2011 Patriots Draft Options ***THANKS TO ALL WHO CONTRIBUTED!***

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    I'm not advocating for Bruce Carter.  I was just mentioning that he is nearly identical in size and speed to Von Miller.  But Carter doesn't have any where near the sack numbers as Miller.  Miller had 11 sacks this year and 17 a year ago even after missing the better part of 2 games. 

    I am a big fan of KJ Wright.  He hasn't put up big sacks numbers but he has the size/speed combo and and is very good against the run and in coverage from the 3 games or so that I saw.  In a 4-3 set, you don't usually expect a lot of sacks from your OLBs.  Wright had pretty solid tackling numbers and defended 7 passes. 
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    A DE conversion to OLB prospect that I think could be a real sleeper is Markus White from Florida State.  He's 6-4, 262 and runs a 4.69.  As a DE he did a solid job stepping into the shoes of Everette Brown.  White racked up 9 sacks and was extremely consistent registering a sack in 7 straight games.  White also had 58 tackle and a pick 6.  He could be a nice find perhaps with our 6th round comp pick.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    Caught the first half of the Texas v. Nation game so far.  A couple of interesting, lesser known players to watch. 

    WR Stephen Burton from West Texas A&M looked outstanding.  He's a big physical kid, 6-2, 219, 4.55.  He made a really nice over the shoulder catch on a deep side line route closely covered then showed his toughness with a nice catch in the slot. 

    WR Denarius Moore from Tennessee, 6-1, 194, 4.49.  So far he looked the most impressive in the game beating his man in the back of the end zone for a TD and coming up with several other nice grabs.  His production on a bad team was pretty solid.  He had only 47 catches but for 981 yards and 9 TDs.  That's nearly 21 YPC!! He had a pair of 200 yard plus games against S. CAR and Kentucky.  He also ran the ball 7 times for 82 yards probably on reverses. 

    RB Mario Fannin from Auburn show cased his pass catching ability out of the backfield on a couple of plays.  The thickly build 5-11, 225, 4.55 back obviously playing in the tough SEC was pretty productive in terms of his opportunities.  He is known as an excellent blocker and receiver but as a pure runner, he's under rated.  He actually has a pretty solid YPC for his career, 5.86.  His stats are as follows.  42 catches in 2009 really caught my eye.  This kid could go undrafted but I'd take a flyer on him if we can pick up a 7th.

    YEARATTYDSAVGLNGTDRECYDSAVGLNGTD
    2007844485.3675181769.8272
    2008542384.43512022311.2522
    2009342858.4320424139.8823
    2010613956.54251717310.2382

    RB Damien Berry of Miami (FL), found the edge and busted a long run for the game's first TD.

    Kenrick Ellis,the MONSTER DT from Hampton dominated on one series with a stuff on a running play followed by a bull rush sack with the OL draped all over him.  Character is an issue with him as he was kicked out of S. Carolina.  But he looks really athletic and strong.

    QBs TJ Yates and Taylor Potts both looked pretty good so far.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from SilverSun. Show SilverSun's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    Fyi, Pats Draft Fanatics; point of interest see the Walter Football Mock Draft at link below,  It has Pats drafting Randall Cobb WR/KR of Kentucky with Pats first 3rd round pick from Vikes & Johnny Patrick DB of Louiseville Cardinals with our second 3rd round selection - MB has been favorably reviewing both these guys and I personnally like Patrick a lot.


    http://walterfootball.com/draft2011.php
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from natesubs. Show natesubs's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***:
    [QUOTE]Agreed Mb.  Watt would be perfect and I feel like he has the frame to add 15 lbs of muscle once he gets NFL weight training.  He was a TE two years ago so he hasn't come close to reaching his potential as a DE.  He is already explosive and makes big plays, lots of TFL, lots of batted balls, forced fumbles, etc. If we miss out on him, I would be fine with Jordan or Heyward but rather see Heyward at 28.  I know he had an off year but I think he played hurt.  He was a beast in his bowl game and I think that's who he really is, a beast!
    Posted by Faucetman[/QUOTE]

    plus watts could play the vrable role of goal line TE
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    Who are the top play-makers in the draft?  AJ Green and Julio Jones would seem to be the best WRs but who are the best 5?  I don't see any consensus after the first two.  A lot of boards have Torrey Smith, some have Hankerson, some have Baldwin.  Then where do we put Cobb, Little and Titus Young?

    For RBs, I don't even think there is a consensus #1.  Everyone says Ingram but I wouldn't bet on him being the first back taken.  Is there a clear top 5 at the RB position?  If I were ranking the backs, I'd have them like this.  I've taken into consideration production, level of competition, size/speed, pass catching ability, etc.  Some of these guys might not even get drafted. 

