2011 Patriots Draft Options ***THANKS TO ALL WHO CONTRIBUTED!***

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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    The question of a LB in pass coverage....How much does a LB drift into coverage??
    and is that part of his games as important as getting to the QB or at least supplying pressure...IE Kerrigan or Quinn....

    The old school thinking was before the NFL became as passng league
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

     Faucetman

    Like Army's point if we are all not sure who to take ...........why not move up and get someone who will make a MASSIVE difference.

    National Football Post has an idea to trade with Arizona and get their 5th and 69th for our 28th, 33rd and 74th.

    Guess who?   PATRICK  PETERSON. Just think what he brings to the table knowing our secondary by figures and facts is still our weakest area. NFP gives really impressive arguments.

    You are still deliberating over DE, OL, OLB etc, etc. Draft is next week.

    WE will never have a better chance to get a player to make that much of a difference. Again if and when free agency comes back think of all the players that may be available.

    We CANNOT guess with our top picks and having read every discussion on this post I feel we need to give this serious thought.

    What about you?
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
     Faucetman Like Army's point if we are all not sure who to take ...........why not move up and get someone who will make a MASSIVE difference. National Football Post has an idea to trade with Arizona and get their 5th and 69th for our 28th, 33rd and 74th. Guess who?   PATRICK  PETERSON. Just think what he brings to the table knowing our secondary by figures and facts is still our weakest area. NFP gives really impressive arguments. You are still deliberating over DE, OL, OLB etc, etc. Draft is next week. WE will never have a better chance to get a player to make that much of a difference. Again if and when free agency comes back think of all the players that may be available. We CANNOT guess with our top picks and having read every discussion on this post I feel we need to give this serious thought. What about you?
    Posted by sydpat

    "WE will never have a better chance to get a player to make that much of a difference."

