So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY......

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    So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY......

        RONDO who  ?????
     
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    [QUOTE]    RONDO who  ?????
    Posted by Bill-806[/QUOTE]

    The Washington coach admitted not guarding Bradley on purpose.  With Rondo and Bradley in the game at the same time you can game plan to not guard either one, double Ray or Paul or KG and sag in the paint..... I like Bradley, I think he will continue to improve but when a coach openly admits to purposely not guarding a player it is hard to call the game some sort of coming out party.....
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : The Washington coach admitted not guarding Bradley on purpose.  With Rondo and Bradley in the game at the same time you can game plan to not guard either one, double Ray or Paul or KG and sag in the paint..... I like Bradley, I think he will continue to improve but when a coach openly admits to purposely not guarding a player it is hard to call the game some sort of coming out party.....
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE] Coming from the wizzards/coach, i will take that "with a grain of SALT"  !!!  Im looking further down the road.... The kid can play the "D" !!!
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : The Washington coach admitted not guarding Bradley on purpose.  With Rondo and Bradley in the game at the same time you can game plan to not guard either one, double Ray or Paul or KG and sag in the paint..... I like Bradley, I think he will continue to improve but when a coach openly admits to purposely not guarding a player it is hard to call the game some sort of coming out party.....
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE]

    Unless that player is Rajon Pierre Rondo.

    Then its a party big time.

    Pud
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : Coming from the wizzards/coach, i will take that "with a grain of SALT"  !!!  Im looking further down the road.... The kid can play the "D" !!!
    Posted by Bill-806[/QUOTE]

    I believe you missed the point..... the Coach decided it was not worth guarding him, of course he can play D but he cannot do much else unless you put him in a position to be ignored.......
     
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    Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY......

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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : I believe you missed the point..... the Coach decided it was not worth guarding him, of course he can play D but he cannot do much else unless you put him in a position to be ignored.......
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE]  You can believe what you want, I did not miss the point.... Bradley is going to be a player !!   Tommy H. will tell you that.  It will be better next year when RONDO is not there !!!
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... :   You can believe what you want, I did not miss the point.... Bradley is going to be a player !!   Tommy H. will tell you that.  It will be better next year when RONDO is not there !!!
    Posted by Bill-806[/QUOTE]

    Tommy H and Fred Flintstone have never been seen together....  loud, boisterous, blowhards that are routinely wrong about just about every subject upon which they opine...... Tommy thinks it is some sort of major accomplishment when he can pronounce a player's name and when the replay shows a viscious foul committed by a Celtic he swears that the oopponent fouled the Celtic.....

    Many years ago on this board some of us tried to kind of corral the language that was being used when opining about players - the example I always used was when Andrey Blatche was arrested for some sort of sex with a prostitute or something the headline that made me read the story said "NBA STAR ARRESTED blah blah blah", I guess I expected to see that an actual NBA star had been arrested, as if by default being in the NBA a player is a star - I believe he was averaging 1 point and 1 board per game....  we also said that the word great was used way too often to describe players because when someone calls Perkins or Delonte West doesn't that make Larry Legend superhuman (or at least something beyond great!)...

    My point is that when someone refers to someone as being "a player" I typically deduce that it means that he will be or is a star.  Bradley is a good defender and only starting because a 36 year old hall of famer is out for a team that will be under 500 by the middle of April, hardly what I will call "a player".  I seem to recall that he was the number two prospect coming out of high school the year he graduated, so suffice it to say that he has not yet plateaued.

    Will he get better?  Yes but "a player", hold your horses.

    Finally, it should be readily apparent that Rondo is an albatross going nowhere.  The best teams already have point guards (that can shoot) and his supposed cap-friendly contract is about 20% of the cap - hardly what I would call friendly.  It is obvious to me when NO wanted Steph Curry and his never-healing ankles ahead of Rondo that Danny's assessment of Rondo is as I have always stated, vastly overstated / overrated.  You have a point guard you can't give away, 2 first round picks that can't play, you will get two more this year, and a 35 year old small forward that is making way too much  money.  Young stars want to go where there are young stars - that basic premise ensures none are coming to Boston. 


