THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?

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    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    He should be shot and left for dead. Actually, hanging him from a tree like he did to the dogs is just punishment. Second chances......ask that to all the victims of criminals who recommit crimes considering recidivisim is pretty high.
    Posted by 4Adam13

    Are you f*ckin serious?! You're condoning shooting, no better yet hanging a black man from a tree because he abused dogs. 

    Classic!
     
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    Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?

    I agree it happens here, Paob. I am not dumb. 

    I question why someone who makes millions would not know it is illegal and why it would be deemed as an "aw shucks" moment, considering what it entailed.

    Some here are saying he "paid his time". Well, yeah, he paid down his time because he has plenty of money to do it.

    If you did that, you'd be in jail for 10 years. 

    I mean, we are talking about a full blown operation here. Interstate crime, a dog pound situation, a hub for breeding and using dogs for entertainment, execution set up, etc.

    This really, really creepy stuff to me.  You don't even have to be a dog lover to find this Vick stuff creepy.

    I don't think anyone was saying it's not a problem here. I know for a fact that coat manufacturers hire trappers to hunt animals and the way they are housed is disgusting.  Many die in a cage from disease or are skinned alive.

    It's pretty disturbing.  

    I just see a difference between breeding chickens for people to eat, so they get nutrition v.s. that kind of animal cruelty situation.

    One has a purpose of need, one is for entertainment. 


     
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    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK? : Here is some insight into the sort of person I am, as you seem to have me pegged as someone who labels the white man as the devil. I worked hard to get to where I am in life. Period! There are obstacles I have to deal with being black, I know that, you obviously don't and for you to suggest otherwise is naive at best. 
    Posted by paob


    You seem to be point to race. Funny you are the one talking about it. And don't hand me the slavery bit. My Irish ancestors were beaten, tortured, and held as slaves way before your ancestors were involved in the slave trade. So stop making this a racial issue.

    Vick is a turd. Period. He should never have been let back in to play football.
     
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    Thats Fine, I wasnt directing it at you, and I also said I didnt want to get into religion, cuz Im not a religous person.  I think religion is a business, and no preacher is gonna make money off me, but we all have our own experiences and we can only speak to those experiences and I can tell you that I'm in a good place in my life right now.  As far as being off topic,  I started my post talking about M.Vick playing good football, and Russ went off so dont ask me how it got to this.  Same with Russ turning a thread about Suggs being sour into a "IS RaY lewis Guilty" and should he be playing thread.  I'm just playing along.  I didnt start this mess.  Russ thinks he is the Voice of Reason.  I have not tried to get anyone to go to church here, I dont even go myself....I simply told Russ I would pray for him.
    Posted by patsfan76



    Stop trying to imply that I am some know-it-all with all the answers when I just form an opinion like eveyrone else does.

    You are just panicking and starting to backpedal because you are starting to look dumb defending Mike Vick and animal torture.

    Think before you speak.  You wonder why I think people like you are insecure?

    You try to paint me as someone who is this superior person or tries to assume that position, but that's not true. Don't paint your insecurities within a discussion as my issue.
     
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    Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?

    I find it strange that people don't expect a higher standard from someone who makes millions of dollars and represents a product that, apparently, Goodell himself wants upheld.

    The hypocrisy is incredible.  If Vick wasn't deemed to be able to generate revenue in some fashion for Goodell, Vick wouldn't be here.  Period.  So, this isn't about principle, this is about $$, as it always is.

    Curran is on WEEI right now painting the picture very well.

    I don't expect to see pro athletes running around with such disregard for the privilege they have.
     
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    "and YES! Mike V. SHOULD have to meet and prove to me that he has changed (this includes Big Boy Birthday parties) !. I haven't watched ANY Philly game since they hired him, but that is MY choice, not one delegated by you cause he's redeeming himself by playing great football. " Huh?  What? Calm down there  buddy.  Are you sure you are not Rusty's Ghost?  But in much?  Nobody was talking to you, and since you havent even watched a philly game, WTH should I sit here and explain myself....just leave this discussion cuz IT WAS about him playing well,and you havent watched him play yet...Soooo, thanks for coming, I'll asnwer to you when you get your posts up Newbie.   Nice try Russ!
    Posted by patsfan76


    Yeah, like this is the first name I've ever had here (rolling eyes). Please learn to read as well as spell. This is a PUBLIC forum. You want private? Invite one of the posters over for coffee.
    This WAS not a subject of How well Mike V. is playing. Re-read the title if you're confused.
     
