2011 Patriots Draft Options ***THANKS TO ALL WHO CONTRIBUTED!***

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    I'm of the mind that you should expect your 1st and 2nd round picks to become starters or major contributors by their 2nd year.  This is especially true of 1st round picks.  If you look back at all of BBs picks in the top 2 rounds you will see that he drafted a player that he expected to start that year or to groom for one year knowing the player to be replaced was soon retiring or moving on.  Below are the examples I found.  My memory fades the further back I went.

    2001:
    1) Richard Seymour
    2) Matt Light

    2002:
    1) Daniel Graham - Wiggins and Rutlidge left after the 2001 season
    2) Deion Branch

    2003:
    1) Ty Warren - Bobby Hamilton's last year
    2a) Eugene Wilson
    2b) Bethel Johnson

    2004:
    1a) Vince Wilfork - Ted Washington left after the 2003 season
    1b) Ben Watson - Replaced Fred Baxter
    2) Marquis Hill

    2005:
    1) Logan Mankins - Andruzzi and Hochstein left after the 2005 season.

    2006:
    1) Laurence Maroney - Corey Dillion retired after the 2005 season
    2) Chad Jackson - Givens, Patton and Branch all left after the '05 season.  This was the year Reche Caldwell was our best WR

    2007:
    1) Brandon Meriweather - '07 was Rodney Harrison's last season
    this was the year we traded our 2nd for Welker and 4th for Moss

    2008:
    1) Jarod Mayo - Bruschi retires after the '09 season and was a mentor to Mayo.  Seau was coming and going. 
    2) Wheatley - Asante Samuel left after the '07 season.  We also drafted Wilhite hoping one of them would emerge.

    2009:
    2a) Patrick Chung - team was thin at S having only Ventrone, Sanders and Meriweather.  Team was still looking for the next Rodney Harrison
    2b) Ron Brace - Vince Wilfork was threatening a hold out at the time of the draft so Brace was an insurance policy
    2c) Darius Butler - Wheatley wasn't the answer to losing Samuel so Butler was drafted high.  The team also brought in Leigh Bodden this year
    2d) Sebastian Vollmer - Team was thin at OT having just Light and Kaczur, Britt left after the 2008 season.

    2010:
    1) Devin McCourty - having unsuccessfully spent a pair of 2nds and a 4th trying to replace Samuel, the team went with McCourty in the first round.
    2a) Gronkowski - The team wiped out all their TEs from their 2009 roster and started over at the position bringing in Crumpler and drafted Hernandez in the 4the round
    2c) Jermaine Cunningham - Adalius Thomas was shown the door prior to the season and every knew it was coming. 
    2d) Brandon Spikes - Although 1st year player Guyton did okay, but a better run stopper was needed.

    Again my point is I can't find an example where a 1st or 2nd round pick was taken where it was expected they would sit for more than 1 year.  In most cases they see immediate playing time.  Certainly not all these picks were hits, but they were intended to make immediate or near immediate contributions.  This is why I don't think we'll take a CB in the first round with Bodden coming back.  You don't draft nickel players in the first round, you draft players that will start and play 3 downs.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from jader. Show jader's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options: Player Spotlight Week 1

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options: Player Spotlight Week 1:
    I was thinking DL with the first pick but Ty Warren will be coming back and then you have Vince and G. Warren.  A nice starting group.  I wonder if the DL would be the pick?  RB and possibly two would be on my menu. On the OL front we are short on tackle and I wonder if it's time to find a replacement for Koppen.  For OLB Von Miller of Texas A&M and Jeremy Beal of Oklahoma.  The DEs of this class seem to be more of the traditional 4/3 DE.
    Posted by garytx

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from jader. Show jader's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    Ty Warren may not make the team next year or maybe traded. Gerard is more dominant and makes more plays.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    If I'm looking at the team, the biggest need heading into 2011 is an impact player on the DL.  Every game I watch where we rush 3 or even 4 guys, the QB has all day.  I can't think of a position that needs a bigger upgrade than the DL.  We have Vince then a bunch of C players.  Ty Warren is coming back and I give him a B but he'll be 30 next season and we should expect him to become more injury prone.  I don't think BB will make a bold move for Watt or Fairley so I take the player in range that makes the most sense.