    PlayerHtWt40Att Yds TDAveRec Yds AveTD
    M. LeShoure6-02304.534242557 236.037439 11.95
    M. Ingram5-102154.48
    572
    3261 42 5.760670 11.24
    K. Hunter5-82004.487084181 375.963519 8.22
    S. Vereen5-102054.495562834 295.174674 9.16
    R Williams5-102024.464032132 305.326289 11.12
    B. Powell6-02154.524362338 195.445344 7.63
    D. Murray6-12084.487593685 504.91571571 10.013
    R. Helu6-02204.515783404 275.954501 9.30
    A. Allen6-02304.585463036 335.633401 12.24
    D. Thomas6-22284.635452850 305.252428 8.20
    J. Todman5-91954.436163179 315.242283 6.70
    J. Clay6-12554.676293413 415.41172 6.50
    D. Locke5-81864.365182618 225.1  95 883 9.33
    V. Taua5-102204.567114588 456.561571 9.48
    E. Royster6-02284.596863932 295.761562 9.23
    N. Devine5-92154.527294317 295.998712 7.32
    J Rodgers5-71924.497883877 464.91511056 7.05
    M Fannin5-112284.542331366 115.9  97 985 10.29
    S. Ridley6-02234.633061419 194.6  17 94 5.50
    D. Carter5-92154.526463104 244.828208 7.41
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from jjaycee. Show jjaycee's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    Putting D priorties aside-- lets use the #1 draft choice to get a "guaranteed, can't miss" player, Mike Pouncey, OL from Florida. He is a natural center that could move right in to the about to be vacated Patrot RG position, since Neal is about to retire anyway. And with center, Koppen in the last year of his contact, Pouncey would move to in there for the rest of his career. And for those unfamiliar with the Pouncey name, his brother is now the center for the Steelers, his 1st year, and has been the NFL rave so far, of those "in the know". Troy Aikman, former Cowboy qb and now Fox NFL announcer, about the younger Pouncey, " he's the best college O lineman I"ve ever seen". 
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    I think my preference on RBs would be to get a potentially great back with one of our first 4 picks then come back at the end of the draft and get Mario Fannin.  Fannin is really growing on me.  He looked pretty good at the TvN game. 

    I might be looking to take 2 of thse backs at these locations.

    #33  LeShoure or Ingram
    #60  Hunter, Vereen or Williams
    #74  Powell or Murray
    #124 Helu, Allen, Thomas, Todman, Clay
    6C  Locke, Taua, Royster, Devine, Rodgers, Fannin

    If we want to compliment our current group and not spend a high pick perhaps one of the guys at 124 then Fannin. 
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***:
    [QUOTE]I think my preference on RBs would be to get a potentially great back with one of our first 4 picks then come back at the end of the draft and get Mario Fannin.  Fannin is really growing on me.  He looked pretty good at the TvN game.  I might be looking to take 2 of thse backs at these locations. #33  LeShoure or Ingram #60  Hunter, Vereen or Williams #74  Powell or Murray #124 Helu, Allen, Thomas, Todman, Clay 6C  Locke, Taua, Royster, Devine, Rodgers, Fannin If we want to compliment our current group and not spend a high pick perhaps one of the guys at 124 then Fannin. 
    Posted by Faucetman[/QUOTE]

    I'm with you on a RB, just not too sure where/when....The more I keep thinking about it, I think we need to grab 1 rush OLB, 1 DE with 2 of our first 3 picks. I want difference makers, not depth. If we are successful here, plus adding Bodden and Warren back, we have a top 10 defense.
    I still think there is room to slide Leshoure in there, but that would mean we would have to wait on OL until #60 or later. of course, this assumes we sign both Mankins and Light. If not, we might be forced into drafting OL sooner than later...
    Here is what I would like to do with the first 4 picks...this assumes Mankins or Light are signed. Not necessarily both.

    #17 (OLB, ASmith)..BB has never selected a rush OLB before this high, but I think this kid could be special with some grooming. Just line him up and let him go...
    #28 (DE Watt or Wilkerson)..One of these 2 should be here, and like either at this spot. Won't go wrong with either one here.
    #33 (RB, Leshoure)...scratching my head on this selection here, but I think if we wait to long, he'll be gone. This pick I think will be traded however..but if we picked here, I like Leshoure.
    #60 (WR, RCobb)...(OL...depends on Mankins/Light situation..we may have to draft a G or RT here...there should be a few good ones left to choose from...)...If both Light and Mankins signed, I like Randall Cobb here. Can you imagine an offense adding Leshoure and Cobb to who we already have?...

    I don't see any superior rush OLB's after round 1, unless you consider BReed as a possible round 2 selection. Do you agree? Do you see any rush OLB's in round 2 worth taking that can make a big difference in our pass rush?