    agreed

    thats why i would like to get quinn ideally or smith

     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
    Alright, I need to start posting here again and help add to the discussion a bit. The Draft is the favorite time of the year and I don't even add comments to a Patriots draft thread haha. All I do is read. But I have been doing work on the side. I have my top 32 players overall, my positional rankings, top 75 patriots targets and new full 2 round mock (with all patriots picks). Here they are, I will try and make this look as neat and easy to read as possible. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Top 32 Players Overall 1.        AJ Green, WR, Georgia 2.        Patrick Peterson, CB, LSU 3.        Marcell Dareus, DT, Alabama 4.        Von Miller, OLB, Texas A&M 5.        Robert Quinn, DE, North Carolina 6.        Prince Amukamara, CB, Nebraska 7.        JJ Watt, DE, Wisconsin 8.        Cameron Jordan, DE, California 9.        Julio Jones, WR, Alabama 10.    Mark Ingram, RB, Alabama 11.    Tyron Smith, OT, USC 12.    Mike Pouncey, OG, Florida 13.    Aldon Smith, DE, Missouri 14.    Ryan Kerrigan, DE, Purdue 15.    Nick Fairley, DT, Auburn 16.    Anthony Castonzo, OT, Boston College 17.    Gabe Carimi, OT, Wisconsin 18.    Kyle Rudolph, TE, Notre Dame 19.    Corey Liuget, DT, Illinois 20.    Cam Heyward, DE, Ohio State 21.    Danny Watkins, OG, Baylor 22.    Brandon Harris, CB, Miami (FL) 23.    Martez Wilson, ILB, Illinois 24.    Blaine Gabbert, QB, Missouri 25.    Randall Cobb, WR, Kentucky 26.    Bruce Carter, OLB, North Carolina 27.    Brooks Reed, OLB, Arizona 28.    Andy Dalton, QB, TCU 29.    Rahim Moore, S, UCLA 30.    Aaron Williams, S, Texas 31.    Ryan Williams, RB, Virginia Tech 32.    Mikel LeShoure, RB, Illinois --------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Postional Rankings QB 1.        Blaine Gabbert, Missouri 2.        Andy Dalton, TCU 3.        Greg McElroy, Alabama 4.        Christian Ponder, Florida State 5.        Cameron Newton, Auburn     RB            1.        Mark Ingram, Alabama 2.        Ryan Williams, Virginia Tech 3.        Mikel LeShoure, Illinois 4.        Kendall Hunter, Oklahoma State 5.        Jordan Todman, Connecticut WR 1.        AJ Green, Georgia 2.        Julio Jones, Alabama 3.        Randall Cobb, Kentucky 4.        Leonard Hankerson, Miami (FL) 5.        Jerel Jernigan, Troy TE 1.        Kyle Rudolph, Notre Dame 2.        Lance Kendricks, Wisconsin 3.        DJ Williams, Arkansas 4.        Jordan Cameron, USC 5.        Luke Stocker, Tennessee OT 1.        Tyron Smith, Southern California 2.        Anthony Castonzo, Boston College 3.        Gabe Carimi, Wisconsin 4.        Ben Ijalana, Villanova 5.        Derek Sherrod, Mississippi State   Interior-OL 1.        Mike Pouncey, Florida 2.        Danny Watkins, Baylor 3.        Stefen Wisniewski, Penn State 4.        Rodney Hudson, Florida State 5.        John Moffitt, Wisconsin 4-3 DE 1.        Robert Quinn, North Carolina 2.        Cameron Jordan, California 3.        Aldon Smith, Missouri 4.        Ryan Kerrigan, Purdue 5.        Da’Quan Bowers, Clemson 3-4 DE 1.        Marcell Dareus, Alabama 2.        JJ Watt, Wisconsin 3.        Cameron Jordan, California 4.        Cameron Heyward, Ohio State 5.        Muhammed Wilkerson, Temple DT 1.        Marcell Dareus, Alabama 2.        Nick Fairley, Auburn 3.        Corey Liuget, Illinois 4.        Marvin Austin, North Carolina 5.        Phil Taylor, Baylor 4-3 OLB 1.        Bruce Carter, North Carolina 2.        Akeem Ayers, UCLA 3.        Mason Foster, Washington 4.        Lawrence Wilson, Connecticut 5.        Dontay Moch, Nevada 3-4 OLB 1.        Von Miller, Texas A&M 2.        Robert Quinn, North Carolina 3.        Aldon Smith, Missouri 4.        Ryan Kerrigan, Purdue 5.        Brooks Reed, Arizona ILB 1.        Martez Wilson, Illinois 2.        Mark Herzlich, Boston College 3.        Greg Jones, Michigan State 4.        Casey Matthews, Oregon 5.        Quan Sturdivant, North Carolina   CB 1.        Patrick Peterson, LSU 2.        Prince Amukamara, Nebraska 3.        Brandon Harris, Miami (FL) 4.        Jimmy Smith, Colorado 5.        Johnny Patrick, Louisville   S 1.        Rahim Moore, UCLA 2.        Aaron Williams, Texas 3.        Ahmad Black, Florida 4.        Shiloh Keo, Idado 5.        Richard Sherman, Stanford ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Top 75 Patriots Targets QB Andy Dalton QB Greg McElroy QB Ricky Stanzi   RB Mark Ingram RB Ryan Williams RB Mikel LeShoure RB Kendall Hunter RB Jordan Todman RB Taiwan Jones   WR AJ Green WR Julio Jones WR Randall Cobb WR Jerrel Jernigan WR Edmond Gates WR Greg Little WR Austin Pettis WR Jeremy Kerley WR Dane Sanzenbacher   TE Kyle Rudolph   OT Anthony Castonzo OT Tyron Smith OT Gabe Carimi OT Ben Ijalana OT Marcus Gilbert   OG Mike Pouncey OG Danny Watkins OG Rodney Hudson OG Clint Boling OG James Carpenter OG John Moffitt OG Andrew Jackson   OC Stefen Wisniewski OC Tim Barnes OC Jake Kirkpatrick     DE/LB Robert Quinn DE/LB Aldon Smith DE Cameron Jordan DE JJ Watt DE/LB Ryan Kerrigan DE Cameron Heyward DE/LB Brooks Reed DE/LB Allen Bailey   DT Marcell Dareus DT Corey Liuget DT Muhammed Wilkerson DT Christian Ballard DT Phil Taylor DT Marvin Austin DT Terrell McClain   OLB Von Miller OLB Akeem Ayers OLB Bruce Carter OLB Mark Herzlich OLB Chris Carter ILB Martez Wilson   CB Patrick Peterson CB Prince Amukamara CB Brandon Harris CB Johnny Patrick CB Curtis Brown CB Buster Skrine CB Ryan Jones CB Justin Rogers S Aaron Williams S Rahim Moore S Ahmad Black CB/S Richard Sherman S Joe Lefeged S Shiloh Keo ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3 Trades: Atlanta Trades #27 --- Buffalo Trades #34, #68 New England Trades #28 --- San Diego Trades #50, #61 New England Trades #33 --- Jacksonville Trades #49, #80 Round 1 1.        Carolina Panthers – Cameron Newton, QB, Auburn 2.        Denver Broncos – Marcell Dareus, DT, Alabama 3.        Buffalo Bills – Von Miller, LB, Texas A&M 4.        Cincinnati Bengals –   Julio Jones, WR, Alabama 5.        Arizona Cardinals – Blaine Gabbert, QB, Missouri 6.        Cleveland Browns – AJ Green, WR, Georgia 7.        San Francisco 49ers – Patrick Peterson, CB, LSU 8.        Tennessee Titans – Nick Fairley, DT, Auburn 9.        Dallas Cowboys – Tyron Smith, OT, USC 10.    