2011 Patriots Draft Options ***THANKS TO ALL WHO CONTRIBUTED!***

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Marc627. Show Marc627's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    first pick is gonna be a top 15 from the raiders and i can really see them go after Julio Jones who Nick Saban(who happens to be Belichks best friend) has said hes the hardest worker hes had at the college level..... would be a great fit seeing as how brandon tate our down field threat cant catch a ball.... Jones has been playing in argually the most professional and pro style system college football has to offer
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsNut5480. Show PatsNut5480's posts

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    An interesting read from Dan Pompei about generating a pass rush in a 3-4 and 4-3.  He's stating in todays NFL teams are generating a better pass rush with OLB's compared to DE's in a 4-3. 

    http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Threeman-fronts-have-sacks-appeal.html
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from jjaycee. Show jjaycee's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    The draft-- the O is the highest scoring team in the NFL this year. as a result, all they need is a big power RB, and a tall, speedy, sure handed WO.
    The D, different story, need- 2 DE's, make Kerrigan one, and another DE, plus 2 OLB's, and last a safety to replace Meriweather who will be gone at season's end, positively. And hopefully, all will be starters, so another year with great playoff potential will be the goal.    
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***:
    I can't see the Patriots drafting a safety in this draft at all. They have 7 safeties now if you include the guys on IR. The kid from Auburn is a very good down lineman Fairley was all over the place against Bama. I can't project where BB will draft because i don't know how far down the list Oakland falls,having the 1rst pick in the second round is huge! That might be the best draft choice they own, just think of the offers that will come for that pick!!!! The Patriots won't have many openings on their roster so trading it out for picks in 2012 is a possibility,however if Mankins leaves then I could see them using it to draft the best available OG. Also if he leaves the Patriots will get a compensation pick at the end of round three,which would make this the deepest draft in the history of the NFL for one team! 2 firsts,two seconds,three 3rds and of course a 4th !! 8 players in the top 150... They don't have a 5th but that could change.
    Posted by sportsbozo1

    Minor point but compensation for losing Mankins (assuming that happens) won't occur until the 2012 draft.  If memory serves from my comp pick process research the level of pick depends on how much Mankins was getting paid plus the % of plays he was involved in plus it is offset by new free agents we sign.  Since Mankins sat out 8-9 weeks and wasn't making elite money, don't count on that being a 3rd round pick and certainly it won't happen until 2012.
     
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    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***:
    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1*** : Good points Faucet.  I agree they do fit as for as size goes.  My only concern was if the Patriots scheme would suit Fairley and Watts' abilities. You would probably know better than me about how they stack up against the run every game.  They obviously get double teamed on passing downs but how do they hold up when a team tries to run down their throat?  Have you seen Justin Houston from Georgia play?  I haven't seen any Georgia games this year but I've been trying to read up on this guy.  From what I've heard he seems legit.
    Posted by PatsNut5480

    Haven't focused in on Houston yet.  That's what I love about this thread and those like it.  I learn as much from everyone here as I do on my own research and game watching.  I plan to watch the Georgia/Georgia Tech game which I think I tivo'd.  I have about 5 games to catch up on. 

    As for Fairley and Watt against the run; both players are solid in tackles for loss.  In the 34 of course, stopping the run doesn't mean getting a lot of tackles, it is about engaging the OL and allowing your LBs to make all the plays.  Granted, there is always an unknown when moving a player from one system to another.  Heck, there is always uncertainty moving a player from one team to another who run similar systems.  All I know is these two guys are extremely athletic, play with high energy, are extremely disruptive and I believe will be stars in the NFL.
     
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    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***:
    The draft-- the O is the highest scoring team in the NFL this year. as a result, all they need is a big power RB, and a tall, speedy, sure handed WO. The D, different story, need- 2 DE's, make Kerrigan one, and another DE, plus 2 OLB's, and last a safety to replace Meriweather who will be gone at season's end, positively. And hopefully, all will be starters, so another year with great playoff potential will be the goal.    
    Posted by jaycee1m

    I respectfully would like to suggest that our O needs a little more than a new WR and RB.  Heading into 2011, here are the ages of our key OL personnel:

    Matt Light 33
    Logan Mankins 30
    Dan Koppen 31
    Stephen Neal 35
    Nick Kaczur 32
    Dan Connolly 29
    Sebastian Vollmer 27

    Light and Mankins are both unrestricted free agents after the season.  Neal could retire.  We could be facing the sudden loss of 3 starters on the OL.  We have to address this situation also in the draft.

