What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Red-16Russ-11. Show Red-16Russ-11's posts

    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?:
    [QUOTE]Rondo is a liability when pg's can play off him when he has the ball forcing him to pass or put up bricks. How long have c fans been waiting for rondo to develop a jumper. Please, dreams are free.
    Posted by null[/QUOTE]

    As a lifelong Celtics fan, though, null, you'd have to admit he is far superior to Derek Fisher in all aspects of the game except outside shot!  Right?
     
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    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3? : Actually that happened in 2008. It was the first time Rondo played with KG and Ray.
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]

     KG and Ray were the ones learning the system that year not Rondo.  But ya, Rondo is the smartest most rapid synapsis firing point guard in the league.  If anyone could QB a playbook on the fly, it would be Rondo.  

     
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    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3? :  KG and Ray were the ones learning the system that year not Rondo.  But ya, Rondo is the smartest most rapid synapsis firing point guard in the league.  If anyone could QB a playbook on the fly, it would be Rondo.  
    Posted by passfirst[/QUOTE]

    The Heat series already proved to us all that a PG who can't make shots from the perimeter is a liability in the playoffs. Chalmers and Bibby were practically camping at the FT line clogging the inside.
     
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    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?:
    [QUOTE]Rondo is signed for short money compared to what D Williams is going to get... so NJ maybe open to trading him. Celts would need to add another player, Big Baby, to make the salaries work. Not sure Danny would do this deal !!!
    Posted by ThePGAPro[/QUOTE]

    I have found over the years that one is paid what one is worth, generally speaking.... so when one person is paid 2/3s of that of another person, there is generally a reason....... and that reason is that the person being paid 2/3s of what the other person is being paid is because it represents their relative worth..... I have heard over and over and over again that Rondo does things to nobody else can do but he does not lead the league in assists, lead the league in rebounds for a point guard, does not lead the league in shooting percentage, etc. 

    He may lead the league in steals but I view Rondo as a guy blind guy.....

    Someone that is blind often times has superior hearing, sense of smell, sense of touch, and sense of taste......

    So if Rondo is a blind guy (one that cannot shoot from anywhere when not guarded and or from the line), one would think he would be leading the league in steals, rebounds for a point guard, assists,  and so on and so forth....

    But the reality is that Rondo does not lead the league in anything and his major weakness ( being the worst shooter in the league) is not offset by him being the blind guy......

    He is vastly overrated in almost every facet of the game  and there is no doubt in my mind that Danny realizes that, absent the BIG 3, Rondo is a less than average point guard who will do nothing but drag the offense down. 

    The things that we have heard about the Cs offense since Rondo has been running it is that the offense is often bogged down, they are playing 3 against 5 on offense, the offense is stagnant, etc...... the only place to look when looking at these weaknesses is Rondo... but most (other than Danny and me) can identify the cause of it........

    There is no way Rondo could be more overrated..... as Dantoni said last year, send Rondo to Minnesota and let's find out what he is really all about......

    If there is a conclusion at some point that Rondo is a building block for the future, then we can rest assured that the Cs will be a 20 win team at least and until they can get some legitimate players through the draft......
     
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    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    I like some of the proposals but has anyone read where KG and Ray will come back on a minimum salary? Can a free agent just assume that will happen? If we trade for D Williams and he doesn't resign we would have even more cap space and if we traded Pierce (not likely) we could start over completely but would not want to do that. We need an athletic big man but that will be a tough thing for Ainge to do with just 3 million. Hopefully if Howard does not pan out we can strike it rich in the draft and rebuild the old fashion way.
     
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    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    maybe bradley will end up platooning with Rondo. bradley doesnt need to learn to pass like Rondo, just to gell with the offense, drive and dish here and there, and create a few shots for himself. hope doc loosens the leash and shows some confidence in Bradley, even if beadleys confidence fluctuates a bit as it will
     
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    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3? : The Heat series already proved to us all that a PG who can't make shots from the perimeter is a liability in the playoffs. Chalmers and Bibby were practically camping at the FT line clogging the inside.
    Posted by Tachometrix[/QUOTE]

      A time or two, Rondo's liabilities have cost the Celts in the playoffs.  But to call Rondo a play-off liability in general is way off.  He has been the prime factor in winning entire series in the play-offs, as in multiple times. Last year's series against the Heat isn't the best barometer.  Dwayne Wade was willing to lie, cheat and steal to win that series last year.  He did all three and got away with it every time.  Rondo played half the series with one arm.  

     This seems to be dump on Rondo season with a few exceptions.  And I'm a little surprised at how ungrateful a lot of posters are toward Rondo.  Is he perfect, no. Is he special at times and frustrating at other times, yes.  But when the play-off lights turn on he has shined more times than not, he's a flat out baller with no fear and all others wearing a different jersey are the enemy.  I wouldn't be surprised if CP3 and Kobe went to starbucks together between playoff games last year.    

     
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    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?


