we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from JamezHill24. Show JamezHill24's posts

    we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    theres alot of pressure on Danny to blow this team up to avoid the same fate that Celtics fans had to endure in the 90's and early to mid 2000's. i feel that people are forgetting a few keys.

    1. we have a good young nucleus
    2. Len Bias
    3. Reggie Lewis
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]theres alot of pressure on Danny to blow this team up to avoid the same fate that Celtics fans had to endure in the 90's and early to mid 2000's. i feel that people are forgetting a few keys. 1. we have a good young nucleus 2. Len Bias 3. Reggie Lewis
    Posted by JamezHill24[/QUOTE] YES, BUT IF DANNY CAN IMPROVE AND KEEP THE YOUNG PLAYERS HE HAS TO DO THAT.... AGAIN, RONDO IS A CHIP THAT SHOULD HAVE VALUE !!!!
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from JamezHill24. Show JamezHill24's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    our nucleus, Rondo, Bass, AB, Moore (if he can get out of the doghouse) is a good filler for the rebuilding process. these guys can all play and can make significant contributions.

    the bigger picture is Len Bias and Reggie Lewis. the Celtics essentially lost two 1st round draft picks in 7 years, and that is what really handicapped us. Len was supposed to be special, although he never saw a league game people knew what he was capable of, and he was going to help lift us out of the ground. Reggie Lewis was even better IMO. he was the 3rd or 4th best SG in the league at the time of his death, and not even in his prime at the time. people underestimate what effect this had on the Celtics returning to glory..

    two tragedies, im willing to bet it wont happen again..we wont be as low to the ground in the near future as we were back then. young nucleus, two 1st rd picks, and a ton of cap space. we are in good shape to me.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from JamezHill24. Show JamezHill24's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!! : YES, BUT IF DANNY CAN IMPROVE AND KEEP THE YOUNG PLAYERS HE HAS TO DO THAT.... AGAIN, RONDO IS A CHIP THAT SHOULD HAVE VALUE !!!!
    Posted by Bill-806[/QUOTE]

    Bill, of course he has value, but you dont have to get rid of every member of the team with value. it only helps the rebuilding process if you keep at least one young veteran. Rondo is a very good pg who only needs people around him who can run and shoot. it takes longer to build a solid starting 5 then it does 4.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!! : Bill, of course he has value, but you dont have to get rid of every member of the team with value. it only helps the rebuilding process if you keep at least one young veteran. Rondo is a very good pg who only needs people around him who can run and shoot. it takes longer to build a solid starting 5 then it does 4.
    Posted by JamezHill24[/QUOTE]DON'T GET MAD AT ME....... B U T , HAVE YOU SEEN HIS LAST TWO GAMES ????   ", THE DEFENSE RESTS" , IN MORE WAYS THAN ONE !!!
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Petey62. Show Petey62's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    I can't see us making any moves before the trade deadline because our asking price is too high.  That's probably being done on purpose so DA can stick with the current roster.

    Nobody wants Ray in exchange for a talented, young stud only to see Ray return to Boston in the off season.  Same goes for KG.  As much as Ray would help a true contender, why would they want to acquire him, give up a young player that the Celtics demand in return, make a run in the playoffs and then see Ray NOT re-sign and possbly return to Boston at a reasonable salary in the off-season?

    I am not even so sure the Celtics are putting pressure on JON to make a decision before the deadline because they can just buy him out after the deadline and sign a big then (possibly one who has been bought out by his team) for a vet minimum salary.

    With our available cap space in the offseason, 2 #1 draft picks AND a high degree of certainty of re-signing Ray, KG and Jeff Green, we're in a great spot in the off-season.  We don't need to get DH or DWill.  We can get talented players who will help long term.  We'll be in a much better position next season and still be in need of ONE spot, A BIG (or two).  There'll be so much more talent around that big than we have now.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from tomobo. Show tomobo's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]our nucleus, Rondo, Bass, AB, Moore (if he can get out of the doghouse) is a good filler for the rebuilding process. these guys can all play and can make significant contributions. the bigger picture is Len Bias and Reggie Lewis. the Celtics essentially lost two 1st round draft picks in 7 years, and that is what really handicapped us. Len was supposed to be special, although he never saw a league game people knew what he was capable of, and he was going to help lift us out of the ground. Reggie Lewis was even better IMO. he was the 3rd or 4th best SG in the league at the time of his death, and not even in his prime at the time. people underestimate what effect this had on the Celtics returning to glory.. two tragedies, im willing to bet it wont happen again..we wont be as low to the ground in the near future as we were back then. young nucleus, two 1st rd picks, and a ton of cap space. we are in good shape to me.
    Posted by JamezHill24[/QUOTE]

    Mr. Lewis was on the cusp of greatness. His offensive game was sure and steady, while defensively he blocked more shots than any other guard(even more than  his Airness). Bias had it all but time. The only real problem rebuilding is that free agents are shunning us like were Utah. You need free agency as one of the tools at your disposal to build a contender. 
     
