TANK OR TRADE

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from wicksandrowe. Show wicksandrowe's posts

    TANK OR TRADE

    HYPOTHESIS:  Garnett and Pierce will not get appreciably better this year and will be even less effective next season. 

    The team from here forward needs players who are bigger, smarter, more physical, and better defenders at all positions. Specifically, it needs a killer rebounder and inside scorer, a professional wing scorer, a couple of physically tough glue-guy specialists (defender, shooter), and perhaps a point guard. (sigh! so does every team!)

    How does that happen given present assets? 

    COLD BLOODED PALACE COUP   Move Garnett, Pierce, and Rondo.

    “Guys, thanks for everything, but to make the Celtics better in the long run we have to trade you, separately, to contenders for younger players.”  

    OR

    LIFETIME ACHIEVEMENT AWARD   Keep the old assets, Garnett, Pierce and Rondo, and get what you can for the rest.

    “For old times sakes, we keep you here, but we also start tanking now and unload Green, Bass, Terry, Lee, et. al., for sure, and perhaps even Rondo.”

    BUT 

    What CAN’T happen is keeping you AND trying to win with this group. You may want to play for a title, but the evidence is in that as constituted this team and some of these players do not have it in them to play for a title.

    The plan to graft the new players onto the old hasn’t worked and it looks more and more like it can’t/won’t.

    Are there any stop gap solutions to this?

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from teejaytee70. Show teejaytee70's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    Tank.  We're not close to being contenders.  Right now the Celtics are in the place where you do not want to be in the NBA - Forever .500 Limbo.  This can lead to years of oblivion - not bad enough to get great players in the draft and not good enough to get past the second round of the playoffs.  Tear it down, now.  I want to see Sullinger and Green playing 35 minutes plus per game.  If Melo continues to shine in the DL, then bring him up after the All Star break and start him next to Garnett and hope he develops.  I do not believe there will be any monster trades because the Celtics honestly do not have that many pieces....and the pieces they do have should not be traded - Sully and AB.  Garnett would be difficult to trade.  Pierce would be difficult to trade as well.  Pierce will be gone at the end of the year - let him go.  Maybe Garnett will decide to retire.  If that happens, hopefully Doc will go - he's not the guy to take us through a rebuilding process. 

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from kaktug. Show kaktug's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    ruibuild around rondo, AB, green, sully, melo...let the rest walk.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Celtsfan4life. Show Celtsfan4life's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    We are terrible right now, but to remain a franchise that is about winning, you never tank.  Last time we tried that strategy (ML Carr coaching), we ended up irrelevant for 20 years.   Boston is NOT a destination like Miami, LA, Dallas, New York for the biggest name free agents.  So, we'd have to get some stars in the draft and that's a very risky approach.

    danny has to take what he has and try to do a trade that brings a big man this year.  Then, hope that Doc and KG pull the same thing as last year and have the team playing better ball in the second half.

     

     

     

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from teejaytee70. Show teejaytee70's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    In response to Celtsfan4life's comment:

    We are terrible right now, but to remain a franchise that is about winning, you never tank.  Last time we tried that strategy (ML Carr coaching), we ended up irrelevant for 20 years.   Boston is NOT a destination like Miami, LA, Dallas, New York for the biggest name free agents.  So, we'd have to get some stars in the draft and that's a very risky approach.

    danny has to take what he has and try to do a trade that brings a big man this year.  Then, hope that Doc and KG pull the same thing as last year and have the team playing better ball in the second half.

     

     

     




    By "tank", I do not mean lose on purpose like the Celtics did to try to get Duncan.  I mean start to develop young players and accept that the window has closed for a championship for awhile.  Use this time to develop the young players.

     

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from hedleylamarr. Show hedleylamarr's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    KG may retire at the end of the year

    PP may opt OUT of his deal

    We will be rebuilding by default.

    If we can get Cousins or Big Al this year, I maintain we will have enough to be good.  I don't know if there is a trade out there that can get us past MIA......but if we rebound, we can get past everyone else!

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from celticsince1958. Show celticsince1958's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    Tank and trade.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Celtsfan4life. Show Celtsfan4life's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    In response to teejaytee70's comment:

    In response to Celtsfan4life's comment:

    We are terrible right now, but to remain a franchise that is about winning, you never tank.  Last time we tried that strategy (ML Carr coaching), we ended up irrelevant for 20 years.   Boston is NOT a destination like Miami, LA, Dallas, New York for the biggest name free agents.  So, we'd have to get some stars in the draft and that's a very risky approach.

    danny has to take what he has and try to do a trade that brings a big man this year.  Then, hope that Doc and KG pull the same thing as last year and have the team playing better ball in the second half.

     

     

     




    By "tank", I do not mean lose on purpose like the Celtics did to try to get Duncan.  I mean start to develop young players and accept that the window has closed for a championship for awhile.  Use this time to develop the young players.

     



    I know what you meant.  But, not playing KG and not playing Paul is to lose on purpose.  Come on, you really thing Doc will watch a game where we can win and let our best scorer (Paul) and our best defender (KG) sit on the bench while we lose?   I would be apalled as a fan as would most people sitting in the stands.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from jdm894g. Show jdm894g's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    In all honesty...KG and PP should be coming off the bench.  They are not starters anymore.  Folks just need to accept that as reality.  At 11 mill a pop should not have to have minutes managed and can play less than half a quarter.  That is some bullsh1t.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Schumpeters-Ghost. Show Schumpeters-Ghost's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    I get the feeling ainge is tempted by the lottery. 

