What are the C's options on JON?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from BiasLewis. Show BiasLewis's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    Petey62, I understand where you're coming from. So everyone is calling them stiffs but the C's aren't getting ANYONE that is worth 2 cents to play 3rd string C. So who everyone is expecting, I don't know. I would look at Jones.

    A stiff will at least keep Semih and Shaq from further injury and make it to April. If the C's do nothing then we're going to see minutes go up for all of our bigs.

    We can't trade JON because he can't/won't play. No one wants to trade BBD, Danielso r anyone else. So your only options are to hit the streets and find a cheap band-aid to get you through the season.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    Luke can be trade bait... hes got potential but hes not gonna be a big part of the Celtics drive for a title this year.

    AB is at best a throw in, sort of like making a multimillion dollar deal and saying to the guy, lets finalize it over a beer. AB would be Coors Lite

    JON is likely washed up and we need someone healthy in the middle...
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from BiasLewis. Show BiasLewis's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    Luke isn't going to get you much in return. He'd have to be packaged with a established player to get a player that can even get in Doc's rotation.

    Again, let's not overvalue our players. Luke is decent but other teams aren't falling over trying to get him.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from BiasLewis. Show BiasLewis's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    See this tells a little of what I was saying about JON. He's hesitant to get surgery. Why does he want to delay it? He's had two long layoffs for it to get better and it isn't.
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------
    Jermaine O’Neal is resigned to the fact that his painful left knee will require surgery, but the Celtics center is hoping he can delay the procedure until after the season. Unfortunately for O’Neal, that possibility is becoming increasingly unlikely.

    The pain returned Wednesday and O’Neal missed that night’s win over Sacramento. He underwent an MRI yesterday and was weighing his options with the Celtics medical staff.

    Doc Rivers didn’t know the results of the MRI after yesterday’s practice, but the C’s coach didn’t sound optimistic about O’Neal’s hopes to delay surgery.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from susan250. Show susan250's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    In Response to Re: What are the C's options on JON?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: What are the C's options on JON? : --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Keep an injury ridden J Oneal? I would rather get another big for him. Sheed is the only person who seems to fit. He knows the system and workd well with the current roster. There can never be enough big men depth for a team!
    Posted by CelticFanLA[/QUOTE]

    I agree with you about Rasheed.  He is definitely better than Jon.  At least he is usually able to play and contribute.  Rasheed was great for us during the playoffs last year. 
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from OneOnOne. Show OneOnOne's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    In Response to Re: What are the C's options on JON?:
    [QUOTE]OneOnOne, funny you should ask.  First off, the Magic traded their only true backup center so it's obvious they are not pressed to pick one up.  Besides, they have the best center in the game and he rarely gets hurt.  Lastly, the Magic passed on centers because their offense is not predicated on having anyone that spectacular backing up Howard.  Three point shot is all they care about. As for a center, I'll tell you where "I'd" get one from.  That's just me!  I'd bring in and work out the following big men who happen to NOT be under contract (might even take a test drive with a 10-day contract): 1 -- Earl Barron 7'0" age 29 2 -- Dwayne Jones 6'11" age 27 (1st team NBDL 2010) 3 -- Brian Zoubek 7'1" (2010 NCAA Champion with Duke) - fierce rebounder with energy. Then I'd inquire about the following players who are under contract: 1 -- Kyrylo Fesenko 7'0" Utah with $1.08M expiring contract (shot blocker & rebounder) 2 -- Francisco Elson 7'0" Utah with $1.145M expiring contract (athletic shot blocker) 3 -- Hilton Armstrong 6'11" Washington with 992K expiring contract (shot blocker with decent offensive skills) 4 -- Hasheem Thabeet 7'3" Memphis with $4.7M and $5.1M then team option (raw shot blocker who has a long way to go with work) The MINUTE I know for certain JON's status, I'd initiate buy out talks to open the roster spot.  I'd also consider waiving Von Wafer with the promise to bring him back once this all gets sorted out. The Celtics need someone NOW who can spell Shaq and Semih and provide some energy, defense and rebounding.  I think if they bring someone in, they'd be excited to play with the Big 4 and would do anything to keep their job.
    Posted by Petey62[/QUOTE]

