Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from jdm894g. Show jdm894g's posts

    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    Tony went to a team where he could possibly get more minutes.  If you get the time you will eventually produce.  I wish him the best.  Let's see if they can hold on to the 8th seed.

    Did someone say he shut down Durant?????  WHAT????????

    All I will remember is him going for that Ben Gordon pump fake and fouling him shooting a three pointer in the playffs two years ago.  

    All this talk about shutting folks down.  Can someone pull stats to back this up?  Or is that he played his man tough?  When did he hold Wade, Kobe, LBJ to "ZERO" points?  This defensive stopper term gets tossed out a lot without any numbers to back it up.  
     
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    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.:
    Tony went to a team where he could possibly get more minutes.  If you get the time you will eventually produce.  I wish him the best.  Let's see if they can hold on to the 8th seed. Did someone say he shut down Durant?????  WHAT???????? All I will remember is him going for that Ben Gordon pump fake and fouling him shooting a three pointer in the playffs two years ago.   All this talk about shutting folks down.  Can someone pull stats to back this up?  Or is that he played his man tough?  When did he hold Wade, Kobe, LBJ to "ZERO" points?  This defensive stopper term gets tossed out a lot without any numbers to back it up.  
    Posted by jdm894g

    see the initial post for the link.
    no one shuts down Durant, but he did shoot 8-20 with only 5 FT's. And OKC lost.
    Grizz are 1.5 games out of the 5th western seed
    There are no defensive stats available, only "opinion"...and the going "opinion" on TA is that he is the best on ball defender in the NBA today
     
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    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.:
    Tony went to a team where he could possibly get more minutes.  If you get the time you will eventually produce.  I wish him the best.  Let's see if they can hold on to the 8th seed. Did someone say he shut down Durant?????  WHAT???????? All I will remember is him going for that Ben Gordon pump fake and fouling him shooting a three pointer in the playffs two years ago.   All this talk about shutting folks down.  Can someone pull stats to back this up?  Or is that he played his man tough?  When did he hold Wade, Kobe, LBJ to "ZERO" points?  This defensive stopper term gets tossed out a lot without any numbers to back it up.  
    Posted by jdm894g


    Amen, brother - he would not be happy here with 13 mins per game, even though he is producing roughly the same numbers in MEM.

    I don't subscribe to the PER theory.  I took a class and studied it.  It is one man's opinion of how to grade a player.  Much like Moneyball.........he made critical mistakes on offense (and D, as you point out), and he took the money and ran.....good for him - let's see what he does the rest of the year and in the playoffs..he made me nervous every time he had the ball, and I saw NO improvment......I agree 100% with YOUR post, but apparently rkarp thinks I'm the only one who feels this way.  Reading must be a problem!!..:)
     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    I think most people would agree TA played great 1on1 defense last playoffs.

    I havent looked at his stats this season ...there I just looked.. 

    18 mpg, 8 ppg, 2.5 rebs, 1 asst, 1 TO

    OK, nothing to write home about... maybe hes having a nice streak right about now but thats the point. All players get good streaks, its can they produce over the long haul.

    Could Larry Bird have had as many poor streaks as TA and be considered great? NO

    Just like TA cant string a few good games together where we should be moaning that we traded him.

    I suspect if Luke had 3 straight games of 20 points we'd be crying the blues about him too... similar to what Bill Walker did for a spell with the Knicks last year... all of a sudden Bill Walker was the one that got away.... but now, an entire season later, we see we didnt miss too much.
     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    the reason doc showed faith in him over the years is that he is such a good defender. doc is willing to overlook mistakes on offense as long as the effort is there on D, which is why I think bradley will stick around
     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.:
    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news. : Amen, brother - he would not be happy here with 13 mins per game, even though he is producing roughly the same numbers in MEM. I don't subscribe to the PER theory.  I took a class and studied it.  It is one man's opinion of how to grade a player.  Much like Moneyball.........he made critical mistakes on offense (and D, as you point out), and he took the money and ran.....good for him - let's see what he does the rest of the year and in the playoffs..he made me nervous every time he had the ball, and I saw NO improvment......I agree 100% with YOUR post, but apparently rkarp thinks I'm the only one who feels this way.  Reading must be a problem!!..:)
    Posted by hedleylamarr

