Shaq vs. Perk

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from concord27. Show concord27's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    This whole conversation is absurd.  Shaq in twenty minute spurts is vastly superior to Perkins.  It is like comparing a back up to Tom Brady.  Still Perk can supply what he does, hard fouls and tough defense in spots. The sad thing is he will probably not mesh with the second unit on the Celtics.  His poor ball handling and weak offensive skills might hold that unit back.  But based on Shaq having minutes that Perk can fill with the second unit he will get maybe fifteen minutes.  Also we have to consider injury may create more need for Perk.  Nobody however should forget the severe limitations of PErk's game.  He is a turnover and technical foul machine.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Icon11. Show Icon11's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    In Response to Shaq vs. Perk:
    [QUOTE]Thank goodness for Shaq this season. The numbers he's putting up, Perk can't even come close to. Perk's biggest problem is combination of limited skills and lack of consistent mental focus; he just doesn't have it. His basketball IQ is exetremely low vs. Shaq's. This was an outstanding pickup by Danny. While I know it's early yet, we haven't had the luxury of a center producing like this in a very long time. I also like Semih's potential......he could be another great addition to the roster, just needs some playing time, and continued mentoring from the likes of Shaq and KG. Perk, I hope you're taking notice. We can't afford any disappearing acts this year; either produce with impressive and expected numbers, or sit on the pine. There's no reason Perk shouldn't be gathering over 10 boards a game; simply a lack of mental focus. Again, I hope you're taking notice.   
    Posted by hondosack[/QUOTE]

    There is no Shaq versus Perk.  Shaq goes around 20 minutes a game now and he still will when Perk comes back.  There is no point to argue who is better because they both will share the minutes anyway.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from cole-ely. Show cole-ely's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    In Response to Re: Shaq vs. Perk:
    [QUOTE]For the record the game last night showed a BIG reason why Perkins is a starting center at this point and Shaq is not.  People have been conveniently ignoring the # of fouls that Shaq has committed and assuming his diminsihed minutes are just due to age. Perkins in 2009-10 per 36 minutes had 2.2 blocks and 3.7 fouls. O'Neal in 2010-11 per 36 minutes has 1.0 block and 5.6 fouls. While I understand that defense isn't all about blocks I'm including that number because centers usually foul during a block attempt.  You can applaud Shaq's presence on defense all you want but the fact is that he's fouling everyone in sight.  Even if he had the stamina to play 30+ minutes the numbers say he'll probably foul out of half those games. Realistically on this team with Rondo, Pierce, KG, Allen you don't need an offensive center and they have not the past few years. All you need is one that can put a body on big centers/PFs (since KG will not) and not keep giving them free throws or foul out.  Ideally what the team should do once Perkins is back is trade Baby for a more athletic PF.  Then you've got your 2 big physical centers and 2 athletic mobile PF's. Baby and Shaq can't block shots or stay with mobile PF's which will be a big problem when you're forced to put a Baby-Shaq or Baby-Perkins combo out there.
    Posted by Stupideeediot[/QUOTE]

    You can't look at fouls per minute accurately in that way.  You know perk would give more fouls per minute if he was only playing 25 minutes per game.  Shaq knows he can foul more under the circumstances, and he makes his fouls count.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from CelticFanLA. Show CelticFanLA's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    HA, looks like we got another Nostradumbus in the house! Lakers are playing very horrible right now, and their lack of big men is a sure weakness. Im not even sure they will even be back in the finals!
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from RickFox17. Show RickFox17's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    In Response to Re: Shaq vs. Perk:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Shaq vs. Perk : This. Of course Shaq is better, he is a hall of famer for crying out loud!  You can't expect Perk to compete with that.  Shaq, even at his age, is miles better than Perk and that's no knock on Perk, because like I said, Shaq is one of the greatest centers ever. And to the person that said Shaq is slow and doesn't block shots... have you seen him go up for alley oops?  He's looking pretty spry to me.  And I have seen him block some shots this year. Shaq is doing everything Perk was unable to do, like catching passes and not bringing the ball down and getting stripped, setting LEGAL picks, etc.  So many easy points that Perk missed out on are actually going in the basket now with Shaq. Oh, don't get me wrong, I love Perk and glad he's on our team.  Shaq's just better is all.  Perk will be here when Shaq is gone.
    Posted by cpjohn1[/QUOTE]

      True  and u are 100 % correct.  Keep Shaq as a starter when Perk comes back and see what happens, I think it will be best for the team to keep this starting line up.  Perk is the future anyways and I jope is taking notes on how a true center should play.  we should be very luck we have whats left of Shaq  I love Shaq. 
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from CHEisCHE. Show CHEisCHE's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    If Perk is healthy today, we are not the top dog in the league.