    You might as well throw Patrick Obryant and Mikki Moore in there.  They are both as good as who you listed. A fierce rebounder with with energy would already be on a team not just sitting around.
    When the Magic first made their trade the talk of the NBA was they were going to have to get another big man.  The only reason you don't hear it anymore is because they rattled of 9 wins in a row.  YES they still need a nother big man, regardless if you say they don't.  I GUARANTEE you that if you asked the Magic if they wanted another big man they would say yes and if any of the stiffs you named were any good the Magic WOULD  already have them. (or some other team)
    Now I repeat my question, where are your going to get this big man from? 
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from concord27. Show concord27's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    I think we are stuck with this mix and match this season .  JON has a contract and we cannot get around it.  I do think if he can come back at the end of the season healthy he might help. His defense and shot blocking in spots could be used in the playoffs. Or course who knows if he can come back.  For those who want us to get rid of him he should never have been signed in the first place. 
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from OneOnOne. Show OneOnOne's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    In Response to Re: What are the C's options on JON?:
    [QUOTE]I think we are stuck with this mix and match this season .  JON has a contract and we cannot get around it.  I do think if he can come back at the end of the season healthy he might help. His defense and shot blocking in spots could be used in the playoffs. Or course who knows if he can come back.  For those who want us to get rid of him he should never have been signed in the first place. 
    Posted by concord27[/QUOTE]

    hindsight is 20 20
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bird-to-DJ. Show Bird-to-DJ's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    Quick "capology" question...  Similar to what happens in baseball all the time, could the C's trade JON but pay a significant portion of his salary thus greatly increasing his trade value...which is currently zero?  I am assuming no or it would have been discussed.

    Since the C's have to release someone to sign anyone, this has the makings of ride it out, at least for the next month or so.  From Peteys list, if they cannot get a sniff of the floor for Jerry Sloan (defense first) in Utah, I can't imagine them doing anything beyond taking up a seat on the bench.  I would not release Wafer (the potential best SG/SF back-up on the roster) or release/trade Harangody/Bradley for a "band aid" who will simply be deactivated once Perk returns. 

    Oh, and if you want Blatche (I live in DC) the Wizards will trade him for BBD IN A HEARTBEAT.  Please look elsewhere.

    If Perk's return is delayed or we have another significant front court injury, then that may well change everything.  But until that occurs, we ride it out.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Petey62. Show Petey62's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    OneOnOne, SoCalCeltFan, CeltsFan4life

    You call these guys stiffs but right now, we have NOBODY.  I'll take a stiff over NOTHING.  I will take Dewayne Jones as a 3rd string center playing 12 minutes and grabbing 5 rebounds and changing 2 shots while committing 3 fouls.  I will take a veteran like Fransisco Elson as a 3rd string center, who's played in 37 games this season (will be on the court), for 12-15 minutes a game to give me some defense and rebounding.  We're talking about 3rd string.  Most 3rd string centers ARE STIFFS.  AND!

    JON was to be the STARTER this season (with Perk out).  Huge failure!  When JON plays basketball again, his knee will swell and tighten right after playing, surgical procedure or not.  As much as I wish we could, I don't think we can count on him.

    Let's also be cautious about Perk returning.  I hear alot of "when Perk" and "if Perk".  Like the Celtics, we should be patient and not look to rush this guy back.  Perk may very well NOT be ready (conditioning) until March.  He was held out of a practice THIS WEEK!  Anything before March will be wonderful.

    OneOnOne, the Magic's needs and the Celtic's needs are different as are their current situations.  The Magic are focused on getting their traded guys some chemistry so it's not their focus to bring in a center now.  To answer your question, they have not signed one because they want to FIRST see, with all the new players, who is now expendable and who do they need to keep.  Once they determine that, they will have more options (who to sign and who they can trade).  Because the Magic haven't signed a center has nothing to do with the quality or availability of centers.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from BiasLewis. Show BiasLewis's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    Remember when I brought up Mikki Moore's name a month ago and everyone laughed? Well I was way down the road and around the curve and some on here didn't know what that was coming down the road. I tried to tell you what was coming down the road and that's why his name was brought up...a on the street, cheap, give you 5 mins, rest bigs band-aid. Nothing more!