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  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bird-to-DJ. Show Bird-to-DJ's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]I can't see us making any moves before the trade deadline because our asking price is too high.  That's probably being done on purpose so DA can stick with the current roster. Nobody wants Ray in exchange for a talented, young stud only to see Ray return to Boston in the off season.  Same goes for KG.  As much as Ray would help a true contender, why would they want to acquire him, give up a young player that the Celtics demand in return, make a run in the playoffs and then see Ray NOT re-sign and possbly return to Boston at a reasonable salary in the off-season? I am not even so sure the Celtics are putting pressure on JON to make a decision before the deadline because they can just buy him out after the deadline and sign a big then (possibly one who has been bought out by his team) for a vet minimum salary. With our available cap space in the offseason, 2 #1 draft picks AND a high degree of certainty of re-signing Ray, KG and Jeff Green, we're in a great spot in the off-season.  We don't need to get DH or DWill.  We can get talented players who will help long term.  We'll be in a much better position next season and still be in need of ONE spot, A BIG (or two).  There'll be so much more talent around that big than we have now.
    Posted by Petey62[/QUOTE]

    Petey -- Excellent.  What I think gets lost is a time perspective.  If DA somehow gets bowle dover for a RR or RA trade, he'll make it otherwise he has the greatest number of options/flexibility if he plays out the season.  The big decision people here clamor for is not a big decision it is an immeidate decision.  And if the max-type FA doesn't dign with us, I can see DA actually going inot nest season with cap space (althought the CBA limits how much) in terms of putting him into the driver's seat for in season options next year - much like Indy's cap space give them this year.  The roster implodes in three months - DA's best move is to allow that o happen unless a no-brainer opportunity comes along.
     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from JamezHill24. Show JamezHill24's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!! : Petey -- Excellent.  What I think gets lost is a time perspective.  If DA somehow gets bowle dover for a RR or RA trade, he'll make it otherwise he has the greatest number of options/flexibility if he plays out the season.  The big decision people here clamor for is not a big decision it is an immeidate decision.  And if the max-type FA doesn't dign with us, I can see DA actually going inot nest season with cap space (althought the CBA limits how much) in terms of putting him into the driver's seat for in season options next year - much like Indy's cap space give them this year.  The roster implodes in three months - DA's best move is to allow that o happen unless a no-brainer opportunity comes along.
    Posted by Bird-to-DJ[/QUOTE]

    yup. Doc is signed for 5 years, seems to be commited to the rebuild. 

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from JamezHill24. Show JamezHill24's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!! : Petey -- Excellent.  What I think gets lost is a time perspective.  If DA somehow gets bowle dover for a RR or RA trade, he'll make it otherwise he has the greatest number of options/flexibility if he plays out the season.  The big decision people here clamor for is not a big decision it is an immeidate decision.  And if the max-type FA doesn't dign with us, I can see DA actually going inot nest season with cap space (althought the CBA limits how much) in terms of putting him into the driver's seat for in season options next year - much like Indy's cap space give them this year.  The roster implodes in three months - DA's best move is to allow that o happen unless a no-brainer opportunity comes along.
    Posted by Bird-to-DJ[/QUOTE]

    yup. Doc is signed for 5 years, seems to be commited to the rebuild. 

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Petey62. Show Petey62's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!! : If DA does nothing then he will just do what Red Auerbach did in the 90s. So DA just contradicted what he said about not following what Auerbach did. Ugh! DOING NOTHING IS THE WORST THING AINGE COULD DO!
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]
    I have to disagree with you Fierce.  Ainge would not be doing the same thing Auerbach did with the Big 3 if we stood pat this season.  The Celtics situation is so different now than it was then.  First off, all three of today's Big 3 would probably be more efficient contributors next season in reduced, even back up, roles (and be much cheaper).  KG would be effective next season for his perimeter offense and his defensive presence.  They'd all make significant contributions with 20-25 minutes each night.  We would instantly have the best bench in the NBA and the deepest.  NOBODY would want to face us in the playoffs.