    Thanks for Shaqy!!
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from chuckman. Show chuckman's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    I agree with everything about Shaq vs Perk except the comment by the guy who said he liked Erden, are you crazy? The guy never gets a rebound, cannot shoot(except for a one a game open dunk), never blocks any shots, or stops anyone!! He is a 6 11 body just running up and down the court.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from cole-ely. Show cole-ely's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    Lately, I'm afraid you've been right.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from CHEisCHE. Show CHEisCHE's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    In Response to Re: Shaq vs. Perk:
    [QUOTE]I agree with everything about Shaq vs Perk except the comment by the guy who said he liked Erden, are you crazy? The guy never gets a rebound, cannot shoot(except for a one a game open dunk), never blocks any shots, or stops anyone!! He is a 6 11 body just running up and down the court.
    Posted by chuckman[/QUOTE]


    Give the grasshopper (Erden) a break.
    The guy is not circumcise yet...what do you expect?
    Paul Mason said: We Will Sell No Wine Before Its Time"
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from OneOnOne. Show OneOnOne's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    In Response to Re: Shaq vs. Perk:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Shaq vs. Perk : You guys live in a fantasy world. The REALITY is that the Lakers are defending NBA champs and expect to send Phil out with another 3-peat.
    Posted by Qdaddy[/QUOTE]

    Puffdaddy you are hillariously funny.  You know the only reason the Fakers won last year.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from jdm894g. Show jdm894g's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    The bottom line is that SHAQ should start because the other teams must respect his offense and he draws fouls on opposing centers/players and will get the Cs in the bonus faster than PERK ever will.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Waynestarr. Show Waynestarr's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    Shaq is a HUGE improvement over Perk. Like another poster said earlier, we have less Tech's without Perk and Sheed in the rotation.

    For his age, Shaq is 100 times more nimble in the paint than Perk EVER was.

    In my opinion, Perk would be good as the BACKUP Center, besides, he might never be the same after that severe knee injury/operation.

    I'm lovin Shaq right now.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Icon11. Show Icon11's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    In Response to Re: Shaq vs. Perk:
    [QUOTE]Shaq is a HUGE improvement over Perk. Like another poster said earlier, we have less Tech's without Perk and Sheed in the rotation. For his age, Shaq is 100 times more nimble in the paint than Perk EVER was. In my opinion, Perk would be good as the BACKUP Center, besides, he might never be the same after that severe knee injury/operation. I'm lovin Shaq right now.
    Posted by Waynestarr[/QUOTE]


    Like I said earlier I agree that Shaq is an improvement but the thread is irrelevant.  Shaq is averaging 22 minutes a game.  He will still get those minutes.  Perk is going to take the minutes of Davis and Erden.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from faz200. Show faz200's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    I can't believe we have begun Perk Bashing...Let's be happy that Shaq is doing and amazing and PRAY Perk comes back healthy...The plan is to win a title and that will take PERK AND SHAQ!!!! Let Doc figure out who starts!! If you're a Celtic fan, you be dying to see how good we can be when we are completley healthy..And that means PERK, Delonte and hopefully J.O....Maybe since perk doesnt have the offense that Shaq does, he would be better suited with the starters and let Shaq dominate all the back up centers in the league..but whatever Doc thinks is fine with me, Im just hoping we get healthy. This was a childish post and I cant believe I wasted my time getting involved in it. If you don't think Perk is important in winning a title then you dont get it!!! I dont think we can get to the finals without ALL our Bigs healthy, and if we did, no way we beat the Lakers without PERK AND SHAQ...
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from faz200. Show faz200's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    Hey Icon, the guy, or child that started this thread isn't to bright for thinking about who should start...We need Perk and Shaq healthy along with Delonte and even JO if we want to win a title.  When this team is 100% healthy it could be a speccial group...it could dominate!!
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from CaptChris. Show CaptChris's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    Hope Perk's knee gets better.  Hope he learned something watching Shaq.  Hope he is ready to play.  Sure can use his "D">

    Biggest thing that has to get better is his mouth.  Unless he has had a "REALITY CHECK", he will be a liability, not an asset.  He has a $20 million dollar mouth, on a $4 million dollar body.  Shut up and play.

    The rules have changed.  Perk will get booted out of games in a hurry.  He cryed over ever call.  Didn't work last year, won't work this year.  Never has.

    When your starting Center is physically healthy, but may miss Championship games because of his mouth  --  you have one DUMB teammate!!!