Washington Redskins – Robert Quinn, LB, North Carolina 11.    Houston Texans – Ryan Kerrigan, LB, Purdue 12.    Minnesota Vikings – Da’Quan Bowers, DE, Clemson 13.    Detroit Lions – Prince Amukamara, CB, Nebraska 14.    St. Louis Rams – Aldon Smith, DE, Missouri 15.    Miami Dolphins – Ryan Mallett, QB, Arkansas 16.    Jacksonville Jaguars – JJ Watt, DE, Wisconsin 17.    New England Patriots – Cameron Jordan, DE, California 18.    San Diego Chargers – Akeem Ayers, LB, UCLA 19.    New York Giants – Mike Pouncey, OG, Florida 20.    Tampa Bay Buccaneers – Adrian Clayborn, DE, Iowa 21.    Kansas City Chiefs – Gabe Carimi, OT, Wisconsin 22.    Indianapolis Colts – Anthony Castonzo, OT, Boston College 23.    Philadelphia Eagles – Nate Solder, OT, Colorado 24.    New Orleans Saints – Muhammed Wilkerson, DE, Temple 25.    Seattle Seahawks – Jake Locker, QB, Washington 26.    Baltimore Ravens – Jimmy Smith, CB, Colorado 27.    Buffalo Bills (f/ATL)   – Christian Ponder, QB, Florida State 28.    San Diego Chargers (f/NE)   –   Cameron Heyward, DE, Ohio State 29.    Chicago Bears – Danny Watkins, OG, Baylor 30.    New York Jets – Phil Taylor, NT, Baylor 31.    Pittsburgh Steelers – Aaron Williams, CB/S, Texas Round 2 1.     Jacksonville Jaguars (f/NE) – Andy Dalton, QB, TCU 2.     Atlanta Falcons (f/BUF) – Kyle Rudolph, TE, Notre Dame 3.     Cincinnati Bengals – Marvin Austin, DT, North Carolina 4.     Denver Broncos – Colin Kaepernick, QB, Nevada 5.     Cleveland Browns – Corey Liuget, DT, Illinois 6.     Arizona Cardinals – Brandon Harris, CB, Miami (FL) 7.     Tennessee Titans – Martez Wilson, LB, Illinois 8.     Dallas Cowboys – Rahim Moore, S, UCLA 9.     Washington Redskins – Mark Ingram, RB, Alabama 10.   Houston Texans – Ras-I Dowling, CB/S, Virginia Tech 11.   Minnesota Vikings – Ben Ijalana, OT, Villanova 12.   Detroit Lions – Derek Sherrod, OT, Mississippi State 13.   San Francisco 49ers – Justin Houston, DE/LB, Georgia 14.   Denver Broncos – Christian Ballard, DT, Iowa 15.   St. Louis Rams – Jonathan Baldwin, WR, Pittsburgh 16.   Oakland Raiders – Stefen Wisniewski, OG, Penn State 17.   New England Patriots (f/JAC) – Randall Cobb, WR, Kentucky 18.   New England Patriots (f/SD) – Bruce Carter, LB, North Carolina 19.   Tampa Bay Buccaneers – Ryan Williams, RB, Virginia Tech 20.   New York Giants – Mikel LeShoure, RB, Illinois 21.   Indianapolis Colts – Stephen Paea, DT, Oregon State 22.   Philadelphia Eagles – Curtis Brown, CB, Texas 23.   Kansas City Chiefs – Kenrick Ellis, NT, Hampton 24.   New Orleans Saints – Mason Foster, LB, Washington 25.   Seattle Seahawks – Orlando Franklin, OT, Miami (FL) 26.   Baltimore Ravens – Leonard Hankerson, WR, Miami (FL) 27.   Atlanta Falcons – Jabaal Sheard, DE, Pittsburgh 28.   New England Patriots – Rodney Hudson, OG/C, Florida State 29.   New England Patriots (f/SD) – Clint Boling, OG, Georgia 30.   Chicago Bears – Jarvis Jenkins, DT, Clemson 31.    Pittsburgh Steelers – Marcus Cannon, OG, TCU 32.    Green Bay Packers – Brandon Burton, CB, Utah Patriots Picks: #17 -- DE Cameon Jordan, California #49 -- WR Randall Cobb, Kentucky #50 -- OLB Bruce Carter, North Carolina #60 -- OG/C Rodney Hudson, Florida State #61 -- OG Clint Boling, Georgia #74 -- TRADED FOR 2012 2nd, 2011 5th Round Pick #80 -- TRADED FOR 2012 2nd #92 -- RB Jordan Todman, Connecticut 4th -- OLB Greg Romeus, Pittsburgh 5th -- CB Buster Skrine, Tennessee-Chattanoga 5th -- S Ahmad Black, Florida 6th -- QB Greg McElroy, Alabama This draft would be a perfect draft for the Patriots and one that seems extremely realsitic with the Patriots with their tendencies, and such. Includes 4 Trades for them, 2 of them trades down, and 2 of them into next year. Player wise I think they get great value. I think Jordan can add to the defense a ton at 17. He can play 5 tech and maybe even stand up in a 2 point stance at some point, in nickel he can kick inside and provide nickel pass rush. Cobb, I think just has Patriot written all over him with ability to help in multiple areas and also be a great slot WR and maybe even play outside the numbers. Bruce Carter has special ability when he plays, and would've been a top 15 talent if not for the injury. Ring any bells with a Brandon Tate type pick? Same school, same injury, stock drop cause of injury. Tate has been solid value for a 4th round pick, and I think that Carter can be real special off the edge for the Pats, he may take a while to get fully healthy, but when he does, he will be good. Then we go with 2 interior lineman. I am thinking that Light will be back on a 2-3 year deal and the fact no good enough OT were available where we picked, trading down was a better option. So we get 2 interior offensive lineman, and the eventual replacment to Koppen at C, for 10 years. Boling will be a RG, and a starter for a good deal of time, providing good 2nd round value. Whoever plays better in camp, will get the job for the year, and next year both will plug in at C and G. Then we trade 2 3rds for 2 2nd round picks next year, and a 5th this year. Giving us 4 picks in the 1st 2 rounds again next year. then we go to Jordan Todman at RB. He will be a nice compliment to our current RB's, who can go inside and outside the tackles, carry a load and also catch the ball out of the backfield. Then we go another injured DE/OLB conversion guy with Greg Romeus, who without injury also would've been a 1st round pick. He has good pass rushing ability, the size BB likes at OLB, and the ability to move in space a little bit. It would be strange picking 2 OLB that are both hurt but if we connect with both or even just 1, we should have a special bookend to team up with Cunningham, and a servicable backup. Then we go 2 secondary players, one who can help out on special teams at CB, and has elite quickness and speed and COD skills. I think he can eventually develop into a stud ST player along with a nice nickel CB at worst. Black continues to drop, but I continue to love the way he plays. He wouldn't need to play every down for us, and can get down on the slot and keep up with his quickness and COD skills, along with making a tackle on a RB, or blitzing. Last, we go with McElroy who is a personal favorite of mine, and would be the one guy I bet on the Patriots drafting in this whole draft. He just has Patriots written all over him.
    Posted by sportslover21



