The Truth about Rondo

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: Truth about Rondo

    In Response to Re: Truth about Rondo:
    oh just wait until jerrycole gets ahold of you reckless people. 
    Posted by aciemvp


    JerryCole is being awfully, awfully quiet. I keep waiting for him to bust out and school Doc on the importance of  trusting the 82games.com stats over what Doc "sees" or what Doc "thinks he sees" on the court RE:  the flaws in young Rondo's game and how it effected the finals.

    My sense is that J/C just got cut off at the kneecaps, considering how many posters he has vilified for being far less critical of Rondo than Doc's common sense, plain as day observations were.

    How about it, J/C? Give us your take on things!

    Man up!

    Pud
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonTrollSpanker. Show BostonTrollSpanker's posts

    Re: Truth about Rondo

    Rondo is currently the starting point guard on the US team so something tells me his game has some redeeming qualities. Rondo haters don't seem to understand that EVERY player has flaws in their game that can be exploited. The key is how you gell as a team and compensate for the flaws of each teammate. Rondo is a good fit with this team just as he is with Team USA. That said, what separates me from a few of the Rondo fanboys on this forum is that I'm not willing to put Rondo in the class of Chris Paul or Deron Williams until he becomes a very good free throw shooter, which I think he can do. Rondo's game is too dependent on slashing and driving to afford any mental hangups about getting to the line. If Rondo doesn't develop that free throw consistency it will prevent him from entering the true elite point guards and it will create some headaches for the team and coaches in the fourth quarters of important games. So that's got to change and hopefully it will. What the haters don't understand however is that we wouldn't have been been in those games without Rondo. 

    I'm baffled by those who think that Rondo getting coached by Coach K is a bad thing for him to be doing this summer. Also laughing at those who said he wouldn't make the roster. 
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

    Re: Truth about Rondo

    In Response to Re: Truth about Rondo:
    I'm baffled by those who think that Rondo getting coached by Coach K is a bad thing for him to be doing this summer. Also laughing at those who said he wouldn't make the roster. 
    Posted by BostonTrollSpanker


    i never said any of that.  but i greatly lament the fact that rondo is two coats of paint away from greatness.....  going into year 5 already.  you can make excuses for him or you can look at the facts.  every player does have a weak point or two. 

    but generally for his position it does not reside in being a miserable / unable to be consistent shooter.  it just doesn't happen for PG's and if it does then your name is jacque vaughan, speedy clankton, steve colter and the like.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from cpjohn1. Show cpjohn1's posts

    Re: Truth about Rondo

    Doc's pissed that they lost the finals because of Rondo.  You can say it was rebounding, but Rondo is one of the reasons for the lopsided rebounding.  Kobe was allowed to clog the paint and grab 15 rebounds because he didnt' have to pay attention to Rondo. I know we lost Perk, but we only lost by 4 points and if the Celtics grab some of those rebounds Kobe got, they would have won, despite losing Perk.  But Doc deserves much of the blame.  Nate only played 4 minutes in game 7.  Maybe he should have played Nate, that would have spaced the floor and Kobe would have to guard someone.  Doc is just as much at fault as Rondo for not making the adjustments when Rondo wasn't working.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: Truth about Rondo

    In Response to Re: Truth about Rondo:
    Rondo is currently the starting point guard on the US team so something tells me his game has some redeeming qualities. Rondo haters don't seem to understand that EVERY player has flaws in their game that can be exploited. The key is how you gell as a team and compensate for the flaws of each teammate. Rondo is a good fit with this team just as he is with Team USA. That said, what separates me from a few of the Rondo fanboys on this forum is that I'm not willing to put Rondo in the class of Chris Paul or Deron Williams until he becomes a very good free throw shooter, which I think he can do. Rondo's game is too dependent on slashing and driving to afford any mental hangups about getting to the line. If Rondo doesn't develop that free throw consistency it will prevent him from entering the true elite point guards and it will create some headaches for the team and coaches in the fourth quarters of important games. So that's got to change and hopefully it will. What the haters don't understand however is that we wouldn't have been been in those games without Rondo.  I'm baffled by those who think that Rondo getting coached by Coach K is a bad thing for him to be doing this summer. Also laughing at those who said he wouldn't make the roster. 
    Posted by BostonTrollSpanker



    I think that we can safely count Doc among Rondo's "haters" NOW  since he has spoken critically of Kid Teflon.

