2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    Patriots Schedule Workout with Damian Williams

     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    Patriots Schedule Workout with Matt Mayberry

     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    To me, it is very simple now: smoehow secure McClain and Dunlap with the first four picks.  The rest of the draft will be the icing on the cake.
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    http://www.rotoworld.com/content/clubhouse_relatednews.aspx?sport=NFL&majteam=NE James Sanders for Greg Olson?  I would hope is McGowan rather than Sanders, I send McGowan and AD for Olson.  Sanders improved the secondary when he became the starter late in the season.
    Posted by Pats7393


    No way I give up a 2nd for Olsen.  He doesn't block.  We could have our choice of Hernandez, Gronkowski, Pitta and Graham with one of those picks.  I'd send Sanders and Thomas straight up or Sanders and a 6th.
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6 : No way I give up a 2nd for Olsen.  He doesn't block.  We could have our choice of Hernandez, Gronkowski, Pitta and Graham with one of those picks.  I'd send Sanders and Thomas straight up or Sanders and a 6th.
    Posted by Faucetman


    I agree no second rounder, I think if they require a second we say no thanks.  We can pickup one of the top TEs in the second or still a really good one in the 4th.

    Now the bears do need a lot of OL help, I've seen a few mocks with every pick except for one them picking guards and tackles.  I'm sure a straight up trade, Light for Olson would be good but which of the two is higher value?  could we get olson and something else?
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    Butler
    http://insider.espn.go.com/nfldraft/draft/tracker/player?draftyear=2009&id=24474

    Hadden
    http://insider.espn.go.com/nfldraft/draft/tracker/player?id=25724
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/A-draft-prospect-everyone-should-know-about.html

    Everyone needs to know about him haha, some impressive measurables.
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6 : No way I give up a 2nd for Olsen.  He doesn't block.  We could have our choice of Hernandez, Gronkowski, Pitta and Graham with one of those picks.  I'd send Sanders and Thomas straight up or Sanders and a 6th.
    Posted by Faucetman



    So you would be willing to give up our 2nd overall rated safety and 2nd overall rated OLB for Watson? Watson grades out almost the same as Olsen does with including everything in the grade.

    I would not do that.

    Burgess only graded out well when playing DE in the 4-3 alignment last season. Thomas graded out playing much better playing OLB in the 3-4 alignment for the Pats last season.

    Sanders was your surest tackler of any DB on the entire team by a wide margin last season. He was also decent in coverage.

    If memory serves me correct, Sanders graded out 26th of all starting safeties in the NFL last season according to PFF. That's out of SS and FS included.

    Olsen graded out about 3 or 4 spots higher then Watson did but BOTH were WAY WAY down the list.
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    Can't get over the hype Kindle is receiving, just got my draft magazines and he is listed as the top outside lb in the draft. What I see on tape is a guy that gets locked onto the tackle and stands straight up when rushing. He does have good speed, but he is not very big. When I watch Graham tape it is like night and day to this guy. Graham comes in low with power and balance and doesn't get locked onto the tackle. I'm sure he is not as quick as Kindle, but he gets past the tackles very well. The more I see of this kid. the more I'm sure the Pats will have to move up a little to get him.
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6 : I think he has SD written all over him.
    Posted by Low-FB-IQ


    He won't get past the Texans at 20 and if he does, we should take him at #22 (780) unless SD wants to move up to our spot and give us #28 (660) and their 3rd #92 (132).  With this trade we could do this.

    #28 OLB Jerry Hughes
    #44 WR Brandon LaFell
    #48 OT Rodger Saffold
    #53 RB Toby Gerhart
    #92 TE Jimmy Graham
    4th MLB Brandon Spikes
    6th DT Corey Peters
    7th on BPA
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6 : So you would be willing to give up our 2nd overall rated safety and 2nd overall rated OLB for Watson? Watson grades out almost the same as Olsen does with including everything in the grade. I would not do that. Burgess only graded out well when playing DE in the 4-3 alignment last season. Thomas graded out playing much better playing OLB in the 3-4 alignment for the Pats last season. Sanders was your surest tackler of any DB on the entire team by a wide margin last season. He was also decent in coverage. If memory serves me correct, Sanders graded out 26th of all starting safeties in the NFL last season according to PFF. That's out of SS and FS included. Olsen graded out about 3 or 4 spots higher then Watson did but BOTH were WAY WAY down the list.
    Posted by Low-FB-IQ