    neat and easy to read (and understand), that is an understatement!
    thanks.

    if the draft went like that 1-9 that would be my ideal so we can trade to 10 and get quinn.

    re your draft, i am not as knowledgeable with all the players later in the draft as many of you are. i have not seen nearly as much college football nor do i have the time to do the viewing and analysis many of you do (so i couldnt come up with a complete draft like this and it will take me some time to analyze). 
    2 injured olb's. if they are out a year, i would nix that; unless it came along with the player we need most in thsi draft a pss rushing olb all star or all pro. fa is a gamble and shouldnt be relied upon. we also rarely spend big money on an elite, or very good player in fa. 

    jordan is who i have my sites set on at de at the moment.
    but for me the draft begins and ends for us in taking the best player at our strongest position of need, pass rushing olb.

    then de, o line and on to the rest with whatever picks we have left.
    i would trade into this year instead of out of it (maybe one pick if there is a specific plan for use, but better to give them the experience this year so by the playoffs we've got 3 shots the next 3 years. tom brady does not come around every day, never mind us being able to have him on our team.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
    Great discussion guys.  Clearly, when you are 32nd in the league getting off the field on 3rd down you need to get more pressure on the QB and cover better.  We also need to give oppossing offenses more negative plays which will set up longer and harder 3rd downs to convert.  Can we all agree on that?  Now clearly Warren and Bodden coming back will make a difference.  How much of a difference, I don't know.  brdbreu, I like Bunting's projections; Jordan, Watkins, Ayers.  I'm not completely sold on Ayers nor do I think he makes it to 32.  I could see BAL taking him at 26.  I like Reed better if he makes it past GB.  Before I saw your post I was thinking about the notion that we need to get a stud on the DL at 17, then get some OL types in the 2nd round.  I don't see any CB that would be there from 17-33, so that's out.  The only DE conversion type I think we should even consider at 17 is Ryan Kerrigan.  All the others have either character or medical issues or both.  But I strongly believe that unless SD trades ahead of us, either Watt or Jordan will be there at 17. So my plan would be this, in order of who's available. #17 a)  DE JJ Watt 6-5.3, 290, 4.84.  The perfect 5 technique.  Big, long and strong at the point of attack.  Fast for his size, Watt will get you 5-6 sacks and 6-8 batted balls plus create some negative plays and forced fumbles in the backfield.  But BB hates his agent and he's the least likely to make it here. b)  DE Cam Jordan , 6-4.1, 287, 4.78.  Has played the 5 technique.  Needs to add a few lbs but his pass rush ability is better than Watts.  He won't bat as many balls but he will get after the QB better. c)  OT Gabe Carimi , 6.7.0, 314, 5.18.  Solves our biggest question mark heading into the draft, the potential loss of Matt Light.  This pick allows us to let Light go saving $6-7MM.  This pick potentially also allows us to cut Kaczur too saving another $3.5MM.  The $10MM in savings could be used to extend Mankins and go after a prize free agent.  I think Carimi is a natural RT and a mauler but can play, obviously, on the left side so he gives great value. d)  OG Mike Pouncey , 6.4.2, 303, 5.12.  His brother was selected 18th overall and made the Pro Bowl as a C his rookie year.  Twin Mike projects better to RG and byall accounts is very similar in size and talent.  Any player you can get at 17 that makes the Pro Bowl as a rookie is a sound pick.  If Mankins holds out, Pouncey takes over at RG and Connolly at LG.  If Mankins plays the whole season, Pouncey beats out Connolly at RG then perhaps takes over at Center in 2012. e)  Trade back f)  OLB Ryan Kerrigan 6-3.7, 267, 4.67.  Potentially solves our biggest defensive need, rush OLB.  Could be a liability in the passing game but he will upgrade Ninkovich on the strong side and provide a steady pass rush.  Teams will have to account for him. Depending who we get at 17 and who's on the board at 28 will dictate if we trade this pick back.  Option #1 for Pick 28  (If we get Jordan or Watt at 17): a)  Any of the remaining OTs, Castonzo, Solder, Sherrod .  The same argument as for Carimi, frees up money to sign Mankins and add a marquis free agent. b)  OG Danny Watkins - This assumes all OTs are gone.  Watkins does not get past PIT at 31 so no room to move down.  He's a plug and play LG who can step in for Mankins or Connolly and give you emergency help at OT. c)  trade back - the deal like SD for 50/61 is very appealing because we can address OL with 2 picks here like Wisniewski/Franklin. d)  OLB Brooks Reed - see Kerrigan above. Option #2 for Pick 28  (If we don't get Jordan or Watt at 17): a)  DE Cameron Heyward 6-5.0, 294, 4.95.  Great character guy, perfect 5 technique size.  I don't like Wilkerson and Taylor is a NT b)  trade back - the deal like SD for 50/61 is very appealing because we can address OL with 2 picks here like Wisniewski/Franklin. c)  OLB Brooks Reed - see Kerrigan above. Option #3 for Pick 28  (If we get Kerrigan at 17). a)  DE Cameron Heyward 6-5.0, 294, 4.95.  Great character guy, perfect 5 technique size.  I don't like Wilkerson and Taylor is a NT. b)  Any of the remaining OTs . c)  OG Danny Watkins - This assumes all OTs are gone.  Watkins does not get past PIT at 31 so no room to move down.  He's a plug and play LG who can step in for Mankins or Connolly and give you emergency help at OT. d)  trade back - the deal like SD for 50/61 is very appealing because we can address OL with 2 picks here like Wisniewski/Franklin. e)  OLB Brooks Reed - see Kerrigan above. I bet the Pats have played out various scenarios like this and they seldom fail to execute their plan.
    Posted by Faucetman

