What's all this nonsense about a "legit NBA starting center?"

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from wicksandrowe. Show wicksandrowe's posts

    What's all this nonsense about a "legit NBA starting center?"

    For some people on this board there is something called "a legit NBA starting center," though they never specify what the criteria is for legit," and exactly who it is that decides who's "legit" or not.

    My guess would be that coaches and GMs have a say in that decision as well as the people on this board, but I could be wrong. In any case, when someone does make a such a claim, they should be obliged to spell out what it is that makes a starting center "legit" or "not legit."

    Here's my argument for why Faverani is without doubt good enough to be a "legit starting NBA center."

    Keep in mind that there will be roughly fourteen NBA starting centers in any given year whose numbers are below the league averages for startiing centers (11.3/7.75/1.3). Are these guys then not legit because their numbers are below average? If so, then more than a few NBA championships have been won by teams who did not have a "legit" starting center. 

    I have no doubt that Vaverani can exceed the league averages.

    Based purely on a bump in minutes from 15 pre-season MPG to about 20 MPG, adding another third again to his per game averages, he'd come in at about 10 PPG, 6 RPG, and 1.5 BPG. This would be pure scavenging and cleaning up inside. 

    Merely at those numbers he would be statistically better across the board than Splitter, McGee, Valanciunas, Jordan, Dalembert, Perkins, etc.

    But could he produce more? Definitely.

    If he’s averaging 10 PPG per 20 MPG just by hanging around, it makes perfect sense that if by design you called his number a handful of times in the post or in pick and roll, he would give you at least another couple of baskets and a few more free throws. I can see him averaging a steady 15+

    Why am I sure of that?

    In Europe there’s a saying that paraphrased goes something like, “he has points in his hands.” It’s used to explain a player’s knack for scoring. That describes Vitor; he just knows how to score.

    For NBA centers 14 PPG seems to be a watershed mark. Nearly all centers averaging over 14 PPG are scoring, go-to centers with offensive skills; centers averaging below 14 tend to be clean up/scavenger guys. The only exception is Anderson Varejao. He’s so efficient at scavenging that he averages 14. 

    All the others who average 14+ are guys you can throw to in the post, the Gasols, Jefferson, Horford, Howard, B. Lopez, Bogut, Cousins, etc., guys with offensive skills.

    Now look at Faverani. He's a scavenger with advanced offensive skills.

    If memory serves, he has so far scored on fast breaks, lefty dunk, righty dunk, two-handed dunk, 3-point shot, foul line jumper, base-line jumper, follow-up offensive rebound dunk, lefty hook, spin reverse, righty jump hook, and bank shot. Plus, he makes 75% of his FTs. 

    These aren't fluke baskets. He will never not have these skills. If he were 6'5-6", he'd be a scoring wing, a Manu Ginobili type player.

    At the other end he is already the best defender on this team. He moves, talks, covers, boxes out, blocks shots, changes shots, takes charges, battles, bangs the offensive boards, punches balls out and avoids fouls  Totally contrary to what Gary Washburn wrote in the Globe, Faverani destroyed the Bucks big men.

    So what's not to like? His haircut? The fact that he doesn't "look" like a "legit" NBA center?

    For these reasons, I believe that Vitor is equally effective or more effective than the bottom half of the center pool in the NBA, and has the potential to become a 13-16 ppg, 9-10rpg, and 2 bpg player.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: What's all this nonsense about a

    Good post... but you don't have to defend Fav, his play is doing that for him.

    The self acclaimed "experts" that have taken over this site in my absence are nauseating.

     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from wicksandrowe. Show wicksandrowe's posts

    Re: What's all this nonsense about a

    It's only my business because I happen to read and occasionally contribute to ths forum, but why are you two and your camps still going on about Pressey and Babb, etc., in a post about starting centers?

    Can you not see how tedious and boring these feuds are for other readers? Can you not see that your points cannot be proven at this juncture in their careers due to a lack of evidence?

    There have been smaller starting NBA point guards than Phil Pressey and there have been shooting guards who spent 2-4 years abroad and in the D-league before making it in the NBA. And there are thousands of wanna-bes and never-made-its.

    At this point you can only believe a certain thing about these guys, but simply believing something never makes it true.

    And that's a fact.

    Wait for a body of evidence

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from chris33. Show chris33's posts

    Re: What's all this nonsense about a

    Faverani has been impressive.