    Forget the grades.  They are based on all skills for a player.  If we got Olsen it would be to do one thing, catch the ball and move the chains.  Olsen is a lot better receiver than Watson.  I would trade Sanders and a 6th for Olsen in a heartbeat.  I would trade Sanders and A. Thomas straight up for Olsen.  By doing this, we dump the $5MM, get out of the contract and decide where Thomas goes for the next two years.  If we don't find a trading partner for Thomas, we cut him and he is wearing Jet green the next day. 

    As far as receiving skills, you compare Watson and Olsen and tell me who you think is better.  With Crump on board to block, Olsen can be used just as a receiver.  Keep in mind also that Olsen had NOBODY to get him the ball with Brady, watch out.  And Olsen is young!!!

    Olsen

    Receiving
    YearTeamGRecYdsAvgYds/GLngTD20+40+1stFUM
    2009Chicago Bears 166061210.238.241891330
    2008Chicago Bears 165457410.635.952561312
    2007Chicago Bears 143939110.027.931260190
    TOTAL461531,57710.334.35215212832

    Watson

    YearTeamGRecYdsAvgYds/GLngTD20+40+1stFUM
    2009New England Patriots 162940413.925.236550200
    2008New England Patriots 14222099.514.929210121
    2007New England Patriots 123638910.832.435670211
    2006New England Patriots 134964313.149.5403102323
    2005New England Patriots 152944115.229.4354100221
    2004New England Patriots 12168.016.01400010
    TOTAL711672,10212.629.640203321086
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    The only DL type likely left at #22 and worthy of the selection is Odrick.  The only pass rushing OLB types likely to be where we pick between 44-53 are Misi and Sapp.  Graham, Hughes, and Kindle will be long gone. I would agree about Odrick being the only likely DE left worthy of possibly taking at #22. But as you stated below they might opt to switch the priorities if they are not high on Odrick for some reason OR more importantly if they think there is not a big difference between a player like Alualu or Carrington and him. One thing was certain in looking into it. The Patriots defensive linmen did not grade out so well last season. They need help there. If they switch priorities I think they are looking at Kindle, Dunlap or Graham at #22. I would need to feel very certain Graham can set the edge standing up at 3-4 OLB before I take him. That's the 3-4 OLB primary job. Kindle is said to be excellent against the run. Only 6.5 sacks but really I would like to know how much pressure he puts not just how many sacks. Dunlap, you have to worry about his immaturity. He's only 20 but no denying his skills. TBC was a 7th rounder and really best suited as a pass rush specialist so I have major reservations on these shorter hybrid guys being picked high. For instance I do not think Hughes can set an edge he only did it so so in the bowl game and I don't think he can do it in the pros. I am not picking a guy like that high just to be a pass rusher. When you play a guy like Peyton he'll just go hurry up and not allow you to substitute and even get him on the field. If you wanted a guy like that I would just take a guy later like Norwood or something. There is DT talent available throughout the draft as it is one of the deepest positions EVER.  Yes we need to replace Seymour but there is no for sure Seymour after Suh, McCoy and Williams and all three will be long gone by 22.   Agreed. See above notes as even though it is a deep class they really need to find the best one they can. It was a problem last year. There are some decent RB choices to be had in the 2nd, Gerhart, Hardesty, and Dwyer.  If we pass on them there is no way McKnight, Dixon or Tate lasts until our spot in the 4th.  If we want a solid RB we have to take one in our first 4 picks. I am not sure of that. First I am not convinced all those backs are ALL off the board before 117. Second I don't think a player like starks is chopped liver compared to a few of those guys and yet he's only expected to go in the 5th or 6th round. I ideally would like them to trade back in the 1st just a few spots and pick up another pick or trade #44 back to the end of round 2 and pick up an end of round 3. Finding partners willing or rather wanting to to that however is probably doubtful. The situation is similar for TEs.  Good choices available in the 2nd and 3rd, nothing by our spot in the fourth.  Pitta will never get out of the 3rd round. Again, I have to disagree that all the decent prospects will be gone before #117. So you think Graham, Pitta and Moeaki will all be gone before #117? Even witht he kid from USC, Gronkowski, Gresham, Hernandez, etc also going ahead of those guys? WRs can be had everywhere but there are only a handful of guys with solid star potential, Bryant, Tate, and D. Thomas.  There will be a bunch of sleeper guys who could emerge throughout the draft but it's hit or miss. Sure I will agree. More importantly though. Who cares. The receiver position is so over hyped and over rated in importance as it relates to the elite ones I mean. The position alone does not help elevate the team to championships. I really like mbeaus boy Tate but I wouldn't take him in the first round due to the position he plays. Same for your beast boy Thomas. Like him but not in 1st because he's a WR. If you want a pass rusher, take Graham, Hughes or Kindle at #22
    Posted by Low-FB-IQ