    #17  DT Marcell Dareus - Alabama, 6-3, 309, 4.90

    #32  OG/C Stefen Wisniewski - Penn State, 6-3, 302, 520.  Played OG until this season.  He backs up Koppen, Mankins and Connolly and either takes over for Koppen after 2011 or beats out Connolly

    #33  trade down for 40 and 104

    #40  WR Randall Cobb - Kentucky, 5-11, 190, 4.46.  Does it all.  Returns kicks, runs the wildcat, throws for TDs, but is mostly a WR.  He almost single handedly beat Auburn back in week 6, it took Auburn a FG as time ran out.  I had to mock him after I watched that Auburn game which re-ran the other day.  Cobb could be described as a bigger version of Dexter McCluster.  This kid competes, hates to lose and plays his heart out.

    #64  OLB KJ Wright - Miss State, 6-4, 250, 4.60.  I've been singing his praises for awhile.

    #66 (96/127)  RB John Clay - Wisconsin, 6-1, 248, 4.60.  Back to Clay.  He just gives us something we don't have back there, a 99.99% change to convert short yardage.

    #74  CB Chimdi Chekwa - Ohio State, 5-11, 190, 4.42.  Ultimately I think this kid goes higher.  He's good in coverage, a big hitter, supports the run. 

    #104 OT DeMarcus Love - Arkansas, 6-5, 315, 5.18  I think Light returns for a year or two and when Light gets hurt or hangs them up, Vollmer moves to LT and this kid takes over at RT.

    #6C  SS Eric Hagg - Nebraska, 6-2, 210. 4.60.  I caught the Neb/Okla game and Hagg stood out to me.  He can cover.  He actually did a decent job staying with Broyles except on one play.  He's been used as SS and MLB and I could see him playing a Rodney Harrison type role covering fast TEs or playing shadow against running QBs.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from natesubs. Show natesubs's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    i highly doubt that DT Marcell Dareus will be around at 17 but i'd love to have him as a member of the pats.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from sydpat. Show sydpat's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    MB and Faucet

    Love all your draft stuff................keep it going ....just hope BB reads it.

    One question though. Do you really think Fairley, Kerrigan and Watt will all go in the first dozen picks?

    There seems to be a lot of QB's coming out as well as depth at wide receiver.
    Heisman had three QB's out of four players.

    Surely the above three prospects for the Pats will drop............at least one or two maybe?

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    Unfortunately, the Raiders are improved.  I never thought they'd beat SD twice.  They are currently in the 17th slot.  I can see them going 2-2 the rest of the way.  I think their pick will be in the 14-18 range now.  Hopes of the pick becoming a top 10 have faded.  Even with potentially 4 QBs coming out ahead of the Raider pick, I see no chance for Fairley and Watt to get out of the top 10.  Kerrigan will be considered by 34 and 43 teams so he won't last long either.

    With all our picks, I really would like to try to move up to get Watt.  We could be coming off a SB victory and could trade up for a top 10 talent.  I think Fairley could be had at 5 (best case) and Watt at 9 (best case).  They won't go later, IMO.  Here's what we COULD do (not saying we will, we probably won't), assuming the Raider pick is between 14 and 18 and we win the SB (which is worst case for our picking order), using the NFL Draft Trade Chart:

    14/64 gets us to #8
    18/64 gets us to #13
    14/32 gets us to #5
    18/32 gets us to #7

    Typically bad teams would like to move back and get additional picks so there should be a willing trade partner.  Seriously, if we are coming off a SB, do we need 7 premium picks?  Why not use two of them to address our biggest need, a disruptive 34 DE?  Fairley and Watt fit the mold.

    I would use pick 32 instead of 33 because we will have time to trade 33 down and get a great deal to start the second day.  If we can sign Mankins long term and Light for another 1-2 years, we wouldn't need that pick 32.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from MordecaiBloodmoon. Show MordecaiBloodmoon's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    jader, Ty Warren was injured and playing through it, that is why he wasnt as dominant as he was prior.  When he returns, assuming everthing heals correctly, he will be a nice boost to our D.  He is also younger than the other Warren. 

