Rondo Still Whimpering

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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    Docs not gonna do that. Rondo is too sensitive that he'd rebell big time and Doc doesnt want that.

    Hes got too much invested with Rondo running PG and nobody is gonna fill his shoes by the time we hit the playoffs.

    But I do agree with your assessment. Rondo is a big disappointment defensively, has been for a long time. Something we're gonna have to live with most likely
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    i don't understand this.  has rondo really been complaining about perkins going away?  of ALL the people on this team, rondo had LITTLE on court interface with perkins since perkins could not catch the ball! 

    please tell me you are kidding me about this rondo "blue" after the perk trade.  these financial rapists always tell the fan / organization "it's just a business" when they leave town to sign a 20 trillion dollar team for someone else so what's with the kleenex now- that's what perkins left town to do!!
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    Rondo not to encourage the obsession topic of this BB is not playing well.  Something has got to be wrong.  It could not come at a worse time.  I have watched the last three games and his defense is killing the team.  It could be that Perkins made it easier for him to play defense.  Yet that makes no sense to me,

    On offense over a longer period I have noticed his ability to drive and keep the opposing defense on its toes has not been evident for awhile.

    With all this transitional stuff to not have this key matchup advantage in games is really troubling.  Last night was a far worse loss than many may think.

    Deandre Jordan had so many easy dunks it was like nothing seen for awhile with this defense. 
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering:
    Rondo not to encourage the obsession topic of this BB is not playing well.  Something has got to be wrong.  It could not come at a worse time.  I have watched the last three games and his defense is killing the team.  It could be that Perkins made it easier for him to play defense.  Yet that makes no sense to me, On offense over a longer period I have noticed his ability to drive and keep the opposing defense on its toes has not been evident for awhile. With all this transitional stuff to not have this key matchup advantage in games is really troubling.  Last night was a far worse loss than many may think. Deandre Jordan had so many easy dunks it was like nothing seen for awhile with this defense. 
    Posted by concord27


    i watched the game once through and was so disgusted i deleted it.  a lot of times you can (with a discerning eye) watch the games through and trace down the root cause of the over-switcharoo that blessed deanderthal jordan with 10 close range gimme's last night.  sometimes the over-switch problem (vs. the switching just enough to get away with it) can result from lousy pick n roll defense 3 people earlier out on the perimeter.

    and there was definitely some MOST TERRIBLE exterior defense going on last night that got this team on the run and i'm pretty sure mopping up people's messes on switches or just horrid pick n roll defense led to mo getting nearly 30 pts.  it could have also led to some of deandre's looks on plays that ran longer into the clock.

    i just didn't have the heart to watch this crappy game through to see which mix it was.  but rest assured mo williams going nutty for 28 has an impact on the overall defense. 

    i'm getting tired of watching rondo play to a lower level than his skills on a nightly basis.  it seems that depending on his mood of the moment, he'll drive and score or be miserably passive.  and last night we got the third element of the dysfunctional hat trick- driving toward the bucket and throwing up lazy crazy improbable garbage shots that did not even come close to going in.

    if you're danny, how much longer do you stand pat with a point guard who prefers to be more identified by "potential" than actual accomplishments?  i know when cornbread maxwell decided he only wanted to try in the playoffs they got rid of him immediately.  it seems the last 2 years this is what rondo has been about.  waiting around to "show us a thing or two" in the post season when he really starts trying. 

    i don't see how this passes muster with the press, the fans or celtic mgt.  and you can stuff the arguement that he "doesn't NEEEEEEEEEEEEEEDDD to do very much on this team because of the big 3"  BULLCRAP!!  look at krstic- these vets are dying to get some easy baskets and will use anyone who can get them!!
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering:
    Rondo takes more punishment than anybody in the NBA.
    Posted by Kirk6


    self imposed, on the floor contact, or on this board?  there are point guards out there with slighter bodies who drive to the bucket more than rondo and get more FTA's per game, so i don't believe he takes more punishment than any PG's.  he purposefully avoids a lot of it so he won't have to shoot free throws!!