    So let's hope that Perk is learning to adapt to the changes.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from CablesWyndBairn. Show CablesWyndBairn's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    In Response to Re: Shaq vs. Perk:
    [QUOTE]For the record the game last night showed a BIG reason why Perkins is a starting center at this point and Shaq is not.  People have been conveniently ignoring the # of fouls that Shaq has committed and assuming his diminsihed minutes are just due to age. Perkins in 2009-10 per 36 minutes had 2.2 blocks and 3.7 fouls. O'Neal in 2010-11 per 36 minutes has 1.0 block and 5.6 fouls. While I understand that defense isn't all about blocks I'm including that number because centers usually foul during a block attempt.  You can applaud Shaq's presence on defense all you want but the fact is that he's fouling everyone in sight.  Even if he had the stamina to play 30+ minutes the numbers say he'll probably foul out of half those games. Realistically on this team with Rondo, Pierce, KG, Allen you don't need an offensive center and they have not the past few years. All you need is one that can put a body on big centers/PFs (since KG will not) and not keep giving them free throws or foul out.  Ideally what the team should do once Perkins is back is trade Baby for a more athletic PF.  Then you've got your 2 big physical centers and 2 athletic mobile PF's. Baby and Shaq can't block shots or stay with mobile PF's which will be a big problem when you're forced to put a Baby-Shaq or Baby-Perkins combo out there.
    Posted by Stupideeediot[/QUOTE]

    This is in at least partly because Shaq knows he's not going to be in the lineup for 30+ minutes and because he has said that he won't let anyone get easy shots, whether big man or a smaller guy taking the ball to the hoop.  There is a value in that itself, it's not a bad thing at times for guys to think twice about getting fouled. 

    I really doubt BBD is going anywhere the way he's playing.  Ask Doc how he feels about blocked shots.  He said last week it is an overrated stat since it means someone else let they guy get the shot in the first place.  BBD doesn't block shots, he's more about leverage, position and taking the charge.  He is more valuable than you're letting on.    
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from CHEisCHE. Show CHEisCHE's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    Shaq must be laughing reading this thread, comparing Perk to his skills and accomplishment.

    .....and Perk is so happy someone comparing him to the great.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Icon11. Show Icon11's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    In Response to Re: Shaq vs. Perk:
    [QUOTE]Hey Icon, the guy, or child that started this thread isn't to bright for thinking about who should start...We need Perk and Shaq healthy along with Delonte and even JO if we want to win a title.  When this team is 100% healthy it could be a speccial group...it could dominate!!
    Posted by faz200[/QUOTE]

    Agreed.  It isn't an either or.  It will just be Perk out there when Shaq isn't.  Which would be a really tough center rotation.  There is no controversy here.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    In Response to Re: Shaq vs. Perk:
    [QUOTE]This thread is a bit of a joke in that it basically compares who's better at standing under the basket and putting the ball in. Shaq is mostly immobile now.  In case you missed it he gets no steals or blocks anymore and he barely moves on the floor most of the time.  The few times I have seen him running he's wound up on the bench shortly after. I appreciate that Shaq foudn a niche as an offensive rebounder and finisher inside but please don't be unrealistic and overinflate what Shaq does.
    Posted by StupidEediot[/QUOTE]

    apparently you missed some great alley-oops, high above the rim, I'm sorry for you

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    In the playoffs Shaq will get about 24 mins at Center, Perkins 16 and KG will get about 8 mins there, certainly close games with Davis at the 4.

    Shaq has been great and is on a mission for sure to win a title, secure his legacy historically, tie Kobe, go 1 up on Duncan, all that. But he also still has game left and LOVES playing with 4 all-stars.

    As he recently said there will be 'knickknack injuries' as part of being 38 and he had one today with the tight calf. Just get JON back in 2 weeks to rest him even more than we have been (end of December to early Feb). Then eval what we have and what we need. We could swing a trade or just go with a 5 headed monster at the 4-5, but there are options.

    Perk is a decent starting Center. He is the same age Parish was when he was given up on in Golden State and traded here in 1980. Perk won't be 100% till next season. Ease him back in this regular season and hope he is 80% of what he was last year when it comes time to play Howard and probably the Lakers. He won't need to be a 32 min, 10p 12r 3b guy for us to win. Just no tech's, smartly use 3-4 fouls, play 16 mins and get 4 points 6 boards and a block.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    Compare Celts 1st 20 games last year to there 1st 20 games this year before we get carried away.

    Shaq has:

    6+ rebounds in 10 games
    9+ rebounds in 3 games

    Perk had:

    6+ rebounds in 16 games
    9+ rebounds in 6 games

    Shaq has:

    9+ points in 10 games
    13+ points in 6 games
    18+ points in 2 games

    Perk had:

    9+ points in 18 games
    13+ points in 8 games 
    18+ points in 2 games

    Perkins had 11 games with 2 or more blocks, including 3 games with 4 blocks, Shaq has had 2 games with 2 blocks, none with 3.