    Faucet, the good thing is if 4 QBs can be taken that helps.  Add atleast 2 CB in Peterson (cries at not getting him) and Prince A.--maybe 3 /Jenkins--From there I see Bowers and Dareus going ahead of our pick.  And as weak of an OT class as it is, I will bet money 1 maybe 2 OTs go off the board before our pick. Then WR Green and maybe Jones  That is atleast 12 or 13 of the picks infront of us.  Definitely leaves us the room to jump up a spot or 5 and grab Fairley or Watt.

    I of course cant speak for BB, but would love to jump up a few times this year. Using our 2nd and both 3rds as chips.  If we can grab Fairley/Watt with the Oak pick plus moving up and Kerrigan with our 1st plus moving up and with the Car pick an OT like Solder I would jump for joy. 
    This of course doesnt include whatever names becomes the hot draft guy after the combine.  There is always someone who raises their value during that by many rounds.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    I'm again laying this idea out there.  We have money under the cap, about $25MM.  We like to retain our valuable players.  I think we sign Mankins long term and Light for 1-2 years.  Neal retires and Connolly takes over as he already has.  We could, and I'd argue, should, do one of these things.

    Two cases:

    Option 1:

    #5 (14/32) DE Nick Fairley
    33 trade down for 40 + 104
    40 trade down for 49 + 113
    49 WR Leonard Hankerson
    56 (64/113) OLB KJ Wright
    74 OG Stephen Schilling
    96 trade this plus our 6th for David Thomas for 2012 2nd
    104 RB Anthony Allen
    127 TE Andre Smith
    6C (for Watson) SS Eric Hagg

    We could come out of the draft with the best 34 DE, an athletic OLB who should be an improvement over Ninkovich, the best senior WR who is tall, physical has solid hands, the 3rd best OG, a decent RB to back up BJGE, a big TE who can block to learn for a year behind Crumpler and a SS/MLB hybrid plus a 2012 2nd round pick.

    Option 2:

    #8 (14/64) DE JJ Watt
    32 C/OG Stefen Wisniewski
    33 trade down for 40 + 104
    40 trade down for 49 + 113
    49 WR Leonard Hankerson
    61 (74/113) OLB KJ Wright
    96 trade this plus our 6th for David Thomas for 2012 2nd
    104 RB Anthony Allen
    127 TE Andre Smith
    6C (for Watson) SS Eric Hagg

    I might like this better.  Fairley is a bit of a dirty player.  He also has been dealing with a shoulder injury (not sure how serious), he tires and needs to take plays off, gets flagged for dumb plays, but he is very disruptive.  Fairley can single handedly take over a game on defense.  Watt on the other hand better fits our 34 DE profile, he is tall, has long arms, he knocks down passes with regularity, he can beat the double team and gets into the backfield.  He plays smart and never takes a play off.


    Wisniewski is the best C in the draft and he only played the position one year, prior to that he played G.  This makes him a great pick for our interior line.  If Mankins, Koppen or Connolly get hurt, next on the depth chart is the diminutive Wendell.  Koppen and Connolly become F/As after 2011 and even if they both are extended, Wisniewski could beat either of them out with a year to learn the system.  The rest of the draft is the same with the exception of Schilling.  If we land Wisniewski, we don't need another OG.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***:
    jader, Ty Warren was injured and playing through it, that is why he wasnt as dominant as he was prior.  When he returns, assuming everthing heals correctly, he will be a nice boost to our D.  He is also younger than the other Warren.  Faucet, the good thing is if 4 QBs can be taken that helps.  Add atleast 2 CB in Peterson (cries at not getting him) and Prince A.--maybe 3 /Jenkins--From there I see Bowers and Dareus going ahead of our pick.  And as weak of an OT class as it is, I will bet money 1 maybe 2 OTs go off the board before our pick. Then WR Green and maybe Jones  That is atleast 12 or 13 of the picks infront of us.  Definitely leaves us the room to jump up a spot or 5 and grab Fairley or Watt. I of course cant speak for BB, but would love to jump up a few times this year. Using our 2nd and both 3rds as chips.  If we can grab Fairley/Watt with the Oak pick plus moving up and Kerrigan with our 1st plus moving up and with the Car pick an OT like Solder I would jump for joy.  This of course doesnt include whatever names becomes the hot draft guy after the combine.  There is always someone who raises their value during that by many rounds.
    Posted by MordecaiBloodmoon