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    Well, I have to agree with Killa on this. His actions were horrendous, and paying a huge fine plus a few months in jail seems lienient to me. Had I been the commisioner I would have given him a 25 year ban. If he could make a team at 55 good luck! But that being said, I do agree he's been a surprize to me on the field. I guess now he's not hanging out with his felon buddies he has time to study film and practice. I don't know that he could ever do enough to "erase" his deeds of the past in my book. If there is a God (I believe, but respect those who do not), then forgiveness is his call. But I still would not want him associated with the Patriots, however good he may play. He's a FA after this season, and if he does get a big payday I would hope he'd set up some sort of foundation for preventing animal cruelty. Perhaps he will. But love him or hate him, he did smoke the Skins last weekend! We'll see how he does against a Giants defense still stinging from the loss to the Boys!
     
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    You are right and what he did was disgusting and if you really think no player in the NFL thinks Vick is a scum bag POS and just happened to never say anything to the media then I guess that is just how you see it but to me that is just not real. I would bet my life that players were told to keep their mouths shut. Too many players in the NFL and not a single one has taken the other side of the debate and said he is a monster. No way thats by happenstance.
    Posted by MVPkilla4life

    Not sure about the censorship aspect of your statement or Vick being a monster - But we've gone over that already. DeMaurice Smith and Kevin Mawae are about as outspoken they come. 

     
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    Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?

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    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK? : So all of this is just to state that dog fighting is prevalent? That was your point? What does the World Wide Dog Fighting league ( the WWDF) and it's prevalence have to do with Vick adopting a LIFESTYLE even though he KNEW he had MILLIONS to lose? And stop with the "I'm black" and offended comments. It wasn't stupid to include dog fighting, slavery , drug use, child slavery etc because they are ALL worldwide. Your Great-great-great Grandpappy MAY have been a slave but fairly sure YOU weren't!
    Posted by ReddsGhost

    He adopted that lifestyle because he was stupid and made a dumb decision. The gov't doesn't like it when it's citizens lie to them in court. As for my "great grand pappy being a slave but you're fairly sure I'm not", pretty much tells me what hue you are.

     
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    Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?

    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK? : He adopted that lifestyle because he was stupid and made a dumb decision. The gov't doesn't like it when it's citizens lie to them in court. As for my "great grand pappy being a slave but you're fairly sure I'm not", pretty much tells me what hue you are.
    Posted by paob


    You're mistaken. Running a red light when a policeman is behind you is a dumb decision. Vick led a LIFESTYLE! In other words he made THOUSANDS of dumb decisions! Buy a piece of property for illegal dogfighting? Dumb decision (hereafter DD). Purchasing a dog? DD. Purchasing another dog? DD. Showing up at a dogfight? DD. Showing up at another one tomorrow? DD. Placing a bet of them? DD. Traveling to variouys arena's to fight them? DD. Allowing your cousin to deal drugs out of the kennels that held dogs? DD.
    See, he didn't make a A dumb decisions. He made a series of multiple bad decisions, in the thousands of DD !
    So, what "hue" am I? The type of hue that regrets some of our countries actions from HUNDREDS of years ago but realize that no US citizen TODAY is a slave? The type of hue that tires of hearing "my ancestors were slaves" as an excuse to not have to strive as hard as Non-slavery descendants? I really don't re-call hearing any whites complaining of their ancestors being held in slavery, yet they were! By the thousands! But we realize that the past is the past, hitch up our pants and carry on rather than maintain a bitter attitude simply because of something that happened centuries ago.
     
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    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    Hey Russ, You do know that several other NFL players attended these "dog fights" and not only condoned it, but they placed wagers on them.  Some of these might even be your favorite players.  You have only one guy to blame cuz he didnt drag a bunch of other people into it.  Some would call that a noble act.  Let you tell it, he was doing something that was isolated only to him and his friends...like the above poster said, this shyt happens evrywhere, but Vick was a scapegoat.  He did his time while others involved enjoyed the good life.  Being in Jail is an adverse situation.  "Vick can get his second chance somewhere else."  You dont have to give him a second chance, he has already been allowed to play again.  Oh, you thought YOU were the Commish?  Does Mike Vick have to meet with you and explain himself?
    Posted by patsfan76


    "Hey Russ, You do know that several other NFL players attended these "dog fights" and not only condoned it, but they placed wagers on them."