     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering:
    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering : i watched the game once through and was so disgusted i deleted it.  a lot of times you can (with a discerning eye) watch the games through and trace down the root cause of the over-switcharoo that blessed deanderthal jordan with 10 close range gimme's last night.  sometimes the over-switch problem (vs. the switching just enough to get away with it) can result from lousy pick n roll defense 3 people earlier out on the perimeter. and there was definitely some MOST TERRIBLE exterior defense going on last night that got this team on the run and i'm pretty sure mopping up people's messes on switches or just horrid pick n roll defense led to mo getting nearly 30 pts.  it could have also led to some of deandre's looks on plays that ran longer into the clock. i just didn't have the heart to watch this crappy game through to see which mix it was.  but rest assured mo williams going nutty for 28 has an impact on the overall defense.  i'm getting tired of watching rondo play to a lower level than his skills on a nightly basis.  it seems that depending on his mood of the moment, he'll drive and score or be miserably passive.  and last night we got the third element of the dysfunctional hat trick- driving toward the bucket and throwing up lazy crazy improbable garbage shots that did not even come close to going in. if you're danny, how much longer do you stand pat with a point guard who prefers to be more identified by "potential" than actual accomplishments?  i know when cornbread maxwell decided he only wanted to try in the playoffs they got rid of him immediately.  it seems the last 2 years this is what rondo has been about.  waiting around to "show us a thing or two" in the post season when he really starts trying.  i don't see how this passes muster with the press, the fans or celtic mgt.  and you can stuff the arguement that he "doesn't NEEEEEEEEEEEEEEDDD to do very much on this team because of the big 3"  BULLCRAP!!  look at krstic- these vets are dying to get some easy baskets and will use anyone who can get them!!
    Posted by aciemvp


    Very true how the media ignores this issue.

    Its always who had a bad shooting night or the teams defense. Well, if one link in the chain is weak then the entire chain is weak.

    Allowing opponents to freely pcik off a defender and get to the lane with either himself or the roll open... disrupts the entire defense. Everyone then must switch and help out and someone is always left open...

    With all the basketball geniuses in the media you'd think a couple would catch on. Probably doesnt do any good,,,  heck if the coach and team arent making an issue of it, whats left to do?
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering:
    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering : self imposed, on the floor contact, or on this board?  there are point guards out there with slighter bodies who drive to the bucket more than rondo and get more FTA's per game, so i don't believe he takes more punishment than any PG's.  he purposefully avoids a lot of it so he won't have to shoot free throws!!
    Posted by aciemvp



    And a lot of his bumps are acting.  The real hard fouls happen because he drove but those falling down acting jobs don't count.

    Rondo's foot may be bothering him and if it is, then I blame Doc.  But, if his foot is not bothering him, he need to step up.  I did watch the plays on my DVR several times and Rondo was at his "reaching from behind" best last night.  Another thing that caused Williams to be open was Rondo drifting in for the rebound while play was going on only for the Clippers to kick one out to Mo.  It wasn't a switch that caused Mo to be open so often.  Mo was smart enough to drift away from Rondo when he turned his head and his teammate kept finding him.  It was just a lack of concentration by Rondo when his man was hot.   I understand the need to rebound, but if yours is the hot man that night, you have to let others rebound and prevent your man from getting easy looks.

    I still like Rondo but I'm just frustrated with his mood swings.  He has to either admit to a foot problem with his coach or he has to step up.   

    We need West back so he can play D on the tougher guard at critical points in the game.
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering:
    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering : With all the basketball geniuses in the media you'd think a couple would catch on. Probably doesnt do any good,,,  heck if the coach and team arent making an issue of it, whats left to do?
    Posted by Karllost


    well, i hope there is a lot of game tape rolling back at them today as a result of that horrid defense last night.  the suitcase falls right open if there is a weak link.

    with regard to how morbid, lazy, miserable and uneffective rondo played for over half that game, i don't know.  this team wants to win and for the vet leadership to take a ham sandwich of a center and get him so involved in the offense that he gets half as many FTA's in 6 games as he had ALL YEAR with OKC, well that says something.