    I feel the same about 3-4 DE's as well. I think beyond 35-40 or so, talent drops off considerably. I want a 3-4 DE day 1 starter. Watt or Wilkerson would fit the bill.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    Here's my first attempt at ranking the top WRs.  A couple of players that intrigue me mid draft are Toliver, Johnson and especially Denarius Moore.  Moore looked great in the TvN game and of my top 20 receivers, he had the 2nd most yards per catch.  There is talent up and down the board.


    RkPlayerHtWt40AttYrdsTDAve
    1AJ Green6-42124.4916626192315.8
    2J. Jones6-42204.4917926531514.8
    3J. Baldwin6-52304.4812823371618.3
    4L. Hankerson6-32084.5213421602216.1
    5R. Cobb5-111804.4614416611311.5
    6T. Smith6-12054.3815222181914.6
    7T. Young5-111704.4820430632515.0
    8J. Jernigan5-91904.3426231281811.9
    9N. Paul6-12204.501031532514.9
    10A. Pettis6-32014.5922928383912.4
    11T. Toliver6-52034.4912618201214.4
    12V. Brown5-111844.52    
    13D Moore6-11944.4911220041817.9
    14T. Doss6-32004.5615418541312.0
    15G Little6-22204.5686969611.3
    16R Johnson5-111864.4613817502012.7
    17J. Maehl6-01854.5617823112413.0
    18J. Kerley5-91884.5512212991210.6
    19G. Salas6-22104.5728543452615.2
    20D Sanzenbacher5-111824.5811518111815.7
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***:
    [QUOTE]Who are the top play-makers in the draft?  AJ Green and Julio Jones would seem to be the best WRs but who are the best 5?  I don't see any consensus after the first two.  A lot of boards have Torrey Smith, some have Hankerson, some have Baldwin.  Then where do we put Cobb, Little and Titus Young? For RBs, I don't even think there is a consensus #1.  Everyone says Ingram but I wouldn't bet on him being the first back taken.  Is there a clear top 5 at the RB position?  If I were ranking the backs, I'd have them like this.  I've taken into consideration production, level of competition, size/speed, pass catching ability, etc.  Some of these guys might not even get drafted.  Player Ht Wt 40 Att   Yds   TD Ave Rec   Yds   Ave TD M. LeShoure 6-0 230 4.53 424 2557 23 6.0 37 439 11.9 5 M. Ingram 5-10 215 4.48 572 3261 42 5.7 60 670 11.2 4 K. Hunter 5-8 200 4.48 708 4181 37 5.9 63 519 8.2 2 S. Vereen 5-10 205 4.49 556 2834 29 5.1 74 674 9.1 6 R Williams 5-10 202 4.46 403 2132 30 5.3 26 289 11.1 2 B. Powell 6-0 215 4.52 436 2338 19 5.4 45 344 7.6 3 D. Murray 6-1 208 4.48 759 3685 50 4.9 157 1571 10.0 13 R. Helu 6-0 220 4.51 578 3404 27 5.9 54 501 9.3 0 A. Allen 6-0 230 4.58 546 3036 33 5.6 33 401 12.2 4 D. Thomas 6-2 228 4.63 545 2850 30 5.2 52 428 8.2 0 J. Todman 5-9 195 4.43 616 3179 31 5.2 42 283 6.7 0 J. Clay 6-1 255 4.67 629 3413 41 5.4 11 72 6.5 0 D. Locke 5-8 186 4.36 518 2618 22 5.1   95 883 9.3 3 V. Taua 5-10 220 4.56 711 4588 45 6.5 61 571 9.4 8 E. Royster 6-0 228 4.59 686 3932 29 5.7 61 562 9.2 3 N. Devine 5-9 215 4.52 729 4317 29 5.9 98 712 7.3 2 J Rodgers 5-7 192 4.49 788 3877 46 4.9 151 1056 7.0 5 M Fannin 5-11 228 4.54 233 1366 11 5.9   97 985 10.2 9 S. Ridley 6-0 223 4.63 306 1419 19 4.6   17 94 5.5 0 D. Carter 5-9 215 4.52 646 3104 24 4.8 28 208 7.4 1
    Posted by Faucetman[/QUOTE]