      I admit that I'm cheerleading for Rondo just to provide a little balance as well as the fact that I support him as a player.  And nothing was more frustrating than watching Kobe play center field by sagging off Rondo in 2010 finals.  But these post are getting a little trendy against him.  He put game 6 out of contention in the first quarter in '08 with the steals alone.  Chicago '09, as well as Ray played, Rondo shined much brighter, took on the whole team and had them all tied into a mental pretzel by the end.  add to this Cleveland and Orlando series in 2010. We've got a player and I'm not ready to throw him under the bus.

      I'd say PJ Brown was more important than Perkins, but not House over Rondo. Posey was a lot more important than House.  And I love what House did when his number was finally called in game 7 against Cleveland and further.  He and Posey sparked them invaluably.  But House wasn't a point guard.  Then again Pierce was playing point forward at times and I'll concede this point order to avoid further debate about it.  Rondo in the last five minutes of a tight game creates an offensive void for the Celts, and he needs to be a better free throw shooter in order to solve it to a degree.  i think he can do this. 
     
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    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?


     totally, from what I understand Doc made it pretty clear to Rondo before last season began that he needed to be commited to getting to the line.  But he shyed away from it as the season went on.  with or without a jump shot, he can get to the line, and make or miss it will force the defender to play a little differently.  He just needs to commit to this, now.
     
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    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3? : Can't do it if he doesn't improve his FT shooting. It all starts with his shooting.  What's scary is this is going to be Rondo's 6th season. Usually it takes young players 4-5 years to master that jumper. So I'm not optimistic about Rondo's shooting this year. His problem is more mental than anything else.
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]

    Im not so sure his problem is mental or otherwise, does it really matter? All that matters is he cant shoot. Hes also apparently terrified to go to the FT line. What was that stretch of games last season ...like 20 games and 4 FT attempts, something crazy like that.

    The word LIABILITY applies. The sagging defenses, the poor jumper & FT shooting may not always haunt the Celtics in the playoffs, but it has enough times to be a signifcant issue.

    IT may seem Im always piling on Rondo, in fact, I do. ITs not because I dont root for the guy, its because I feel the need to offset others posts championing him like hes elite and an all timer. HEs had some great, great games and series in the playoffs... and I mean GREAT. But he has also cost us big time... remember, its not all about statistics and stats wont tell you that ignoring Rondos jumper cost the Celtics big  in crunchtime in the playoffs or his reluctance to drive for fear of being fouled... None of that shows up in stats.
     
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    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3? : If Dwight and D-Will team up in New Jersey and their supporting cast is composed of Anthony Morrow and Travis Outlaw then they're still not contenders.  
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]

    Orlando played in the finals a few years ago and you probably could not name anyone other than Howard, Williams would immediately become the best player Howard has ever played with and they would somehow not be contenders?
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Red-16Russ-11. Show Red-16Russ-11's posts

    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3? : Orlando played in the finals a few years ago and you probably could not name anyone other than Howard, Williams would immediately become the best player Howard has ever played with and they would somehow not be contenders?
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE]


    Nelson, Lee, Turkoglu, Lewis, Reddick, Alston.............and Howard!
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheDUDDER. Show TheDUDDER's posts

    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3? : Nelson, Lee, Turkoglu, Lewis, Reddick, Alston.............and Howard!
    Posted by Red-16Russ-11[/QUOTE]

    And not one better than Deron Williams...........not anywhere near as good as Williams.
     
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    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3? : And not one better than Deron Williams...........not anywhere near as good as Williams.
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE]

    They'd be as good as Stockton and Malone - EXACTLY as good as Stockton and Malone - zero titles!
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheDUDDER. Show TheDUDDER's posts

    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3? : They'd be as good as Stockton and Malone - EXACTLY as good as Stockton and Malone - zero titles!
    Posted by Red-16Russ-11[/QUOTE]

    Well either that or the wealthiest owner in all of sports would be able to some more talent.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Red-16Russ-11. Show Red-16Russ-11's posts

    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3? : Well either that or the wealthiest owner in all of sports would be able to some more talent.
    Posted by TheDUDDER[/QUOTE]


    How, praytell?  This isn't baseball
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheDUDDER. Show TheDUDDER's posts

    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3? : How, praytell?  This isn't baseball
    Posted by Red-16Russ-11[/QUOTE]

    Where there is a will there is a way.  The top 10 teams in payroll all were over the cap last year and guess who they were..... Lakers, Magic, Spurs, Cs, Heat, Mavs, etc..... hhmmmm... the contenders.......
     
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    Re: What about D. Williams for Rondo pkg instead of CP3?

    "He's matched and gotten the better of CP3 before.  Why is everyone so grass is greener when it comes to Rondo?"   
    Posted by passfirst[/QUOTE]

    I agree - trying to justify shipping out Rondo makes little sense if they don't get full value (all-star point or true top five center in return).  Despite what some say about RR's value being higher here than elsewhere, his value is strong among other players who would benefit from his largess with the ball. Imagine him on any team that has active bigs and then gauge his ability to easily get the ball where and when they want it. Have people read what other players have said about playing with him during the lockout? Teams can say anything publically, but in private they are probably salivating at the thought that he might be available.  We won't know until or if Danny makes the move, but as for now, he's here, and I, for one, am glad. 
     
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