    maybe THEY have had it and are looking for easy ways to get the job done, despite the "floor general" making things harder as often as he facilitates.  but alas, there is nothing you can do when the ball is being usurped and flattened into the floor at the top of the key.  that crap has to stop! 

    i really like the green-pierce-kg and ray to a lesser extent ball movement i've seen in the past few games.  these things are moving the ball around and krstic is getting rich on dunks, layins and foul shots.  we've never had an easier time of inside scoring.

    and i must admit that i had INSTINCTIVE thoughts of "oh good, a guy is there who does things decisively" when i saw arroyo in the game last night.  he does do things crisply, whether it be shoot, drive or pass, without the painful delays that just allow the defense to dig in harder, 3 second calls, broken plays, etc.

    i don't think arroyo at 31 is starting material, he only started 1 year in his career, but he does do things like a point guard should, and can shoot the outside shot.  nice to see in a green uniform, a real back up guard.  maybe he can push rondo into player better. 
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    Many of us refer to when Shaq and West get back.  I am wondering if some of these guys are going to ever really be back in a consistent way.  This injury thing is very pervasive right now.  A game like last night seemed acceptable we are 5 and 1 but something is not right.  We need guys back, this idea that we can wait until every one is healthy is not working with five guys out. The rest are all new players. It is a bad mix.

    Kirk rightly pointed out we are 5 and 1 and not to overeact but to say these injuries are not a problem doesn't seem right.  Hope I am wrong.
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering:
    I don't think it is defense; I just think Rondo has the blues.  Powe was a big part of Celtics run gets injured and he is out the door and now Perkins kicked his butt, actually came back early and this happens;  had Perk known this was going to happen he would have taken his time.  All of this has to take a toll on the concept of loyalty and taking one for the team.  All of this has an impact on young players, which Rondo is one. 
    Posted by ShepherdCall


    absolutely not true.  perkins pushed it like crazy because it was a contract year.  his big pay day.  he had to prove he had something or he was going to be offered a million bucks to play somewhere next year.

    loyaly my AZZZZZSSSS- there is NO loyalty by players any more.  when i was growing up you had as many one team career guys as guys who moved around.  now they all move around.  pierce is a rarity.  rondo will not stay here forever.  in fact i wish they worked a juicy trade tomorrow to get a ham sandwich point guard and some good draft picks out of the sad little prik.

    carmelo had loyalty, lebron had loyalty, shak also loyal to orlando, miami, pippen to chicago, barkley to the 76ers, and just sit yourself down and watch dwight howard's loyalty job that he's going to do on orlando.  it's all about the money, honey.  and perkins got his.  while injured.  he couldn't have possibly done any better for a guy with no hands and feet.

    if rondo can't deal with that then he's really soft in the head.
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    BB and Delonte should right the ship....f@#k Shaq!
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering:
    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering :   I did watch the plays on my DVR several times and Rondo was at his "reaching from behind" best last night.  Another thing that caused Williams to be open was Rondo drifting in for the rebound while play was going on only for the Clippers to kick one out to Mo.  It wasn't a switch that caused Mo to be open so often.  Mo was smart enough to drift away from Rondo when he turned his head and his teammate kept finding him.  Posted by Celtsfan4life


    wow!  ok.  yes, i saw the reach-o-rama that was going on all night long.  but the "floating for rebounds" defensive failure if even more annoying in my book.  reaching for steals can at least be weakly classified as an ATTEMPT to play defense, whereas just drifting away from your man and failing without BEING THERE TO TRY is a much worse offense.

    but these are the treats you get when you have a "starter of the future" after 20 games started in the NBA.  no pressure, no threats, NO BIG DEAL.  and just like when gadafi survives and the other murderous apes in the middle east figure out it's GOOD to kill people because you can get away with it, rondo has figured out that he can GET AWAY WITH DOING ANYTHING, SOMETHING, or NOTHING- it's just whatever he wants goes with this team.

    how unfortunate.  kind of like danny created a 6-1 monster who can be a little bit moody on top of it all!!  Sealed
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    One thing about Rondo is that for the past few years, its been like watching soap opera. Talk about a high maintenance PG with a very fragile psyche.