    For me you have Leshoure, Igram and Williams in their own class and everyone else is a level below them.
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***:
    [QUOTE]Here's my first attempt at ranking the top WRs.  A couple of players that intrigue me mid draft are Toliver, Johnson and especially Denarius Moore.  Moore looked great in the TvN game and of my top 20 receivers, he had the 2nd most yards per catch.  There is talent up and down the board. Rk Player Ht Wt 40 Att Yrds TD Ave 1 AJ Green 6-4 212 4.49 166 2619 23 15.8 2 J. Jones 6-4 220 4.49 179 2653 15 14.8 3 J. Baldwin 6-5 230 4.48 128 2337 16 18.3 4 L. Hankerson 6-3 208 4.52 134 2160 22 16.1 5 R. Cobb 5-11 180 4.46 144 1661 13 11.5 6 T. Smith 6-1 205 4.38 152 2218 19 14.6 7 T. Young 5-11 170 4.48 204 3063 25 15.0 8 J. Jernigan 5-9 190 4.34 262 3128 18 11.9 9 N. Paul 6-1 220 4.50 103 1532 5 14.9 10 A. Pettis 6-3 201 4.59 229 2838 39 12.4 11 T. Toliver 6-5 203 4.49 126 1820 12 14.4 12 V. Brown 5-11 184 4.52         13 D Moore 6-1 194 4.49 112 2004 18 17.9 14 T. Doss 6-3 200 4.56 154 1854 13 12.0 15 G Little 6-2 220 4.56 86 969 6 11.3 16 R Johnson 5-11 186 4.46 138 1750 20 12.7 17 J. Maehl 6-0 185 4.56 178 2311 24 13.0 18 J. Kerley 5-9 188 4.55 122 1299 12 10.6 19 G. Salas 6-2 210 4.57 285 4345 26 15.2 20 D Sanzenbacher 5-11 182 4.58 115 1811 18 15.7
    Posted by Faucetman[/QUOTE]

    Good stuff.

    What 5 do you see as the most realistic fits/targets for NE based on skill (speed/quicks/hands/routes etc) and assumed draft position?
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from ShiningWizard. Show ShiningWizard's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    The Pats are fine with BJGE as their #1 RB.  

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    when people talk about Watt of Jordan are there seriously thinking about them at #17?

    I am not saying the Patriots wouldn't do it as I have no idea what they will or won't do but it would seem odd to me.

    Last year they passed on Jared Odrick who was 6-5 300ilbs. The target measurables everyone thinks the Patriots want. He also had a very good senior bowl week and game and on film, to me anyways, moves extremely similar to JJ Watt as far as quickness and athleticism.

    So my question is why would the Patriots pull the trigger on either of those guys at #17 when they are less ideal as far as measurables go then a player they already passed on at better value a year ealier.

    The Patriots are all about value so it does make me curious.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***:
    [QUOTE]when people talk about Watt of Jordan are there seriously thinking about them at #17? I am not saying the Patriots wouldn't do it as I have no idea what they will or won't do but it would seem odd to me. Last year they passed on Jared Odrick who was 6-5 300ilbs. The target measurables everyone thinks the Patriots want. He also had a very good senior bowl week and game and on film, to me anyways, moves extremely similar to JJ Watt as far as quickness and athleticism. So my question is why would the Patriots pull the trigger on either of those guys at #17 when they are less ideal as far as measurables go then a player they already passed on at better value a year ealier. The Patriots are all about value so it does make me curious.
    Posted by Low-FB-IQ[/QUOTE]

    Yes, I am seriously considering Watt and Jordan at 17. I think Odrick and Watt/Jordan are different players. I might make a comparison between Odrick and Watt, but not Jordan. In terms of measurables, I think Watt has close to ideal, as does Odrick. Jordan is a bit small for the position.

    I don't think it's as easy to make a comparison between players of different draft years. Just because they passed on Odrick, doesn't mean they would on Watt or Jordan. I think they look not only at the individual player, but also relative to need to ranking in terms of each specific year. Perhaps Odrick didn't grade out high for them, and they had McCourty a lot higher?...
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***:
    [QUOTE]when people talk about Watt of Jordan are there seriously thinking about them at #17? I am not saying the Patriots wouldn't do it as I have no idea what they will or won't do but it would seem odd to me. Last year they passed on Jared Odrick who was 6-5 300ilbs. The target measurables everyone thinks the Patriots want. He also had a very good senior bowl week and game and on film, to me anyways, moves extremely similar to JJ Watt as far as quickness and athleticism. So my question is why would the Patriots pull the trigger on either of those guys at #17 when they are less ideal as far as measurables go then a player they already passed on at better value a year ealier. The Patriots are all about value so it does make me curious.
    Posted by Low-FB-IQ[/QUOTE]


    Low,
    To answer your question, yes I think both Watt and Jordan make a ton of sense at 17 though none of us know how BB feels about them.  Last year, they clearly had McCourty ranked ahead of Odrick (assuming they even had interest in him), but I'm not sure how that correlates to this years draft class. 
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15*** : Good stuff. What 5 do you see as the most realistic fits/targets for NE based on skill (speed/quicks/hands/routes etc) and assumed draft position?
    Posted by mbeaulieu07[/QUOTE]

    My 2 cents for what it's worth....

    Before I weigh in on the list, do you think it's important to consider who they curently have at the position in terms of skillset? To me, it looks like (in lieu of not knowing how Price & Tate will pan out), a group of good slot receivers, mostly guys that aren't going to stretch the field, and guys that are adept to short/intermediate routes and big YAC potential. If we want to keep drafting in this mold, I would put Cobb top of list here.