    Everyone is coming down on the D and based on how they are rated I can see why but keep in mind, our D is only 25 years old on average.  We have 4 rookies starting (Deaderick, Cunningham, Spikes, and McCourty) .  They will get better with more experience.  We have Ty Warren and Leigh Bodden coming back.  I agree we should draft an elite DE (if we can get Fairley or Watt) and an OLB.  I prefer to sign a solid F/A CB.  As for safety, I agree we could add one via the draft or free agency.
     
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    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***:
    first pick is gonna be a top 15 from the raiders and i can really see them go after Julio Jones who Nick Saban(who happens to be Belichks best friend) has said hes the hardest worker hes had at the college level..... would be a great fit seeing as how brandon tate our down field threat cant catch a ball.... Jones has been playing in argually the most professional and pro style system college football has to offer
    Posted by Marc627

    I'm pretty high on Jones too.  I even suggested taking him with the Raider pick if Fairley, Watt and Kerrigan are gone to the chagrin of many.  I applaud you sir for bringing up his name.  My only concern about Jones is he has screws and what not in his hand.  I worry about that.  As a player, he's top shelf.  I think Jones would become our #1 WR and put up huge numbers with Brady.  I see him as an option even though my good friend Mord will kill me for saying it again, huh Mord?
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxnsl. Show maxnsl's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    I love reding this thread. Ever since last year leading up to the draft I look so forward to anything put up by mb and Faucet among others. You 2 guys are the cats pajamas and make my Pats reading so enjoyable. Having said that I may have thought of something you havent adressed.... 18 game scedule! I would think certain postions would be cause for concern and maybe looked at as needing a bit more concentration. Im thinking dl and wr and rb are positions that you might see even more injuries next year
     
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    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***:

    Here's my Jr top heavy mock also going after some D.  Adding a few players probably not talked about.  Missed a ton of posts so not sure if they have or not but really liking what I'm finding on both 3rd round picks. Jarrett and Gates, think these guys could make a difference.  1st Rnd (Oak) - Brandon Harris CB 5'11" 195 - another guy with shutdown CB type upside.   4 down player. Assng - Jared Crick DE 6'6" 290 this guy is the real thing, needs to add some bulk to hold against the run.   Has a none stop motor, great also at getting into the backfield and after the QB 2nd Rnd (Car) - Aldon Smith OLB 6'5" 260 Great first step, only question is does he come out or return to school. assgn - Benjamin Ijalana OG 6'4" 320 plays tackle in college but projects as a guard.   Can pass block and run block, plays with an attitude, strong punch.   If Mankins is gone this guy could play himself into the starting role. 3rd Rnd 73 (Min) - Jaiquawn Jarrett FS 6'0" 202 smart football player, plays well in zone and is an excellent open field tackler. 96 - Edmund Gates WR 6'0" 190 this kid from Abilene Christian dominates.   He is not a great route runner but it is does have a route tree.   Makes people miss in the open field, deep threat can break a big run anytime. 4th Rnd 101 (Denver) - Cyrus Gray RB 5'10" 198 fast shifty RB, can get to the corner.   Gives the offense yet another weapon.   Figure adding a few lbs and he could be a very dagerous combination with woody and BJGE. 5th Rnd Chris Hairston OT 6'7" 325 If Light returns which I believe he will a RT of the future can be groomed for a season or two.   Hairston fits the bill. 6th Rnd (dave thomas trade) 6 Kyle Hix OT 6'7" 325 strickly a RT in the NFL, could add depth and maybe in the Patriots OL school he becomes a solid player
    Posted by Pats7393

    Pats,

    Thanks for injecting some new names to the discussion.  You aren't alone in talking up Harris.  I just don't see the need with Bodden coming back.  If we were talking about Peterson or Amukamara then I think that is one thing but I don't have Harris quite in their realm as of yet.  Time could change my thinking on him though.

    Crick is a guy I like as a second tier 34 DE.  He isn't in the same class as Fairley and Watt.  This is not to say he couldn't develop into a solid player.  I just don't think he would upgrade our current DL with Ty Warren coming back.  I'm not knocking the suggestion because I had the same thoughts about taking Crick late 30s but decided against it for these reasons. 