    Where to begin?

    WR is the most drafted position in the first round this decade.  We are probably the only team not to have drafted a WR in the first round in the 2000s.  Most overhyped, no that honor would go to QB.

    I wouldn't touch Moeaki with a 20 foot stretcher.  He gets hurt getting out of the bath tub.  If we can't get Gresham I'd be in favor of getting a pure pass catcher now with Crump on board; Hernandez, Graham, Dickerson, and Pitta.  Gron's back worries me too much.  I'm not high on the other TEs that are 2nd round worthy.

    There is an outside chance that Tate/Dixon lasts to us in the 4th.  No way any of the others do.  I would save one of those 2nds to take a RB for the future.  Would go for a bruiser allowing us to cut/retire Taylor and/or Morris.

    There really isn't a Richard Seymour in this draft.  The closest thing to Ty Warren is Odrick.  He'd be an ok pick and certainly improve the right side of the DL but other guys who could be just as stout against the run can be had later, Aluala, Houston, Thomas, Joseph, Smith, Woods, Peters, Oghobaase.  Any of those guys would be an improvement but in the end would any of them beat out Wright the first year?  The one guy who could develop into a Seymour is Geathers.  He could be an absolute beast in 2-3 years.  Take him in the 4th if you think so.  So, I'm not looking to spend a #22 on a guy that won't crack the line up for awhile.  I'd rather wait since the bust rate on DTs is high.

    Graham/Kindle/Hughes debate is heating up.  Kindle has the most experience and best size for the BB 34 OLB.  I'm not sold on any of these guys for our scheme.  You don't spend a first round pick on a player you need to convert who you can't evaluate.  It seems 90% of the posters here are want to plug that pass rushing need with our first pick.  That is a recipe for disaster IMO.  I'd love to take Brandon Graham and watch him rack up 15 sacks the first year, set the edge and blow up any receiver in his path.  I just worry that he won't.  He's much, much better suited and tested as a 43 DE.  If we take him, that's how we should use him but then we should change out of our base defense and I don't see that happening.

    I keep bringing up Pouncey as the safest pick who graded out as high as any player in the draft in his position.  We could trade back 5-6 spots or so and still take him ahead of IND and NO.

    If we aren't going with the safe pick at #22, then I'd like to see us take a dynamic pick - a guy who can change a game and contribute immediately.  Guys to consider?  Mathews, Best, D. Thomas, G. Tate, J. Gresham.  I would not rule out Wilson either as I do think he's the best CB in the draft after Haden but we are loaded with high picks and have Bodden back.
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6 : He won't get past the Texans at 20 and if he does, we should take him at #22 (780) unless SD wants to move up to our spot and give us #28 (660) and their 3rd #92 (132).  With this trade we could do this. #28 OLB Jerry Hughes #44 WR Brandon LaFell #48 OT Rodger Saffold #53 RB Toby Gerhart #92 TE Jimmy Graham 4th MLB Brandon Spikes 6th DT Corey Peters 7th on BPA
    Posted by Faucetman

    Spikes slipping to the 4th??? I don't see it even with his poor 40 time.  Also I am strongly opposed to taking an OL in the 2nd, I would go DE here (Alualu, Houston, Carrington).  Looks good otherwise.