    I haven't tried to find a way to get both Watt and Kerrigan.  Again, if we can extend Mankins long term, that takes away the need for getting 2 interior linesmen.  If we extend Light 1-2 years and with Kaz coming back we can hold off on OT for another year.  Let's see if this would work.

    #8 (14/64) DE JJ Watt
    #12 (32/33) OLB Ryan Kerrigan
    #74 OG Stephen Schilling
    #96 WR Greg Salas
    #127 SS Eric Hagg

    I don't think I would do this.  I would love having both of those defenders but we don't add picks for 2012 and we lose a pair of picks.  I think the Watt deal looks great on paper.  I like Wright and feel he may actually be a safer pick for OLB since he plays it today.  He has speed to get to the edge where Ninkovich often gets exposed.  Kerrigan can get after the QB, there is no doubt about that.  He can do that better than anyone.  I think our need at 34 DE is greater and added pressure up front will help the rush.  We also get a great C/OG in the kid from Penn State, a better WR and RB.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Pats7393. Show Pats7393's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    Thought on the Raiders before I post my last mock for a few weeks, there are a few games to be played and my Jrs will not announce if the choose to come out for a few months still.

    Raiders are 6-6 with 4 games left:
    @ Jacksonville - Jags should win this game
    Vs Broncos - Will have to see how the Broncos play for their new coach but after a 59-14 A $$ kicking in Denver, don't see the broncos winning, Raiders
    vs Indy - The colts will need to win out to make the playoffs, they won't loss this game, Colts
    @ KC - Possible the playoffs and division is determined by the winner of this game if the CHargers win out.  KC will need to win to win their division while the raiders have their Uhauls packed up.  Chiefs

    Final record 7-9 with that record the pick should fall 12 to 16, I say it falls at 14 Although I believe Ayers or Kerrigan will fall into range.  Two reasons I still wait to pickup the OLB; one Harris is a very good CB and has a bright future, can do it all and second there are two OLBs that I'm extremely high on even more than Kerrigan and Ayers.  These two OLBs will make an impact, they are fast, quick and best of all know how to get to the QB. 

    Looking at this mock, there are names (actually a ton) that are not been talked about much but they will be in a few months. 

    #14 Brandon Harris CB 5'11" 195 JR
    Very talented, has shutdown abilities.  Plays well zone and man as well as run support.
    #32 Alson Smith OLB 6'5" 260 JR(redshirt sophmore)
    My pick for an everydown OLB, great first step sets the edge.  Biggest question is, does he come out if he does he might need to be had with the 14th.  1st of my 2 OLBs.
    #33 Dontay Moch OLB 6'1" 242
    I know what you are all thinking, BB doesn't draft OLBs under 6'3" well he also didn't line up CBs at DE but he did with Arrinton.  Moch is a great pass rusher and rumors to have sub 4.30 40 time.  He's not only fast but he does get the sacks, plays with leverage and uses different moves to get to the QB.  He will be a nightmare on passing downs and all special teams.  Remember the name.
    #62 Lawrence Guy DE 6'5" 300 JR 
    Another stud Jr.  He is a run stuffing DE who makes a ton of plays in the backfield.  Has a nonestop motor and brings a passrush. 
    3rd rnd (Min) Anthony Allen RB 6'0" 230 
    Alot will be said about what type of RB and offense this kids comes from at Georgia Tech (my back yard :) but he can run.  He's a powerful RB who will run people over.  He's got both power and speed to run through and can make moves in the open field.  Really like this kid.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LBXClhyzm0 Look at power
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAb_0ZuwGnw&NR=1 watch some speed
    3rd Rnd (Pats) Andrew Jackson OL 6'5" 295
    The Next Logan Mankins?  Question asked on the article I'm posting.  He sounds like a guy who would be a great addition to this line.  I have not seen him play but have not found any negative on this kid.  Until I get shown where he's not worth the pick I like what I've been reading so far.   http://draftcountdown.com/draft-blog/2010/11/athletes-maulers/
    4th Rnd Lee Ziemba OT 6'8" 308
    He's not talked about much but is a good option in the 4th.  I've been saying that Light is back which will give Ziemba a year or two to work on his skills in the NFL.
    5th Rnd Armand Robinson WR 6'0" 200
    Has lead Miami of Ohio in catches, he plays in the slot and runs good routes.  He has the speed and hands to play inside or outside.  Just another weapon in the type of O the Pats have moved to.
    6th Rnd Zach Hurd OG 6'7" 315
    This is more of wishful thinking that anything else, Hurd probably doesn't get pass the 4th or maybe 5th round but had to get his name here.