    Now Aldon Smith is a stud.  If he comes out as a RS sophomore, you're on to something with the CAR pick or even our late 1st.  Now Benjamin Ijalana I don't see as athletic enough to be a BB type OG, let alone OT.  I'm stuck on the Moffitt, Henry or Schilling train at this spot.

    Good call on Jarrett.  If he's there at this spot, I too would be all over him.  I'm not familiar with Gates.  Will have to look into him more.  I do like a few WR here like Titus Young, Pettis, Salas, Maehl, and others in this spot.



     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***:
    I love reding this thread. Ever since last year leading up to the draft I look so forward to anything put up by mb and Faucet among others. You 2 guys are the cats pajamas and make my Pats reading so enjoyable. Having said that I may have thought of something you havent adressed.... 18 game scedule! I would think certain postions would be cause for concern and maybe looked at as needing a bit more concentration. Im thinking dl and wr and rb are positions that you might see even more injuries next year
    Posted by max5344

    Max,

    Thank you for the kind words.  This is what happens when you've been married 22 years and the wife watches Oprah on DVR at night:).

    You raise a very interesting topic - the 18 game schedule.  I am very curious if the league will expand the 53 man roster and 45 man game roster to address this concern.  If not RB especially would be a position of special concern.  I do think all positional players would feel the impact, especially play-off teams.  In years past you would play 19 meaningful games if you made the SB.  You will play that many by Wild Card weekend.  Assuming there are no roster allowances, I do think teams with the deeper benches will be at an advantage. 
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from MordecaiBloodmoon. Show MordecaiBloodmoon's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    Faucet, I always love good, reason backed discussion.  I am not against Jones per se.  It is just the #1 area that I think we can get and start a rookie in is OLB and it will also improve our D by leaps and bounds.  It also stays in line with the cap ideology of the team and allows this very young D to grow as an almost complete unit for the next several years.  Not that we can get him, but I also love P Peterson and have since before last draft.  Certain guys can change the entire D.
    Onto OL, I agree we need to grab some in this draft.  The challenge is going to be based on who stays.  Although I would have no issues with grabbing a new OT, OG AND C.  Unless people leave or retire etc we wouldnt have roster space unless we cut some solid backups.  I am hoping we can get a C/OG type to mold for the future and back up 2 spots with 1 very good player.  I think we need a new OT who can learn behind Light and SeaBass. 
    I am just glad we have the BB style of trading picks.  I know it frustrates the heck out of us, but look at all the great picks we have this year.  We as the fans see so many holes that can be fixed, patched, etc and we have the resources to fill them almost all in one year all while being 9-2 so far in a "rebuilding" year.  Plus we should be very cap friendly after this season as well when it returns.
    18 game season, I recall reading they wanted to add 1 to the game day roster, 2 to the roster and 2 more to the practice squad as a proposal.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Pats7393. Show Pats7393's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    Hi Faucet my answers in red.

    Thanks for injecting some new names to the discussion.  You aren't alone in talking up Harris.  I just don't see the need with Bodden coming back.  If we were talking about Peterson or Amukamara then I think that is one thing but I don't have Harris quite in their realm as of yet.  Time could change my thinking on him though.
    Harris is one of my favorite players on the draft, I think he has a lot of upside to him and could add another reliable CB in the mix.  Bodden will be good but with all this time off can he get back to pre injury form during offseason workouts and training camp?  Also, I was high on Butler and still am although a bit disapointed as most.  Hope he can develop but I'm one that thinks you can't have enough DBs.  Also my thinking, we've seen a lot of 3 safety sets with Chung covering nickle, this could be Bodden or Harris next season and move Chung back.

    Crick is a guy I like as a second tier 34 DE.  He isn't in the same class as Fairley and Watt.  This is not to say he couldn't develop into a solid player.  I just don't think he would upgrade our current DL with Ty Warren coming back.  I'm not knocking the suggestion because I had the same thoughts about taking Crick late 30s but decided against it for these reasons. 
    I see Crick as a Mike Wright type but has the potential to be a 3 down DL.  You might be right he's not an upgrade over Warren but I think he would be over Deadrick (and I'm have high hopes for Deadrick).  Crick make a lot of plays in the backfield.  Plays on the right side of a 4 man front.  Worth keep an eye on.

    Now Aldon Smith is a stud.  If he comes out as a RS sophomore, you're on to something with the CAR pick or even our late 1st.  Now Benjamin Ijalana I don't see as athletic enough to be a BB type OG, let alone OT.  I'm stuck on the Moffitt, Henry or Schilling train at this spot.
    If he comes out big IF, Smith, he needs to be drafted and could be with the Raiders pick.  He can bring the heat.  Ijalana, you are right he's not the most athletic but he's a bulldozer to open holes in the run game.