    We need to thank Shaq for signing with the C's. They need to give JON's money to him. If we didn't have Shaq we'd be screwed BIG TIME! JON was suppose to start!! I don't even want to think about it.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Petey62. Show Petey62's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    In Response to Re: What are the C's options on JON?:
    [QUOTE]To quote a line from the movie "Butch Cassidy and The Sundance Kid", 'Who ARE those guys?' Petey62, you are either a true NBA gym rat or a coroner to dig up those stiffs! :O) Unfortunately, you are what you are, and none of those guys are destined for serious playing time in the NBA, or they'd be there already [I know you have some end of the benchers on your list of cadavers]. Forget about 'Sheed. He was a cancer last year and made Doc's coaching life miserable, if you haven't read between the lines of some of Doc's comments about comparing last year's team to this year's. Plus, he didn't get in shape last year, when he KNEW HE HAD TO. What makes you think he wants to undergo a crash get in shape program now? He's been eating Philly cheesesteaks, Tastycakes, Wise potato chips, scrapple, and hoagies and kicking back. His mouth will be earning techs while he lounges on the bench unable to play for 4 to 6 weeks. Who needs that!?
    Posted by SoCalCeltFan[/QUOTE]

    I did not suggest we bring Sheed back but when you compare what Sheed brings to what we have in that spot now, I can see where he might be an option.  Third string center, yes.

    You are too funny, I'm not a coronor nor a gym rat.  I'm a Celtics fan who believes it's time to put the "final run" team together and we'll need, more than anything, guys who will provide minutes and contribute.

    Keep this in mind, many of the names I listed can give the Celtics something merely because who the Celtics have on the court around them.  When you play with Rondo, Ray, KG and PP, whatever your job is comes just a bit easier.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Petey62. Show Petey62's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    In Response to Re: What are the C's options on JON?:
    [QUOTE]Remember when I brought up Mikki Moore's name a month ago and everyone laughed? Well I was way down the road and around the curve and some on here didn't know what that was coming down the road. I tried to tell you what was coming down the road and that's why his name was brought up...a on the street, cheap, give you 5 mins, rest bigs band-aid. Nothing more! We need to thank Shaq for signing with the C's. They need to give JON's money to him. If we didn't have Shaq we'd be screwed BIG TIME! JON was suppose to start!! I don't even want to think about it.
    Posted by BiasLewis[/QUOTE]

    I totally agree with you.  Although I'm not a Mikki Moore fan, I do believe we've lost the JON chip.  I truly believe he's done.  You're also right that signing Shaq was HUGE.  Imagine where we'd be if we had not signed him.

    I can't understand what folks want from a 3rd string center.  It's like any name mentioned other than Brad Miller or Marcus Camby is considered a stiff.

    Right now, we need a 3rd string center to spell Shaq and Semih.  Key word "center".
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from kccorwin. Show kccorwin's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    Jon needs to have surgery right away. Then we will know how long he will be out. He's of no use to us the way he is so no point putting off surgery. I think Sheed is the best center available and I would bring him back. Depending on how surgery goes with Jon we could buy him out or attempt to trade him but that will be difficult. Maybe if he has surgery he can get to the point where he can help us and we can bring him back then.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from OneOnOne. Show OneOnOne's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    In Response to Re: What are the C's options on JON?:
    OneOnOne, the Magic's needs and the Celtic's needs are different as are their current situations.   WE BOTH NEED BIG MEN. SOUNDS THE SAME TO ME.

      The Magic are focused on getting their traded guys some chemistry so it's not their focus to bring in a center now. 
    HOW IN THE WORLD COULD YOU KNOW THIS?  I BET IF THERE WAS A BIG THEY COULD GET THEY WOULD DO IT IN A HEARTBEAT.


      To answer your question, they have not signed one because they want to FIRST see, with all the new players, who is now expendable and who do they need to keep.
    AGAIN HOW CAN YOU KNOW THIS?
      

    Because the Magic haven't signed a center has nothing to do with the quality or availability of centers.  AGAIN HOW CAN YOU KNOW THIS? 