    If we want to draft someone with complimentary skills, someone who can run the whole route tree, has speed and big play ability, fits the Pats mold, I think the list goes something lilke this for top 5; (btw..I'm not counting AJ Green or Julio Jones as I believe both will be out of our reach, and I'm not figuring in taking a WR in the 1st round of this draft unless Jones slips to 17....)
    1a. RCobb (fits mold to a "T", but is he a compliment to Welker, Branch, Edelman, Price, Tate, etc.?...or is he more in their mold? I like him taking over for either Branch eventually or Welker if he departs after next year)...
    1. Titus Young (a bit light, but is a burner and runs great routes..might make it to 2nd round?....close call)
    2. Torrey Smith
    3. Leonard Hankerson
    3. Austin Pettis
    4. Toliver (? mark here...kind of on the fence witih him.same with Baldwin..)
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from sydpat. Show sydpat's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    Faucetman

    Wes Bunting from National Football Post reckons Cameron Jordan, Phil Taylor and Danny Watkins will all go in the first round.
    How does that fit in with your ideas of what Pats should do?
    Just can't help thinking if BB doesn't do something dramatic in this draft we may never see Brady win another SB.
    What effect do you think it will have on Pats draft if there is no free agency till possibly after draft?
    Big decisions for BB....................need impact players on Defence.
    It is obvious even to a blind man what all the forum fans think the Pats should do to improve.
    Trouble is the coach never does what we think he should do and the same result occurs in the big games.
    Think Bob Kraft may still save his money or go for the jugular?
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15*** : My 2 cents for what it's worth.... Before I weigh in on the list, do you think it's important to consider who they curently have at the position in terms of skillset? To me, it looks like (in lieu of not knowing how Price & Tate will pan out), a group of good slot receivers, mostly guys that aren't going to stretch the field, and guys that are adept to short/intermediate routes and big YAC potential. If we want to keep drafting in this mold, I would put Cobb top of list here. If we want to draft someone with complimentary skills, someone who can run the whole route tree, has speed and big play ability, fits the Pats mold, I think the list goes something lilke this for top 5; (btw..I'm not counting AJ Green or Julio Jones as I believe both will be out of our reach, and I'm not figuring in taking a WR in the 1st round of this draft unless Jones slips to 17....) 1a. RCobb (fits mold to a "T", but is he a compliment to Welker, Branch, Edelman, Price, Tate, etc.?...or is he more in their mold? I like him taking over for either Branch eventually or Welker if he departs after next year)... 1. Titus Young (a bit light, but is a burner and runs great routes..might make it to 2nd round?....close call) 2. Torrey Smith 3. Leonard Hankerson 3. Austin Pettis 4. Toliver (? mark here...kind of on the fence witih him.same with Baldwin..)
    Posted by PatsLifer[/QUOTE]

    PL
    I'm in agreeance that both Green and Jones are off the board by 17.

    My assumption is that Tate and Price represent the "deep threats" of the future for the WR corp.

    With that being said, I see them taking a WR that best fits their preferred skill set for the position which is good speed, quick/sudden COD skills, good agility, solid hands, clean route running and RAC ability.  We'll know a lot more following the combine, but below are my 5 targets (in no particular order):

    Randall Cobb
    Torrey Smith (assuming he falls to Rd 2)
    Vincent Brown
    Titus Young
    Jeremy Kerley
     
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    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    I am on record as saying that it doesn't really matter WHEN they get the needs, but I think the needs are apparent:

    Top 4 (in no order):

    1. DE
    2. OLB
    3. OL
    4. RB

    As mentioned in other threads, Scarnecchia's ability to coacup O LInemen means they may be able to go mid rds (2, 3 or 4) to get personnel either at Guard, Center or Tackle.

    Not sure how the OL depth is in this draft.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***:
    [QUOTE]Faucetman Wes Bunting from National Football Post reckons Cameron Jordan, Phil Taylor and Danny Watkins will all go in the first round. How does that fit in with your ideas of what Pats should do? Just can't help thinking if BB doesn't do something dramatic in this draft we may never see Brady win another SB. What effect do you think it will have on Pats draft if there is no free agency till possibly after draft? Big decisions for BB....................need impact players on Defence. It is obvious even to a blind man what all the forum fans think the Pats should do to improve. Trouble is the coach never does what we think he should do and the same result occurs in the big games. Think Bob Kraft may still save his money or go for the jugular?
    Posted by sydpat[/QUOTE]
    I agree with the assessment on Jordan and Taylor both going in the first, not sure I agree on Watkins.  If he wasn't 27, maybe, but I think concern over his age pushes him into the 2nd round but he probably will go before 45.  I think teams needing an OG will go with Pouncey and Wisniewski before Watkins.