    Good call on Jarrett.  If he's there at this spot, I too would be all over him.  I'm not familiar with Gates.  Will have to look into him more.  I do like a few WR here like Titus Young, Pettis, Salas, Maehl, and others in this spot.
    Saw someone say we are not going to pickup a safety and they might be right but man I like Jarrett's game.  If he's available in that spot, best player on the board?  IMO he is an upgrade at Safety except for Chung, so yes I'm saying he'll be better than Merri.
    See what you can find on Gates, I think you'll be plesently surprised.  He's a speed guy who can run routes.  Not a great route runner but also not a Randy Moss, 9 route only king.  He's also a return guy, I like Titus Young
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***:
    Faucet, I always love good, reason backed discussion.  I am not against Jones per se.  It is just the #1 area that I think we can get and start a rookie in is OLB and it will also improve our D by leaps and bounds.  It also stays in line with the cap ideology of the team and allows this very young D to grow as an almost complete unit for the next several years.  Not that we can get him, but I also love P Peterson and have since before last draft.  Certain guys can change the entire D. Onto OL, I agree we need to grab some in this draft.  The challenge is going to be based on who stays.  Although I would have no issues with grabbing a new OT, OG AND C.  Unless people leave or retire etc we wouldnt have roster space unless we cut some solid backups.  I am hoping we can get a C/OG type to mold for the future and back up 2 spots with 1 very good player.  I think we need a new OT who can learn behind Light and SeaBass.  I am just glad we have the BB style of trading picks.  I know it frustrates the heck out of us, but look at all the great picks we have this year.  We as the fans see so many holes that can be fixed, patched, etc and we have the resources to fill them almost all in one year all while being 9-2 so far in a "rebuilding" year.  Plus we should be very cap friendly after this season as well when it returns. 18 game season, I recall reading they wanted to add 1 to the game day roster, 2 to the roster and 2 more to the practice squad as a proposal.
    Posted by MordecaiBloodmoon

    I'm with you on Peterson.  If the Raider pick ends up in the top 10.  I think it could be as good as #9 based on their remaining schedule and the schedule of the teams below them and tie breakers, etc.  If Watt, Fairley or Peterson are still on the board at #6, I would package 64 and 9 to move up to get whichever one is there.  If they are gone, perhaps Kerrigan at this spot.  If the Raider pick is more in the 12-15 range and all the above players are gone, I guess we could trade down and get a Carimi or something but I would not be against Julio Jones in this range.  If you consider that Branch will be 32 and is a $6MM man and Welker will be 30 and both will be in the final year of their contracts, who do we have?  Tate?  Price?  Edelman?  Slater?  We could use a ligit #1 WR who is tall, fast, and tough.

    I don't think BB will take Jones or any WR in the 1st round.  He's never done it before even when the need was there.  That's fine, there are 16 guys I like in the first 4 rounds who I think would upgrade Tate.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    If the season ended today we'd be at 14, 30, 33, 62, 73, 94. 
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Pats7393. Show Pats7393's posts

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    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***:
    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1*** : Max, Thank you for the kind words.  This is what happens when you've been married 22 years and the wife watches Oprah on DVR at night:). You raise a very interesting topic - the 18 game schedule.  I am very curious if the league will expand the 53 man roster and 45 man game roster to address this concern.  If not RB especially would be a position of special concern.  I do think all positional players would feel the impact, especially play-off teams.  In years past you would play 19 meaningful games if you made the SB.  You will play that many by Wild Card weekend.  Assuming there are no roster allowances, I do think teams with the deeper benches will be at an advantage. 
    Posted by Faucetman


    Heard on NFL network a few days ago a report where the NFL and PA had good talks and almost sounded like a 18 game season is a done deal, it will happen.  There have been some reports that the PA has a few requests which the NFL owners found they were ok, less offseason workouts extra roster spots (2 to 3 I believe).  I'll see if I can find a link.