     
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    Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY......

    avery bradley going to be a good decent player give him a few more years this kid came out texas after 1 year of college hoops
     
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    [QUOTE]avery bradley going to be a good decent player give him a few more years this kid came out texas after 1 year of college hoops
    Posted by dom1983[/QUOTE]

    He is going to be a decent player, many of the best players come out after one year, so don't make it sound as if he would be a much better player right now if he had stayed longer... call me crazy but I believe playing against NBA players probably makes you better than playing against college players......  people used to love wax poetic about how Perk needed time and "the sky was the limit" and had he gone to college, etc. he would have been much better, I used to joke some time around year 5 of his career that had he gone to college he would still only be in his first year of law school, and then in year 6 I reminded people that had he gone to college he would only be wrapping up his MBA at that point, etc.  In other words, still waiting for Perkins to blossom.  College has absolutely nothing to do with it as our 2011 two 4 year first round picks have shown.  In my opinion, the longer a guy stays in college it becomes more evident that he can't play, not that he can.
     
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    Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY......

    Well, then Whitman should be fired. About the time avery hit that three, I think it was time to start guarding him.
     
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    In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY......:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : Tommy H and Fred Flintstone have never been seen together....  loud, boisterous, blowhards that are routinely wrong about just about every subject upon which they opine...... Tommy thinks it is some sort of major accomplishment when he can pronounce a player's name and when the replay shows a viscious foul committed by a Celtic he swears that the oopponent fouled the Celtic..... Many years ago on this board some of us tried to kind of corral the language that was being used when opining about players - the example I always used was when Andrey Blatche was arrested for some sort of sex with a prostitute or something the headline that made me read the story said "NBA STAR ARRESTED blah blah blah", I guess I expected to see that an actual NBA star had been arrested, as if by default being in the NBA a player is a star - I believe he was averaging 1 point and 1 board per game....  we also said that the word great was used way too often to describe players because when someone calls Perkins or Delonte West doesn't that make Larry Legend superhuman (or at least something beyond great!)... My point is that when someone refers to someone as being "a player" I typically deduce that it means that he will be or is a star.  Bradley is a good defender and only starting because a 36 year old hall of famer is out for a team that will be under 500 by the middle of April, hardly what I will call "a player".  I seem to recall that he was the number two prospect coming out of high school the year he graduated, so suffice it to say that he has not yet plateaued. Will he get better?  Yes but "a player", hold your horses. Finally, it should be readily apparent that Rondo is an albatross going nowhere.  The best teams already have point guards (that can shoot) and his supposed cap-friendly contract is about 20% of the cap - hardly what I would call friendly.  It is obvious to me when NO wanted Steph Curry and his never-healing ankles ahead of Rondo that Danny's assessment of Rondo is as I have always stated, vastly overstated / overrated.  You have a point guard you can't give away, 2 first round picks that can't play, you will get two more this year, and a 35 year old small forward that is making way too much  money.  Young stars want to go where there are young stars - that basic premise ensures none are coming to Boston. 
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE] Tell that to Tommy H....... Without a doubt, one of the best to ever play/coach our Boston Celtics !!!!!!
     
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    Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY......

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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : He is going to be a decent player, many of the best players come out after one year, so don't make it sound as if he would be a much better player right now if he had stayed longer... call me crazy but I believe playing against NBA players probably makes you better than playing against college players......  people used to love wax poetic about how Perk needed time and "the sky was the limit" and had he gone to college, etc. he would have been much better, I used to joke some time around year 5 of his career that had he gone to college he would still only be in his first year of law school, and then in year 6 I reminded people that had he gone to college he would only be wrapping up his MBA at that point, etc.  In other words, still waiting for Perkins to blossom.  College has absolutely nothing to do with it as our 2011 two 4 year first round picks have shown.  In my opinion, the longer a guy stays in college it becomes more evident that he can't play, not that he can.
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE]

    I think it is a case to case issue.  Some guys do benefit from coming out after a year but I see Bradley as a guy that could have benefited from another year or 2 at Texas.  He is still pretty raw and I think more time in college to develop his offensive game would have served him well. 
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : I think it is a case to case issue.  Some guys do benefit from coming out after a year but I see Bradley as a guy that could have benefited from another year or 2 at Texas.  He is still pretty raw and I think more time in college to develop his offensive game would have served him well. 
    Posted by Thesemenarecowards[/QUOTE]