    I'm still thinking DL or rush OLB with our first choice.  That would be the most logical move.  For now I am going to assume that we reach a deal with Mankins and Light which takes some pressure off OL for the first round.  

    I am a little uncertain about most of the top OLB prospects.  Most of them are DE conversion types and that always worries me.  Of the top rated players; Quinn, Smith, and Kerrigan have had very limited exposure to playing standing up while Houston, Ayers and Miller have shown ability at the position already.  Of Miller, Quinn, and Kerrigan it is possible that none of these guys will be there at 17 just based on other team's draft priorities.  If one is there but Jordan and/or Watt is also there I'd be torn on who to take.  I would probably go with the 34 DE because there are some other options at OLB down the board.

    I don't think I would take Ayers or Houston at 17, I think at 28 or 33 we can consider them.  I would probably stay away from Carter based on his injury and I don't like anyone else this high.  At 60 or 74 I would consider, Herzlich, Reed, Wright and even Acho.  Moch would be interesting but I wouldn't count him as solving our OLB problem, he'd be more of a LB/Safety hybrid that we'd use on special teams and sub packages.  At 60 or 74, the risk becomes a lot lower on a DE/OLB conversion type.  History shows it takes 3-4 years usually for a conversion type to make a big impact although Matthews and Ware are exceptions.

    Today, I'd say lets go with Jordan or Watt at 17 then see who of the OLB types are there at 28.  Houston or Ayers could be considered.  I think we trade 33 down to the mid 40s so I think this would be the place for a stud interior OL type like Watkins or perhaps a stud RB like LeShoure.  I could even make a case for Martez Wilson or Rahim Moore with our first pick of Round 2.  60 or 74 is probably the place I would look to take an OLB.  Reed, Wright or even Acho.

    I don't know what to tell you if Free Agency happens after the draft.  All teams will be in the same boat.  I think we have a little less exposure than most teams because Light and Mankins are our only real major concerns.  I expect us to draft 1 C/G type anyway to replace Neal on the roster but we might not draft OT if we think Light will stay.  But this is why I like Watkins.  If we could get him around 40-45 he gives us depth inside and out.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from sportslover21. Show sportslover21's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    I am relatively new at posting on this board, but aside from the Patriots games, the draft is my favorite part of the year, and I put a lot of work and time and thought into things. So here is my top 10 at each position, and in the next post I will put some more thoughts. Along with some PAtriots fits that I see.

    QB

    1.       Andy Dalton, TCU

    2.       Christian Ponder, Florida State

    3.       Jake Locker, Washington

    4.       Blaine Gabbert, Missouri

    5.       Colin Kaepernick, Nevada

    6.       Greg McElroy, Alabama

    7.       Nathan Enderle, Idaho

    8.       Cameron Newton, Auburn

    9.       Ricky Stanzi, Iowa

    10.   Pat Devlin, Delaware

     

    RB          

    1.       Mark Ingram, Alabama

    2.       Mikel LeShoure, Illinois

    3.       Ryan Williams, Virginia Tech

    4.       Daniel Thomas, Kansas State

    5.       Bilal Powell, Louisville

    6.       Kendall Hunter, Oklahoma State

    7.       Demarco Murray, Oklahoma

    8.       Taiwan Jones, Eastern Washington

    9.       Derrick Locke, Kentucky

    10.   Dion Lewis, RB, Pittsburgh

    WR

    1.       AJ Green, Georgia

    2.       Julio Jones, Alabama

    3.       Leonard Hankerson, Miami

    4.       Torrey Smith, Maryland

    5.       Titus Young, Boise State

    6.       Jon Baldwin, Pittsburgh

    7.       Jerel Jernigan, Troy

    8.       Niles Paul, Nebraska

    9.       Randall Cobb, Kentucky

    10.   Vincent Brown, San Diego State

    TE

    1.       Kyle Rudolph, Notre Dame

    2.       Lance Kendricks, Wisconsin

    3.       Julius Thomas, Portland State

    4.       DJ Williams, Arkansas

    5.       Luke Stocker, Tennessee

    6.       Charles Clay, Tulsa

    7.       Wesley Saunders, South Carolina

    8.       Lee Smith, Marshall

    9.       Richard Gordon, Miami (FL)

    10.   Mike McNiell, Nebraska

    OT

    1.       Gabe Carimi, Wisconsin

    2.       Anthony Castonzo, Boston College

    3.       Tyron Smith, Southern California

    4.       Nate Solder, Colorado

    5.       Derek Sherrod, Mississippi State

    6.       Ben Ijalana, Villanova

    7.       Marcus Gilbert, Florida

    8.       Lee Ziemba, Auburn

    9.       Jason Pinkston, Pittsburgh

    10.   James Carpenter, Alabama

     