    I had hoped aloud that Rondo would NOT make Team USA. He has more important things to be doing than building his brand. Besides rank amateurs should be playing for Team USA IMHO.

    Nothing would build brand more than his finally learning some BB fundamentals in a quiet gym somewhere away from limelight.

    Pud
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from potging. Show potging's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    lets go celtics....
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from croc. Show croc's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    This one's for you Pud.

    Rondo is rated 3rd best PG behind only Paul and Deron Williams by Kelly Dwyer of Ball Don't Lie

    http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Ranking-the-point-guards-10-through-No-1;_ylt=AspsSmYhljPwQX7ifPNpItS8vLYF?urn=nba-263267

    http://www.celticsblog.com/2010/8/18/1630725/rondo-is-ranked-3rd-best-point
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo:


    Given this rating, does this mean that the Lakers should have given young Rondo at least token defensive attention in the finals instead of sagging and resting KB?

    Does this mean that he really is fearless and CPP should let Rondo handle the ball at crunch time?

    Are his coach and teammates being way too darn hard on Rondo, just because he can't shoot, leaving the team in a lurch?

    He do have rating though!

    Pud
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    in that ranking of guards, i thought that ONLY for the fact that rondo doesn't have a reliable shot, he should have been ranked equal to westbrook and no higher.  his performance in the finals just was not 3rd in the league, sorry.  i wish it was.

    as soon as the kid masters (to a consistent, medium level of competence) the open jumper and the free throw, he immediately becomes #2 behind chris paul, no questions asked.  and if he gets better at shooting from there, he could be the top guard in the game pretty quickly.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: Truth about Rondo

    In Response to Re: Truth about Rondo:
    Rondo is currently the starting point guard on the US team so something tells me his game has some redeeming qualities. Rondo haters don't seem to understand that EVERY player has flaws in their game that can be exploited. The key is how you gell as a team and compensate for the flaws of each teammate. Rondo is a good fit with this team just as he is with Team USA. That said, what separates me from a few of the Rondo fanboys on this forum is that I'm not willing to put Rondo in the class of Chris Paul or Deron Williams until he becomes a very good free throw shooter, which I think he can do. Rondo's game is too dependent on slashing and driving to afford any mental hangups about getting to the line. If Rondo doesn't develop that free throw consistency it will prevent him from entering the true elite point guards and it will create some headaches for the team and coaches in the fourth quarters of important games. So that's got to change and hopefully it will. What the haters don't understand however is that we wouldn't have been been in those games without Rondo.  I'm baffled by those who think that Rondo getting coached by Coach K is a bad thing for him to be doing this summer. Also laughing at those who said he wouldn't make the roster. 
    Posted by BostonTrollSpanker


    Hmmmmmmmm!!! Lookee here!

    Pud
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    Id have to agree that Rondo may never be able to hit FT's at a good percentage. Hes been in the NBA long enough, if he hasnt fixed it yet, he probably never will. Same story with Shaq and all the other bad FT shooters... just cant be taught.

    Last year during a close playoff game (cant remember) I was so angry that Doc left Rondo & Perk in the game together during the final minutes. We cant afford to ever do that in close games other than injuries.

    So just accept Rondo for what he is, he gives the Celts plenty and he'll occassionaly hit his FT's, then miss 4 in a row. So will Shaq and Perk.

    We also have issues with Rondo when he gets reckless with the ball, sometimes trying to force fancy, threading the needle passes when the game is on the line. Well, we hate it when it doesn work but love him when it does. When you get a dog, the fleas come with it. ITs a matter of Doc recognizing when we cant afford to have so many bad FT shooters on the court at the same time in a tight game.  He cant worry so much about egos (which unfortunately he does) Rondo is a head case as is Pierce and DOc usually treats them like special players and feeds their egos even when it hurts the team.