    You realize that by making krap up it weakens your arguement right? WHAT NFL players attended and bet along with Vick? Just curious cause I didn't see any other NFL player get convicted and we all know noone would make krap up to support their arguement.
    and YES! Mike V. SHOULD have to meet and prove to me that he has changed (this includes Big Boy Birthday parties) !. I haven't watched ANY Philly game since they hired him, but that is MY choice, not one delegated by you cause he's redeeming himself by playing great football.
     
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    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    I live among (surrounded by, literally) the Amish.  They pen dogs up and breed them till dead.  The pens are raised, with chain link floors, so the dogs get an area about 2.5 feet wide by 5 feet long to live their lives in.  They have to walk on the chain link, because its easier than cleaning the cages to have it there and let the fecal matter fall to the ground where you can shovel it up.  Tell them they are being cruel, they will hear none of it.  They believe animals are lesser beings.  They believe they have dominion over them.  Different people believe different things.  I'm WAY WAY more concerned about Ben trapping women than Vick.  I don't like what he did, but he went to jail, and now sees the error of his ways.  He didn't grow up in a world that valued animals, get it.
    Posted by TroyBrown80



    there you go...another version of what i was trying to say.

    and yes, i would be harder on people who hurt other people...physically or psychologically...regardless of race, nationality, belief (so long as their belief has nothing to do with hurting people)
     
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    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    Im narrow minded? Really? You are sitting here expecting everyone to fall under the same "god is the only judge" frame of mind and I am narrow minded? Seriously? I didnt say you had a low IQ so I will assume thats directed at Rusty, I dont think cause you are a god fearing man that you have a low IQ I simply dont agree with you and the fact that you expect everyone to believe as you do just shows how narrow minded YOU ARE not the other way around. Not everyone believes in forgiveness and that is my right and anyone elses for that matter. This is why I say leave your beliefs at the door cause i dont care to talk about how you believe in god and I dont or whatever that shouldnt ever be brought into it. If anyone is being "narrow minded" its you. And I am not perfect that is for sure but i have never gotten my kicks *raping women or torturing defenseless animals for fun. So I would say that puts me miles ahead of Vick and Big Ben.
    Posted by MVPkilla4life

    killa just for the record, i am so not a jesus freak. my god does not write books. i do not believe one needs a jesus or any one else to connect themselves to a god. i accept atheists' positions as well as nontheistic godists' views,. so please stop the jesus thing with me. compassion and empathy are necessary human pragmatic values in my view. we all benefit from a bigger view when it comes to each s to each other. to paraphrase the great MLK, "i have a dream, that one day little black boys and girls and little white girls and boys wil one day get to the same values point; i may not get there with you but it will happen". as a percentage of the population, i would expect the demographic group most oppressed and dehumanized historically to have the toughest time reaching those higher social standards. heck, look at the values between the north and south in general? it takes time! let's give it some generational time. if a vick and a tiger have such tough time dealing with those standards, how tough is it for the average unknown brotha on the street or bottom feeder player? it takes time.

    so many here prayed for vick's demise, wanted him to stink and even get injured.. yet he so far has triumphed despite your prayers and negativities. good luck to him thus far! he is now making a real contribution to society via football.. hope he gets paid, gets the glory again and the opportunity to lose to my pats in the SB!

    so many
     
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    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    all this issue about killing dogs being horrible and he should never be given a second chance is bs. it's illegal so he did time for it per the penal code. that's it. if you are judging him because you think what he did is wrong from a values perspective, then you're wrong. dogs get eaten in other cultures. on the flipside, if that's wrong then hunting should be wrong too. what's the difference between killing dogs and shooting animals for fun (hunting)? why is it wrong to kill dogs and not wrong to kill deer or duck or bear or even a lion for the thrill of it?
    Posted by seattlepat70


    Who said he was "eating dogs"?

    He was TORTURING dogs for entertainment purposes, it's illegal and so was his operation.

    May I ask why you feel a need to spin this as a way to defend something so sick?

    Do you torture dogs for fun too?
     
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    Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?

    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK? : Wow did you just compare Ali and Vick, seriously? One fought for equal rights and fought against a war he found unjust. The other Tortured helpless animals for fun and sport. There is no comparison and you can't justify it because he's a great athlete regardless if he won 5 SB's in a row or has never even been to one. Seriously man don't compare what Ali did to what Vick did you're disgracing Ali
    Posted by PatsEng
    again, i do not defend what vik did. i would prefer the cause ali took on than vik's.. point i was making very clearly is the REACTION of the public (more bluntly, MOST who happen to be white), most who happen to be blak supported ali for same reason most (including most nfl players) support vick. they share a similar cultural breeding and experiential understanding of america, for better or worse. as whites, we must grasp that rather than just pushing  our values, standards, history and expectations on others esp historically power minority groups!
     