    Interior-OL

    1.       Rodney Hudson, Florida State

    2.       John Moffitt, Wisconsin

    3.       Marcus Cannon, TCU

    4.       Mike Pouncey, Florida

    5.       Stefen Wisniewski, Penn State

    6.       Danny Watkins, Baylor

    7.       Will Rackley, Leheigh

    8.       Stephen Schilling, Michigan

    9.       Kristopher O’Dowd, Southern California

    10.   Zach Hurd, Connecticut

    4-3 DE

    1.       Robert Quinn, North Carolina

    2.       Da’quan Bowers, Clemson

    3.       Aldon Smith, Missouri

    4.       Ryan Kerrigan, Purdue

    5.       JJ Watt, Wisconsin

    6.       Brooks Reed, Arizona

    7.       Jamaal Sheard, Pittsburgh

    8.       Jeremy Beal, Oklahoma

    9.       Sam Acho, Texas

    10.   Allen Bailey, Miami

    3-4 DE

    1.       Marcell Dareus, Alabama

    2.       Cameron Jordan, California

    3.       JJ Watt, Wisconsin

    4.       Muhammed Wilkerson, Temple

    5.       Cameron Heyward, Ohio State

    6.       Jarvis Jenkins, Clemson

    7.       Christian Ballard, Iowa

    8.       Kenrick Ellis, Hampton

    9.       Marvin Austin, North Carolina

    10.   Lawrence Guy, Arizona State

    DT

    1.       Marcell Dareus, Alabama

    2.       Nick Fairley, Auburn

    3.       Stephen Paea, Oregon State

    4.       Phil Taylor, Baylor

    5.       Drake Nevis, LSU

    6.       Corey Liuget, Illinois

    7.       Marvin Austin, North Carolina

    8.       Phil Taylor, Baylor

    9.       Sione Fua, Stanford

    10.   Terell McClain, South Florida

    4-3 OLB

    1.       Bruce Carter, North Carolina

    2.       Greg Jones, Michigan State

    3.       Akeem Ayers, UCLA

    4.       Lawrence Wilson, Connecticut

    5.       Dontay Moch, Nevada

    6.       Mason Foster, Washington

    7.       Colin, McCarthy, Miami (FL)

    8.       Ross Homan, Ohio State

    9.       KJ Wright, Mississippi State

    10.   Greg Lloyd, Connecticut

    3-4 OLB

    1.       Robert Quinn, North Carolina

    2.       Aldon Smith, Missouri

    3.       Von Miller, Texas A&M

    4.       Ryan Kerrigan, Purdue

    5.       Justin Houston, Georgia

    6.       Mark Herzlich, Boston College

    7.       KJ Wright, Mississippi State

    8.       Jeremy Beal, Oklahoma

    9.       Tom Keiser, Stanford

    10.   Jabaal Sheard, Pittsburgh

    ILB

    1.       Mark Herzlich, Boston College

    2.       Martez Wilson, Illinois

    3.       Scott Lutrus, Connecticut

    4.       Greg Jones, Michigan State

    5.       Quan Sturdivant, North Carolina

    6.       Casey Matthews, Oregon

    7.       Kelvin Sheppard, LSU

    8.       Chris White, Mississippi State

    9.       Nate Irving, NC State

    10.   Bruce Miller, Central Florida

     

    CB

    1.       Patrick Peterson, LSU

    2.       Prince Amukamara, Nebraska

    3.       Jimmy Smith, Colorado

    4.       Brandon Harris, Miami (FL)

    5.       Aaron Williams, Texas

    6.       Ras-I Dowling, Virginia

    7.       Jalil Smith, Colorado

    8.       Curtis Brown, Texas

    9.       Johnny Patrick, Louisville

    10.   Kendrick Burney, North Carolina

     

    S

    1.       Rahim Moore, UCLA

    2.       Ahmad Black, Florida

    3.       DeAndre McDaniel, Clemson

    4.       Quinton Carter, Oklahoma

    5.       Robert Sands, West Virginia

    6.       Duenta Williams, North Carolina

    7.       Shiloh Keo, Idaho

    8.       Eric Hagg, Nebraska

    9.       Da’Norris Searcy, North Carolina
    10. Jeron Johnson, Boise State

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15*** : Good stuff. What 5 do you see as the most realistic fits/targets for NE based on skill (speed/quicks/hands/routes etc) and assumed draft position?
    Posted by mbeaulieu07[/QUOTE]
    I think the Mankins and Light situations will be resolved before the draft so I think we will go DL or OLB at 17.  I don't think any other direction at 17 would make sense unless there is a highly rated player that unexpectedly fell to us. 