    Let me give you two UDFAs you hope to see in camp next season:

    Craig Marshall DE/OLB 6'5" 260
    he hasn't had a real chance to play because of guys like George Selvie and Jason Pierre-Paul and when he did this season he got hurt so missed a few games.  Very quick off the edge.
    Michael Janac DE/DT 6'5" 294
    One word describes this kid, RAW.  Very powerful and runs well for a 300 lb man.  He will need to develop, yes but give him a year or 2 in this system can turn into a very good DE.  At worse, he is Wrights replacement in a few years.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    Updated draft order.

    #14
    #32
    #33
    #64
    #76
    #96
    #128

    Gotta cheer for the Texans and Vikings to win tomorrow.  That would make 5 teams at 6-7 with the Raiders.  Not sure about the tie breakers but the Raiders pick could be at #12 by tomorrow night.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from CanadianPat. Show CanadianPat's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    Looking good for Pats getting:

    1 Akeem Ayers OLB
    1b Jared Crick DE
    2 Jimmy Smith CB
    2b DeMarco Murray RB
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    Pats, a couple of comments.  Not disrespecting Harris but why would the Pats spend a top half of the first round pick on another CB?  With Bodden coming back it doesn't make sense to me.  A general draft rule is you expect your 1st and 2nd round picks to be 3 down players and Harris would only play on special teams and sub packages.  Assuming he can beat out Bodden (which is a stretch coming into our system the first year), he would only moderately upgrade Bodden.  We have far bigger needs such as DE, rush OLB, and interior OL. 

    The deadline for college underclassmen to declare is Jan 15.  So we are one month away.  Players are already starting to declare.  Baldwin is coming out and after reading the release, I don't want him...

    Dec. 8, 2010 - 1:55 PM ET

    Pittsburgh WR Jonathan Baldwin announced that he will forgo his senior season with the Panthers and enter the 2011 NFL draft.

    Baldwin is coming off a disappointing season along with the rest of the Pitt program, which fired coach Dave Wannstedt on Tuesday. Though Baldwin's leaping ability and size (6'5/230 listed) can't be taught, he also has a history of off-field problems. It's worth noting that Baldwin ripped Pitt upon announcing his draft intentions on Wednesday: "Heck yeah I'm leaving," he said. "It can only get worse. They had me running a lot of deep routes [this year] and yards were hard to come by. I barely ran intermediate routes; it felt like they were purposely trying to disrupt my draft stock." A projected late first- to second-round pick, Baldwin comes with plenty of Knucklehead Factor.