    I still believe PP starts at SF next season but if RA or KG decided they did not want backup roles, then thanks for the 5 years and we would wish them well.  I think RA would be ok with it though.

    As for comparing both Big 3s, RA and PP are far from retiring.  Bird's chronic back pain forced his retirement and a bad foot forced McHale's too.  These guys were "doner" than done!  Of course Aurebach stayed with those guys way too long.  KG, RA and PP are nowhere near that condition and having one or more of them as backups legitimizes the bench next season.

    Imagine a bench of:  KG, RA, Green, Bass, Pietrus, AB, JJJ, Moore, FA BIG pickup.

    Starting team:  Rondo, #1 Draft Pick-SG, PP, #1 Draft Pick-PF, FA BIG pickup.

    That isn't even taking into account an off-season package of picks/player for an immediate non-DH/DWill impact player the Celtics would have the flexibility to obtain.

    If standing pat now increases the chances of the above scenario(s), I'm on board with that.  Nothing we do by next Thursday will bring championship #18.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from cabutan. Show cabutan's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!! : I have to disagree with you Fierce.  Ainge would not be doing the same thing Auerbach did with the Big 3 if we stood pat this season.  The Celtics situation is so different now than it was then.  First off, all three of today's Big 3 would probably be more efficient contributors next season in reduced, even back up, roles (and be much cheaper).  KG would be effective next season for his perimeter offense and his defensive presence.  They'd all make significant contributions with 20-25 minutes each night.  We would instantly have the best bench in the NBA and the deepest.  NOBODY would want to face us in the playoffs. I still believe PP starts at SF next season but if RA or KG decided they did not want backup roles, then thanks for the 5 years and we would wish them well.  I think RA would be ok with it though. As for comparing both Big 3s, RA and PP are far from retiring.  Bird's chronic back pain forced his retirement and a bad foot forced McHale's too.  These guys were "doner" than done!  Of course Aurebach stayed with those guys way too long.  KG, RA and PP are nowhere near that condition and having one or more of them as backups legitimizes the bench next season. Imagine a bench of:  KG, RA, Green, Bass, Pietrus, AB, JJJ, Moore, FA BIG pickup. Starting team:  Rondo, #1 Draft Pick-SG, PP, #1 Draft Pick-PF, FA BIG pickup. That isn't even taking into account an off-season package of picks/player for an immediate non-DH/DWill impact player the Celtics would have the flexibility to obtain. If standing pat now increases the chances of the above scenario(s), I'm on board with that.  Nothing we do by next Thursday will bring championship #18.
    Posted by Petey62[/QUOTE]

    That is a very idealistic though but we all know Doc will never EVER sit a veteran to start a Rookie...I wish he would but thats not happening this year and I dont think will happen next year. If the big 3 remain Celtics, Doc will keep lying to himself that they are capable of going all the way...
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]Tragedy? Right now there is tragedy. We have a starting PG that shoots below 60% from the FT line, has no 3pt shot, and turns into Rondini in the 4th qtr. That's a tragedy!
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]SON, THATS A BINGO !!!   I COULDN'T HAVE SAID IT ANY BETTER !!!  "YOUR MAKING MY POINT/S" !!!!
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from kaktug. Show kaktug's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!! : If DA does nothing then he will just do what Red Auerbach did in the 90s. So DA just contradicted what he said about not following what Auerbach did. Ugh! DOING NOTHING IS THE WORST THING AINGE COULD DO!
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]

    wrong. we're in great shape, trade or no trade. i agree with those who feel that we should make a move IF a great move presents itself. otherwise, there is absolutely no reason to trade rondo or ray just for the sake of doing it. our biggest ace is our cap space. we'll be fine.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheDUDDER. Show TheDUDDER's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]theres alot of pressure on Danny to blow this team up to avoid the same fate that Celtics fans had to endure in the 90's and early to mid 2000's. i feel that people are forgetting a few keys. 1. we have a good young nucleus 2. Len Bias 3. Reggie Lewis
    Posted by JamezHill24[/QUOTE]