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    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    You could not be more ignorant Russ.  You talk about black people being hypocritical about the fact they were slaves and yet see no problem with torturing dogs.  Ok, first off, if you dont know who is black, white, etc, than what, and who the fudge ARE you talking about? Secondly, IF I was an ancestor of a race that was enslaved by the same country that locked someone up for torturing dogs, I would be upset about the white people who got off scott free for raping and killing hundreds of innocent black people. Where do you get this fudged up Logic?  Yes, just be happy you had nice parents who raised you in a loving environment and you never had to face adversity like you said. 
    Posted by patsfan76


    Who am I talking about? 

    Mike Vick, Einstein.

    Holy christ.
     
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    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK? : i do not see what he did as any worse than hunting for entertainment, from a right or wrong perspective. society's acceptance of hunting while rejecting what he did is inconsistent, borderline hypocritical. Posted by seattlepat70


    I do my hunting at the grocery store, so there's some inherent hypcrisy in what I'm about to say, but if you can't see the difference between stalking animals in the wild -- where at least they have the defenses natural selection (or God, if you prefer) gave them -- and breeding animals for the express purpose of torturing them, I would suggest that you're observing this question through a deeply tinted lens.


     
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    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK? : dude, it is called PERSPECTIVE! how you and others can not independently make the sensitivity call that most blaks will take great offense at anything connnecting ANY blak man to a lynching is beyond me. it may not qualify as RACIST but it is certainlY unnecessarily RACIAL!
    Posted by KOOLAID-CONTRARIAN


    See, I love how when someone dislikes what someone else has to say, they bring in the race card. I said nothing about race and if your perspective is that this is a racial comment or issue, then you my friend, are the one with the racial issue. Not me. Don't point the finger at me in hopes of making your point.  Michael Vick hung dogs. He should get a taste of his own torture. Maybe then he'd realized it was wrong. Oh wait, maybe an "eye for eye" isn't what the old testament really meant.
     
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    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    He should be shot and left for dead. Actually, hanging him from a tree like he did to the dogs is just punishment. Second chances......ask that to all the victims of criminals who recommit crimes considering recidivisim is pretty high.
    Posted by 4Adam13
    dude, it is called PERSPECTIVE! how you and others can not independently make the sensitivity call that most blaks will take great offense at anything connnecting ANY blak man to a lynching is beyond me. it may not qualify as RACIST but it is certainlY unnecessarily RACIAL!
     
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    redd, i mIn Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK? : You're mistaken. Running a red light when a policeman is behind you is a dumb decision. Vick led a LIFESTYLE! In other words he made THOUSANDS of dumb decisions! Buy a piece of property for illegal dogfighting? Dumb decision (hereafter DD). Purchasing a dog? DD. Purchasing another dog? DD. Showing up at a dogfight? DD. Showing up at another one tomorrow? DD. Placing a bet of them? DD. Traveling to variouys arena's to fight them? DD. Allowing your cousin tt admito deal drugs out of the kennels that held dogs? DD. See, he didn't make a A dumusb decisions. He made a series of multiple bad decisions, in the thousands of DD ! So, what "hue" am I? The type of hue that regrets some of our countries actions from HUNDREDS of years ago but realize that no US citizen TODAY is a slave? The type of hue that tires of hearing "my ancestors were slaves" as an excuse to not have to strive as hard as Non-slavery descendants? I really don't re-call hearing any whites complaining of their ancestors being held in slavery, yet they were! By the thousands! But we realize that the past is the past, hitch up our pants and carry on rather than maintain a bitter attitude simply because of something that happened centuries ago.
    Posted by ReddsGhost
    redd, i must admit you and paob are kind of going where i hoped the thread would include when i originally posted. just keep being respectful even as you disagree. i do not agree with your view but i am learning more from your perspective. overall, my focus was to be directly about his FOOTBALL redemption, as i also see the situation of big ben. about them  making better decisions in the now both on and off the field so we all get to enjoy the showcasing of their talents and not distracted by all the PR distractions of their controversial off-field dynamics.