    I noticed most boards have moved Zeimba to OG.  He would make a beastly guard.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from mbeaulieu07. Show mbeaulieu07's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***:
    Thought on the Raiders before I post my last mock for a few weeks, there are a few games to be played and my Jrs will not announce if the choose to come out for a few months still. Raiders are 6-6 with 4 games left: @ Jacksonville - Jags should win this game Vs Broncos - Will have to see how the Broncos play for their new coach but after a 59-14 A $$ kicking in Denver, don't see the broncos winning, Raiders vs Indy - The colts will need to win out to make the playoffs, they won't loss this game, Colts @ KC - Possible the playoffs and division is determined by the winner of this game if the CHargers win out.  KC will need to win to win their division while the raiders have their Uhauls packed up.  Chiefs Final record 7-9 with that record the pick should fall 12 to 16, I say it falls at 14 Although I believe Ayers or Kerrigan will fall into range.  Two reasons I still wait to pickup the OLB; one Harris is a very good CB and has a bright future, can do it all and second there are two OLBs that I'm extremely high on even more than Kerrigan and Ayers.  These two OLBs will make an impact, they are fast, quick and best of all know how to get to the QB.  Looking at this mock, there are names (actually a ton) that are not been talked about much but they will be in a few months.  #14 Brandon Harris CB 5'11" 195 JR Very talented, has shutdown abilities.  Plays well zone and man as well as run support. #32 Alson Smith OLB 6'5" 260 JR(redshirt sophmore) My pick for an everydown OLB, great first step sets the edge.  Biggest question is, does he come out if he does he might need to be had with the 14th.  1st of my 2 OLBs. #33 Dontay Moch OLB 6'1" 242 I know what you are all thinking, BB doesn't draft OLBs under 6'3" well he also didn't line up CBs at DE but he did with Arrinton.  Moch is a great pass rusher and rumors to have sub 4.30 40 time.  He's not only fast but he does get the sacks, plays with leverage and uses different moves to get to the QB.  He will be a nightmare on passing downs and all special teams.  Remember the name. #62 Lawrence Guy DE 6'5" 300 JR  Another stud Jr.  He is a run stuffing DE who makes a ton of plays in the backfield.  Has a nonestop motor and brings a passrush.  3rd rnd (Min) Anthony Allen RB 6'0" 230  Alot will be said about what type of RB and offense this kids comes from at Georgia Tech (my back yard :) but he can run.  He's a powerful RB who will run people over.  He's got both power and speed to run through and can make moves in the open field.  Really like this kid. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LBXClhyzm0 Look at power http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAb_0ZuwGnw&NR=1 watch some speed 3rd Rnd (Pats) Andrew Jackson OL 6'5" 295 The Next Logan Mankins?  Question asked on the article I'm posting.  He sounds like a guy who would be a great addition to this line.  I have not seen him play but have not found any negative on this kid.  Until I get shown where he's not worth the pick I like what I've been reading so far.   http://draftcountdown.com/draft-blog/2010/11/athletes-maulers/ 4th Rnd Lee Ziemba OT 6'8" 308 He's not talked about much but is a good option in the 4th.  I've been saying that Light is back which will give Ziemba a year or two to work on his skills in the NFL. 5th Rnd Armand Robinson WR 6'0" 200 Has lead Miami of Ohio in catches, he plays in the slot and runs good routes.  He has the speed and hands to play inside or outside.  Just another weapon in the type of O the Pats have moved to. 6th Rnd Zach Hurd OG 6'7" 315 This is more of wishful thinking that anything else, Hurd probably doesn't get pass the 4th or maybe 5th round but had to get his name here. Let me give you two UDFAs you hope to see in camp next season: Craig Marshall DE/OLB 6'5" 260 he hasn't had a real chance to play because of guys like George Selvie and Jason Pierre-Paul and when he did this season he got hurt so missed a few games.  Very quick off the edge. Michael Janac DE/DT 6'5" 294 One word describes this kid, RAW.  Very powerful and runs well for a 300 lb man.  He will need to develop, yes but give him a year or 2 in this system can turn into a very good DE.  At worse, he is Wrights replacement in a few years.
    Posted by Pats7393


    Pats,
    Harris and Smith (assuming they declare) are both intriguing kids that will certainly be part of the discussion with their top 3 picks. 