     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6 : Spikes slipping to the 4th??? I don't see it even with his poor 40 time.  Also I am strongly opposed to taking an OL in the 2nd, I would go DE here (Alualu, Houston, Carrington).  Looks good otherwise.
    Posted by titletownfan


    Spikes might not last to us late in the 4th, agreed.  But I don't think he's a 2nd round grade anymore unless he re-runs the 40 and comes in under 4.85.  I've taken Spikes off my top 100.  He's likely gone in the 3rd but we don't have a pick there so either we reach or let him go. 

    Why would you be opposed to taking OL in the 2nd?  The oldest position on the team is OL.  Saffold is a beast.  He's a leader, solid character, basically a 4 year starter at LT.  We've got highly paid Matt Light who has played his best football entering his final year and I doubt will return.  We have an up and coming star in Vollmer who can play either side and an over rated Nick Kaczur on the right side.  Do you want to enter 2011 with Vollmer and Kaz?  I'd bring Saffold in now give him a year to learn the system.  You could kick him inside too.  Whether it's Saffold in the 2nd, or Pouncey in the first, we have to start the youth movement on the OL soon, not to mention we could be losing Mankins next year and all of these guys are making decent coin now.  If we free up some cash and get younger, we can make a bigger play in F/A next year.

    Granted OL isn't a dire need pick but taking one this year gives us great depth and allows us to part with Mankins/Neal/Light after the season without as much pain.

    Ages as of 10/10/2010

    LT Matt Light - 32 ($4.5MM, contract expires 2010)
    LG Logan Mankins - 28 ($3.3MM playing on RFA tender)
    C Dan Koppen - 31 ($2.9MM, contract expires 2011)
    RG Stephen Neal - 34 ($2.5MM, contract expires 2011)
    RT Nick Kaczur - 31 ($2.7MM, contract expires 2012)

    Key Back ups

    T Sebastian Vollmer 26 (can take over at either T positions now)
    C/G Dan Connolly 28
    T - Mark LeVoir - 28
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    We took Ohrnberger and Bussey in the 4th and 5th rounds last year. While they may not be the answer in the future, I would say they are the key as to whether we would draft a OL in the second or first this year. Next year are line is mostly set ( doesn't mean that the draft couldn't upgrade it ) and if BB thinks these guys may have potential to be ready for 2011, I think he holds off.
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    Can't get over the hype Kindle is receiving, just got my draft magazines and he is listed as the top outside lb in the draft. What I see on tape is a guy that gets locked onto the tackle and stands straight up when rushing. He does have good speed, but he is not very big. When I watch Graham tape it is like night and day to this guy. Graham comes in low with power and balance and doesn't get locked onto the tackle. I'm sure he is not as quick as Kindle, but he gets past the tackles very well. The more I see of this kid. the more I'm sure the Pats will have to move up a little to get him.
    Posted by mthurl


    I agree 100%, Graham and JPP look like the top two off the edge, with Hughes a not that distant third. Graham seems to have the best feel for the running lanes and getting himself in position to make a tackle, and despite his short arms lol disengages from blocks real well. Dunlap I would stay away from despite his obvious talent, this is because on all the tape I watch he does his part but tends to quit on plays once he feels it is moving away from him, almost as if he considers football work and doesn't have the passion for the game. Would hate to give a guy like that $$ and still hope to see him show up
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6 : I would be all for moving to 11th but would not be for Spiller, although he's an electric back I would grad McClain.  This is a guy you can line up in all 4 spots at LB and is a 3 down guy.  I would play him on the weak side and cut him free.  If you trade to 11 for a RB to me is not worth it. If 11 is in play here are my picks, McClain, Hadden or Bulaga.  I know we found a LT in the 2nd last year but Bulaga is from Iowa, those kids are tough and well coached.  From all report he can start this year at LT but I would put him on the RT and try to trade Light on draft day.
    Posted by Pats7393