    No one said "PER" is perfect. It is one man's opinion. But please point me in a better direction for player metrics? All of the players are graded on the same scale, and TA grades out very well.
    Also, no one said TA is an all star. What I did say was that the way TA has been playing, and what the Celts needs have been the past 6 weeks, TA could have been the perfect answer.
    Long story short, my original question was why couldn't Doc bring it out of him, since based on the (imperfect) "PER" score, he is achieving with the Grizz. I also questioned who Doc has developed outside of Rondo and Perk.  
    Money aside, I would have prefered TA over Marquis, Nate, Wafer, Battier, Posey and the like. 
    I don't fault TA for taking the $$$, I question why he didn't put it together in green (confidence?), and I wonder if it was equally the coaches fault. 
     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    what exactly is this link? so what i go to espn.. is there a specific article? 

    i see memphis pushing the spurs or the lake show to 6 or 7 games in that first round. tony is whayt miami could have used. a tou, hard nosed defender, PERSONALITY and player. like with perk, about $$$$... tony at 2-3M, no problem. TA at 4-5M, forget it.. green makes around 4M.. is TA even close to being a jeff green? esp when you put tony, rondo and perk on the floor together. tony  according to both doc and danny has always been much better the more he plays and STARTS. problem is that was never going to happen here... period! for us, the less he played, the better LIKE  PERK! great role players that can shine in spots and against certain matchups!
     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    Go TA
     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    http://espn.go.com/nba/dailydime/_/page/dime-110308/daily-dime


    The article was on the front page of ESPN, now it can be seen above.
     
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    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.:
    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news. : No one said "PER" is perfect. It is one man's opinion. But please point me in a better direction for player metrics? All of the players are graded on the same scale, and TA grades out very well. Also, no one said TA is an all star. What I did say was that the way TA has been playing, and what the Celts needs have been the past 6 weeks, TA could have been the perfect answer. Long story short, my original question was why couldn't Doc bring it out of him, since based on the (imperfect) "PER" score, he is achieving with the Grizz. I also questioned who Doc has developed outside of Rondo and Perk.   Money aside, I would have prefered TA over Marquis, Nate, Wafer, Battier, Posey and the like.  I don't fault TA for taking the $$$, I question why he didn't put it together in green (confidence?), and I wonder if it was equally the coaches fault. 
    Posted by rkarp



    So, he HAS put it together in MEM??
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.:
    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news. : No one said "PER" is perfect. It is one man's opinion. But please point me in a better direction for player metrics? All of the players are graded on the same scale, and TA grades out very well. Also, no one said TA is an all star. What I did say was that the way TA has been playing, and what the Celts needs have been the past 6 weeks, TA could have been the perfect answer. Long story short, my original question was why couldn't Doc bring it out of him, since based on the (imperfect) "PER" score, he is achieving with the Grizz. I also questioned who Doc has developed outside of Rondo and Perk.   Money aside, I would have prefered TA over Marquis, Nate, Wafer, Battier, Posey and the like.  I don't fault TA for taking the $$$, I question why he didn't put it together in green (confidence?), and I wonder if it was equally the coaches fault. 
    Posted by rkarp


    Here's where you lost me.

    What exactly has he put together in Memphis that he didnt here?

    Hes getting more playing time in Memphis but his stats are very impressive. Hes had good games against the Thunder is about all.

    Sorry, but a coach cant teach an NBA player to not dribble the ball off his own foot out of bounds or go crashing into the defense out of control.