    I don't see a scenario in which Moch would be an option for them that high.  I don't deny his talent and ability to rush the passer, but he's not a fit for their scheme and would at best be a part time, situational edge rusher.  His value, IMO, would be to a 4-3 team.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***:
    Updated draft order. #14 #32 #33 #64 #76 #96 #128 Gotta cheer for the Texans and Vikings to win tomorrow.  That would make 5 teams at 6-7 with the Raiders.  Not sure about the tie breakers but the Raiders pick could be at #12 by tomorrow night.
    Posted by Faucetman


    Thanks for the update.  I hate having to root for a team QB'd by Brett Fav-re  but, the trade off is worth it, ha.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***:
    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK*** : Pats, Harris and Smith (assuming they declare) are both intriguing kids that will certainly be part of the discussion with their top 3 picks.  I don't see a scenario in which Moch would be an option for them that high.  I don't deny his talent and ability to rush the passer, but he's not a fit for their scheme and would at best be a part time, situational edge rusher.  His value, IMO, would be to a 4-3 team.
    Posted by mbeaulieu07


    I know the 6'3"+ 260lbs is the mold of molds and that was the first thing I looked at until I saw Arrington lined up at DE.  If BB liked the type of rush he got from a smaller quicker pass rusher why not have a guy who can be in sub packages, which NE plays over 50% of the time and still can play outside when they play teams with very quick small backs.  I think he can be a very nice player.  I agree his size says 43 OLB but watching some 6'1 guys around the league do well at 34 OLBs tells me it is possible.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***:
    Pats, a couple of comments.  Not disrespecting Harris but why would the Pats spend a top half of the first round pick on another CB?  With Bodden coming back it doesn't make sense to me.  A general draft rule is you expect your 1st and 2nd round picks to be 3 down players and Harris would only play on special teams and sub packages.  Assuming he can beat out Bodden (which is a stretch coming into our system the first year), he would only moderately upgrade Bodden.  We have far bigger needs such as DE, rush OLB, and interior OL.  The deadline for college underclassmen to declare is Jan 15.  So we are one month away.  Players are already starting to declare.  Baldwin is coming out and after reading the release, I don't want him... Dec. 8, 2010 - 1:55 PM ET Pittsburgh WR Jonathan Baldwin announced that he will forgo his senior season with the Panthers and enter the 2011 NFL draft. Baldwin is coming off a disappointing season along with the rest of the Pitt program, which fired coach Dave Wannstedt on Tuesday. Though Baldwin's leaping ability and size (6'5/230 listed) can't be taught, he also has a history of off-field problems. It's worth noting that Baldwin ripped Pitt upon announcing his draft intentions on Wednesday: "Heck yeah I'm leaving," he said. "It can only get worse. They had me running a lot of deep routes [this year] and yards were hard to come by. I barely ran intermediate routes; it felt like they were purposely trying to disrupt my draft stock." A projected late first- to second-round pick, Baldwin comes with plenty of Knucklehead Factor. I noticed most boards have moved Zeimba to OG.  He would make a beastly guard.
    Posted by Faucetman


    Two good CBs are not enough in today's NFL.  Teams now have 3 or 4 WRs who can run well and catch the ball.  Only having to above average CB (Bodden DM) is not enough.  Patriots play over 50% of the time in sub packages, Chung has played down in slot because they are missing a guy to put there.  I believe Whilhite is gone, Harris will be a very nice replacement.  Bodden is 30 already, an injury and the secondary can be in trouble.

    Now, I saw Arrington play tonight and boy he's looking mighty good.  Might be he becomes a very solid CB and I won't see as big a need to have Harris but right now I think a third (specially one which projects as a very good NFL prospect) CB is as big a need as DE.  OLB is bigger but I rather have Smith late in the 1st than Kerrigan mid 1st but that's just me.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    Hey guys, the Pats just mathematically clinched the 5th tie breaker with the Jets, Strength of Victory today.  Why is that important?  Because if the Jets win out and the Pats get only one more win against either BUF or MIA, it would force the 5th tie breaker and now we own it.

    The Jets only hopes to win the division are to win out with us losing out or for the Jets to win out and we lose to both MIA and BUF. 
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    I seem to remember someone posting that Price had bad hands and would never be any good. Havent seen anyone on tv talking about it but that catch he made was as good as any catch you can make. Talk about good hands.Mat\ybe we dont need a reciever
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***:
    I seem to remember someone posting that Price had bad hands and would never be any good. Havent seen anyone on tv talking about it but that catch he made was as good as any catch you can make. Talk about good hands.Mat\ybe we dont need a reciever
    Posted by max5344


