebounding PG, and passing PG.  But I still say that the best PG will be established at the end of this season, and the mix consists of:

    Rondo
    CP3
    Nelson
    Westbrook
    Williams

    And that is the order I rank them as of right now.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from basketbert. Show basketbert's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?! : im pretty sure that there are things that every player in the nba needs to work on. noones great at EVERYTHING. the problem with you guys is there is ONE area rondo needs to work at, his ft shooting, and your trying to put an unproven late-game player on the court for bigtime FT over a player that makes them when it counts. you can say he needs to work on 3's, but he really doesnt. its a luxury if you can shoot them. his midrange shot is good and improving. Doc said this about rondo yesterday: "We wanted him to take shots; that's the next step for him," Rivers said after Monday's game. "He can make those shots. That's what's so frustrating to our guys: [Rondo] passed up at least six of them today, maybe seven. Rondo can make those shots. We just have to get him to take them after a miss. Because the way [the Timberwolves] guarded him tonight is the way they're going to guard him in the playoffs.   "I see him every day in practice make that shot. Two years ago, I didn't say that. He's an elbow shooter. He can make them all day. He will make them all day. We've just got to make him keep shooting."   last nights late game misshap had NOTHING to do with rondo being unable to shoot ft..thats just a stupid idea bc robinson was passing rondo the ball and rondo got knocked over by ginobli. then the play before they stole the ball from pierce, not bc rondo couldnt shoot ft, but bc pierce was trying to draw an intentional foul. lets not try to pin everything on rondo just bc theres things about him you dont approve of. the guys an all-world pg, his FT shooting will come along, just like every other part of his game has.
    Posted by JamezHill24


    He has to work both on his FTs and mid-range jumper. Threes are unneccesary.
    You're quoting Doc, but he is voicing the same what some guys here are saying: he has to improve in those areas, especially during crunch time. "Guys are frustrated" That's a pretty unambiguous statement, no? Apparently he can shoot in practice (and the all-star game), so it may be psychological.

    If he gets it down he'll be on another level.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from KGLove. Show KGLove's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?! : Agreed... Delonte at the end. Rondo's FT shooting issues led to two critical turnovers  in the last minute of the game that nearly ruined RR's otherwise wonderous performance. Pud
    Posted by puddinpuddin


    Rondo's FT issues or Ray Allen's? If the best FT shooter on our team can't hit clutch FT how can we expect anyone else to?... As for the last TO, did you not hear the announcers saying they were fouling Pierce but the refs weren't calling it, Pierce was so caught up in the foul that it allowed them to steal the ball.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Driscoll92587. Show Driscoll92587's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?! : He has to work both on his FTs and mid-range jumper. Threes are unneccesary. You're quoting Doc, but he is voicing the same what some guys here are saying: he has to improve in those areas, especially during crunch time. "Guys are frustrated" That's a pretty unambiguous statement, no? Apparently he can shoot in practice (and the all-star game), so it may be psychological. If he gets it down he'll be on another level.
    Posted by basketbert


    It's also different because he is a pass-first PG.  Plus, with the likes of Ray, Paul, and KG, why should he take more shots when he can get a higher percentage bucket for the team by passing to one of these guys?  I think he plays his game perfectly.  He doesn't need to shoot and I like the way he's so selective with his shot selection.  He doesn't waste possessions trying to get his jumper going.  It's for the greater good of the team that he doesn't shoot 10-15 shots per game, even if he had a decent outside jumper.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Petey62. Show Petey62's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    come on, petey. you're objective, that's fine. i'm objective, too. but it's not the team that makes rondo this good. it's rondo that makes the team this good. rondo's not racking up dimes at this obscene rate because his teammates are such sharpshooters. rather, the Cs dwarf the rest of the league in FG% because rondo is just this good a playmaker.  
    Posted by BaileyPowe


    BaileyPowe, Rondo's numbers would not be the same if he were the PG for the Washington Wizards.  It's a combination of both.  Rondo does a masterful job setting guys up.  No doubt about it.  But after getting set up, Ray and the guys HAVE to make the shots.  THAT is what allows a PG to amass 22 assists in a game.  Rondo makes the pass when it needs to be made and to whom it needs to go and then that player shoots and makes the shot.