    Maybe TA is improving his game (stats dont back it up) and he should be... hes getting more minutes and probably more time with the starters in Memphis.  Using PER or any other stat alone doesnt tell the story. Its been proven a million times over... you can cherry pick stats to make almost anyone look better or worse than they really are.


     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.:
    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news. : Here's where you lost me. What exactly has he put together in Memphis that he didnt here? Hes getting more playing time in Memphis but his stats are very impressive. Hes had good games against the Thunder is about all. Sorry, but a coach cant teach an NBA player to not dribble the ball off his own foot out of bounds or go crashing into the defense out of control. Maybe TA is improving his game (stats dont back it up) and he should be... hes getting more minutes and probably more time with the starters in Memphis.  Using PER or any other stat alone doesnt tell the story. Its been proven a million times over... you can cherry pick stats to make almost anyone look better or worse than they really are.
    Posted by Karllost

     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news. : Here's where you lost me. What exactly has he put together in Memphis that he didnt here?
    What he has put together is having his coach and team mates confidence allowing him to increase his minutes and production. Something he was unable to do for the Celts

    Hes getting more playing time in Memphis but his stats are very impressive. Hes had good games against the Thunder is about all. Sorry, but a coach cant teach an NBA player to not dribble the ball off his own foot out of bounds or go crashing into the defense out of control. Maybe TA is improving his game (stats dont back it up) and he should be... hes getting more minutes and probably more time with the starters in Memphis. 
    Allen
    FG% .496
    FT% .736
    Points per 40 minutes 17.5
    Rebounds per 40 minutes 5.1
    Assists per 40 minutes 2.5
    Rebound rate 7.6
    He guarded the holy trinity of perimeter players -- Dwyane Wade, LeBron James and Kobe Bryant -- and kept each well below his normal standards of production. Allen is undersized for a 2, but his athleticism more than compensates for it. He's incredibly aggressive on defense, leading the league in steals per minute and aiming for every block he can get. However, that costs him fouls -- he was third among shooting guards at nearly one every eight minutes.
    Green
    FG%.443
    FT%.822
    Points per 40 minutes 16.5
    Rebounds per 40 minutes 5.9
    Assists per 40 minutes 1.9
    Rebound rate 8.6
    Jack-of-all-trades combo forward who lacks an elite-level skill.  Likes to run right wing and finish in transition. Will shoot jump hooks in post.  Good defender at 3 or 4 but can struggle against bigger 4s. Bad rebounder. The hope that Green could be an effective floor-spacing big man suffered a setback last season. He slipped to 33.3 percent on 3-pointers and was again dreadful on long 2s (33.1 percent). Combined with his lack of progress in other phases, it was a somewhat disappointing season. 
    He's a solid defender and can crush undersized 4s on post-ups, but he's one of the worst rebounders at his position and his team played dramatically better with him off the court (a staggering 9.3 points per 100 possessions, according to 82games.com).
    Using PER or any other stat alone doesnt tell the story. Its been proven a million times over... you can cherry pick stats to make almost anyone look better or worse than they really are.
    This is true, I just did it
     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.:
    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news. :
    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news. : Here's where you lost me. What exactly has he put together in Memphis that he didnt here? What he has put together is having his coach and team mates confidence allowing him to increase his minutes and production. Something he was unable to do for the Celts Hes getting more playing time in Memphis but his stats are very impressive. Hes had good games against the Thunder is about all. Sorry, but a coach cant teach an NBA player to not dribble the ball off his own foot out of bounds or go crashing into the defense out of control. Maybe TA is improving his game (stats dont back it up) and he should be... hes getting more minutes and probably more time with the starters in Memphis.  Allen FG% .496 FT% .736 Points per 40 minutes 17.5 Rebounds per 40 minutes 5.1 Assists per 40 minutes 2.5 Rebound rate 7.6 He guarded the holy trinity of perimeter players -- Dwyane Wade, LeBron James and Kobe Bryant -- and kept each well below his normal standards of production. Allen is undersized for a 2, but his athleticism more than compensates for it. He's incredibly aggressive on defense, leading the league in steals per minute and aiming for every block he can get. However, that costs him fouls -- he was third among shooting guards at nearly one every eight minutes. Green FG%.443 FT%.822 Points per 40 minutes 16.5 Rebounds per 40 minutes 5.9 Assists per 40 minutes 1.9 Rebound rate 8.6 Jack-of-all-trades combo forward who lacks an elite-level skill.  Likes to run right wing and finish in transition. Will shoot jump hooks in post.  Good defender at 3 or 4 but can struggle against bigger 4s. Bad rebounder. The hope that Green could be an effective floor-spacing big man suffered a setback last season. He slipped to 33.3 percent on 3-pointers and was again dreadful on long 2s (33.1 percent). Combined with his lack of progress in other phases, it was a somewhat disappointing season.  He's a solid defender and can crush undersized 4s on post-ups, but he's one of the worst rebounders at his position and his team played dramatically better with him off the court (a staggering 9.3 points per 100 possessions, according to 82games.com). Using PER or any other stat alone doesnt tell the story. Its been proven a million times over... you can cherry pick stats to make almost anyone look better or worse than they really are. This is true, I just did it
    Posted by rkarp