    hey, thats Docs job to do what he thinks is best. I dont always agree but I also dont get paid millions to make those decisions.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo:
    Id have to agree that Rondo may never be able to hit FT's at a good percentage. Hes been in the NBA long enough, if he hasnt fixed it yet, he probably never will. Same story with Shaq and all the other bad FT shooters... just cant be taught. Last year during a close playoff game (cant remember) I was so angry that Doc left Rondo & Perk in the game together during the final minutes. We cant afford to ever do that in close games other than injuries. So just accept Rondo for what he is, he gives the Celts plenty and he'll occassionaly hit his FT's, then miss 4 in a row. So will Shaq and Perk. We also have issues with Rondo when he gets reckless with the ball, sometimes trying to force fancy, threading the needle passes when the game is on the line. Well, we hate it when it doesn work but love him when it does. When you get a dog, the fleas come with it. ITs a matter of Doc recognizing when we cant afford to have so many bad FT shooters on the court at the same time in a tight game.  He cant worry so much about egos (which unfortunately he does) Rondo is a head case as is Pierce and DOc usually treats them like special players and feeds their egos even when it hurts the team. hey, thats Docs job to do what he thinks is best. I dont always agree but I also dont get paid millions to make those decisions.
    Posted by Karllost


    Apparently Coach K refused to feed Rondo's ego... so Rondo decided that he's really rather have another NBA ring than a Team USA championship... and went home to get ready for 2010-11 season... instead. 

    Besides facts establish that

    (1) he really didn't want to play with Team USA (agent's idea afterall), especially when he realized that other superstars (KB, LBJ, DWade) passed, leaving him a  superstar, now inexplicably riding the pines... but supremely confident (bordering on cocky) that he was irreplaceable;

    (2) he hated Euro food;

    (3) he missed his 2 year old daughter (no mention of the the daughter's mother BTW) and needed to be with her.

    Pud
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    From Mark Murphy at the BH.... Note the quotes in bold letters.

    Pud

    N
    EWPORT, R.I. - Rajon Rondo’s self-image is exalted, in a matter-of-fact kind of way.

    “I feel I’m the best at what I do, and that’s how I play it,” the point guard said following yesterday’s practice at Salve Regina. “People know who I am, but that’s not why I play. I play to be the best.

    “I’m the best, hands down. There’s no speculation. Not top three or top five, I’m the best.”

    Shaquille O’Neal, for one, won’t dispute those supremely cocky words. The former Cavalier’s memory of Rondo in last season’s Eastern Conference semifinals is still so vividly painful, Shaq needs a waiver from the FCC just to talk about it.

    Back on the night of Game 1, he also needed a license from the WWE for his hard takedown of the Celtics point guard.

    “Being the big man and being the enforcer, he was killing us, so I had to touch him up, you know?” Shaq said. “But I knew he was a tough kid because he kept coming at me. He kept coming at me. A lot of times when you touch people up, they have a choice to make. You know, ‘I don’t want to get fouled by Shaq again,’ and you make them go somewhere else. That (bleep) kept coming.”

    And O’Neal, still haunted despite the fact Cleveland actually won the game and countered Rondo’s 27-point, 12-rebound, six-assist performance, kept reliving the moment.

    “We didn’t plan for him at all,” he said. “And then when he (bleep) tore us a new (bleep), we had to plan for him. That’s what I really like about this team - that you can tell that they’re unselfish, because, you know, most teams have one or two guys that you’ve always got to get up for.

    “So we’re concentrating on Paul (Pierce) and Kevin (Garnett), and this (bleep) gave us a triple-double. Now we’ve got to concentrate on him. But him being a smart player, he just did the same thing. But when we reacted, he just gave up the ball. Then (bleep) Ray (Allen) got off. Now we’ve got to (bleep) concentrate on Ray, and Ray dropping that (bleep) to Kevin. And then the game they beat us, everybody got off. So that’s when I said I wouldn’t mind playing for a team like that, because they don’t give a (bleep) who scores or who takes all the shots.”

    And one of the best parts, according to O’Neal? He now gets to play with the little bleep.

    “He’s the new definition of a point guard,” he said. “Of course he’s going to get everybody off, but if you disrespect him, he’s going to put up MVP-type numbers.”

    Magic Johnson, in much cleaner fashion, said something similar about Rondo last May. The Hall of Famer called him “the best all-around point guard” in the NBA.

    Reminded of Johnson’s words, Rondo finally slowed down for a moment.

    “That’s a great acknowledgement from, if not the best point guard there ever was, then one of them,” he said. “But I was (determined) to put in the work to get there. Derrick Rose was working this summer for it, and Russell Westbrook was working this summer.

    “It’s not to be the best for one year, or for people to say it for one year - it’s to do it every night and to do it for the next five.”

    That means that Rondo can’t spend too much time listening when a player like Johnson or O’Neal starts mailing bouquets.