    Case by case...... the reigning MVP - required to go to school for one year, rookie of the year - Griffin - required to go to school, rookie of the year - Rose - required to go to school for a year, Kobe, Howard, Wall, Irving, blah blah blah......the best players come out after 1 year...22 of the 24 all-stars were lottery picks, the lottery picks come out after a year or two at most........ in this era when a player stays for 4 years, for the most part he is not a player........  of course there are exceptions like Hibbert who being one of the biggest players in the league becomes an all-star and most thought he was just a large unathletic lumbering oxen has become a very good player but it is a rarity now.......
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : I think it is a case to case issue.  Some guys do benefit from coming out after a year but I see Bradley as a guy that could have benefited from another year or 2 at Texas.  He is still pretty raw and I think more time in college to develop his offensive game would have served him well. 
    Posted by Thesemenarecowards[/QUOT

    p.s. Chris Paul came out after 2 years and nobody is still wondering whether he is going to be a good player or not.....  just so you know.
     
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    In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY......:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : Case by case...... the reigning MVP - required to go to school for one year, rookie of the year - Griffin - required to go to school, rookie of the year - Rose - required to go to school for a year, Kobe, Howard, Wall, Irving, blah blah blah......the best players come out after 1 year...22 of the 24 all-stars were lottery picks, the lottery picks come out after a year or two at most........ in this era when a player stays for 4 years, for the most part he is not a player........  of course there are exceptions like Hibbert who being one of the biggest players in the league becomes an all-star and most thought he was just a large unathletic lumbering oxen has become a very good player but it is a rarity now.......
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE]

    Combative much?  You are being very undude....

    Right, but for a guy like Bradley who isn't Rose or Paul or Durant, I think staying in school has value because they see more actual game action instead of spending 90% of the time on the bench.  Bradley didn't dominate the college game in his one year the way Durant did.

    Trust me, if I was in Avery's shoes I'd do the same thing. 
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : Combative much?  You are being very undude.... Right, but for a guy like Bradley who isn't Rose or Paul or Durant, I think staying in school has value because they see more actual game action instead of spending 90% of the time on the bench.  Bradley didn't dominate the college game in his one year the way Durant did. Trust me, if I was in Avery's shoes I'd do the same thing. 
    Posted by Thesemenarecowards[/QUOTE]

    Sorry, I think you may have misunderstood what I was saying.  Bradley may eventually become a pretty good player and I do like him.... but very few players who were drafted where he was with either no college experience or 4 years of college become actual legit stars.....

    What I see on this board is that people think that a break out game where the opponent's coach says his game plan included ignoring him means that he is the next Kobe and that with some tutelege and experience he will become Rose.......  the board in general thinks that each year thinks Danny has drafted the sleeper, the steal of the draft, etc. and that as a result of Danny's genius the Cs are destined to become contenders... the reality of the situation is that Danny has never drafted an all-star and without at least a couple you have ZERO PERCENT CHANCE of contending........

    Neither the KG nor the Ray trades would have happened without two huge expiring contracts and then throw in a bucket of balls to make the money work... so this crazy notion that Doc stayed because Danny has a master plan and that the Cs are just a breath away from being right back on top is sheer fantasy......

    Danny made a couple of once in a career deals and there is nothing like that on the horizon and that is compounded with the vastly overrated / overpaid chip that most on this board have convinced themselves they would not trade for Moses, Jesus, Abraham, or any of the 12 apostles........ 
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : I believe you missed the point..... the Coach decided it was not worth guarding him, of course he can play D but he cannot do much else unless you put him in a position to be ignored.......
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE]