    "Clearly, when you are 32nd in the league getting off the field on 3rd down you need to get more pressure on the QB and cover better.  We also need to give oppossing offenses more negative plays which will set up longer and harder 3rd downs to convert.  Can we all agree on that?  "

    yes! i am in agrreement with you on more pressure, covering better, negative plays, and stopping offenses instead of seeing if they can get enough first downs to get in the end zone.

     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    i dont mean to sound like a broken record but the pats are going to end up trading their 28th and 33rd pick in this years draft for first rounders next year( think people rookie wage scale). 
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
    [QUOTE]i dont mean to sound like a broken record but the pats are going to end up trading their 28th and 33rd pick in this years draft for first rounders next year( think people rookie wage scale). 
    Posted by isurfvb35[/ QUOTE]then I must be the broken CD...anyone who wants #28 or #33 is not positioning themselves for an OG....they want to draft their "franchise" quarterback...so do the Pats trade down seven picks from #28 or #33 for a 2011 3rd round pick?...does anyone else?...I don't think those picks are traded down...they are "sold" for 2012 1st rounders...and then negotiate from there.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
    i dont mean to sound like a broken record but the pats are going to end up trading their 28th and 33rd pick in this years draft for first rounders next year( think people rookie wage scale). 
    Posted by isurfvb35


    no player will be signed from this years draft till a rookie cap iscale is done. they are already agreed to this (players and ownership).

    rookie cap is not an excuse to wait till next year.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    SPORTSLOVER : JUST WANTED TO SAY AWESOME JOB .
     I may not completely agree with everything you wrote , but it was an entertaining and well thought out piece.
     ( For those that missed it - One page back on 273 )

    Keep up the good work.


     Note : In your Mock ~You dont have GB picking anybody at #32 &
       Brandon Tate was actually a 2009 3rd Rndr (and the jurys still out on him )

     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    I've read a couple of times on here that we should trade pick 60 to a bad team for their 1st round pick next year.  Now I'm not saying it can't happen, but I kind of doubt it.  60 is a low 2nd rounder.  More importantly, if most of us on this board can name which teams are bad, don't you think that most of them realize they're bad too?  Why do we really think that they'll realistically trade a top 10 pick next year for 60 this year?  What player would be there that would really cause some team to make that trade?  Just not seeing it.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
    i dont mean to sound like a broken record but the pats are going to end up trading their 28th and 33rd pick in this years draft for first rounders next year( think people rookie wage scale). 
    Posted by isurfvb35



    What are the chances that there won't be a draft anymore?  Isn't that why they're saying "trade at your own risk with future picks?"  I think it's time we start using what we have.  No more trading for the future!
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    With V. Wilfork experimenting at DE last year, I wonder if BB might do the same this year.  What if we did draft a player like Peae and place him at DE?  How could any line cope with the likes of Peae, Wilfork, and either of the Warrens.  All 3 would command double teams.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
    With V. Wilfork experimenting at DE last year, I wonder if BB might do the same this year.  What if we did draft a player like Peae and place him at DE?  How could any line cope with the likes of Peae, Wilfork, and either of the Warrens.  All 3 would command double teams.
    Posted by Army2LT


    Army, I see that as a line great against the run, but like all of last year, little QB pressure.  Not enough speed.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
    With V. Wilfork experimenting at DE last year, I wonder if BB might do the same this year.  What if we did draft a player like Peae and place him at DE?  How could any line cope with the likes of Peae, Wilfork, and either of the Warrens.  All 3 would command double teams.
    Posted by Army2LT


    The Wilfork experiment to me was one manly of desperation more then anything else. At the beginning part of the season and for actually the entire season or DL was decimated with injury. As such teams were running around both corners and away from Wilfork with ease. BB moved Wilfork to 1 side not to generate a pass rush but in an attempt to funnel the run towards one side of the field. Trust me if they had any consistency when it came to the DL last year Wilfork would have stayed right in the center.