    I think if rumor has truth than the real pick at 11 for the Pats would be JPP. Not sure I would choose him over Graham but can't deny potential. Everyone projects JPP to land with the Phins at 12 so 11 would be the right slot. Also could be a good smokescreen to get the Dolphins quessing.
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6 : I agree 100%, Graham and JPP look like the top two off the edge, with Hughes a not that distant third. Graham seems to have the best feel for the running lanes and getting himself in position to make a tackle, and despite his short arms lol disengages from blocks real well. Dunlap I would stay away from despite his obvious talent, this is because on all the tape I watch he does his part but tends to quit on plays once he feels it is moving away from him, almost as if he considers football work and doesn't have the passion for the game. Would hate to give a guy like that $$ and still hope to see him show up
    Posted by Asher77


    Agree with the talent of JPP. the kid is long and moves well. Dunlap looks like a slug to me, I couldn't believe it when he ran a 4.6 and he looks very narrow and lost when teams run at him. Graham's size is a concern, especialy his arm length, but he does look very powerful.
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    Just a fun mock:

    #11 OLB/DE Jason Pierre-Paul- (Trade 22nd and 44th) Get there #1 rated pass rusher in this years draft

    #48 Trade to Atlanta ( they have no second ) for next years first round pick. Also swap our 4th this year for there 3rd.

    #53 WR  D. Williams- I love D. Thomas (who will have already gone) but this guy might also become a star

    #83 TE  Jimmy Graham- he looks smooth to me, think the pass catching side of his game will develop quickly

    As much as I want to see us make are picks in the draft you have to admit haveing three first round picks next year would be even better than the three seconds this year.
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6 : I agree 100%, Graham and JPP look like the top two off the edge, with Hughes a not that distant third. Graham seems to have the best feel for the running lanes and getting himself in position to make a tackle, and despite his short arms lol disengages from blocks real well. Dunlap I would stay away from despite his obvious talent, this is because on all the tape I watch he does his part but tends to quit on plays once he feels it is moving away from him, almost as if he considers football work and doesn't have the passion for the game. Would hate to give a guy like that $$ and still hope to see him show up
    Posted by Asher77


    JPP played one year in South Florida with 6.5 sacks.  Dunlap got 9.5 sacks in 08 and 9 sacks in 09.  Dunalp was defense MVP in the 08 national champship game. Yet JPP ranks higher in most boards.  McShay now has JPP at #3 and Dunlap at #19.  Strange.
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    A history lesson:

    In 2006 draft, here is what's in Mario Williams's scouting report:
    Weaknesses:
    Can be too inconsistent and needs to be properly motivated...Has a questionable motor and doesn't always give his all on every play...Really needs to work on his technique and master the nuances of the position...Often relied too heavily on his pure talent to get by in college...Is not very instinctive...Not a finished product.

    You can copy the same paragragh to the scouting report on Dunlap.

    After the Taxan drafted him ahead of Bush, almost everyone including myself thought it was a laughable mistake.   Len Pasquarelli called "Snubbing Bush a Texans-size blunder".  He wrote:

    "Ten of his 14½ sacks in 2005 came in just three games and against lesser opponents. Half of his six sacks in 2004 came in one outing, although, granted, the opponent was Florida State. But you ask yourself: What was this guy doing the rest of the time? Maybe the Texans, who haven't had many answers for anything else in their first four seasons, actually have one for that query. "

    Eaxctly the same thing has been said to discredit Dunlap's stats.

    In the end Super Marion has made the All-Pro first team twice, three times pro-bowl.  And Bush is a just third-down back.

     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6 : JPP played one year in South Florida with 6.5 sacks.  Dunlap got 9.5 sacks in 08 and 9 sacks in 09.  Dunalp was defense MVP in the 08 national champship game. Yet JPP ranks higher in most boards.  McShay now has JPP at #3 and Dunlap at #19.  Strange.
    Posted by TrustBill


    Can't argue with production, or can you? McShay and all of us are just fans and we would all love to spend some time in the war room. I do not know how much character factors in but for me the number one thing I want to see is what I call passion. I want a pure love of the game football player at every position, I guy who is still hitting you after the whistle blows and has so much blood boiling in his ears he never heard it. Line em up and do it again. From the tape I have found and there is so much of it on the Gators ( I like to watch the tape that isn't made just for him ) he tends to stop hustling. JPP never does, nor does Graham, these guys go full out all the time. I don't care if Dunlap runs faster, jumps higher, and is the more productive stat line pro, I don't want him on my team. I don't think that translates into winning.