    Come on now.. OK, Ta is a good defernder, no argument there but please, are you really going to credit TA and TA alone for handling the Holy Trinity?

    First off, TA played limited minutes... also Ray had alot to do with guarding Kobe effectively and PP with Lebron and so on... its alot easier to guard Kobe when youre on the floor for a limited amount of minutes instead of having to stick with him for 35 mins.... same goes for all the Per Minute stuff. Henry Finkel can enter the final minute of a game , make a layup and his per minute average is 96 PPG

    Also TA played a good part of his minutes this season off the bench against other teams 2nd unit players.  So your comparisons to Green are apples & oranges.
     
    Again, stats are easily distorted.

    I assume youre trying to make a point here that TA is preferable to GReen.. well, its a little too early to judge Green on the Celtics but if I had to make a choice right now... Id say Green in a heart beat
     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.:
    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news. : Come on now.. OK, Ta is a good defernder, no argument there but please, are you really going to credit TA and TA alone for handling the Holy Trinity? First off, TA played limited minutes... also Ray had alot to do with guarding Kobe effectively and PP with Lebron and so on... its alot easier to guard Kobe when youre on the floor for a limited amount of minutes instead of having to stick with him for 35 mins.... same goes for all the Per Minute stuff. Henry Finkel can enter the final minute of a game , make a layup and his per minute average is 96 PPG Also TA played a good part of his minutes this season off the bench against other teams 2nd unit players.  So your comparisons to Green are apples & oranges.   Again, stats are easily distorted. I assume youre trying to make a point here that TA is preferable to GReen.. well, its a little too early to judge Green on the Celtics but if I had to make a choice right now... Id say Green in a heart beat
    Posted by Karllost

    Yes, you are correct. It is easy to manipulate stats and perceptions.
    No, I am not asking if Allen is preferable to Green. My early read is that I prefer Green as well, assuming the Celts can sign him to a reasonable contract.
    The point I am trying to make is that TA statistically and from the eye test, has improved dramatically while playing for the Grizz. Why wasn't Doc able to bring it out of him? After watching Marquis and Nate for a large sampling last year, and obviously knowing PP and Ray age vs optimum minutes played, getting TA signed and playing with confidence should have been a bigger priority.   
     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.:
    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news. : Yes, you are correct. It is easy to manipulate stats and perceptions. No, I am not asking if Allen is preferable to Green. My early read is that I prefer Green as well, assuming the Celts can sign him to a reasonable contract. The point I am trying to make is that TA statistically and from the eye test, has improved dramatically while playing for the Grizz. Why wasn't Doc able to bring it out of him? After watching Marquis and Nate for a large sampling last year, and obviously knowing PP and Ray age vs optimum minutes played, getting TA signed and playing with confidence should have been a bigger priority.   
    Posted by rkarp