    The other rookies have been terrible.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from bigbostonceltics. Show bigbostonceltics's posts

    Re: What's all this nonsense about a

    fav all the way!

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Eldunker. Show Eldunker's posts

    Re: What's all this nonsense about a

    I think you nailed it.  Its his haircut.  There is no way Fav can be a "legit" NBA center with that doo. 

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from R9R. Show R9R's posts

    Re: What's all this nonsense about a

    Fav is not even close to providing the shakiest of sample sizes.

     

    Noone on here is an expert, but some do have an understanding of statistics which goes a long way.

     

    Cousins IMO is a "legit" starting Center. The kid has a solid sample size, is younger than Fav and is still improving. Cousins is 20+ ppg, 11+ rpg, 1.3 bpg, 2.7 spg, 1.7 apg with a PER north of 26. That's best amoung true centers.

     

    If we had Cousins and Rondo ... I don't care what the other pieces are. Thats a winning team.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from wicksandrowe. Show wicksandrowe's posts

    Re: What's all this nonsense about a

    In response to R9R's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Fav is not even close to providing the shakiest of sample sizes.

     

    Noone on here is an expert, but some do have an understanding of statistics which goes a long way.

     

    Cousins IMO is a "legit" starting Center. The kid has a solid sample size, is younger than Fav and is still improving. Cousins is 20+ ppg, 11+ rpg, 1.3 bpg, 2.7 spg, 1.7 apg with a PER north of 26. That's best amoung true centers.

     

    If we had Cousins and Rondo ... I don't care what the other pieces are. Thats a winning team.

    [/QUOTE]

    What's your point,

    - that the sample size on Faverani is not sufficient upon which to base a claim that he is a "legit" starting center

    or

    - that Cousins is a "legit" starting center  

    or

    - that Cousins and Rondo alone would equal a winning team?

    Concerning the first, I really don't know exactly how large a size the sample should be, and I agree that 7 pre-season games and 3 NBA games against average to below average teams is indeed a small sample. But I'm going on the eye-ball and smell test based on 30+ years of coaching / scouting here and abroad at the professional level. It may be premature to you, but I have seen enough evidence to believe that Faverani is every bit a "legit" starting center in the NBA.

    But you then seem to hold up Cousins as somewhat a model for a "legit" starting center, citing his stats to back up that assertion. In your opinion he's a "legit" starting center. A classic case of command of the obvious, wouldn't you say? No one with a functioning brain would argue that Cousins is not a "legit" center. He may be the most "legit," or "best," center in the league. 

    So is your point that to be considered a "legit" center you have to have numbers like Cousins? If that's the case, then there are maybe, what, two or three "legit" centers in the league? That can't be right, can it? His stats make him a top center, a star center; "legit" goes along with that territory. 

    Lastly, you claim that Rondo and Cousins on the same team would make that team a winning team regardless of who else was on it. Keep in mind that Rondo was on a team that last year had KG and Pierce on it and it didn't break .500.  

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from prakash. Show prakash's posts

    Re: What's all this nonsense about a

    In response to melswitt's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Not that I wo0uld ever try to protect R9R, for he is a big boy and can do that by himself, but...

    W&R..ST flyin' fiddlers fandango U...you have your opinion, just know that's all it is...R9R's got you all the way on this one...2 bleepin' games is what FauxHawk has played...ONE-TWO...I mean, truth be told to you and all the "pro-FauxHawk" EXPERTS opining here, if FauxHawk was any good, why wasn't he signed by any other center hungy NBA teams before this season?............

    [/QUOTE]

    Now there is a shining example of clear thinking and clear expression.  What should we do about W&R's correct observation that, "If memory serves, he has so far scored on fast breaks, lefty dunk, righty dunk, two-handed dunk, 3-point shot, foul line jumper, base-line jumper, follow-up offensive rebound dunk, lefty hook, spin reverse, righty jump hook, and bank shot. Plus, he makes 75% of his FTs."

    Why do you think he was not signed by another team?  Why was Manu Ginobli passed 56 times in the draft?  Why was Tony Parker passed 26 times in the draft?  Are we supposed to dis-regard what we are seeing?  What are you seeing?  Are you not seeing that Fav has the ability to be very productive from the 5 position?  Do you hear folks here comparing him to Dwight Howard?

     
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