    All I'm saying is that it's a combination of both.  With our team FG% being as high as it is, I'd expect our PG to have a high assist rate.  We have 3 superstar players who offensively can get a basket whenever they want.  That HAS to count for something.  That's why I contend it's a combination of both Rondo's passing and the fact that our shots are falling.

    If our shots aren't falling and Rondo ends up with 9 or 10 assists, that doesn't make Rondo less of a player.  It just means the guys were unable to make their shots and get him the assists.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from jrleftfoot. Show jrleftfoot's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    Nash doesn`t belong on that list. I generally agree with your point though.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?! : Rondo's FT issues or Ray Allen's? If the best FT shooter on our team can't hit clutch FT how can we expect anyone else to?... As for the last TO, did you not hear the announcers saying they were fouling Pierce but the refs weren't calling it, Pierce was so caught up in the foul that it allowed them to steal the ball.
    Posted by KGLove


    So your argument seems to be that since the best clutch FT shooter doesn't hit 100% of the time, Rondo gets a free pass... along with everyone else????

    Is that your position?

    RayRay is one of the best FT shooters in the history of the game... and Rondo is one of the very worst... in the history of the league.

    One is a nearly automatic MAKE and the other is a nearly automatic DRAW IRON at crunch time.

    Which one shoots techs BTW... and why?

    Pud
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from jeezem. Show jeezem's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?! : Those shots did not win games.  They helped.... like any other made shot late in a close game but Rondo has yet to win a game with a shot or a FT. Pud
    Posted by puddinpuddin

    Actually, off the top of my head there was a game last year where they were down by one, and the last shot was a lob thrown to Rondo who converted at the buzzer for a win.  


     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from paulliu. Show paulliu's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    That lob to Rondo was a great call.   With Pierce and Allen around to act as decoys, Rondo was wide open.  A great instance of turning an apparent weakness (Rondo's weak perimeter shooting) into a strength (the defense discounting Rondo to key on Pierce ad Allen) to allow Rondo to score the buzzer beater.

    I do not count it against Rondo that he has never made a buzzer beating perimeter shot to win or tie a game.  With Allen, Pierce and, to a lesser extent KG, available, the only way Rondo will get that shot is on a broken play.

    Be that as it may, is there any doubt that the offense is much better with Rondo as the playmaker?
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Icon11. Show Icon11's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?! : Rondo totally blasted Parker tonight 22 assists to 5.  Not counting the triple double.  Does this mean Parker isn't any good?  No. But  we were posting that crap about BBD when Love dominated him in rebounds. go figure. There is not a pt guard in the league that could run the Celtic offense like Rondo. Hands down the best distributor in the game.  Williams, Nash, Paul, Rose, none of them would make this team click like Rondo.  They are all too busy looking for their own shots.
    Posted by OneOnOne



    Wild.  This is how I started the post about Davis getting outrebounded 24 to 1.  "Now I am not saying Davis stinks or that he needs to be traded.  I have mentioned before that the one thing that he doesn't do well IMO is board."  Since I put that up I have been called a GBD hater and in this post it gets insinuated I said he wasn't any good. 