    If this is the case, do you get position players or big uglys on both sides of the ball.  will there be an extra round added to the draft?
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from MordecaiBloodmoon. Show MordecaiBloodmoon's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    Faucet, I forgot to mention another reason for being less into drafting a WR. I like the potential FAs that will be there and that falls in line with BBs history.  Sydney Rice would look great in a Pats Uni IMHO.  I know Minn will work hard to keep him, but if I recall correctly their cap # was around 150 mil this year with Favre, so even after he is gone, they will be way over and need to lose some quality guys to get under the new cap when it is in place. 
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    Everyone seems to agree that we need to upgrade our OLB corps.  I don't disagree.  However, this is Cunningham's first year and Ninkovich's first year as a starter.  Both should improve.  Here's a look at how our current OLBs stack up. 

    Rob Ninkovich 6-2, 255
    Jermaine Cunningham 6-3, 260, 4.86
    Tully Banta-Cain 6-2, 250
    Dane Fletcher 6-2, 244, 4.62
    Pierre Woods 6-5, 250

    With the exception of Cunningham and Woods (who isn't the answer), these guys are all shorter than we normally have at OLB.  I was only able to find 40 times for Cunningham and Fletcher.  Cunningham is slow.  Ideally our OLBs should be 6-4+ and 250-269 and run in the 4.65-4.80 range.

    So, who sorta fits that criteria?

    KJ Wright, Miss State, 6-3, 250, 4.60
    Akeem Ayers, UCLA, 6-4, 255, 4.68
    Justin Houston, Georgia, 6-3, 258, 4.73
    Ryan Kerrigan, Purdue, 6-4, 263, 4.82
    Jabaal Sheard, Pitt, 6-3, 260, 4.76
    Sam Acho, Texas, 6-3, 260, 4.72
    Pierre Allen, Nebraska, 6-4, 265, 4.78
    Cliff Matthews, S. Car, 6-4, 268, 4.77

    That's about it for top 100 or so ranked players.  All of these guys are DEs except for Wright and Ayers.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    Good research and list.  Hopefully we grab one of them.  Part of my logic also stems from watching Pitt.  They always seem to have great OLBs.  Why?  They draft the next generation before they need them.  They sit a bit, learn, learn the Pitt way and system etc.  So when a guy wants too much, is getting older, or whatever reason they feel is correct, they have a replacement waiting in the locker room.  I would have to spend time thinking of when Pitt didnt have very good to great Olbs.  They have done it correctly for so long. 
     
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    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***:
    Everyone seems to agree that we need to upgrade our OLB corps.  I don't disagree.  However, this is Cunningham's first year and Ninkovich's first year as a starter.  Both should improve.  Here's a look at how our current OLBs stack up.  Rob Ninkovich 6-2, 255 Jermaine Cunningham 6-3, 260, 4.86 Tully Banta-Cain 6-2, 250 Dane Fletcher 6-2, 244, 4.62 Pierre Woods 6-5, 250 With the exception of Cunningham and Woods (who isn't the answer), these guys are all shorter than we normally have at OLB.  I was only able to find 40 times for Cunningham and Fletcher.  Cunningham is slow.  Ideally our OLBs should be 6-4+ and 250-269 and run in the 4.65-4.80 range. So, who sorta fits that criteria? KJ Wright, Miss State, 6-3, 250, 4.60 Akeem Ayers, UCLA, 6-4, 255, 4.68 Justin Houston, Georgia, 6-3, 258, 4.73 Ryan Kerrigan, Purdue, 6-4, 263, 4.82 Jabaal Sheard, Pitt, 6-3, 260, 4.76 Sam Acho, Texas, 6-3, 260, 4.72 Pierre Allen, Nebraska, 6-4, 265, 4.78 Cliff Matthews, S. Car, 6-4, 268, 4.77 That's about it for top 100 or so ranked players.  All of these guys are DEs except for Wright and Ayers.
    Posted by Faucetman


    Jeremy Beal from Oklahoma is another one to add to your list.  I'm starting to jump on the Justin Houston bandwagon.  He does play OLB in Georgia's 3-4.  He has 10 sacks and an INT.  Since he already plays standing up it would seem he has a leg up on most coming out of college.  He might be had with our own first round pick.  Kerrigan is another I like.  He is very good against the run and we all know what he does rushing the passer and tackles for loss.  My only concern is if he is athletic enough in coverage.  Otherwise he reminds me a little of Clay Matthews.  I think it's down to those two.
     