    Oh, one more point, he can get drunk every night for all I care, so can JPP. All I ask is you show up on the football field ready to kill someone. Look at Lawrence Taylor, loved it
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    Just a fun mock: #11 OLB/DE Jason Pierre-Paul- (Trade 22nd and 44th) Get there #1 rated pass rusher in this years draft #48 Trade to Atlanta ( they have no second ) for next years first round pick. Also swap our 4th this year for there 3rd. #53 WR  D. Williams- I love D. Thomas (who will have already gone) but this guy might also become a star #83 TE  Jimmy Graham- he looks smooth to me, think the pass catching side of his game will develop quickly As much as I want to see us make are picks in the draft you have to admit haveing three first round picks next year would be even better than the three seconds this year.
    Posted by Asher77


    Mock 2.0

    If Pitta or Hernandez are still somehow on the board at #83 I take them over Graham
     
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    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6 : Forget the grades.  They are based on all skills for a player.  If we got Olsen it would be to do one thing, catch the ball and move the chains.  Olsen is a lot better receiver than Watson.  I would trade Sanders and a 6th for Olsen in a heartbeat.  I would trade Sanders and A. Thomas straight up for Olsen.  By doing this, we dump the $5MM, get out of the contract and decide where Thomas goes for the next two years.  If we don't find a trading partner for Thomas, we cut him and he is wearing Jet green the next day.  As far as receiving skills, you compare Watson and Olsen and tell me who you think is better.  With Crump on board to block, Olsen can be used just as a receiver.  Keep in mind also that Olsen had NOBODY to get him the ball with Brady, watch out.  And Olsen is young!!! Olsen Receiving Year Team G Rec Yds Avg Yds/G Lng TD 20+ 40+ 1st FUM 2009 Chicago Bears 16 60 612 10.2 38.2 41 8 9 1 33 0 2008 Chicago Bears 16 54 574 10.6 35.9 52 5 6 1 31 2 2007 Chicago Bears 14 39 391 10.0 27.9 31 2 6 0 19 0 TOTAL 46 153 1,577 10.3 34.3 52 15 21 2 83 2 Watson Year Team G Rec Yds Avg Yds/G Lng TD 20+ 40+ 1st FUM 2009 New England Patriots 16 29 404 13.9 25.2 36 5 5 0 20 0 2008 New England Patriots 14 22 209 9.5 14.9 29 2 1 0 12 1 2007 New England Patriots 12 36 389 10.8 32.4 35 6 7 0 21 1 2006 New England Patriots 13 49 643 13.1 49.5 40 3 10 2 32 3 2005 New England Patriots 15 29 441 15.2 29.4 35 4 10 0 22 1 2004 New England Patriots 1 2 16 8.0 16.0 14 0 0 0 1 0 TOTAL 71 167 2,102 12.6 29.6 40 20 33 2 108 6
    Posted by Faucetman


    Forget the grades. Ha! Yeah I think Not. Grades are based on the tape and the tape don't lie. The grades are NOT perfect but they are a pretty good indicator because the top graded players by and large are always the guys most people perceive to be the better ones any ways. If I was going to ignore the facts why bother checking anything out we all might as well just make it all up. They are based on all skills for a player.  Exactly! That's the point. The "player". NOT the "receiver" or the "blocker". If we got Olsen it would be to do one thing, catch the ball and move the chains.  Olsen is a lot better receiver than Watson.  Let me quote BB for you. "If I wanted a receiver I would draft a receiver and not a tight end." The one year we actually used Watson as a receiver he caught 49 passes. That means "he" can do the job as well. Go look at some numbers. If Olsen came here he would NOT have good numbers. They would go down and even worse he would aid in getting Brady killed. Baker avg'd 31 receptions before coming here his number last season? 14 - Less than half the avg of his previous 3 seasons. Dave Thomas leaves and his numbers go UP. He catches almost as many balls as Watson and Baker combined by simply going to a different offensive system. The grades on Watson and Olsen are close based on the total player for 2 reason. 1st Watson is an obvious much better pass blocker as well as run blocker but secondly the receiver grade for Watson is less than Olsen by not that much. The grades for receiving are based on how the player performs with the opportunities given to him not simply by how many catches he has. You do not rip another guy down for having less opportunities. The "receiving" ONLY grade on Olsen was 14th in the league and Watson was 18th. 