    I think you mean Tate....He has struggled with dropping the easy passes
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***:
    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK*** : Two good CBs are not enough in today's NFL.  Teams now have 3 or 4 WRs who can run well and catch the ball.  Only having to above average CB (Bodden DM) is not enough.  Patriots play over 50% of the time in sub packages, Chung has played down in slot because they are missing a guy to put there.  I believe Whilhite is gone, Harris will be a very nice replacement.  Bodden is 30 already, an injury and the secondary can be in trouble. Now, I saw Arrington play tonight and boy he's looking mighty good.  Might be he becomes a very solid CB and I won't see as big a need to have Harris but right now I think a third (specially one which projects as a very good NFL prospect) CB is as big a need as DE.  OLB is bigger but I rather have Smith late in the 1st than Kerrigan mid 1st but that's just me.
    Posted by Pats7393

    I'm not disputing we need to have a solid back-up CB.  We need a solid back-up or two at each position.  My point is you don't spend a high 1st round pick on a guy who would see the field on about half of our defensive snaps.  The only way you do this is if you are set at every other position.  Getting another front line CB with our top pick is a luxury, not a need.  Getting a starting DE who would clearly beat out Brace or Deaderick or whatever the flavor of the day is, is essential. 

    As you mentioned, Arrington appears to be a solid back up.  I think Wilhite will be back.  I think after yesterday's game, Butler is the odd man out.  A dumb PI penalty plus he let an interception go through his hands won't help his cause.  This only adds to my point.  We spent two 2nd round picks at CB over the past 3 drafts.  One (Wheatley) was already cut and Butler will be next. 

    We hit on our 1st with McCourty, so we are 1 for 3 on drafting CBs with premium picks over the past 3 years.  First round picks MUST be SAFE picks and should play every down.  BB said it himself with McCourty.  He said he felt McCourty was a four down player.  So, why would he draft a 2 down player at the top of the first?  I would much rather draft someone like Chekwa in the 3rd.  We developed Samuel, a 4th round pick, Randall Gay an UDFA, and now Arrington a UDFA of PHI.  Let's use #1 on a stud DE, a stud OLB or OL.  To me that's better value and bigger need.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    The below is from Brian DiTullio of the Bleacher Report.  This is his list of underclassmen who should declare because they have nothing to gain by staying in school.  I don't know how the heck he could have left Cam Newton, Nick Fairley and JJ Watt off his list.  These three guys have nothing left to prove in college and all three are top 15 picks.  I'm going to put these guys in there in red where I think they belong.  I won't change his order although we should discuss it.  If all or most of these guys come out, we're going to have one heck of a draft.

    1.  QB Andrew Luck
    2.  CB Patrick Peterson
    3.  DE Da'Quan Bowers
         DT Nick Fairley
         QB Cam Newton
    4.  DT Marcell Dareus
    5.  DE Robert Quinn
    6.  WR AJ Green
         DE JJ Watt
    7.  CB Janoris Jenkins
    8.  OLB Akeem Ayers
    9.  RB Mark Ingram
    10. QB Ryan Mallett
    11. CB Aaron Williams
    12. RB Ryan Williams
    13. WR Julio Jones
    14. ILB Dont'a Hightower
    15. S Lance Mitchell
    16. S Mark Barron
    17. CB Brandon Harris
    18. WR Jonathan Baldwin - Already declared
    19. RB LaMichael James - I didn't think he was eligible, but he is.  Not clean off the field, arrest for domestic violence against his GF, suspended a game.
    20. OT DeMarcus Love
    21. S Rahim Moore - My favorite safety
    22. CB Brandon Burton
    23. DT Jerel Worthy - Didn't realize he had a red shirt year.  Should be part of our discussion at 6-3, 305, 5.04
    24. WR Ryan Broyles
    25. TE Kyle Rudolph
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***WITH NEW MOCK***:
    The pick that intrigues me the most is the 33rd. There will be wheeling and dealing for that pick.
    Posted by bobbysu

    Absolutely correct.  Because there is a whole night before the 2nd round, teams will be calling wanting to land their BPA.  I could see us getting more than fair market value.  I could see us getting a later 2nd, in the 40 range plus a 2012 2nd for that pick.
     
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