2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

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    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to zbellino's comment:
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    In response to TexasPat's comment:
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         Had to take a break a vent. I've never been so disappointed in Tom Brady til I read his whine about how the Pats have spoiled the fans, and how winning in the NFL is hard. Oh...boo-hoo, Tom: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/10/22/tom-brady-maybe-we-spoiled-people/ 

         Is isn't like this team is losing close games to the NY Giants, Packers, or 49ers. They are having a tough time with lightweights, such as the Cardinals, Seahawks, and, yesterday, the Jets. This team is consistently failing to stick the dagger in these weaklings...allowing them to hang around. They were within an inch of blowing out the Ravens in Baltimore.

         So...whats' wrong with the Patriots?

    1.) OC Josh McDaniels: The Pats can't seem to decide whether to be a smash mouth team, or to go back to the spread offense that has worked so well over the past several seasons. This indecisiveness reflects in the play-calling, and has rendered the offense far less aggressive and dynamic. Tom Brady has, and always has been, best in the shot-gun. The running game should be used as a diversionary tactic to the staple passing attack. Draws and screens are fine. But, shortening the game with the run allows inferior teams to hand around. The Pats, with their firepower, should be blowing teams like the Seahawks and Jets away. There's little chance for 4th quarter heroics when a team is down 3 TDs;

    2.) Tom Brady: The guy is hearing footsteps...which is affecting his accuracy. Never Mr. Mobility, Tom isn't very good behind the center. Teams know that when Tom goes behind the center, that it's a running play. He's best in the shotgun. Turn him loose! He's a Hall of Fame QB! Why aren't the Pats putting the game in his hands, rather than in the hands of RB Stevan Ridley and the "D"??

    3.) DB Coach Josh Boyer: Can somebody please tell me why this guy still has a job? The secondary is awful for the 2nd straight year. For whatever reason, he's not getting the best out of his guys. Even when a coach is given lemons to work with, his job is to make lemonaide;

    4.) Conditioning: The Pats repeatedly are dying in the 4th quarter. Could this be a reason?

    5.) This Team Isn't Hungry: Other teams appear to want it more. The 2012 Pats are constantly allowing teams to come from behind and beat them;

    6.) Where is BB?: I can't believe BB isn't going off on his guys. They haven't looked like the Patriots all season;

    7.) Brandon Lloyd: Time for McDaniels to  go back to the Billy O'Brien (remember him?) offense, and stop worrying about making Lloyd happy. He's a complimentary piece...nothing more;

    8.) Pass Rush?: Horrible. Guys like Mark Sanchez and, God help us...Russell Wison, are being made to look like Joe Montana. This team has one guy who can pressure the QB...Chandler Jones. Blitzes, anybody?

    9.) DBs: Still a disaster...and still get beaten deep on a regular basis (see Josh Boyer, above);

    10.) Lack of Leadership: Spare me about how winning is hard, Tom. After that debacle in Seattle Tom, in which the likes of Richard Sherman did everything but spit in your face...I really expected this team to destroy the Jets. But no...it was the usual, tepid, go through the motions, and let them hang around, performance. Such play hasn't been seen in these parts since 2002. Other than Brandon Spikes, I see no player willing to take the bull by the horns, and get this thing turned around. This team has far to much talent to be playing this way. The only thing that appears to stand in the way of them and another SB appearance is their unwillingness to pay the price to win, and Houston's 6'8" DE, J.J. Watts.

         Where have you gone, Rodney Harrison, Tedy Bruschi, and Willie McGinest?       

    [/QUOTE]


    TP, while I think Brady has been great this season, I agree with you NE actually needs to pass more. Not needs, because they are doing just fine offensively, but it would likely lengthen the games a touch.

    Stats 101, Ernie Adams style. In a longer contest, the advantage is ceded to the team with a better offense. In a shorter contest, the advantage goes to the team with a better defense. Running the ball (despite what people contend here) does not get 'rest' for the defense, because the real world clock keeps running even if the game clock stops. But it does shorten the amount of total possessions per game. Why ... why.... would you want to shorten the total possessions when you have the best offense in football? Not so sure. 

    More, most, importantly, in a longer contest the advantage goes to the more talented team. In a shorter contest flukes are more likely to happen. This is key, this is how NE won against the Rams in 01. 

    If the answer is, to keep your p!ss poor defense off the field, then your only real solution is to improve your defense. 

    Amen, brother. Good post!

     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to Brad34's comment:
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    In response to maine12's comment:
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    I really wish the Pats would play there best football in weeks 3-10. So all the fools on this board could be happy. 4-3 is the third best record in the AFC and the Pats havn't played a good game yet this year. Its better to click as a team going into the playoffs, rather than week 7. Save your drama for your mama all you homers. This team is a superbowl caliber team and its fine with me if they are not in perfect form during week 7. The season is not even half way through yet!!!!! I REMEMBER YOU ALL INCLUDING TP WRITING THEM OFF LAST YEAR AROUND WEEK 10. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Yes I agree. I really hope this year the Pats play their best in the playoffs instead of like the last few years and even in 2007 where they have put together some of the best regular seasons of all time only to run out of steam in the playoffs. 