    Sorry I am not giving up my 2nd best safety last season on my team and 26th rated safety in the league for a TE who is marginally better at only one aspect of his game than the player I just let walk because I had absolutely no interest in resigning him. To me that makes no sense.

    Here is the other reason I do not want a receiving only TE. If I am a defensive player and I know every time Olsen is in the game it's a pass then yahoo for my defense. Olsen is a fit for a lot of teams and could put up similar numbers in the right system but I do not see it happening here. He doesn't fit the Patriots system as it is currently constituted.


    You can see in the graphic above the comparison. It was sorted with "Receiving" set to be the filter. I took the liberty to highlight a couple important things. You want to post your reception numbers below but as I stated before the graphic you have to look at the targeting.  Olsen was targeted 105 times to Watson's 40. Olsen should have more receptions based on that, it's a huge difference. Let me point something even more important to you. Watson caught 72.5% of the balls thrown to him. Olsen only caught 56.2%. Watson also had a higher yards per reception. Watson also only has 3 fewer touchdowns even though he had less than half the opportunities at receptions.

    But I forgot I am suppose to "forget the grades" and what they mean.

    Again if the Patriots had absolutely NO interest in resigning Watson who would not have cost them a single player and only money why would they ever want to part with their 2nd best safety and a draft pick or their 2nd best safety and their 2nd best 3-4 OLB for Olsen. Especially since Watson is considered the better all around player and only a marginally less receiver.

    We can agree to disagree my friend because I fail to see the logic in it.

    If you wish to trade Thomas(your 2nd best 3-4 OLB) and some late rounder for something because you think he would be cut then fine but I think you could target a better fit for the current system. Unless you are telling me they are changing the offensive system. As far as controlling where Thomas goes I could care less. Fans think he stinks. I am in the minority. I do not. If the Patriots think he stinks then they should not worry about where he goes. If I thought a player stunk I would want him to go to my competitor and hope that my competitor played him so I could exploit him.

    I would trade Sanders and a 6th for Olsen in a heartbeat.  I would trade Sanders and A. Thomas straight up for Olsen.  By doing this, we dump the $5MM, get out of the contract and decide where Thomas goes for the next two years.  If we don't find a trading partner for Thomas, we cut him and he is wearing Jet green the next day.  

    As far as receiving skills, you compare Watson and Olsen and tell me who you think is better.  With Crump on board to block, Olsen can be used just as a receiver.  Keep in mind also that Olsen had NOBODY to get him the ball with Brady, watch out.  And Olsen is young!!! I answered all of these already above but I will reiterate. Olsen did not have Brady but Chicago also did not have much in way of receivers the past few years either. The one year we did not have much in receivers Watson had a good number of receptions and that's still in a less TE friendly offense.

    Olsen

    Receiving
    YearTeamGRecYdsAvgYds/GLngTD20+40+1stFUM
    2009Chicago Bears166061210.238.241891330
    2008Chicago Bears165457410.635.952561312
    2007Chicago Bears143939110.027.931260190
    TOTAL461531,57710.334.35215212832

    Watson

    YearTeamGRecYdsAvgYds/GLngTD20+40+1stFUM
    2009New England Patriots162940413.925.236550200
    2008New England Patriots14222099.514.929210121
    2007New England Patriots123638910.832.435670211
    2006New England Patriots134964313.149.5403102323
    2005New England Patriots152944115.229.4354100221
    2004New England Patriots12168.016.01400010
    TOTAL711672,10212.629.640203321086

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from sportsbozo1. Show sportsbozo1's posts

    Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6

    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6:
    In Response to Re: 2010 Mock Rounds 1-6 : Mock 2.0 If Pitta or Hernandez are still somehow on the board at #83 I take them over Graham
    Posted by Asher77
    Hernandez won't be available after the 3rd round,and Pitta is rising on everyones draft boards.Nice thought though..
     

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