    Yes he takes a lot of pounding sometimes when he decides to go to the cup.

    How about a pull up and pop so that the defense  can't predictably wait right at the rim to punish you/make you pay.

    It makes the game so much easier with less wear and tear for all involved if you have a bit of range.

    Pud
     
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    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering:
    One thing about Rondo is that for the past few years, its been like watching soap opera. Talk about a high maintenance PG with a very fragile psyche. Yes he takes a lot of pounding sometimes when he decides to go to the cup. How about a pull up and pop so that the defense  can't predictably wait right at the rim to punish you/make you pay. It makes the game so much easier with less wear and tear for all involved if you have a bit of range. Pud
    Posted by puddinpuddin


     That's true Pud, but first you have to have "a bit of range"!!
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering:
    One thing about Rondo is that for the past few years, its been like watching soap opera. Talk about a high maintenance PG with a very fragile psyche. Yes he takes a lot of pounding sometimes when he decides to go to the cup. How about a pull up and pop so that the defense  can't predictably wait right at the rim to punish you/make you pay. It makes the game so much easier with less wear and tear for all involved if you have a bit of range. Pud
    Posted by puddinpuddin


    stop talking this nonsense!! it's too logical! 

    think michael adams.  he probably scored 7,000 points on herky jerky pull ups in the lane from 6-10 feet.  where is the development of this weapon?  or who cares about the pull up jumper, how about some runners that go in with some regularity?  one or the other would do it as far as making defenses unable to predict where rondo might shoot.  it would save his body all that torture of getting pegged those few infrequent times he does drive and draw contact!

    there's the "D" word again.  development. 
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    In Response to Rondo Still Whimpering:
    I heard it said that the Heat weren;'t the only ones crying in the locker room.  It appears that Rondo is still whimpering in the corner after the Perkins trade.  Has he been pathetic or what.........start Arroyo and let him pine on the bench for awhile.........seriously though he is either injured, worn down from major minutes or lost in space somewhere..........he has played very little defense, reaching for the ball after his man blows by him..........passively brings the ball up court and doesn't go to the basket.........and with all this happening Doc continues to play him major minutes.........I hope that having Arroyo will get him off the court for a lot of time to while away on the pine....
    Posted by damfuno


    Yeah, let's replace an all star with Miami's third string cast away. That makes sense. I think Rondo is playing hrt. I think he needs to get his minutes down before the playoffs. The problem is we are in a bit of a dogfight for the top seed. btw, why not bash KG for his awlful offensive last night? The whole team played bad. I think Jeff Green was a minus 20 in the +_ column. 
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering:
    i don't understand this.  has rondo really been complaining about perkins going away?  of ALL the people on this team, rondo had LITTLE on court interface with perkins since perkins could not catch the ball!  please tell me you are kidding me about this rondo "blue" after the perk trade.  these financial rapists always tell the fan / organization "it's just a business" when they leave town to sign a 20 trillion dollar team for someone else so what's with the kleenex now- that's what perkins left town to do!!
    Posted by aciemvp


    Perkins was shipped out of town. He didn't leave to do anyhting and he really wanted to stay. btw. The owners all make billions off the NBA why exactly is it wrong for a player to deman some of that. I don't go to games to watch Marc Cuban. 
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    Rondo is fine, give him time. Its the middle of the season, he's still a very good point guard, top 5 in the league for offensive intangibles. I think what Rondo needs is Delonte West to get healthy and you will see some of the pressure lifted off Rondo. At the beginning of the year Rondo was untouchable at point, he hasn't forgotten how to play basketball. Sure he's playing worse defense than usual but it's only a slump, give em time. 
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering:
    In Response to Rondo Still Whimpering : Yeah, let's replace an all star with Miami's third string cast away. That makes sense. I think Rondo is playing hrt. I think he needs to get his minutes down before the playoffs. The problem is we are in a bit of a dogfight for the top seed. btw, why not bash KG for his awlful offensive last night? The whole team played bad. I think Jeff Green was a minus 20 in the +_ column. 
    Posted by jtkl


    has rondo been hurt his whole career?  i mean he crested at 64% freethrows his rookie year and has been steadily going down ever since.  now he's in the 50's.  what gives?