    I believe crack is still illegal so somehow suggesting they are worse off than 07 is a complete joke....  in 2007 they had Paul Pierce in his prime... they now have nothing, no building blocks, no good draft picks, etc. and a changed league where the best young players want to play with the best young players.....  the Celtics have absolutely nothing to offer anyone, they have bad weather, and they absolutely do not have A GOOD YOUNG NUCLEUS....... they have a bunch of guys that if they were players they would be on the floor.... I love reading about how Doc hates rookies, etc.  If they could play they would, they can't - so they don't.... coming out of the big 10 after 4 years of college means one simple thing -I CANNOT PLAY BASKETBALL AT THE NEXT LEVEL....or at best I am a back up..... but of course not knowing anything about basketball you would not know that..
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from kaktug. Show kaktug's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!! : I believe crack is still illegal so somehow suggesting they are worse off than 07 is a complete joke....  in 2007 they had Paul Pierce in his prime... they now have nothing, no building blocks, no good draft picks, etc. and a changed league where the best young players want to play with the best young players.....  the Celtics have absolutely nothing to offer anyone, they have bad weather, and they absolutely do not have A GOOD YOUNG NUCLEUS....... they have a bunch of guys that if they were players they would be on the floor.... I love reading about how Doc hates rookies, etc.  If they could play they would, they can't - so they don't.... coming out of the big 10 after 4 years of college means one simple thing -I CANNOT PLAY BASKETBALL AT THE NEXT LEVEL....or at best I am a back up..... but of course not knowing anything about basketball you would not know that..
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE]

    a friendly wager perhaps? let's see where we are one year from today. how much you wanna put on it?
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from elDunker2. Show elDunker2's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    We are in much much better shape than in 07.
    We have 4 valuable pieces and cap space to work with, to significantly improve.
    We just need to...take some action before March 15.
     
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  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from OneOnOne. Show OneOnOne's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!! : I have to disagree with you Fierce.  Ainge would not be doing the same thing Auerbach did with the Big 3 if we stood pat this season.  The Celtics situation is so different now than it was then.  First off, all three of today's Big 3 would probably be more efficient contributors next season in reduced, even back up, roles (and be much cheaper).  KG would be effective next season for his perimeter offense and his defensive presence.  They'd all make significant contributions with 20-25 minutes each night.  We would instantly have the best bench in the NBA and the deepest.  NOBODY would want to face us in the playoffs. I still believe PP starts at SF next season but if RA or KG decided they did not want backup roles, then thanks for the 5 years and we would wish them well.  I think RA would be ok with it though. As for comparing both Big 3s, RA and PP are far from retiring.  Bird's chronic back pain forced his retirement and a bad foot forced McHale's too.  These guys were "doner" than done!  Of course Aurebach stayed with those guys way too long.  KG, RA and PP are nowhere near that condition and having one or more of them as backups legitimizes the bench next season. Imagine a bench of:  KG, RA, Green, Bass, Pietrus, AB, JJJ, Moore, FA BIG pickup. Starting team:  Rondo, #1 Draft Pick-SG, PP, #1 Draft Pick-PF, FA BIG pickup. That isn't even taking into account an off-season package of picks/player for an immediate non-DH/DWill impact player the Celtics would have the flexibility to obtain. If standing pat now increases the chances of the above scenario(s), I'm on board with that.  Nothing we do by next Thursday will bring championship #18.
    Posted by Petey62[/QUOTE]

    Petey do you really think Doc would start to rookies on our team? I don't think that would have ever with KG and RA, Bass, and Greene on the team. Looks good on paper and I am all in for it but I would bet my left Not that Doc couldn't do it.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from elDunker2. Show elDunker2's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    You acttually think that we are going to get 2 starters for next year from picks 17 and 20+ in the draft?  They'll be lucky to make the team!!

    don't count on the draft to help us at all next year unless we bundle the picks and move into the lottery with a team with good odds, like Charlotte.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!! : If DA does nothing then he will just do what Red Auerbach did in the 90s. So DA just contradicted what he said about not following what Auerbach did. Ugh! DOING NOTHING IS THE WORST THING AINGE COULD DO!
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]
    How is having a ton of cap space a the same thing? Especially with the ability to do Sign and Trades?
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from basketbert. Show basketbert's posts

    Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!

    In Response to Re: we are NOT in the same trouble we were in before 07!!!:
    [QUOTE]Pete No way Doc starts rookies over KG and Ray next year, no way!
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]
    The only way that could happen if those players (KG and RA) insist they want to come off the bench. Don't know if they would do that though. If its up to Doc forget it.
     

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