    With Peae I'd be weary of a 6'1" DT who hovers around 300lbs that had a knee issue in 08' and just recently this past senior bowl had a meniscus tear. 2 knee problems in 3 years is a major issue and might speak to his long term health and success. If we don't get a DE early and if he can be had in the right round like say mid 3rd or later I'd give him a shot but just watching film on him he seems best suited for a 1 tech role not a 5 tech position. Sione Fua out of Stanford has a similar playing style and upside without the knee issues.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK*** : Army, I see that as a line great against the run, but like all of last year, little QB pressure.  Not enough speed.
    Posted by MordecaiBloodmoon


    So what do you suggest?  Should we get rid of some of the players or change the scheme?  Which players do we need to bring in?  

    I think the Pats D plays in a read and react type scheme.  The D-Line aren't all about shooting through and getting to the QB.  They are used more often to tie up O-Linemen so that the LBs can roam free.  So why not draft a guy like Paea to take on double teams and give Wilfork and the 2 Warren's a break.  Imagine seeing all 4 of them on the field at once.  That would be something.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from natesubs. Show natesubs's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
    I've read a couple of times on here that we should trade pick 60 to a bad team for their 1st round pick next year.  Now I'm not saying it can't happen, but I kind of doubt it.  60 is a low 2nd rounder.  More importantly, if most of us on this board can name which teams are bad, don't you think that most of them realize they're bad too?  Why do we really think that they'll realistically trade a top 10 pick next year for 60 this year?  What player would be there that would really cause some team to make that trade?  Just not seeing it.
    Posted by paularnold


    bad teams don't have coaches with secure futures with the exception of cincy.  if these coaches don't win they are fired so they would be more than willing to trade away future pick which they might not even get to make for anything that improves their odds of keeping their jobs.  if the right player is there at 60 then it could be possible.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from mountainmonkey. Show mountainmonkey's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    Some random thoughts on trading #28 or #33....(1)...This year, there are many quarterback needy teams, and as many as 6 quarterbacks could go in the first 40 picks. There is pressure on those GM's and coaches to energize their fan base with a quarterback pick...everyone knows this....(2)...quarterback needy teams need to think twice about passing up a quarterback in the early first round, because it will be expensive to get that second pick where they need it...that alone will make this draft very interesting...(3)...If the Patriots trade #28 or #33, they should want a 2012 #1, and more, because it weakens them in 2011,  the actual value and draft position of that future #1 is unknown, so improving pick #60 should be important, and the patriots should negotiate switching 2011 #2 picks with their trading partner. I think the Patriots will trade one of those picks,but not without improving that # 60 pick.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    sportslover21,

    You certainly made a splash with your first post on this thread.  Your mock is pretty realistic based on team needs and player value.  Who did GB at 32?  I think you left that out.  Some of your picks may surprise people such as Jones coming off before Green at 4 to CIN.  I actually think that pick makes better sense because CIN runs the West Coast offense and Jones is the better down field blocker.  There are a couple of minor points.  If Amukamara is on the board at 11, there is no way HOU passes on him given their struggles in the secondary last year.  But other than that, your mock is among the best I've seen.  The trades are something that the Pats will look to do so well done. 

    Moving to your picks, and here they are again below, I love the Jordan, Cobb, Hudson, and Todman picks atop your mock.  I'm not sold on Carter as a scheme fit but agree he represents good value at 50.  I'm not a Clint Boling fan.  He got pushed around too much during the Senior Bowl week.  As for Matt Light, I don't know how we can assume we will extend him 2-3 years when a deal didn't get done before the draft.  I have to assume he's gone so taking an OT is a priority to me even if it is a second tier guy like Franklin.  But good stuff.