    You know, r, I really enjoyed this post.  It not only is very intelligent, but it shows someone who is passionate about the Celtics.  I respect that.  I was never a big TA fan, so we must agree to disagree on this point.  Secondly, Doc said he was very surprised TA was not coming back last year, and they did offer him a contract, like Perk, and he shot it down.  Lastly, in my many years as a coach, I have developed the philosophy of not talking about players who aren't here and can't help us (because they're not here).  Is TA a good defender? Yes!  Would he help us this year if he were here? Yes!!  BUT........he's NOT here, and we have to play the hand we're dealt...I think it is pointless to keep talking about the guy (and Posey, too), because he cannot help us this year.

    I love the team we have.  Green is a RFA, so we can match any offer....I don't think anyone will break the bank for Jeff Green.  We do need to sign Krsitc and BBD...I'm pretty much done with West after this year, but I do think he will help us in the playoffs...........so maybe Ray Allen has to play 40 mins against Wade et al.........so let's rest him now with Pavlovic, Wafer and West.....we have a 3 game lead on the Bulls with 20 to go.  Let's focus on that and not on "the one that got away". 
     
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    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.:
    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news. : You know, r, I really enjoyed this post.  It not only is very intelligent, but it shows someone who is passionate about the Celtics.  I respect that.  I was never a big TA fan, so we must agree to disagree on this point.  Secondly, Doc said he was very surprised TA was not coming back last year, and they did offer him a contract, like Perk, and he shot it down.  Lastly, in my many years as a coach, I have developed the philosophy of not talking about players who aren't here and can't help us (because they're not here).  Is TA a good defender? Yes!  Would he help us this year if he were here? Yes!!  BUT........he's NOT here, and we have to play the hand we're dealt...I think it is pointless to keep talking about the guy (and Posey, too), because he cannot help us this year. I love the team we have.  Green is a RFA, so we can match any offer....I don't think anyone will break the bank for Jeff Green.  We do need to sign Krsitc and BBD...I'm pretty much done with West after this year, but I do think he will help us in the playoffs...........so maybe Ray Allen has to play 40 mins against Wade et al.........so let's rest him now with Pavlovic, Wafer and West.....we have a 3 game lead on the Bulls with 20 to go.  Let's focus on that and not on "the one that got away". 
    Posted by hedleylamarr

    Heddy,
    I didn't intend for the posting to be about TA. He was just the prime example of what I am trying to put across, albeit I am not doing it so well.
    Rondo, Green, BBD and Bradley are a most likely big part of the team going forward. Are these players developing fast enough for you under Doc?
    Karlost will argue that a coach cannot get development out of a player. That may be true. But we have seen numerous CBulls including DRose show marked developement in their game under Coach Tibs, and I was making the point that TA has shown great development now that he is with the Grizz. It will be interesting to see where Perks development curve points now that he is with OKC.
    I also asked the question earlier(no one ever replied) other than Rondo or Perk, can you recall any young player that has shown marked improvement with the Celts other than Rondo and Perk? Al Jeff to me flourished once he went to the TWolves.   
     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.:
    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news. : Heddy, I didn't intend for the posting to be about TA. He was just the prime example of what I am trying to put across, albeit I am not doing it so well. Rondo, Green, BBD and Bradley are a most likely big part of the team going forward. Are these players developing fast enough for you under Doc? Karlost will argue that a coach cannot get development out of a player. That may be true. But we have seen numerous CBulls including DRose show marked developement in their game under Coach Tibs, and I was making the point that TA has shown great development now that he is with the Grizz. It will be interesting to see where Perks development curve points now that he is with OKC. I also asked the question earlier(no one ever replied) other than Rondo or Perk, can you recall any young player that has shown marked improvement with the Celts other than Rondo and Perk? Al Jeff to me flourished once he went to the TWolves.   
    Posted by rkarp


    I'm going to say "NO".........but Pierce's overall game has improved, KG and RA have bought into the idea of sacrificing.  Doc is very good with a veteran team.  He DID get a lot out of younger players in ORL like TMac, but he hasn't had a lot of really talented young players.  I think Al Jefferson was fine and going to be good anyway.  I also think Ryan Gomes, as a second round pick was doing okay.  How about Davis?  He is due for a  big payday this summer, and he was a second round pick - his maturity has grown, at least, in part due to Doc.