    RESPONSE: The Pats didn't run out of steam during those years. In 2007, they ran into a white-hot N.Y. Giants' team, who rode a supranatural catch, and a major media  distraction, to beat them. In 2009, they lost Wes Welker in the final game of the season, and were beaten by a better Ravens' team. In 2010, they played an awful game and were out-coached in their loss to the Jets. Last year, they were great. Only some hard luck (untimely Gronk injury), and a very good N.Y. Giants' team stopped them from winning it all.


     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from maine12. Show maine12's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    TP listen to yourself! You said the Pats played great last year and all you did was complain about their DB's. You do it every year and forget that you did. We know the DB's suck but thats the cards were dealt and to be honest this D will be much better by the end of the year. Fonzie will be our #1 corner and will have a ton more experience, Arrington our #2 and in the red zone Ras-I will be our #2 CB because of his size. McCourty is a huge upgrade at FS and Chung needs to get healthy while Wilson continues to get snaps. The goal is to find your identity at the end of the year and with the changes they are making they will. No need to hit the PANIC button. Relax and enjoy the ride.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Brad34. Show Brad34's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
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    In response to Brad34's comment:
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    In response to maine12's comment:
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    I really wish the Pats would play there best football in weeks 3-10. So all the fools on this board could be happy. 4-3 is the third best record in the AFC and the Pats havn't played a good game yet this year. Its better to click as a team going into the playoffs, rather than week 7. Save your drama for your mama all you homers. This team is a superbowl caliber team and its fine with me if they are not in perfect form during week 7. The season is not even half way through yet!!!!! I REMEMBER YOU ALL INCLUDING TP WRITING THEM OFF LAST YEAR AROUND WEEK 10. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Yes I agree. I really hope this year the Pats play their best in the playoffs instead of like the last few years and even in 2007 where they have put together some of the best regular seasons of all time only to run out of steam in the playoffs. 

    RESPONSE: The Pats didn't run out of steam during those years. In 2007, they ran into a white-hot N.Y. Giants' team, who rode a supranatural catch, and a major media  distraction, to beat them. In 2009, they lost Wes Welker in the final game of the season, and were beaten by a better Ravens' team. In 2010, they played an awful game and were out-coached in their loss to the Jets. Last year, they were great. Only some hard luck (untimely Gronk injury), and a very good N.Y. Giants' team stopped them from winning it all.


    [/QUOTE]

    Rubbish - in 2007 and last year they peaked too early. Both years they were very lucky to win the AFC championship game. In 2007 against an injury racked Chargers team they struggled to get through and lost to an inferior Giants team in  the Superbowl. Last year they were a simple missed field goal from having to go into OT or saved from a loss by Sterling Moore to Flaco and the Ravens. Both games were in Foxboro and once again had they been midseason Pats would have blown both opponents away. Giants last year were a lot tougher prospect for that Pats team in the Superbowl then they were for the 2007 Pats. In 2010 they absolutely blew the Jets away at the same venue only about 6 weeks before a very embarrasing playoff loss to them. Midseason they blow them away and crumble to them in the playoffs. Wouldn't that be peaking too early?

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    This team is kind of like Tiger Woods (minus all the shenanigans...as far as we know).   Was the greatest thing ever a few years ago, gone through a few swing changes but still always a major factor regardless.  Going through yet another swing change (whether it was necessary or not), a little beat up and not necessarily the best in the business any more.  But not ready just yet to throw dirt on him.

    I don't think they're either complacent or soft.  Just finding their identity and transitioning to a different type of team, especially on offense.  It's a work in progress, there will be bumps in the road.  Have faith, they have people in charge that know how to get it done.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from brazilnut. Show brazilnut's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to maine12's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I really wish the Pats would play there best football in weeks 3-10. So all the fools on this board could be happy. 4-3 is the third best record in the AFC and the Pats havn't played a good game yet this year. Its better to click as a team going into the playoffs, rather than week 7. Save your drama for your mama all you homers. This team is a superbowl caliber team and its fine with me if they are not in perfect form during week 7. The season is not even half way through yet!!!!! I REMEMBER YOU ALL INCLUDING TP WRITING THEM OFF LAST YEAR AROUND WEEK 10. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Agree with this.  This team has a lot of people playing hurt right now.  Hopefully they can get healthy and will start to gel more.  I would like to see them use Vereen a little more. When he was in there he was pretty effective.  With him and a healthy Bolden, I think we have a great running game along with Ridley.  Gronk and Hernandez should get better as they get healthy.  I like Dennard as a cornerback, and it seems we do play better in man coverage.  Hopefully the defense has more confidence matter this last win.  If we can get a better, consistent pass rush the secondary will look better.  Any QB in the NFL can complete a high % of passes if given enough time.  Keep the faith and in December we will a much better team.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from AZPAT. Show AZPAT's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
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    In response to AZPAT's comment:
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    In response to TexasPat's comment:
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    In response to PatsLifer's comment:
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    I don't think Brady goes anywhere. He retires a patriot because of what he means to the franchise from historical perspective . I am sure BB would love to cash him in for a couple of firsts, and then trade down for 14 3rd round picks , but Kraft won't have it. 