     
  11. This post has been removed.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from antiqueman1. Show antiqueman1's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    In response to kaktug's comment:

    ruibuild around rondo, AB, green, sully, melo...let the rest walk.




    I don't think the answer is rebuilding around Rondo and Green. I think Rondo has great talent, but is too immature and a diva. He is part of the problem, not the solution.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from antiqueman1. Show antiqueman1's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    In response to jdm894g's comment:

    In all honesty...KG and PP should be coming off the bench.  They are not starters anymore.  Folks just need to accept that as reality.  At 11 mill a pop should not have to have minutes managed and can play less than half a quarter.  That is some bullsh1t.



    I could not agree more and stated it last season over and over. When Allen, KG and Pierce all started. That was the beginning of the end. Just too old. And now with Allen playing for the enemy, that just leaves Pierce and KG. One should start but not both. The Cs are not even a .500 team as constructed. TRADE

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Celtsfan4life. Show Celtsfan4life's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    In response to antiqueman1's comment:

    In response to kaktug's comment:

    ruibuild around rondo, AB, green, sully, melo...let the rest walk.




    I don't think the answer is rebuilding around Rondo and Green. I think Rondo has great talent, but is too immature and a diva. He is part of the problem, not the solution.



    Agreed.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Celtsfan4life. Show Celtsfan4life's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    In response to jdm894g's comment:

    In all honesty...KG and PP should be coming off the bench.  They are not starters anymore.  Folks just need to accept that as reality.  At 11 mill a pop should not have to have minutes managed and can play less than half a quarter.  That is some bullsh1t.



    And why is it that Pop manages Duncan's minutes so that he's fresh all season?   What Doc is doing is the smart move to manage for the full season.  KG could play more minutes but would worn out and subject to more injury.  

     
  16. This post has been removed.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from ironceltic33. Show ironceltic33's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    While I love KG and Pierce, they may have to go at some point. I love Sully. Best low post player since we had since Radja. I won't say McHale,yet. Ainge doesn't need to trade him. Fab has some talent. He had to learn basketball and English, KG needs to work with him, too. Jim Boeheim screwed with his game at SU. This team reminds me of McHale and Reggie Lewis (RIP) last seasons. We don't need to go down the same path after Reggie's death. Don't tank. Go Celts!

     
  18. This post has been removed.

     
  19. This post has been removed.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from antiqueman1. Show antiqueman1's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

    Rondo has already proven he can still improve. This season his shooting % has gone up compared to last season. He's also just 26 years old. So Rondo can still get better. If not then the Celts can always trade him next season or before he become a FA in 2015.

    Right now it's unfair to say that Rondo is part of the problem.




    Sorry Fiierce. How many more yrs will it take for Rondo to reach his full potential? He is part of the problem. Hence the reason Ray moved on for less money. There are others out there that can do Rondo's job with less headaches involved.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from antiqueman1. Show antiqueman1's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

    Before we put the blame on Rondo, KG plays 29.1 minutes per game, Duncan 30.4 minutes per game, but why is it that Duncan still averages 9.9 boards per game while KG only gets 7.0 boards every game? I mean is it Rondo's fault that KG has gone from 10.5 rebounds per game, career average, to just 7.0 rpg?

     



    Duncan is on a team with talent. And a better point guard. KG is on a team but it lacks depth and talent. H_ll the SA bench took Miami to the threshold a few weeks back. Actually, they should have won.

     
  22. This post has been removed.

     
  23. This post has been removed.

     
  24. This post has been removed.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Celtsfan4life. Show Celtsfan4life's posts

    Re: TANK OR TRADE

    In response to Fierce34's comment:

    Rondo has already proven he can still improve. This season his shooting % has gone up compared to last season. He's also just 26 years old. So Rondo can still get better. If not then the Celts can always trade him next season or before he become a FA in 2015.

    Right now it's unfair to say that Rondo is part of the problem.



    Come on, Fierce, time to fess up to some intellectual honesty on this one.  Rondo is not part of the problem?  Really?

    Rondo's clearly not the ONLY problem but it is equally clear that he is PART of the problem.  Watch the Spurs, for example, and see how Parker pushes the ball and is often a one man fast break.  Watch him clearly create early in the shot clock and when he goes to the hole he either scores or kicks the ball out.  That starts the ball rotating and forces the opposition defense to rotate and switch.  After the 2nd or 3rd pass, they have a wide open jumper, often a 3 pointer.  

    That's how we used to play and why we led the league in field goal %...the ball moved!   As Rondo became a star (and was told this is HIS team), he held the ball looking for that one hero/ESPN highligh pass that created an assist for him.   As he became a star, he's improved his shooting but he's not TRYING to score to take the load off others.

    Again, look at Parker, Paul, Westbrook, Rose, Jennings, or (yuck) Isiah Thomas against us!....they all score and get their team easy buckets.  Saves their big men from always having to score and get double teamed.  Gives them offensive rebound opportunities, as well, when the PG breaks down the defense.  We need Rondo to do that!

    Rondo CLEARLY has the skills to do this but chooses not to....even when Doc is pleading from he sidelines for him to push the pace and move the ball.  He CHOOSES to walk it up and dribble for 15 to 18 seconds while he's directing traffic as if no one but him knows how to play the game!

    He clearly plays below his potential and it hurts the team.  All that and I haven't even mentioned his matador defense.  He's is definitely part of our problem, not the whole problem and not the biggest problem, but a big part of our problems.   I am not an advocate for trading Rondo, but I do think Danny and Doc need to get in his rear or sit him more!

     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share