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    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***:
    Oakland is going to be pick #9 is my best guess.  They will finish at 6-10.  SEA and STL finish ahead of them at 7-9.  Also at 6-10 will be HOU, MIN, WAS, ARI and TEN.  Oakland would lose the tie breaker to all those teams and be seeded lowest of the 6-10 teams.  I predict that none of the 3-8 or worse teams can catch OAK.  I have SF losing to ARI tomorrow. The MIN pick and our #9 gets us to #6 if we need to make the move.
    Posted by Faucetman


    Raider Implosion Underway?  Faucet, the Bolts will crush the Raiders this Sunday and the Pats pick from Al Davis is looking good!!

    Enjoy this!

    How did the optimism fade so quickly in Oakland?
    Three weeks ago, the Raiders had pulled into a first-place tie with the Chiefs by clinching their first three-game win streak in eight years. Today, the Raiders are mired in a two-game losing streak (in which they have been outscored 68-20) that has left them in a familiar place: under .500 at 5-6. The welcomed optimism that surrounded the franchise has vanished, and the Raiders are again fighting to make their season mean something. "One little thing turns into another little thing turns into another little thing, and before you know it, it's a big, big thing," Raiders LB Quentin Groves told the San Francisco Chronicle. On Sunday, coach Tom Cable started Bruce Gradkowski at QB instead of Jason Campbell -- perhaps to the irritation of team owner Al Davis -- and Gradkowski suffered another shoulder injury during the game. But the ability of the Raiders -- who now face a two-game trip to San Diego and Jacksonville -- to rally is in doubt, with some players questioning their commitment. DL Richard Seymour said the team was "going through the motions." And S Mike Mitchell offered an ominous read on a team that's still just two games out of first place. "It's a simple question: Is everyone on our team going to decide that we're done (messing) around, and are we going to play?" Mitchell said, via the www.mercurynews.com/raiders/ci_16731256?nclick_check=1" target="_blank">San Jose Mercury News. "That's what this game was. It wasn't coaching. It wasn't scheme. It wasn't anything. It was us. If you're not 100% committed, you can't play."

     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***:
    Faucet, I forgot to mention another reason for being less into drafting a WR. I like the potential FAs that will be there and that falls in line with BBs history.  Sydney Rice would look great in a Pats Uni IMHO.  I know Minn will work hard to keep him, but if I recall correctly their cap # was around 150 mil this year with Favre, so even after he is gone, they will be way over and need to lose some quality guys to get under the new cap when it is in place. 
    Posted by MordecaiBloodmoon


    SD will be in a similar cash crunch and they have a ton of F/A to sign.  Malcolm Floyd would be on my short list of F/A WRs.  But, I'd rather use some money to sign Mankins and draft a Hankerson perhaps at 33.  Would that be more agreeable?
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***:
    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1*** : Jeremy Beal from Oklahoma is another one to add to your list.  I'm starting to jump on the Justin Houston bandwagon.  He does play OLB in Georgia's 3-4.  He has 10 sacks and an INT.  Since he already plays standing up it would seem he has a leg up on most coming out of college.  He might be had with our own first round pick.  Kerrigan is another I like.  He is very good against the run and we all know what he does rushing the passer and tackles for loss.  My only concern is if he is athletic enough in coverage.  Otherwise he reminds me a little of Clay Matthews.  I think it's down to those two.
    Posted by PatsNut5480

    Thanks, we should add Beal.  Probably should add Bowers and Quinn too.  That gives us some real choices in various spots in the draft.  Have you seen KJ Wright play?  I've seen him twice now.  He is everywhere on the football field making plays.  He's in the backfield, he's out on the flat covering WRs.  He's 6-3, 250, 4.60.  He reminds me of a healthy Rosevelt Colvin, besides them being identical in size.  Right now he's slotted in the mid third round range, right where we have the Vikings pick.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***:
    Good research and list.  Hopefully we grab one of them.  Part of my logic also stems from watching Pitt.  They always seem to have great OLBs.  Why?  They draft the next generation before they need them.  They sit a bit, learn, learn the Pitt way and system etc.  So when a guy wants too much, is getting older, or whatever reason they feel is correct, they have a replacement waiting in the locker room.  I would have to spend time thinking of when Pitt didnt have very good to great Olbs.  They have done it correctly for so long. 
    Posted by MordecaiBloodmoon

    For whatever reason Pittsburgh seems to prefer shorter, thicker OLBs.  Look who they have on their roster now.

    LaMarr Woodley 6-2, 265
    James Harrison 6-0, 242
    Jason Worilds 6-1, 262

    If we look at our good OLBs from years past...