    RESPONSE: Why not? Joe Montana and Peyton Manning were traded late in their careers. Both were iconic figures for their teams, too.  

    If Brady has lot his spark, his hyper competitive edge, BB needs to have a chat with him. I will be honest, I have seen Bradresiding the bench more this year and quiet than he has been in years past. The old Brady wouLD be on the sideline or moving up and down the bench motivating both offensive and defensive players. 

    RESPONSE: I just don't see the same fire in the guy. Unfortunately, he's not alone. No one, save Wes Welker, is playing particularly well. 

    The team appears soft for 3 reasons

    Brady'a lack of spark..he needs to remember why he loves this game..seems to be going through the motions this year, lack of emotion.

    RESPONSE: If Tom needs to remember his love for the game, it's time for him to retire.

    Both sides of the ball missing the killer instinct of years past. Defense needs to attack and so does tthe offense . Please BB be more aggressive. Aggresbuilds a good thing and I don't care if the secondary gets burnt because of it...

    RESPONSE: Amen, brother. Part of the blame must fall on the coaches, too. DC Matt Patricia, OC Josh McDaniels, and DB coach Josh Boyer are not getting it done. As soon as Romeo Crennel gets canned in KC, BB should bring him back aboard.  

    Injuries...OL, TE and some other key injuries on the defense.

    RESPONSE: The injuries haven't been that bad.  This team lacks heart, determination, and a mean streak. 

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    [/QUOTE

    Tex,

    EXACTLY what I've been saying for over a month now.... there is NO aspect of this Pats team that ANY opposing absolutely fears before a game. Not Brady and the offense, not the defense, and most especially not the Pats passing defense. They have forgotten to play in all 4 Qtrs. Save for the last 1:36 Sunday, we'd be staring down a 3-4 record. But, some folks would be whining having four losses by a total of "X" points. (Funny how their love of Brady fogs their ability to see the ongoing complete lack of ANY offensive production in the 4th Qtr. Amazing!)

    We consistently see the DB's getting gashed time and time again for big plays. Rose colored glasses fans don't yelp in the first half because the offense is generating points. Yet, in the 4th, when the rubber meets the road, and Brady and his Band of Suddenly Apparent Inepts hit the field, it's the DB's that are losing these games. Same play in all Qtrs, but now they and they alone take the heat.

    My God! Some folks here have become what we've despised from Colt and other trolls...... STAT HOGS. As long as Brady throws numbers up, he's great, terrific, can father my offspring. Hasn't won a darn thing (as defined by Super Bowls and actual/real championships, the ONLY measurement we used when "discussing" Mr Pay-a-ton, if you recall) since becoming All World. Pads HOF stats, but does nothing to prompt a parade in downtown Boston in February.

    Welcome back, my friend!   

    [/QUOTE]

         Thanks Az! Been very, very busy. It's still crazy...but the Pats are driving me crazy with their tepid, lackadaisical play. Shame on Tom Brady for calling our fan base "spoiled". I'm really disappointed in him. He always used to be the guy who take the blame on his rare bad days...no whines, and no excuses. But..."it's hard to win"..."maybe we spoiled our fans"?? Pleeeaaasssse!!

         This teams needs a collective good swift kick in the azzz, Az.

    [/QUOTE]


    I'd offer to boot it, and it won't go over the goal post. I, too, have been really busy with work stuff, having to transfer from AZ to Purgatory, PA.... half way between Steelerville and Birdland. Interesting....... Tons of excuses as to why the Steelers aren't doing well... INJURIES. Seems to me that if you have an older, aging team, and aren't getting younger players, you will have debilitating injuries.It's like trying to explain away the death of an 105 yr old person by saying they died "suddenly". Not a question of "if", but "when". Iggles? Half the fans are infatuated with Vick and Reid, and the other half wish they both were gone. They are now both on notice from ownership, I think, but we'll see. All I can say is that I believe Reid knows whre the bodoes are buried.  Ten years, I retire and go back home.

    Just putting this out there..... Tom Terrific hasn't been the same since he became papa Brady and then Mr Brady. Maybe there is something to those Hollyweird movies that have a woman/women ruining an athlete at the top of his game. He's got nothing left for the final 15 minutes, this past Sunday excepted. No visible fire in the belly, no post game emotion other than to drone on about how "we gotta do this".........