    in vick's case, there is a racial ancestral dynamic mr. redd. you cant see that for you have clearly benefited from generational white male privileges to the point where you cant just see the long term consequences. like it or not, the choices of your great grand daddy is having major positive dividends for ya. likely if he came to this country, he didnt come in chains and was not relegated to a socially inferior dawg culture. he was able to own a house and buy property (which included blacks at the time), get educated, move up in social staus and lifestyle and easily make his forebears dream in that direction. if black, you simply were not afforded such opportunitiies. heck, the great bill russell spells it out everyday. he was not able to live in certain neighborhoods which impacted how high his property was able to accrue in value even in comparison to absolute white scrubs on his team and the league. he was not able to tap into his home equity to easily send his kids to the first colleges of their choice and so on. same with a colin powell in comparison to a rumsfeld and his peers. he may have the same income as his peers but because they enjoy the multiple-generational privileges of white-male freedom and economic stature, they are able to enjoy far superior lifestyles and set up their kids and future generations in much better ways. ditto with a tiger woods and others. your high value standards are unfortunately still an IDEAL and distant reality for many blacks and power racial minorities. you can afford those values, they still cant in spite of how big their self-earned big accounts may be. in a few generations, their great grand kids will easily be able to share your multi-generational success values as a norm. you cant just dismiss history because its inconvenient for ya publically.

    you know in private, with your wife and kids, that you talk about your history without the inconveniences of slavery. per example, you dont have to trace your name history via the perspective of immediate lineage relatives being owned and being constitutionally a percentage of a human with no voting stake or rights within the country they are born into.

    redd, its funny how you and so many of my white brethren, can find it so easy to bond and rightfully empathize with dogs, hamsters and lobsters but simply cant bring yourself to do so with your power minority fellow citizens and HUMANS! in conclusion, vick's cruelty to animals should be condemned and called out, but yep his REDEMPTION thus far proves that there are so many black men and other power-minorities who could be reached with such structured setups that mr. vick has benefited him. kudos to the goodells and tony dungys of the world... heck, even the bill belichicks.. he does lots of work quietly with BLACK prisoners via jim brown's group in his spare time. and yep, our great belichick is an open private liberal and DEMOCRAT! not that republicans and conservatives cant reach the same conclusions. george and laura bush per example when not forced to demonize power minorities for their political minions also seem to get it. so to redd and others like him, spread your compassion and empathy to more of your fellow HUMANS and their HISTORIES in this nation, not to just conveniently project them to dogs, lobsters and so on!.
     
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    Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?

    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK? : Although I don't think Vick should be killed for what he did I also don't believe he should be allowed to make millions playing football again. However, what I think adam was saying is an eye for an eye type of deal. Vick hanged dogs from trees and shot them among other methods to kill them. It has nothing to do with race though I understand that coindication of hanging a black man from a tree I don't think he meant it in that way. It might not be easy to understand but racism isn't everywhere, sometimes it's just someone not seeing how the dots could connect not how they were meant to connect
    Posted by PatsEng

    I disagree with some of your post, but I appreciate the thoughtful response.

     
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    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK? : So, what's your point? That dogfighting is prevalent? So was slavery at one time. So are drugs today. Because they are prevalent we should condone them?
    Posted by ReddsGhost

    What's my point? I have to spell it out for you, ok...Dog fighting and drug use in society are prevalent, period it's done everywhere and anywhere. I'm black and for you to even mention slavery in a discussion with dog fighting is offensive and stupid. Did I drop any hints that I condoned Vick's actions, or couldn't you see that in my post either.

     
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    Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?

    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    I still think this is a mirage with a guy playing over his head and stand by it.  I'll also admit he's been playing great, but I think it's going to fade down the stretch as well. He did this in 2004 as well. Washington is a mess right now and their pass D is horrendous, which I am not sure why considering they have some decent talent there with Landry and then two good CBs.
    Posted by BBReigns

    Vick would have put 40+ on anybody last night. Even your Pats. He's finally getting it and it's trouble for the rest of the league.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?

    In Response to Re: THOUGHTS ON THE REDEMPTION OF MICHAEL VICK.... ON RIGHT TRACK?:
    I haven't read every thread but I wonder if the Eagles had aquired Ray Lewis instead of Vick would Philly fans have been less hostile? Lewis was possibly involved in a murder of a human being. I don't think there would have been nearly as much controversy. Which is worse?
    Posted by jaytf25


    If Lewis were convicted, there's no way in hE ll he'd be playing.  Both are despicable!  You may think it's a lessor crime but most sociopaths start out hurting animals.  They also don't change because they're void of conscience.
     
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