    You're question about which backs make the most sense for our system is really a tough question.  Fitting our system generically would be versatile backs that run well with good vision who can catch, block and hold onto the ball.  First we have to assume that we are happy with BJGE and Woody.  I think it's safe to say Woody has taken over the 3rd down roll that Faulk had.  Is it safe to say BJGE will be our #1 back next year so we are only looking to fill 2 roster spots?  This is the part I don't know.  I assume BB is expecting BJGE to be his #1 back but we don't know how he views the top backs in the draft yet or whether he thinks an upgrade is needed. 

    If I had a chance to draft an explosive back that I think would be better than BJGE, I would seriously consider doing so with pick 28 or 33.  But if I'm looking for depth and players who compliment our main 2 guys, then different players come to mind and certainly later in the draft. 

    For RBs, I think Ingram and LeShoure have set themselves apart for pick 28 consideration or certainly at 33.  I think both guys have the ability to be better than BJGE and both could be game changers. 

    Then I think there's another group of backs that I'd be considering at 60 such as Hunter, Vereen and Williams.  But 60 is where I think OLB makes the most sense right now so we might be inclined to put RB off until the 4th round if we miss out on these 5 RBs by pick 60.  I like these 5 backs better than the rest primarily because of their production, dual threats as receivers, their size/speed ratio (4 of the 5 are listed in the 4.4s) and that they all bring something a little different to the table from our current crew.  A healthy Ingram showed us in 2009 what he can do and LeShoure had his break out year this year.  Both guys could easily take the starting job from BJGE.  Hunter reminds me of Maurice Jones-Drew and could do many of the same things that BJGE and Woody do today, so he provides excellent depth to both players.  Vereen and Williams are about the same size/weight as BJGE but both move faster and Vereen especially is a solid receiver out of the backfield.  Williams had his break out year in 2009.

    At 92 or laterthere are a whole slew of RBs that would seem to make sense.

    B. Powell
    D. Murray
    R. Helu
    A. Allen
    D. Thomas
    J. Todman
    J. Clay
    D. Locke
    V. Taua
    E. Royster
    N. Devine
    J Rodgers

    Powell and Helu are very similar to each other and BJGE but both are faster than BJGE.  Allen, Royster and Thomas are big bruising backs like LeShoure but they should be had later in the draft.  Murray is a pure receiver, third down, ST guy.  Clay is a pure beast as a short down guy.  Todman, Rodgers and Locke are your scat back types so they wouldn't really add much to what Woodhead already brings us. 

    If I was trying to round out the group with late picks I might get Clay with our late 4th or 5th if we have one, then Fannin with a late pick or undrafted.  Fannin really interests me as a late round guy in that he's big, 5-11, 228, runs well, 4.54 but has low miles, just 233 career carries which is the lowest of the group but at a nice 5.9 average and he was very productive with Auburn coming out of the back field with 97 catches for 985 yards and 9 TD.  After Murray and Rodgers, Fannin was the most productive receiving back in my top 20. 

    Sitting here today looking at the board and our needs I'd likely hold off at RB and go with one of the guys in the table above in the 4th or 5th than take Fannin with our last pick of the draft since he is currently projected as going undrafted. 
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from sportslover21. Show sportslover21's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    Obviously most people on this board can identify the areas of needs:

    OLB
    DE
    OG
    OT
    WR

    Other areas that may be addressed:
    C
    CB
    S

    With our multitude of picks in the top half of the draft, I think it will be a formality that many of these needs are addressed in one way or another.

    At OLB one of our biggest area of needs, I think it is a nessecity to grab at least one of the following:

    Robert Quinn
    Ryan Kerrigan
    Von Miller
    Aldon Smith
    Justin Houston
    Brooks Reed
    Mark Herzlich

    In that order.

    It's pivotal that we get some kind of pass rush or have someone on our defense that strikes fear in the opponents eyes. Someone they have to gameplan for. Taking it for what it is, if we had a Clay Matthews type talent this year, I think we are the best team in the league.  I think if BB can't get his top guys that fit his requirments for measurables (Smith, Quinn, Kerrigan), that he ought to dig down deep and explore a little smaller guys who are still damn good football players which starts with Von Miller.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***

    In Response to Re: 2011 Patriots Draft Options ***UPDATED MOCK 1/15***:
    [QUOTE]I am on record as saying that it doesn't really matter WHEN they get the needs, but I think the needs are apparent: Top 4 (in no order): 1. DE 2. OLB 3. OL 4. RB As mentioned in other threads, Scarnecchia's ability to coacup O LInemen means they may be able to go mid rds (2, 3 or 4) to get personnel either at Guard, Center or Tackle. Not sure how the OL depth is in this draft.
    Posted by BBReigns[/QUOTE]

    I hear you, but I think the WHEN is just as important as the WHO. We are not drafting for depth at OLB and DE positions. We are drafting possibly day 1 starters. THat means, we need top tier talent, and we need to target that talent at 17, 28 or 33, or possibly 60. Beyond that I see depth if we want to add an extra DE, or OLB, or whatever.
     
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