    Just something to think about.......... 

    LATER!!!!

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from AZPAT. Show AZPAT's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to maine12's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I really wish the Pats would play there best football in weeks 3-10. So all the fools on this board could be happy. 4-3 is the third best record in the AFC and the Pats havn't played a good game yet this year. Its better to click as a team going into the playoffs, rather than week 7. Save your drama for your mama all you homers. This team is a superbowl caliber team and its fine with me if they are not in perfect form during week 7. The season is not even half way through yet!!!!! I REMEMBER YOU ALL INCLUDING TP WRITING THEM OFF LAST YEAR AROUND WEEK 10. 

    [/QUOTE]

     "4-3 is the third best record in the AFC"

    Really? Is this the best you got? REALLY??? This bunch has the talent to be 6-0, but not enough between the ears to get there. With the toughest part of their schedule coming up, this bunch of underperformers could end uo 8-8, which could be the 6th best record in the AFC. Problem is, and it needs to be points out to you, this doesn't get them in to the playoffs.

    Wonder what the excuses would be then, if they play the same way?

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to AZPAT's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to AZPAT's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to PatsLifer's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I don't think Brady goes anywhere. He retires a patriot because of what he means to the franchise from historical perspective . I am sure BB would love to cash him in for a couple of firsts, and then trade down for 14 3rd round picks , but Kraft won't have it. 

    RESPONSE: Why not? Joe Montana and Peyton Manning were traded late in their careers. Both were iconic figures for their teams, too.  

    If Brady has lot his spark, his hyper competitive edge, BB needs to have a chat with him. I will be honest, I have seen Bradresiding the bench more this year and quiet than he has been in years past. The old Brady wouLD be on the sideline or moving up and down the bench motivating both offensive and defensive players. 

    RESPONSE: I just don't see the same fire in the guy. Unfortunately, he's not alone. No one, save Wes Welker, is playing particularly well. 

    The team appears soft for 3 reasons

    Brady'a lack of spark..he needs to remember why he loves this game..seems to be going through the motions this year, lack of emotion.

    RESPONSE: If Tom needs to remember his love for the game, it's time for him to retire.

    Both sides of the ball missing the killer instinct of years past. Defense needs to attack and so does tthe offense . Please BB be more aggressive. Aggresbuilds a good thing and I don't care if the secondary gets burnt because of it...

    RESPONSE: Amen, brother. Part of the blame must fall on the coaches, too. DC Matt Patricia, OC Josh McDaniels, and DB coach Josh Boyer are not getting it done. As soon as Romeo Crennel gets canned in KC, BB should bring him back aboard.  

    Injuries...OL, TE and some other key injuries on the defense.

    RESPONSE: The injuries haven't been that bad.  This team lacks heart, determination, and a mean streak. 

    [/QUOTE]


    [/QUOTE

    Tex,

    EXACTLY what I've been saying for over a month now.... there is NO aspect of this Pats team that ANY opposing absolutely fears before a game. Not Brady and the offense, not the defense, and most especially not the Pats passing defense. They have forgotten to play in all 4 Qtrs. Save for the last 1:36 Sunday, we'd be staring down a 3-4 record. But, some folks would be whining having four losses by a total of "X" points. (Funny how their love of Brady fogs their ability to see the ongoing complete lack of ANY offensive production in the 4th Qtr. Amazing!)

    We consistently see the DB's getting gashed time and time again for big plays. Rose colored glasses fans don't yelp in the first half because the offense is generating points. Yet, in the 4th, when the rubber meets the road, and Brady and his Band of Suddenly Apparent Inepts hit the field, it's the DB's that are losing these games. Same play in all Qtrs, but now they and they alone take the heat.

    My God! Some folks here have become what we've despised from Colt and other trolls...... STAT HOGS. As long as Brady throws numbers up, he's great, terrific, can father my offspring. Hasn't won a darn thing (as defined by Super Bowls and actual/real championships, the ONLY measurement we used when "discussing" Mr Pay-a-ton, if you recall) since becoming All World. Pads HOF stats, but does nothing to prompt a parade in downtown Boston in February.

    Welcome back, my friend!   

    [/QUOTE]

         Thanks Az! Been very, very busy. It's still crazy...but the Pats are driving me crazy with their tepid, lackadaisical play. Shame on Tom Brady for calling our fan base "spoiled". I'm really disappointed in him. He always used to be the guy who take the blame on his rare bad days...no whines, and no excuses. But..."it's hard to win"..."maybe we spoiled our fans"?? Pleeeaaasssse!!

         This teams needs a collective good swift kick in the azzz, Az.