    He can’t be swooned when some Hall of Famer affectionately calls him a little bleep.

    “It is easy to let something like that get to you, but on this team it’s not,” Rondo said. “There’s All-Stars on this team, four future Hall of Famers, so I haven’t done anything yet.

    “I just play the game. If I was the only guy on the Celtics who was an All-Star then maybe I would relax a little bit, but I’m not. That’s just who I am, how I’m wired.”

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from P34. Show P34's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    I think Rondo will average 10 assists per game this year. The 2 O'Neals are certainly an upgrade from Perk on the offensive end. 
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo:
    I think Rondo will average 10 assists per game this year. The 2 O'Neals are certainly an upgrade from Perk on the offensive end. 
    Posted by P34


    Agreed! Good assist numbers for Rondo this year and for DWest too feeding down low.

    Nice to have the BUPG position solidified before the season even starts.

    A win win situation for sure with each able to play to his own strengths.

    Pud
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo:
    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo : Agreed! Good assist numbers for Rondo this year and for DWest too feeding down low. Nice to have the BUPG position solidified before the season even starts. A win win situation for sure with each able to play to his own strengths. Pud
    Posted by puddinpuddin


    wouldn't ya say that nate is the back up PG and deloonte is the backup ray allen?  i know delonte has some 1 skills in his bag and that's only a plus, but in my mind you can't ice nate out of the rotation to 3rd string #1 as i think he has better ballhandling and possibly passing skills (based on his work in a green uniform in the playoffs last year) than delonte. 

    right?
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonTrollSpanker. Show BostonTrollSpanker's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    "wouldn't ya say that nate is the back up PG and deloonte is the backup ray allen?"

    Yeah, I'd agree, though if Nate is having an off night or if Ray is on fire I could see Delonte playing some point. As pud pointed out, this will give Doc some options. As for Rondo, this next year is really going to be the year where we find out if he can overcome some of his remaining flaws and become truly elite or if he is going to linger in that second pack of point guards who are very effective but not elite. Rondo isn't the only one, this is a big year for Derrick Rose as well that way. Both struggle with their jump shot, difference right now is Derrick is better from the line. I was ready to put Rondo in that elite group but his free throw shooting in the finals changed my tune slightly. One thing is for sure, this is going to be one of the more interesting NBA regular seasons in a while, and in the eastern conference, the young guns of the Heat versus the old guard of the Celtics, with Chicago trying to insert itself into the picture and the Magic and the Hawks trying to do something also - that's going to be pretty good. Staying healthy may be our biggest challenge, but I'm encouraged by what I hear about KG in training camp...
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo:
    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo : wouldn't ya say that nate is the back up PG and deloonte is the backup ray allen?  i know delonte has some 1 skills in his bag and that's only a plus, but in my mind you can't ice nate out of the rotation to 3rd string #1 as i think he has better ballhandling and possibly passing skills (based on his work in a green uniform in the playoffs last year) than delonte.  right?
    Posted by aciemvp


    Agreed... I forgot completely about Nate (brain f@rt). I think of DWest as a PG anyway since that's the position I remember him mostly playing when he was last in Celtic green, before Rondo came aboard. (Besides Nate has kinda gotten lost in the shuffle.)

    DWest: Fairly decent PG as I recall. Good handle. Good midrange game. Tough nosed. Gritty. Hits his FTs. Spreads the floor. Nothing flashy. Not afraid of taking the big shot. Should compliment RR, RA and Nate well.

    Nice to be deep in the backcourt for a change.

    Pud
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from dboss. Show dboss's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    I think things are setting up for West to play off the ball and for Nate to run the offense.

    I think that will be a good change of pace.  However Ialso expect to see West and Rondo paired together during games.  The Celtics have tons of options at the 1,2 spots.