    As I said if those guys you mentioned were any good someone would have gotten them by now.  Think OKC couldn't use a big man?  Denver?  There are a lot of teams that could use a big man.   You don't just "go and get one"

    Posted by Petey62[/QUOTE]
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from BiasLewis. Show BiasLewis's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    In Response to Re: What are the C's options on JON?:
    [QUOTE]Jon needs to have surgery right away. Then we will know how long he will be out. He's of no use to us the way he is so no point putting off surgery. I think Sheed is the best center available and I would bring him back. Depending on how surgery goes with Jon we could buy him out or attempt to trade him but that will be difficult. Maybe if he has surgery he can get to the point where he can help us and we can bring him back then.
    Posted by kccorwin[/QUOTE]


    Unless is minor arthoscopic...he's done. 12 weeks easily to recover and then get in shape. 

    Turn off the oven because he's done!!
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Celtsfan4life. Show Celtsfan4life's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    Petey, all valid arguments (about "we need SOMEBODY").  
    You make all good points and candidly, I admit I'm not smart enough to know whether the current team is going to play too many minutes and we need another body or if the current team of Garnett, BBD, Shaq, and Semih can handle the needs.   If I could rank the choices, I'd go with Sheed first (knows our system, doesn't bind us to any long term contract, is known and liked by the other players and by the coach).   I've watched some of those other guys you mention and while you mention their 3rd string stats like " 5 rebounds and changing 2 shots while committing 3 fouls", I fear what will happen is that a lead goes from up 5 to down 5 in 2 minutes due to a third string center making 3 fumbles, allowing 3 consecutive offensive boards by his opponent, and being out of rotation all the time.   In other words, he may be more of a hindrance than a help!  

    While its fun to play GM on this Board and it gives us a release, the real question is what our REAL GM is going to do.  I'm betting that he tries to ride it out and if not, he tries to go for Sheed.


     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from BiasLewis. Show BiasLewis's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    In Response to Re: What are the C's options on JON?:
    [QUOTE]Petey, all valid arguments (about "we need SOMEBODY").   You make all good points and candidly, I admit I'm not smart enough to know whether the current team is going to play too many minutes and we need another body or if the current team of Garnett, BBD, Shaq, and Semih can handle the needs.   If I could rank the choices, I'd go with Sheed first (knows our system, doesn't bind us to any long term contract, is known and liked by the other players and by the coach).   I've watched some of those other guys you mention and while you mention their 3rd string stats like "  5 rebounds and changing 2 shots while committing 3 fouls ", I fear what will happen is that a lead goes from up 5 to down 5 in 2 minutes due to a third string center making 3 fumbles, allowing 3 consecutive offensive boards by his opponent, and being out of rotation all the time.   In other words, he may be more of a hindrance than a help!   While its fun to play GM on this Board and it gives us a release, the real question is what our REAL GM is going to do.  I'm betting that he tries to ride it out and if not, he tries to go for Sheed.
    Posted by Celtsfan4life[/QUOTE]

    This makes no sense.

    Would you rather have a 3rd string C giving up fouls, maybe getting 6 pts and 4 boards, giving the others rest OR have a guy showing up in suits on game day??

    C'mon now. A 3rd string C isn't going to win or lose a game for the C's. He's going to give others rest so we don't end up having to start that 3rd string C due to more injuries.

    We don't know the condition of Sheed but I bet Ainge does.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Petey62. Show Petey62's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    CeltsFan4life, I understand where you're coming from but BiasLewis took the words right out of my mouth.  When has a 3rd string center been the difference in the Celtics winning or losing?  I can't remember.

    A guy in uniform ON THE COURT is better than a guy in an Armani suit sitting on the bench especially when, it's my bet, that guy in the Armani suit (JON) aint puttin that uniform on again this season?

    OneOnOne, the Magic know they need a backup to Howard.  But they also know they need to evaluate the new players with the old and see who they can trade for that big man.  Obtaining a big man just is not their priority right now.  Isn't that obvious?  Before they do that, they want to make sure they have all their pieces in place.  When they eventually do get that big man, you'll see someone like Duhon or someone else as part of the package.  With all the new faces there, don't you think doing that makes sense FIRST?