    [/QUOTE]


    I'd offer to boot it, and it won't go over the goal post. I, too, have been really busy with work stuff, having to transfer from AZ to Purgatory, PA.... half way between Steelerville and Birdland. Interesting.......

    RESPONSE: You're going to love those PA winters, after all that golden Arizona sunshine...LOL!!!

    Tons of excuses as to why the Steelers aren't doing well... INJURIES. Seems to me that if you have an older, aging team, and aren't getting younger players, you will have debilitating injuries.It's like trying to explain away the death of an 105 yr old person by saying they died "suddenly". Not a question of "if", but "when".

    RESPONSE: Amen. Their best defenders, Polamalu and Harrison, have grown old, and have become injury prone. Hard to replace great players like these.  

    Iggles? Half the fans are infatuated with Vick and Reid, and the other half wish they both were gone. They are now both on notice from ownership, I think, but we'll see. All I can say is that I believe Reid knows whre the bodoes are buried.  Ten years, I retire and go back home.

    RESPONSE: Vick is vastly overrated, and should be replaced asap by rookie Nick Foles. You may know him well from his AZ days. Reid's personal life has taken some severe hits. He likely needs some time off to regroup.  

    Just putting this out there..... Tom Terrific hasn't been the same since he became papa Brady and then Mr Brady. Maybe there is something to those Hollyweird movies that have a woman/women ruining an athlete at the top of his game. He's got nothing left for the final 15 minutes, this past Sunday excepted. No visible fire in the belly, no post game emotion other than to drone on about how "we gotta do this".........

    RESPONSE: Still think that his confidence was shaken in a huge way when the Pats lost SB 42, in 2007. He's still been outstanding since then...but has never regained his touch at being at his best in the clutch.

    Just something to think about.......... 

    LATER!!!!

    Good luck in PA, my friend!


     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from ccnsd. Show ccnsd's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    Texas Pat said he could see it in Brady's eyes he no longer had the will to win in 2008 after watching Brady play less than a half. I agree that the Pats should pass more but knowing how hard a man works or his desire to succeed after watching him only 3 hours a week is laughable. The fact that certain players are not playing as good as you would like does not make them "soft".  

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from maine12. Show maine12's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to AZPAT's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to maine12's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I really wish the Pats would play there best football in weeks 3-10. So all the fools on this board could be happy. 4-3 is the third best record in the AFC and the Pats havn't played a good game yet this year. Its better to click as a team going into the playoffs, rather than week 7. Save your drama for your mama all you homers. This team is a superbowl caliber team and its fine with me if they are not in perfect form during week 7. The season is not even half way through yet!!!!! I REMEMBER YOU ALL INCLUDING TP WRITING THEM OFF LAST YEAR AROUND WEEK 10. 

    [/QUOTE]

     


     "4-3 is the third best record in the AFC"

    Really? Is this the best you got? REALLY??? This bunch has the talent to be 6-0, but not enough between the ears to get there. With the toughest part of their schedule coming up, this bunch of underperformers could end uo 8-8, which could be the 6th best record in the AFC. Problem is, and it needs to be points out to you, this doesn't get them in to the playoffs.

    Wonder what the excuses would be then, if they play the same way?

    [/QUOTE]


    Haha the Pats toughest part of the schedule is coming up??????? They play the Rams(who stink), HAVE A BYE, play the Bills, play the Colts, Dolphins, and Jets. Thats tough??? haha none of them have winning records. Yeah AZPat you heard me right I dont care how many regular season wins we have. The fact is I know the Pats will make the playoffs, what matters to me is if they are playing good at the end of the season. The sun must be doing its damage down south on TP and AZPat as both are panicking. Someone get them a beer.

     
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  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from maine12. Show maine12's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to ipotnyc's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Regular season wins has EVERYTHING to do with making the playoffs.  In 2008 11-5 wasn't good enough.  In other years (see: Seattle) 8-8 is good enough. 

    Yes, this team, even playing beneath it's capabilities, should be 6-0 or 5-1.  But, it isn't.  It's 4-3. You don't lose to the Cards at home and you don't blow double digit leads in the 4th qtr to Seattle.


    So, you go out and beat the Rams on Sunday.  You play them as if you're playing the Rams of 2001.  You play as if they are a must win.  You do that, win, and then as a team you start feeling really good about yourself, about your effort and its result.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    This team will make the playoffs!!!!!! Why do they need to be 6-0. Because so may teams have won superbowls underfeated, do your self a favor bub and go back and look at the past 10 years and tell me what seeds have won superbowls. The #1 seed is over rated, its better to go into the playoffs hot. The Patriots have played like complete crap and they still have the 3rd best record in the AFC, and the Pats have a ton of room to grow. They will get better but they don't have to be perfect during week 7 or 8. 

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    2012 Patriots Fans . . . Complacent, Soft.  (Mighty and Maine, excepted, of course.)