    As an aside - name a player Phil Jackson has developed?
     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.:
    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news. : I'm going to say "NO".........but Pierce's overall game has improved, KG and RA have bought into the idea of sacrificing.  Doc is very good with a veteran team.  He DID get a lot out of younger players in ORL like TMac, but he hasn't had a lot of really talented young players.  I think Al Jefferson was fine and going to be good anyway.  I also think Ryan Gomes, as a second round pick was doing okay.  How about Davis?  He is due for a  big payday this summer, and he was a second round pick - his maturity has grown, at least, in part due to Doc. As an aside - name a player Phil Jackson has developed?
    Posted by hedleylamarr

    I never thought Gomes showed much while he was here(and not so much now either)
    I will give you BBD. He has shown progress over the past 2 years. Kind of limited group, no?
    Jackson=Kobe, Bynum, Lamar, Divac, Gasol, Fischer have all improved since they have been with Jackson

     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.:
    In Response to Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news. : I never thought Gomes showed much while he was here(and not so much now either) I will give you BBD. He has shown progress over the past 2 years. Kind of limited group, no? Jackson=Kobe, Bynum, Lamar, Divac, Gasol, Fischer have all improved since they have been with Jackson
    Posted by rkarp


    OK, my bad!!!

    I thought we were discussing DRAFTED players.............all those players above have improved since Phil, but who have the lakers OR Bulls DRAFTED that Phil has developed and turned into a great player??
     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    When you discuss what young players has Doc developed lets remember one thing.  This Celtic team is a veteran squad of old dudes. Players that are good enough to win a championship. Because of this, Doc has to focus on the here and now... Notice how many defat picks the last 3 years are no longer here....

    Doc & Danny have a small window with this group and the focus is bring seasoned/proven players in to help win a title.

    He had no interest and there was no game plan to develop Bill Walker, Luke etc etc because by the time they did ((or IF) the window of the BIg 3 would be closed.

    Also know that BBD wasnt developed either... he got next to NO playing time in the title year against the L:akers... Only reason BBD developed was cause KG went down and we were forced to stick him in the lineup to absorb big minutes.

    SO, I dont think it a matter of inability they didnt develop the young dudes, its a matter of it wasnt their game plan for this group
     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    Doc's philosophy is focused on vets. He believes that Vets know who they are and can be trusted to play Doc's way. Young players on the other hand, are trying to figure out who they are, and will do things to enhanse their own situation at the expense to the team. They have to prove they can score when they should not, play for more playing time by making hero plays, or play for bigger contracts or accolades instead of team wins. 

    Doc has shown that this approach is the correct one, however, the development of younger players suffers from time to time, because they are not the prioity.
     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    Tony Allen is an amazing defender and if he scores ANY points that's just gravy.  He guarded Kobe about as good as anyone in the league ever has.

    As a Laker fan the last thing I want to do is face Memphis in the first round.  With their wing combo of Tony Allen and Shane Battier thats a tough matchup for Kobe.

    If you've noticed, Kobe has had an easier time scoring in the two regular season games against you guys this year, and I think thats a direct result of you not having Allen.  I think that's a strong reason why Ainge picked up Green.  There's too many good wing players in the NBA that you need an athletic defender at that position.
     
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    Re: Wow! Tony Allen makes the news.

    just curious if anyone saw the Grizz/Knicks game last night and thoughts on TA's game?
     
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