    Patriots Picks:
    #17 -- DE Cameon Jordan, California
    #49 -- WR Randall Cobb, Kentucky
    #50 -- OLB Bruce Carter, North Carolina
    #60 -- OG/C Rodney Hudson, Florida State
    #61 -- OG Clint Boling, Georgia
    #74 -- TRADED FOR 2012 2nd, 2011 5th Round Pick
    #80 -- TRADED FOR 2012 2nd
    #92 -- RB Jordan Todman, Connecticut
    4th -- OLB Greg Romeus, Pittsburgh
    5th -- CB Buster Skrine, Tennessee-Chattanoga
    5th -- S Ahmad Black, Florida
    6th -- QB Greg McElroy, Alabama
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
    sportslover21, You certainly made a splash with your first post on this thread.  Your mock is pretty realistic based on team needs and player value.  Who did GB at 32?  I think you left that out.  Some of your picks may surprise people such as Jones coming off before Green at 4 to CIN.  I actually think that pick makes better sense because CIN runs the West Coast offense and Jones is the better down field blocker.  There are a couple of minor points.  If Amukamara is on the board at 11, there is no way HOU passes on him given their struggles in the secondary last year.  But other than that, your mock is among the best I've seen.  The trades are something that the Pats will look to do so well done.  Moving to your picks, and here they are again below, I love the Jordan, Cobb, Hudson, and Todman picks atop your mock.  I'm not sold on Carter as a scheme fit but agree he represents good value at 50.  I'm not a Clint Boling fan.  He got pushed around too much during the Senior Bowl week.  As for Matt Light, I don't know how we can assume we will extend him 2-3 years when a deal didn't get done before the draft.  I have to assume he's gone so taking an OT is a priority to me even if it is a second tier guy like Franklin.  But good stuff. Patriots Picks: #17 -- DE Cameon Jordan, California #49 -- WR Randall Cobb, Kentucky #50 -- OLB Bruce Carter, North Carolina #60 -- OG/C Rodney Hudson, Florida State #61 -- OG Clint Boling, Georgia #74 -- TRADED FOR 2012 2nd, 2011 5th Round Pick #80 -- TRADED FOR 2012 2nd #92 -- RB Jordan Todman, Connecticut 4th -- OLB Greg Romeus, Pittsburgh 5th -- CB Buster Skrine, Tennessee-Chattanoga 5th -- S Ahmad Black, Florida 6th -- QB Greg McElroy, Alabama
    Posted by Faucetman


    I would agree. A well thought out mock. Like Faucet, I like the top of the order, but possibly would change it up in the second round at #50 and #61. I like Carter, but I would'nt mind taking possibly either Acho or Sheard here if available.
    And at 61, I think we have quite a few options at guard in addition to Boling. Will Rackley is shooting up boards, and I personally like him at 61 vs. Boling. I think he plays with a Mankins mean streak and I think he earned a 2nd round discussion given what he did at the east/west game against good competition.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from MordecaiBloodmoon. Show MordecaiBloodmoon's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK*** : So what do you suggest?  Should we get rid of some of the players or change the scheme?  Which players do we need to bring in?   I think the Pats D plays in a read and react type scheme.  The D-Line aren't all about shooting through and getting to the QB.  They are used more often to tie up O-Linemen so that the LBs can roam free.  So why not draft a guy like Paea to take on double teams and give Wilfork and the 2 Warren's a break.  Imagine seeing all 4 of them on the field at once.  That would be something.
    Posted by Army2LT

    Obviously BB isnt going to change the scheme.  Maybe if we are lucky we attack more in some situations.  We need what Seymour gave us when we were winning SBs.  A solid run guy and pressure with the occasional sack.  We dont just need an immoveable object because the QB gets too much time then.  We need to make a QB feel pressure even if we dont get the sack so they make mistakes.  We need TFLs.  We need splash plays/turnovers.  Basically a 3 down DL that can turn it up on 3rd down.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from sportslover21. Show sportslover21's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
    SPORTSLOVER : JUST WANTED TO SAY AWESOME JOB .  I may not completely agree with everything you wrote , but it was an entertaining and well thought out piece.  ( For those that missed it - One page back on 273 ) Keep up the good work.  Note : In your Mock ~You dont have GB picking anybody at #32 &    Brandon Tate was actually a 2009 3rd Rndr (and the jurys still out on him )
    Posted by CaptnFoxboro


    Thanks man,

    When copying and pasting, GB's pick have disappeared somehow, but they take Brooks Reed at #32.

    You right Tate was a 3rd round pick, and I agree that jury was still out on him, and I don't think he is a stud by any means, it was just a similar comparison based on school, type of injury and loss of draft stock.

    Thanks for the comments
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from sportslover21. Show sportslover21's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK*** : I would agree. A well thought out mock. Like Faucet, I like the top of the order, but possibly would change it up in the second round at #50 and #61. I like Carter, but I would'nt mind taking possibly either Acho or Sheard here if available. And at 61, I think we have quite a few options at guard in addition to Boling. Will Rackley is shooting up boards, and I personally like him at 61 vs. Boling. I think he plays with a Mankins mean streak and I think he earned a 2nd round discussion given what he did at the east/west game against good competition.
    Posted by PatsLifer


    I just have a feeling about Carter, he can bend and dip and get around the edge, and has all the athleticism in the world, he just had one major injury which was a torn ACL, he is clean off the field from what I hear, and I just see a parallel to Brandon Tate type situation from a few years ago but someone who will turn out to be a better player.