     

     

    (Actually, complacent is probably better replaced with "hysterical")

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to ccnsd's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Texas Pat said he could see it in Brady's eyes he no longer had the will to win in 2008 after watching Brady play less than a half. I agree that the Pats should pass more but knowing how hard a man works or his desire to succeed after watching him only 3 hours a week is laughable. The fact that certain players are not playing as good as you would like does not make them "soft".  

    [/QUOTE]

    RESPONSE: Your post above is what's laughable. What labels would you attach to a team that consistently tanks in the 4th quarter of games? Tough? Determined? Clutch??

         LOL!!!  

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to ipotnyc's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Regular season wins has EVERYTHING to do with making the playoffs.  In 2008 11-5 wasn't good enough.  In other years (see: Seattle) 8-8 is good enough. 

    Yes, this team, even playing beneath it's capabilities, should be 6-0 or 5-1.  But, it isn't.  It's 4-3. You don't lose to the Cards at home and you don't blow double digit leads in the 4th qtr to Seattle.


    So, you go out and beat the Rams on Sunday.  You play them as if you're playing the Rams of 2001.  You play as if they are a must win.  You do that, win, and then as a team you start feeling really good about yourself, about your effort and its result.

     RESPONSE: The Pats should smash the Rams. But, the way they're playing right now, the game is a toss up. You know that their pass "D" is going to make Sam Bradford look like the second coming of Johnny Unitas.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    2012 Patriots Fans . . . Complacent, Soft.  (Mighty and Maine, excepted, of course.)

     (Actually, complacent is probably better replaced with "hysterical")

    [/QUOTE]

    RESPONSE: Is it an act of hysteria to criticize your favorite team for constantly tanking it in the 4th quarter? If the Jets were doing the 4th quarter el foldos, I doubt that you or others would be be defending them.

         Futhermore, is it an act of hysteria to criticize a team with the talent that the Pats' have, after loses to the likes of Arizona, QBed by Kevin Kolb, or Seattle, QBed by Russell Wilson?...and after being lucky to barely beat the punchless Jets?

         Week 8 is coming up. This is not Week 3. There's legitimate reason for concern.   

     

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Sam-Adams. Show Sam-Adams's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

         Had to take a break a vent. I've never been so disappointed in Tom Brady til I read his whine about how the Pats have spoiled the fans, and how winning in the NFL is hard. Oh...boo-hoo, Tom: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/10/22/tom-brady-maybe-we-spoiled-people/ 

         Is isn't like this team is losing close games to the NY Giants, Packers, or 49ers. They are having a tough time with lightweights, such as the Cardinals, Seahawks, and, yesterday, the Jets. This team is consistently failing to stick the dagger in these weaklings...allowing them to hang around. They were within an inch of blowing out the Ravens in Baltimore.

         So...whats' wrong with the Patriots?

    1.) OC Josh McDaniels: The Pats can't seem to decide whether to be a smash mouth team, or to go back to the spread offense that has worked so well over the past several seasons. This indecisiveness reflects in the play-calling, and has rendered the offense far less aggressive and dynamic. Tom Brady has, and always has been, best in the shot-gun. The running game should be used as a diversionary tactic to the staple passing attack. Draws and screens are fine. But, shortening the game with the run allows inferior teams to hand around. The Pats, with their firepower, should be blowing teams like the Seahawks and Jets away. There's little chance for 4th quarter heroics when a team is down 3 TDs;

    Tex, one other thing I've seen is it seems like they feature one player on certain drives and it's completely transparaent. Three is a row to Ridley or Gronk or two passes in a row to Lloyd. At the end of the day you see an overall decent balance between run/pass but during the game it isn't balanced. They need to get back to quick slot passes/screens on first, give it to Ridley on second and see what you have on third and make the call then. 

    2.) Tom Brady: The guy is hearing footsteps...which is affecting his accuracy. Never Mr. Mobility, Tom isn't very good behind the center. Teams know that when Tom goes behind the center, that it's a running play. He's best in the shotgun. Turn him loose! He's a Hall of Fame QB! Why aren't the Pats putting the game in his hands, rather than in the hands of RB Stevan Ridley and the "D"??

    They turned him loose in Seattle with 56 attempts and that didn't work either. Mankins being out doesn't help, I don't think he truly trusts the line like he has in the past.

    3.) DB Coach Josh Boyer: Can somebody please tell me why this guy still has a job? The secondary is awful for the 2nd straight year. For whatever reason, he's not getting the best out of his guys. Even when a coach is given lemons to work with, his job is to make lemonaide;

    I agree uhnless he isn't failing in BB's eyes. Is this part of the bend don't break coaching style BB covets so much and it's just not working in the red zone like it's supposed to? 

    4.) Conditioning: The Pats repeatedly are dying in the 4th quarter. Could this be a reason?