    It was a great plan, I mean Bradley outscored their entire team the first quarter.
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : Sorry, I think you may have misunderstood what I was saying.  Bradley may eventually become a pretty good player and I do like him.... but very few players who were drafted where he was with either no college experience or 4 years of college become actual legit stars..... What I see on this board is that people think that a break out game where the opponent's coach says his game plan included ignoring him means that he is the next Kobe and that with some tutelege and experience he will become Rose.......  the board in general thinks that each year thinks Danny has drafted the sleeper, the steal of the draft, etc. and that as a result of Danny's genius the Cs are destined to become contenders... the reality of the situation is that Danny has never drafted an all-star and without at least a couple you have ZERO PERCENT CHANCE of contending........ Neither the KG nor the Ray trades would have happened without two huge expiring contracts and then throw in a bucket of balls to make the money work... so this crazy notion that Doc stayed because Danny has a master plan and that the Cs are just a breath away from being right back on top is sheer fantasy...... Danny made a couple of once in a career deals and there is nothing like that on the horizon and that is compounded with the vastly overrated / overpaid chip that most on this board have convinced themselves they would not trade for Moses, Jesus, Abraham, or any of the 12 apostles........ 
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE]


    First off Bradley is developing into an excellent player. I don't think anyone is saying he is going to be the next Derrick Rose. I think the model people are looking more at is a player like Tony Allen. He has become the best on ball defender in the league and he is becoming a reasonable threat on the offensive end.

    Also, Bradley's athletic ability is off the charts. However , he is a bit small for the 2 guard and he doesn't posses great ball handling skills like truly elite point guards such as Rondo. So their is room to grow. But he is only 21. 

    As for the Celtics, they are in pretty good shape and should rebuild quickly. There are no guarantees, ever, but they have two draft picks in a loaded draft a few players in recent drafts that could become solid contributors and money to spend. That is always a good place to be. Their is also the possability of bringing back the core on cheaer salries with reinformcents like OJ Mayo. Between the draft and the money I think the future of the Celtics looks pretty bright. 

     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : First off Bradley is developing into an excellent player. I don't think anyone is saying he is going to be the next Derrick Rose. I think the model people are looking more at is a player like Tony Allen. He has become the best on ball defender in the league and he is becoming a reasonable threat on the offensive end. Also, Bradley's athletic ability is off the charts. However , he is a bit small for the 2 guard and he doesn't posses great ball handling skills like truly elite point guards such as Rondo. So their is room to grow. But he is only 21.  As for the Celtics, they are in pretty good shape and should rebuild quickly. There are no guarantees, ever, but they have two draft picks in a loaded draft a few players in recent drafts that could become solid contributors and money to spend. That is always a good place to be. Their is also the possability of bringing back the core on cheaer salries with reinformcents like OJ Mayo. Between the draft and the money I think the future of the Celtics looks pretty bright. 
    Posted by jtkl[/QUOTE]

    JTKL.... here is my most fundamental issue with you and most other posters..... you cannot say that "player x is developing into an excellent player" and then mention that he is not going to be Rose...... Rose is an excellent player and therefore by default player X cannot be one...... there is a decided and gigantic difference between excellent players and nice players off the bench..... OJ Mayo would come here and immediately become the best player on the team as opposed to a reinforcement.... please at least attempt to use the language properly.... Rose and excellent player, Deron Williams is an excellent player, CP3 is an excellent player, a player at Bradley's level is not by almost any definition of "excellent" is not an excellent player....... Bradley is on the way to almost becoming a marginal starter at the 2 guard who at 6 feet 2 inches will be an undersized 2 guard and when I think of undersized two guards I think of Ben Gordon and Bradley is nowhere near as good as Gordon... so please either use the language better or temper your enthusiasm or both......
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : JTKL.... here is my most fundamental issue with you and most other posters..... you cannot say that "player x is developing into an excellent player" and then mention that he is not going to be Rose...... Rose is an excellent player and therefore by default player X cannot be one...... there is a decided and gigantic difference between excellent players and nice players off the bench..... OJ Mayo would come here and immediately become the best player on the team as opposed to a reinforcement.... please at least attempt to use the language properly.... Rose and excellent player, Deron Williams is an excellent player, CP3 is an excellent player, a player at Bradley's level is not by almost any definition of "excellent" is not an excellent player....... Bradley is on the way to almost becoming a marginal starter at the 2 guard who at 6 feet 2 inches will be an undersized 2 guard and when I think of undersized two guards I think of Ben Gordon and Bradley is nowhere near as good as Gordon... so please either use the language better or temper your enthusiasm or both......
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE]

    No Rose is a great player. One of the 10 best on the planet. An excellent player would be someone in the OJ Mayo category. or the Tonly Allen Category or the Bruce Bowen Category, Horace Grant Category,so on and so on.