    As for Rackley, he may never be the great G, but I have a feeling in the late 2nd round you can get a guy that maybe won't start at a pro bowl level but will be a starting caliber RG for 6-10 years, which I think is good value.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from sportslover21. Show sportslover21's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***:
    sportslover21, You certainly made a splash with your first post on this thread.  Your mock is pretty realistic based on team needs and player value.  Who did GB at 32?  I think you left that out.  Some of your picks may surprise people such as Jones coming off before Green at 4 to CIN.  I actually think that pick makes better sense because CIN runs the West Coast offense and Jones is the better down field blocker.  There are a couple of minor points.  If Amukamara is on the board at 11, there is no way HOU passes on him given their struggles in the secondary last year.  But other than that, your mock is among the best I've seen.  The trades are something that the Pats will look to do so well done.  Moving to your picks, and here they are again below, I love the Jordan, Cobb, Hudson, and Todman picks atop your mock.  I'm not sold on Carter as a scheme fit but agree he represents good value at 50.  I'm not a Clint Boling fan.  He got pushed around too much during the Senior Bowl week.  As for Matt Light, I don't know how we can assume we will extend him 2-3 years when a deal didn't get done before the draft.  I have to assume he's gone so taking an OT is a priority to me even if it is a second tier guy like Franklin.  But good stuff. Patriots Picks: #17 -- DE Cameon Jordan, California #49 -- WR Randall Cobb, Kentucky #50 -- OLB Bruce Carter, North Carolina #60 -- OG/C Rodney Hudson, Florida State #61 -- OG Clint Boling, Georgia #74 -- TRADED FOR 2012 2nd, 2011 5th Round Pick #80 -- TRADED FOR 2012 2nd #92 -- RB Jordan Todman, Connecticut 4th -- OLB Greg Romeus, Pittsburgh 5th -- CB Buster Skrine, Tennessee-Chattanoga 5th -- S Ahmad Black, Florida 6th -- QB Greg McElroy, Alabama
    Posted by Faucetman


    I made it in for a few surprises, I think Green is the much better football player but my mock is what I think the teams will do, and I think Jones is who CIN would go if they went WR. I agree on HOU, that I can't see them passing Amukamara, but recently, a few trusted draft sources, mainly Wes Bunting and Tony Pauline, that HOU is considering Kerrigan, Quinn and Smith highly at the 11 position in the draft and may take them over Amukamara, cause they deseparetly need a new pass rusher either at OLB or the 5-tech for Wade Phillips coming in. They also are interested in JJ Watt, supposedly. So while I'd take Prince again, I think that is a nice twist as for what could possibly happen.

    I originally had trouble with Carter as a scheme fit also, but I feel that he can hold up when he needs to against the run, can drop in coverage with athleticism and has great ability to rush the passer, which would be his #1 assignment. He may not be the best fit but if we haven't addressed the need until the late 2nd round I'd jump on him. As for Boling, as I said in the previous post, he may never be a pro bowler but he will be steady and be a very solid RG for 6-10 years, and that's good value for a pick at #61 in the draft.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from fishers5. Show fishers5's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    In Id take moffitt over boling....Seems like he is tougher and maybe a lil like mankins
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Pats7393. Show Pats7393's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED 2/19 w/ PRE-COMBINE MOCK***

    Arizona will probably gamble here, hopping there's a rookie scale in place.  If not they will pay for the trade but that team is close and could compete with a QB who can get LF and those weapons the ball.  Ten moves as well.

    I don't know watt makes it to where I have him but can fall if teams move around base on those team needs.

    PickTeamTradePlayerPosit.
    1Arz5, 38 Blaine Gabbert - With rummors of the Skins trying to move up Arz takes no chances and lands their QB.QB
    2Den-Marcell DareusDT
    3Buf-Patrick PetersonCB
    4Ten8, 39Cam Newton - Was does not have enough picks to get to Newton, they'll have to settle for a 2nd rnd QBQB
    5Car1A.J. GreenWR
    6Hou6,73, 105Prince AmukamaraCB
    7SF-Von MillerOLB
    8Cin4, 109Julio JonesWR
    9Dal-Tyron SmithOT
    10Was-Jake LockerQB
    11Cle6Robert QuinnDE/OLB
    12Min-Nick FairleyDT
    13SD18, 61Cam JordanDE
    14StL-Mike PounceyOG/C
    15Phi23, 85, 104Anthony Costanzo with NE, Det, NYG, TB, KC Ind needing OL help they move up to help keep Vick healthyOT
    16Jac-Ryan Kerrigan their DE Aaron Kampman is on his second ACL surgery in as many seasons, Kerrigan takes his placeDE
    17NO24, 72Aldon SmithDE
    18Det13Jimmy SmithCB
    19NYG-Gabe CarimiOT/OG
    20TB-Adrian ClaybornDE
    21KC-Phil TaylorNT
    22Ind-Nate Solder OT
    23Mia15Mark IngramRB
    24NE17J.J. WattDE
    25Sea-Ryan MalletQB
    26Bal-Danny WatkinsOG/OT
    27Atl-Kyle RudolphTE
    28Cin35, 101Christian PonderQB
    29Chi Derek SherrodOT
    30NYJ Jabaal SheardOLB
    31Pit Ben IjalanaOT/OG
    32GB Cameron HeywardDE
         
    33Min43, 106, 139Andy DaltonQB
         
    35NE28Brooks ReedOLB
    43NE33TRADED Jack 49, 114 Jack draft Colin Kaepernick  
    49NE43Traded 2012 SF 2nd rnd & 115 (For WR Hankerson) 
    60NE-James CarpenterOT
    72NE17Edmond GatesWR
    74NE-TRADED 2012 2nd 
    90NE-John MoffittOG/C
    101NE28Rob HouslerTE/WR
    114NE43Alex GreenRB
    115NE49TRADED 2012 3rd (Was),  213 & 224 
    125NE-TRADED 2012 3rd 
    159NE-Zach HurdOT/OG
    193NE-Mark HerzlichLB
    213NE115Justin RogersCB
    224NE115Mark LeGreeFS
     
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