    I thought most of you guys understood English.  
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Icon11. Show Icon11's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    more or at least the same as anyone else, i loves to watch rondo cause havoc for other teams and nice fluid offense for us. but you guys, 90% or thereabouts of you, have forgotten about the laker series last year and every year in the playoffs once rondo's shooting from the line falls into a hole- what happens to us? the sag defense.  the deeper we go into the playoffs, the less running game there is.  so it slows down.  and so does rondo's production because he won't then drive into traffic and get hacked and can't shoot the J adequately to keep his man out of the paint; all in all we play 4 on 5 in the half court set and no team can overcome that. he looked masterful last night.  and he was.  but fast forward to the playoffs.  he has NEVER shot was horrible as 41% from the line.  sure, he'll come up 10-15 points at the end of the year when he suddenly (why suddenly) shoots more FT's than before and can be seen taking jumpers with more frequency in games.  but 56-58% free throws and "hot" from the stripe and his jumper heading into the playoffs.... i see trouble ahead.  the dude has boogeymen in his head worse than any player i've ever seen with the jumper and freebie.  it all comes apart each year in the playoffs, go look at the box scores and stats.  the problem with this year is that he's never been anywhere near as bad as 41% from the line at this point!!!!  i wish it didn't come apart for the guy.  he's mvp quality player with it all "together", but yes, he does need to have it all together for this team to go deep.  once he lost confidence in the laker series, we were finished.  no more easy anything because kobe was in the lane all night hassling passes, cuts and attempted post ups.
    Posted by aciemvp

    I took you up on it and looked at the stats in the playoffs and how it all comes apart for him.

    in 08-09 Rondo in the regular season was 11.9 points a game and 8.2 assists.

    08-09 playoffs he was 16.9 points a game and 9.8 assists.

    09-10 regular season he was 13.7 assists a game and 9.8 assists.

    09-10 playoffs he was 15.8 points a game and 9.3 assists.

    Why would you say "look at the stats" to prove your point when they do the opposite?  His playoff averages are higher than his regular season averages. 

    I said this before but you always talk about how bad he was against the Lakers last year in the finals. KG and Ray Allen had really bad series as well.  Why don't you talk about how bad they are in the playoffs?  You write really well and are fun to debate with.  But you get things in your head man and you don't let go. 

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?! : Actually, off the top of my head there was a game last year where they were down by one, and the last shot was a lob thrown to Rondo who converted at the buzzer for a win.  
    Posted by jeezem


    Yes... that was the op end of an alley op from CPP. Point blank. Rondo laid it in.

    I mentioned that earlier.

    Pud
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from bilalkazmi. Show bilalkazmi's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?! : It's also different because he is a pass-first PG.  Plus, with the likes of Ray, Paul, and KG, why should he take more shots when he can get a higher percentage bucket for the team by passing to one of these guys?  I think he plays his game perfectly.  He doesn't need to shoot and I like the way he's so selective with his shot selection.  He doesn't waste possessions trying to get his jumper going.  It's for the greater good of the team that he doesn't shoot 10-15 shots per game, even if he had a decent outside jumper.
    Posted by Driscoll92587


    The best aspect of Rondo's playmaking is his decision making.  He makes the optimal or close to optimal decision at a very high %.  In contrast to PGs and PointFs like Derrick Rose and Lebron James who are always looking to score on their own.  Once they realize they don't have a good look, they will try and see if they have a marginal look at the basket.  Once they realize that even a marginal look isnt available, they will look to pass.  By this point the shot clock has little time left and their team mates have already been taken out of the play.  But because these two are so athletic and gifted on scoring they will stretch the opposing defense and sometimes they will find an open guy who they will pass to and he will score an easy basket.  This allows them to collect 6-9 assists each game and everyone hails them as GREAT distributors, when in fact they STIN K at it completely because they often make the wrong decisions.  Their teammates are seldom involved in the offense.  It usually the Lebron show or the Rose show.

    Most NBA fans think Lebron and Rose are great distributors.  They think scoring and distribution is the same thing.  PATHETIC!
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from bilalkazmi. Show bilalkazmi's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    I have never been a Rondo hater, but I have criticized him in the past, and have even suggested they play Nate over Rondo towards the end of the game, but now..., I have change my mind, Rondo should always be in there at the start, and the end of games. I admit, his absense, has shed new light to me, and now I realize how great of a floor general that he is. All hail ROndo!!!
    Posted by rayallen1


    Yes.  Rondo is not perfect.  He has holes in his game.  He can't hit a FT even if his life depended on it.  And he is not confident about shooting mid-range jumpers (and I THINK he would be an OK shooter if he kept taking the with confidence).