    Rosevelt Colvin 6-3, 250
    Willie McGinest 6-5, 270
    Mike Vrabel 6-4, 261

    I don't know if the Pats like to line their rush OLB up as DE in passing downs where Pittsburgh stands theirs up disguising what they are doing and brings them more on blitzes.  But, you're right, they always have solid OLBs.  It is an area I hope we can address.  As I said in my last post, I really like KJ Wright from Mississippi State.  He's a very solid player and he is much faster than any of our OLBs.  He already plays the position at a high level and he has 6 sacks so he can get after the passer.  We could land him at 73 rather than spending a top pick on a DE conversion type.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    I've been studying centers and I think I found a great gem at a value spot.  Jake Kirkpatrick of TCU.  He should be available for our 6th round comp pick.  He's 6-3, 306 and runs a fast 5.14 for a center.  Basically he's as fast as Spikes.  Kirkpatrick is a hair bigger than the 6-2, 295 Dan Koppen who I believe we drafted in the 5th round.  Below is a story about him.

    Nov. 10, 2010

    FORT WORTH, Texas -- The Rotary Club of Houston has announced TCU center Jake Kirkpatrick as one of four finalists for the 2010 Rotary Lombardi Award, presented annually to the nation's top college football lineman.

    The award honors the memory of Vince Lombardi, legendary coach of the Green Bay Packers.

    Kirkpatrick is the lone offensive lineman among the Rotary Lombardi Award finalists. The other finalists are Clemson defensive end Da'Quan Bowers, Iowa defensive end Adrian Clayborn and Auburn defensive lineman Nick Fairley.

    This is the second straight year that TCU has had a Rotary Lombardi Award finalist. Two-time consensus All-America defensive end Jerry Hughes was a finalist last year, when the award was presented to Nebraska's Ndamukong Suh.

    Kirkpatrick sets the blocking scheme on each play for the third-ranked Horned Frogs. He was a first-team All-American last season and one of six finalists for the 2009 Rimington Trophy, presented to the nation's top center.

    A 6-foot-3, 305-pound senior from Tyler, Texas, Kirkpatrick is the anchor of a TCU offensive line that paves the way for the Horned Frogs to rank eighth nationally in scoring offense (41.4 points per game) and total offense (492.9 yards per game) and 10th in rushing (261.5 yards per game).

    Kirkpatrick never played football until his senior year at Robert E. Lee High School. He was previously a first-team all-state selection in basketball. He also lettered in baseball and tennis in high school.

    The 2010 Rotary Lombardi Award winner will be announced Dec. 8 in Houston.

     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED WITH MOCK V1***

    Slight change to my mock.

    #9       DE JJ Watt - Wisconsin
    #30     OT DeMarcus Love - Arkansas
    #33     WR Leonard Hankerson - Miami (FL)
    #62     RB Bilal Powell - Louisville
    #73     OLB KJ Wright - Mississippi State
    #96     FB Owen Marecic - Stanford
    #127   OG Justin Boren - Ohio State
    6th      C Jake Kirkpatrick - TCU

    I would be absolutely thrilled with this draft.  As everyone knows, I think JJ Watt is a superstar in waiting.  He will immediately replace Deaderick on the right side with Ty Warren returning.  I've seen DeMarcus Love play a few times now and I think he could be better than Carimi.  He's not as tall so perhaps we move him to the right side and Vollmer to LT. 

     I waited until the second round to get my skill players.   I've also seen Hankerson play several times now.  He's clearly the best Senior WR in the draft. (In fact, all of my picks are seniors except Watt who is a 4 year junior).  Hankerson can catch and block and at 6-3, 208 he can get down the field and win against most corners.  Mb sold me on Powell.  I think he is a complete back who is bigger and faster than BJGE.  Powell can hit the home run both running and receiving.

    I've written a lot about KJ Wright lately.  I think he is a very solid player.  He plays OLB at a high level in the SEC and excels against elite competition.  Wright is in on or around every play.  He can rush the passer, he can drop into coverage and he's a captain. 

    Marecic is a BB type player.  He will block, run, catch and even play a little LB if you need him too.  Being from Stanford you know he has the smarts.  Justin Boren is a solid Guard.  He's 4th on my list behind Henry, Moffitt and Schilling. 

    I just posted a piece on Kirkpatrick.  How this guy isn't rated higher is a mystery to me.  Give him one year to learn and he'll be ready to take Koppen's job in 2012.
     
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