    The offense more so I think. There seems to be a definate lack of intensity to put games away when they can and it breathes life into teams that should normally be put down early in the third!

    5.) This Team Isn't Hungry: Other teams appear to want it more. The 2012 Pats are constantly allowing teams to come from behind and beat them;

    Agreed

    6.) Where is BB?: I can't believe BB isn't going off on his guys. They haven't looked like the Patriots all season;

    Did he ever?

    7.) Brandon Lloyd: Time for McDaniels to  go back to the Billy O'Brien (remember him?) offense, and stop worrying about making Lloyd happy. He's a complimentary piece...nothing more;

    Agreed, he should get a quick look and only be thrown to if open or to set something else up.

    8.) Pass Rush?: Horrible. Guys like Mark Sanchez and, God help us...Russell Wison, are being made to look like Joe Montana. This team has one guy who can pressure the QB...Chandler Jones. Blitzes, anybody?

    Bend don't break......that's all I hear but if you're constantly bent over you don't need to break to have people drive right over the top of you. They need 1 freaking safety with a brain who knows when/where to bring the weakside pain!

    9.) DBs: Still a disaster...and still get beaten deep on a regular basis (see Josh Boyer, above);

    Are they being coached this way?

    10.) Lack of Leadership: Spare me about how winning is hard, Tom. After that debacle in Seattle Tom, in which the likes of Richard Sherman did everything but spit in your face...I really expected this team to destroy the Jets. But no...it was the usual, tepid, go through the motions, and let them hang around, performance. Such play hasn't been seen in these parts since 2002. Other than Brandon Spikes, I see no player willing to take the bull by the horns, and get this thing turned around. This team has far to much talent to be playing this way. The only thing that appears to stand in the way of them and another SB appearance is their unwillingness to pay the price to win, and Houston's 6'8" DE, J.J. Watts.

         Where have you gone, Rodney Harrison, Tedy Bruschi, and Willie McGinest?       

    [/QUOTE]


    I agree......Clay Matthews doesn't just run into the backs of people and say whatever....he finds a way to get around corners and get to the ball. The Pats have a few guys willing to do this but I don't see an equal level of effort being demonstrated. If they don't all buy min and start getting more pressure on opposing QB's you ca n forget about seeing JJ Watts in the playoffs.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    RESPONSE: The Pats didn't run out of steam during those years. In 2007, they ran into a white-hot N.Y. Giants' team, who rode a supranatural catch, and a major media  distraction, to beat them. In 2009, they lost Wes Welker in the final game of the season, and were beaten by a better Ravens' team. In 2010, they played an awful game and were out-coached in their loss to the Jets. Last year, they were great. Only some hard luck (untimely Gronk injury), and a very good N.Y. Giants' team stopped them from winning it all.

    [/QUOTE]

    TEX u gotta drop that media distraction nonsense-its ridiculous and straw clutching

    RESPONSE: Yeah, right. The 2007 Pats played their absolute worst game of the season in SB 42. Yet the king-size distraction of Spygate II, strategically delivered on the eve of the big game by the NY media, had absolutely no effect on the Pats....LOL!!!

         Time to remove those royal blue colored glasses, and get real. 

    [/QUOTE]


     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to Sam-Adams's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

         Had to take a break a vent. I've never been so disappointed in Tom Brady til I read his whine about how the Pats have spoiled the fans, and how winning in the NFL is hard. Oh...boo-hoo, Tom: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/10/22/tom-brady-maybe-we-spoiled-people/ 

         Is isn't like this team is losing close games to the NY Giants, Packers, or 49ers. They are having a tough time with lightweights, such as the Cardinals, Seahawks, and, yesterday, the Jets. This team is consistently failing to stick the dagger in these weaklings...allowing them to hang around. They were within an inch of blowing out the Ravens in Baltimore.

         So...whats' wrong with the Patriots?

    1.) OC Josh McDaniels: The Pats can't seem to decide whether to be a smash mouth team, or to go back to the spread offense that has worked so well over the past several seasons. This indecisiveness reflects in the play-calling, and has rendered the offense far less aggressive and dynamic. Tom Brady has, and always has been, best in the shot-gun. The running game should be used as a diversionary tactic to the staple passing attack. Draws and screens are fine. But, shortening the game with the run allows inferior teams to hand around. The Pats, with their firepower, should be blowing teams like the Seahawks and Jets away. There's little chance for 4th quarter heroics when a team is down 3 TDs;

    Tex, one other thing I've seen is it seems like they feature one player on certain drives and it's completely transparaent. Three is a row to Ridley or Gronk or two passes in a row to Lloyd. At the end of the day you see an overall decent balance between run/pass but during the game it isn't balanced. They need to get back to quick slot passes/screens on first, give it to Ridley on second and see what you have on third and make the call then. 