    Perkins only played 4 mins more per game than Shaq. The Celtics had the same 16-4 record... only KG was nowhere near what he is now, and Rondo was a 9 assist guy, not 14.

    So for now, we may love Shaq, but Perkins was superior a year ago to open the season. We know he guards Howard great. He just faded towards the end of the year as the team went .500 and was hurt in the finals and that will make him less than 100% this entire season.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Stupideeediot. Show Stupideeediot's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    In Response to Re: Shaq vs. Perk:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Shaq vs. Perk : apparently you missed some great alley-oops, high above the rim, I'm sorry for you
    Posted by rameakap[/QUOTE]

    Shaq can reach the rim standing.  Finishing an alley oop isn't much for him. If he gets 6-10 inches off the ground it looks 'high above the rim'.  And jumping ability was not what I was referring to.  The ability to move laterally on defense QUICKLY and go out from teh rim to defend a player is what I was referring to.  So far they have mostly sat him under the basket and tried to force guys into him. 

    If the other team has a center who can make a 10 foot shot then they will eat him alive on defense. If the other team has a center that will make him work hard on D like Howard then he will be worn down in 15 minutes.  Have you seen him chuggin down the court recently or are you blind ?  Playing him 24 minutes has REALLY been a stretch on what he's capable of now.  If you keep relying on Shaq , then teams will start pushing hard right at his exhausted, immobile self and forcing him to foul them early.

    I find it hilarious that people use to make fun of Perkins foul totals saying he couldn't play proper D and was jsut fouling, yet we ignore the fact that Shaq is averaging nearly 6 fouls per 36 minutes calling them 'smart fouls'.  I've seen Shaq's fouls turn into 3 point plays . There's nothing any smarter about them than anything else.  And there's been plenty  of braindead incidental fouls by him too jsut lounging around the court .

    The problem here is that people are too in love with the name Shaq to notice that this is not 'Shaq' anymore. He's an elderly player who is a fraction of his former self.  Cuting the shortocming of an over the hill future HOF'er does not make people dumb, it makes them intelligent and openminded.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from jeezem. Show jeezem's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    It will be interesting to see how Perk plays after the time off once he gets his legs back.  Did you ever take an extended break from something you practiced all the time only to find out you were better after the time off?  I have.  I'm not saying this will happen to Perk's game, but he's got plenty of time to work on skills and really to internalize the years he spent playing.  If he heals well, I bet he ends up a better player for the time off in the long run.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: Shaq vs. Perk

    In Response to Re: Shaq vs. Perk:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Shaq vs. Perk : Shaq can reach the rim standing.  Finishing an alley oop isn't much for him. If he gets 6-10 inches off the ground it looks 'high above the rim'.  And jumping ability was not what I was referring to.  The ability to move laterally on defense QUICKLY and go out from teh rim to defend a player is what I was referring to.  So far they have mostly sat him under the basket and tried to force guys into him.  If the other team has a center who can make a 10 foot shot then they will eat him alive on defense. If the other team has a center that will make him work hard on D like Howard then he will be worn down in 15 minutes.  Have you seen him chuggin down the court recently or are you blind ?  Playing him 24 minutes has REALLY been a stretch on what he's capable of now.  If you keep relying on Shaq , then teams will start pushing hard right at his exhausted, immobile self and forcing him to foul them early. I find it hilarious that people use to make fun of Perkins foul totals saying he couldn't play proper D and was jsut fouling, yet we ignore the fact that Shaq is averaging nearly 6 fouls per 36 minutes calling them 'smart fouls'.  I've seen Shaq's fouls turn into 3 point plays . There's nothing any smarter about them than anything else.  And there's been plenty  of braindead incidental fouls by him too jsut lounging around the court . The problem here is that people are too in love with the name Shaq to notice that this is not 'Shaq' anymore. He's an elderly player who is a fraction of his former self.  Cuting the shortocming of an over the hill future HOF'er does not make people dumb, it makes them intelligent and openminded.
    Posted by Stupideeediot[/QUOTE]

    Apparently you missed my two essays where I said Perk was better than Shaq and used FACTS and chose instead to harp on my tounge in cheek comment

    Shaq has been exactly what this team needs in wake of an injury, he is 85% of Perk's effectiveness. Perk is in the 7-11 range for strating centers I would want (if healthy and doign what he did for the 1st 2/3 of last season) and gets slammed far too much here.

    when it is DUDDER, shamefully wrong and moronic for years, who cares, but when posters I respect attack Perk it is annoying.

     
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