    But the way he runs the offense is unparalleled in the NBA.  People say stuff like, "an assist is the most overrated stat in the NBA," and I agree with this statement partially.  For someone like Derrick Rose and Lebron James an assist is a COMPLETELY OVERRATED statistic, because their assists are usually accidental.  They didn't have any kind of look at the basket, then they passed and found an open guy that drained the shot.  They got an assist.  OVERRATED.

    But for people like Magic Johnson, Jason Kidd, John Stockton, and Rajon Rondo assists are not OVERRATED.  On the contrary, they are SPECIAL.  These PGs did not/don't get accidental assists.  They plan most of their assists.  As they brought/ bring the ball up the court they have plays in their heads that they get into instantly and usally for their assists to happens 2-3-4 or even 5 moves have to be made first.  Everything has to work like clockwork before they make that final pass that leads to an easy basket.  To discredit the assists of such PGs by calling them OVERRATED is a TRAVESTY.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from concord27. Show concord27's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    Icon,
    I agree with you sentiments on Rondo, but when you say that Rondo like Pierce and Ray had an off finals against the Lakers you can't serious.  Rondo won two finals games singlehanded in games 2 and 4.  How could you forget? The guy dominated two games and was very strong in games 3 and 5.  He was incredible, if he had been allowed to carry the offense in the latter parts of the 4th period he may have even led us to victory despite Pud's nonsense on this topic.  Everyone else was gassed.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from jdm894g. Show jdm894g's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?! :  If our shots aren't falling and Rondo ends up with 9 or 10 assists, that doesn't make Rondo less of a player.  It just means the guys were unable to make their shots and get him the assists.
    Posted by Petey62



    Thats when I would expect Rondo to take more shots because he would realize that the shots are not falling and he needs to score.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from JamezHill24. Show JamezHill24's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    Glen Davis was wide open for shots all night against the spurs puddin..are you telling me that he doesnt have a shot? just bc the spurs sagged?
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from JamezHill24. Show JamezHill24's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    bottom line is whether or not you think the Rondo we have is good enough to win a championship. if he leads the team to a ring it really doesnt matter what he cant do. i think unquestionably the answer is yes. 
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    Icon, I agree with you sentiments on Rondo, but when you say that Rondo like Pierce and Ray had an off finals against the Lakers you can't serious.  Rondo won two finals games singlehanded in games 2 and 4.  How could you forget? The guy dominated two games and was very strong in games 3 and 5.  He was incredible, if he had been allowed to carry the offense in the latter parts of the 4th period he may have even led us to victory despite Pud's nonsense on this topic.  Everyone else was gassed.
    Posted by concord27


    Since when does an all-star PG need permission to carry his teams offense late in games? And from whom?

    Let me give you my thoughts. The ops are guarding every single player on the floor they think has the potential to lead the team at crunch time.

    Those players they ignore (think Rondo) are considered to be highly unlikely to lead anything. Not impossible... but unlikely.

    Its awfully hard to lead much of anything when you are routinely ignored by teammates and ops alike.

    Even Sheriff Taylor gave Barney Fife a single bullet that he carried in his breast pocket.

    Has Rondo checked his pockets lately?

    Ever?

    Pud

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!

    In Response to Re: Rondo haters are you glad he is back now?!:
    Glen Davis was wide open for shots all night against the spurs puddin..are you telling me that he doesnt have a shot? just bc the spurs sagged?
    Posted by JamezHill24


    Unlike Rondo, BBD does a wonderful job of spreading the floor... and torched the Spurs for 23 points. Unlike Rondo, BBD has a terrific mid-range game... or haven't you noticed. 

    In the unlikely event that BBD is left wide open, maybe his defender is inexplicably doubling on Rondo.

    Not gonna happen.

    Pud
     
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