    CeltsFan4life, it will be interesting to see what Danny does, if anything.  Beat Charlotte.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from BiasLewis. Show BiasLewis's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    THe Magic are trying to see if Arenas or JRich is going to work. Which one to package. They have time and they have more assets than the C's to move.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Celtsfan4life. Show Celtsfan4life's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    In Response to Re: What are the C's options on JON?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: What are the C's options on JON? : This makes no sense. Would you rather have a 3rd string C giving up fouls, maybe getting 6 pts and 4 boards, giving the others rest OR have a guy showing up in suits on game day?? C'mon now. A 3rd string C isn't going to win or lose a game for the C's. He's going to give others rest so we don't end up having to start that 3rd string C due to more injuries. We don't know the condition of Sheed but I bet Ainge does.
    Posted by BiasLewis[/QUOTE]


    Petey and Bias, surely you guys are kidding right?   I can't believe what you're saying.  Are you really saying you've never seen starters go out with a lead and 3 minutes later, the subs have given it up.....especially due to one or two players who make mistakes while they are in playing vs the other team's starters?

    If you have a 3rd string player playing against say the Heat or the Magic starters (because we all know that absent fouls, Howard and the Heat players play huge minutes!!!), he's going to be taken advantage of.

    Heck, we've seen it on our own team many times.  How many times have we on this board complained that the starters built a lead and the subs gave it away in 5 or 10 minutes of play so the starters have to come back and try to get it back.   

    I can't believe you don't think this happens all the time!  Heck, some of us complained about Sheed doing it in the regular season last year!!!!!
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Celtsfan4life. Show Celtsfan4life's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    and let me ask this....I hope you guys answer it objectively:  What have you seen more often:   

    a. bench players come in the game and lose a lead or even make a deficit worse or
    b. a starter gets injured because he plays 30 minutes instead of 20 minutes?  

    I really can't believe you think a young guy like Semih is going to get injured playing 10 more minutes a game.   Let him play 10 more minutes - it won't kill him.  If you argue he doesn't have the skill - that's an entire different debate.  But if you argue he's better than a new 3rd stringer, then he's young enough to sustain 10 more mins a game.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from OneOnOne. Show OneOnOne's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    In Response to Re: What are the C's options on JON?:
    [QUOTE]THe Magic are trying to see if Arenas or JRich is going to work. Which one to package. They have time and they have more assets than the C's to move.
    Posted by BiasLewis[/QUOTE]

    Or could it be there are not a lot of big guys out there?  I know, I know, just "go get one"  They are on that tree over there.   You know each team is ALWAYS EVALUATING  their team. The Magic didn't just start that process when they made a trade.  As I said if there was a big guy available believe me the Magic with all their assets would be going all in for them . You are absolutely correct. They have more assets than we do.

    I think the C's with stand pat a little while longer and evaluate what they got.   No knee jerk reactions.  Danny doesn't usually do that.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from jeezem. Show jeezem's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    He isn't jumping at surgery because he already had surgery on the knee and it was supposed to be OK.  He probably needs it scoped or cleaned out, which should not take too long to heal if they can identify soemthing that isn't right that is causing a little abrasion that is causing friction/rubbing that results in swelling.  He's not all about it right away because surgery has risks and he wants to be playing, Tom Brady missed a whole season because of an infection that can happen during any open surgery.  You're supposed to take it seriously, it is not a small decision to get cut open with a knife.  He'd like to play and do it in the off season, he already feels like he is a let down, and is trying to play through the pain for the team and the fans - and all you can do is bash the guy.  Did you bash KG all last year and this year because KG is also dealing with injuries?  This guy is a 5 time all star who could be the difference in bringing another title to Boston.  They're not going to get anything trading an injured player.  The only thing that can happen is they deal with the issue and get some quality court time out of him as a player.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from BiasLewis. Show BiasLewis's posts

    Re: What are the C's options on JON?

    Celtsfan4life,

    You have to look at the schedule. I just posted that I don't think KG should return until Jan. 27th vs Portland.

    These are all pros. It's not we're expecting the 3rd string C to start game 7 of the Finals. The one thing you're forgetting is FOUL TROUBLE. Ok so you have two guys splitting time for 48 mins. If one of them OR both of them get in foul trouble, how do you make up those other minutes?? We know Semih can play more than 10 mins but both him and Shaq have been in foul trouble most of these games.

    Losing leads happens in the NBA, you can't substitute just to keep leads. Funny things happne in games that you don't expect. A 14 point lead in the NBA is nothing. It's the last 5 mins that really matter. Can you get stops, rebound and score.
     

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