    i think it's a brain injury.
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering:
    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering : i watched the game once through and was so disgusted i deleted it.  a lot of times you can (with a discerning eye) watch the games through and trace down the root cause of the over-switcharoo that blessed deanderthal jordan with 10 close range gimme's last night.  sometimes the over-switch problem (vs. the switching just enough to get away with it) can result from lousy pick n roll defense 3 people earlier out on the perimeter. and there was definitely some MOST TERRIBLE exterior defense going on last night that got this team on the run and i'm pretty sure mopping up people's messes on switches or just horrid pick n roll defense led to mo getting nearly 30 pts.  it could have also led to some of deandre's looks on plays that ran longer into the clock. i just didn't have the heart to watch this crappy game through to see which mix it was.  but rest assured mo williams going nutty for 28 has an impact on the overall defense.  i'm getting tired of watching rondo play to a lower level than his skills on a nightly basis.  it seems that depending on his mood of the moment, he'll drive and score or be miserably passive.  and last night we got the third element of the dysfunctional hat trick- driving toward the bucket and throwing up lazy crazy improbable garbage shots that did not even come close to going in. if you're danny, how much longer do you stand pat with a point guard who prefers to be more identified by "potential" than actual accomplishments?  i know when cornbread maxwell decided he only wanted to try in the playoffs they got rid of him immediately.  it seems the last 2 years this is what rondo has been about.  waiting around to "show us a thing or two" in the post season when he really starts trying.  i don't see how this passes muster with the press, the fans or celtic mgt.  and you can stuff the arguement that he "doesn't NEEEEEEEEEEEEEEDDD to do very much on this team because of the big 3"  BULLCRAP!!  look at krstic- these vets are dying to get some easy baskets and will use anyone who can get them!!
    Posted by aciemvp

    Rondo, has a player effciency rating of 17.96. That's higher than Ray Allen's. He has defensive rating of 100. one of the top ratings for a point guard in the league. He is an NBA all defensive team member. He leads the league in assists. Saying he is "potential" is not paying attention. John Wall has potential. Rondo is a top 5 point guard. 

    He is not playing well now, but neither are alot of the Celtics. You don't give up 4 or 5 100 point games unless the whole team defense is bad. 

    Here is a link of Krystic and KG getting dunked on over and over last night. 


    Krystic, played a wonderful offensive game, but his defense needs work. We need Shaq back and maybe Jermaine O'neil. I don't see krystic being the guy that gives the hard fouls. He is a guy that will be a terrifc scorer off the bench for us. and tht's great, but Shaq would have put Jordan on his butt one time at least. 

    As for Rondo, he abused Mo Williams last year in the playoffs. I think Rondo, is playing too many minutes and is hurt. I think West getting healthy and having Arroyo will let him cut minutes which will get him back on track.


    Keep in mind this is bound to happen. Half of our roster is brand new. I think we have better players now, but we also have players that haven't played together very much. Let's just hope on the fly we figure it out enough to be ready for the playoffs and hold off Chicago.
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering:
    Rondo is fine, give him time. Its the middle of the season, he's still a very good point guard, top 5 in the league for offensive intangibles. I think what Rondo needs is Delonte West to get healthy and you will see some of the pressure lifted off Rondo. At the beginning of the year Rondo was untouchable at point, he hasn't forgotten how to play basketball. Sure he's playing worse defense than usual but it's only a slump, give em time. 
    Posted by myaim45


    I agree with a good part of your post.

    Where we differ is Rondo defensively...hes not slumping there...hes been doin it for a long time.
     
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    Re: Rondo Still Whimpering

    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering:
    In Response to Re: Rondo Still Whimpering : has rondo been hurt his whole career?  i mean he crested at 64% freethrows his rookie year and has been steadily going down ever since.  now he's in the 50's.  what gives? i think it's a brain injury.
    Posted by aciemvp


    Has Steve Nash, been playing hurt his entire career? he has a defensive rating of 116. maybe that is one realy weak part of his game that he makes up for by being terrifc in other areas. 
     
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