    Can't wait to see the 1st pre season game and I'm hoping it will be broadcast down here in Atlanta.

    dboss
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo:
    [QUOTEbecome truly elite or if he is going to linger in that second pack of point guards who are very effective but not elite. Rondo isn't the only one, this is a big year for Derrick Rose as well that way. Both struggle with their jump shot, difference right now is Derrick is better from the line.Posted by BostonTrollSpanker[/QUOTE]

    no, rondo is not the only one who is in the second tier ranking, but he is TOTALLY ALONE among point guards playing any sort of minutes in the nba and lingering around 60% freebies.  so alone that it makes my head hurt.  he is dead last by a mile in those most crucial of stats for the position that is supposed to control the ball during crunch time rather than run away from it for fear of being fouled........
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo:
    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo : [QUOTEbecome truly elite or if he is going to linger in that second pack of point guards who are very effective but not elite. Rondo isn't the only one , this is a big year for Derrick Rose as well that way. Both struggle with their jump shot, difference right now is Derrick is better from the line.Posted by BostonTrollSpanker
    no, rondo is not the only one who is in the second tier ranking, but he is TOTALLY ALONE among point guards playing any sort of minutes in the nba and lingering around 60% freebies .  so alone that it makes my head hurt.  he is dead last by a mile in those most crucial of stats for the position that is supposed to control the ball during crunch time rather than run away from it for fear of being fouled........
    Posted by aciemvp


    I have lived with the reality that poor FT shooting takes the ball out of Rondo's hands at crunch time.

    With DWest on the team, poor FT shooting should put Rondo on the bench too at crunch time... and I can live with that too. Okay with me.

    What I could not live with was the C's having to play 3 on 5 (including Perk) or 4 on 5 at crunch time because their PG couldn't hit FT's.

    That was AWFUL!

    Pud


 
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo:
    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo : With DWest on the team, poor FT shooting should put Rondo on the bench too at crunch time...
    Posted by puddinpuddin


    remember nate too.  unless the opposing PG is large in size, i like him on the floor closing out a game too.  he's not afraid and he can shoot outside better than deloonte

    maybe sitting his fanny down, if doc actually does it, in crunch time will connect to rondo.  i think most of the problem to date is that nobody has connected with rondo in a way that gets past his ego.

    he was pre-annointed starter of (the now and) future by danny after the last 20 games of his rook year.  he's not had pressure on him from management, just pressure from kg, pierce and ray.  and that sort of fellow player pressure only goes so far.
     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo:
    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo : remember nate too.  unless the opposing PG is large in size, i like him on the floor closing out a game too.  he's not afraid and he can shoot outside better than deloonte maybe sitting his fanny down, if doc actually does it, in crunch time will connect to rondo.  i think most of the problem to date is that nobody has connected with rondo in a way that gets past his ego. he was pre-annointed starter of (the now and) future by danny after the last 20 games of his rook year.  he's not had pressure on him from management, just pressure from kg, pierce and ray.  and that sort of fellow player pressure only goes so far.
    Posted by aciemvp


    I continue to have a problem taking Nate seriously. (Maybe seeing him fully integrated into the C's game plan will change my mind.)

    I tend to think of him more like he is one of Oakland A's owner Charlie Finley's freak show midgets than a legit NBA player.

    I know he can dunk and is an explosive scorer but he is so painfully undersized that I sense whatever he gives us on the offensive end he immediately gives up defensively when the other team mercilessly exploits his size.

    At least, DWest has size to him.

    I had the exact same problem with Spud Webb... and hate to be unfair to these little guys... but they are awfully small!!!

    Big hearts, indeed... but its a tall man's game.

    Pud


     
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    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo:
    In Response to Re: The Truth about Rondo : I continue to have a problem taking Nate seriously. Posted by puddinpuddin


    you may be right.  but for me, what i saw from nate in the playoffs, i saw a serious player and a viable one too.  he was a pest on defense and had a super 3 pt fg% and some terrific games for us. 

    sure, it wasn't every game but you also have to consider that nate overcame doc's hatred of young players to crack the rotation at all. 

    i guess i need to see more from nate to say that he'll be there for 100% sure in key situations down the stretch.  but really it's up to doc to let him prove he doesn't belong because i feel nate proved that he very much belonged in what we saw of him, finally. 

    and here's anothe way to look at it- RAY needs his minutes cut way down, like to 26 or 28 a game if we don't want another coffin act in the playoffs.  that means delonte gets a lot of mins there.  does wafer even make it?  i dunno.  has anyone heard how he's doing?
     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from oldtimerceltfan. Show oldtimerceltfan's posts

    Re: The Truth about Rondo

    How long has Rondo been in the NBA? 5 yrs
    Has he been in long enough to have improve on his faults? Yes
    What the avg. NBA career? 12 Yrs
    Is he in the second half of that avg. career? very soon
    Why has he not improve his faults by now? lack of dedication

    Whoop there it is! He's lazy
     
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