    Lamar Odom was an excellent player, Tim Duncan was a great one. I think their is a lot of potential in Bradley, but he is not going to carry is team like Rose and no one is saying he ever will.  If your criteria of an excellent player is Derrick Rose, then their are only 10 excellent players in the league and obviously That means around 20 teams have no excellent players. Not logic I buy. 
     
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    Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY......

    In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY......:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : No Rose is a great player. One of the 10 best on the planet. An excellent player would be someone in the OJ Mayo category. or the Tonly Allen Category or the Bruce Bowen Category, Horace Grant Category,so on and so on. Lamar Odom was an excellent player, Tim Duncan was a great one. I think their is a lot of potential in Bradley, but he is not going to carry is team like Rose and no one is saying he ever will.  If your criteria of an excellent player is Derrick Rose, then their are only 10 excellent players in the league and obviously That means around 20 teams have no excellent players. Not logic I buy. 
    Posted by jtkl[/QUOTE]

    I think that when you start talking Tony Allen, Bruce Bowen and the likes, you are not talking excellent players.  You are talking average.  I believe that Bradley will be better than average.  He was a top ranked player coming out of high school and has ony now started finding himself.  He may very well become a Montae Ellis level player (BTW, Montae was a 2nd round pick).

    It is obvious that both Rondo and Bradley, even at their best, will not be complete players.  But they are going to have similar quality NBA careers which is pretty darned good.
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : The Washington coach admitted not guarding Bradley on purpose.  With Rondo and Bradley in the game at the same time you can game plan to not guard either one, double Ray or Paul or KG and sag in the paint..... I like Bradley, I think he will continue to improve but when a coach openly admits to purposely not guarding a player it is hard to call the game some sort of coming out party.....
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE]BTW DUDSTER,   The wizzards coach won't be the bench boss next year.......  Heck, the fool gave Bradley (Ray Allens) 23 points last night & Bradley brought his "A" game on "D" = VICTORY !!!
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : BTW DUDSTER,   The wizzards coach won't be the bench boss next year.......  Heck, the fool gave Bradley (Ray Allens) 23 points last night & Bradley brought his "A" game on "D" = VICTORY !!!
    Posted by Bill-806[/QUOTE]

    As I said I like Bradley but as has been custom for the Cs lately they played a team without one of their best players and got a victory.......  deluding oneself into thinking the Cs are a good team by beating a team that just traded for a team that would be one of their best players but by coaches decision decided not to play him the Cs are somehow considered a good team......
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : As I said I like Bradley but as has been custom for the Cs lately they played a team without one of their best players and got a victory.......  deluding oneself into thinking the Cs are a good team by beating a team that just traded for a team that would be one of their best players but by coaches decision decided not to play him the Cs are somehow considered a good team......
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE]


    The Celtics are a good team. Good teams beat bad ones. Are they a great team this year? No. They are 11-5 since the all star break. if they had played that good out of the gate we'd be a third seed in the east. 
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: So, great wise ones... Ya got to like AVERY BRADLEY...... : The Celtics are a good team. Good teams beat bad ones. Are they a great team this year? No. They are 11-5 since the all star break. if they had played that good out of the gate we'd be a third seed in the east. 
    Posted by jtkl[/QUOTE]

    They cannot beat good teams, they barely beat bad teams on the road, the beat bad teams at home more easily and it deludes posters into thinking they are a good team......  11 and 5 since the all-star game... are any of those teams above 500?  the only 1 can think of is the clippers and perhaps the hawks....... not sure you get the concept here.... going 5 and 11 is better than going 11 and 5 since the all-star game.... deep draft is mutually exclusive with going 11 and 5 since the break....... they cannot beat good teams, they cannot beat good teams in a series, every loss is a very very very good thing........  losing to Charlotte is a gift tonight... but those of you who are clueless cannot quite comprehend it.... every year you don't don't draft the best players becomes a year where you cannot compete against the best players.......
     

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