    2.) Tom Brady: The guy is hearing footsteps...which is affecting his accuracy. Never Mr. Mobility, Tom isn't very good behind the center. Teams know that when Tom goes behind the center, that it's a running play. He's best in the shotgun. Turn him loose! He's a Hall of Fame QB! Why aren't the Pats putting the game in his hands, rather than in the hands of RB Stevan Ridley and the "D"??

    They turned him loose in Seattle with 56 attempts and that didn't work either. Mankins being out doesn't help, I don't think he truly trusts the line like he has in the past.

    3.) DB Coach Josh Boyer: Can somebody please tell me why this guy still has a job? The secondary is awful for the 2nd straight year. For whatever reason, he's not getting the best out of his guys. Even when a coach is given lemons to work with, his job is to make lemonaide;

    I agree uhnless he isn't failing in BB's eyes. Is this part of the bend don't break coaching style BB covets so much and it's just not working in the red zone like it's supposed to? 

    4.) Conditioning: The Pats repeatedly are dying in the 4th quarter. Could this be a reason?

    The offense more so I think. There seems to be a definate lack of intensity to put games away when they can and it breathes life into teams that should normally be put down early in the third!

    5.) This Team Isn't Hungry: Other teams appear to want it more. The 2012 Pats are constantly allowing teams to come from behind and beat them;

    Agreed

    6.) Where is BB?: I can't believe BB isn't going off on his guys. They haven't looked like the Patriots all season;

    Did he ever?

    7.) Brandon Lloyd: Time for McDaniels to  go back to the Billy O'Brien (remember him?) offense, and stop worrying about making Lloyd happy. He's a complimentary piece...nothing more;

    Agreed, he should get a quick look and only be thrown to if open or to set something else up.

    8.) Pass Rush?: Horrible. Guys like Mark Sanchez and, God help us...Russell Wison, are being made to look like Joe Montana. This team has one guy who can pressure the QB...Chandler Jones. Blitzes, anybody?

    Bend don't break......that's all I hear but if you're constantly bent over you don't need to break to have people drive right over the top of you. They need 1 freaking safety with a brain who knows when/where to bring the weakside pain!

    9.) DBs: Still a disaster...and still get beaten deep on a regular basis (see Josh Boyer, above);

    Are they being coached this way?

    10.) Lack of Leadership: Spare me about how winning is hard, Tom. After that debacle in Seattle Tom, in which the likes of Richard Sherman did everything but spit in your face...I really expected this team to destroy the Jets. But no...it was the usual, tepid, go through the motions, and let them hang around, performance. Such play hasn't been seen in these parts since 2002. Other than Brandon Spikes, I see no player willing to take the bull by the horns, and get this thing turned around. This team has far to much talent to be playing this way. The only thing that appears to stand in the way of them and another SB appearance is their unwillingness to pay the price to win, and Houston's 6'8" DE, J.J. Watts.

         Where have you gone, Rodney Harrison, Tedy Bruschi, and Willie McGinest?       

    [/QUOTE]


    I agree......Clay Matthews doesn't just run into the backs of people and say whatever....he finds a way to get around corners and get to the ball. The Pats have a few guys willing to do this but I don't see an equal level of effort being demonstrated. If they don't all buy min and start getting more pressure on opposing QB's you ca n forget about seeing JJ Watts in the playoffs.

    [/QUOTE]

         Agreed. I don't see this team playing with a sense of urgency.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from AZPAT. Show AZPAT's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to maine12's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to AZPAT's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to maine12's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I really wish the Pats would play there best football in weeks 3-10. So all the fools on this board could be happy. 4-3 is the third best record in the AFC and the Pats havn't played a good game yet this year. Its better to click as a team going into the playoffs, rather than week 7. Save your drama for your mama all you homers. This team is a superbowl caliber team and its fine with me if they are not in perfect form during week 7. The season is not even half way through yet!!!!! I REMEMBER YOU ALL INCLUDING TP WRITING THEM OFF LAST YEAR AROUND WEEK 10. 

    [/QUOTE]

     


     "4-3 is the third best record in the AFC"

    Really? Is this the best you got? REALLY??? This bunch has the talent to be 6-0, but not enough between the ears to get there. With the toughest part of their schedule coming up, this bunch of underperformers could end uo 8-8, which could be the 6th best record in the AFC. Problem is, and it needs to be points out to you, this doesn't get them in to the playoffs.

    Wonder what the excuses would be then, if they play the same way?

    [/QUOTE]


    Haha the Pats toughest part of the schedule is coming up??????? They play the Rams(who stink), HAVE A BYE, play the Bills, play the Colts, Dolphins, and Jets. Thats tough??? haha none of them have winning records. Yeah AZPat you heard me right I dont care how many regular season wins we have. The fact is I know the Pats will make the playoffs, what matters to me is if they are playing good at the end of the season. The sun must be doing its damage down south on TP and AZPat as both are panicking. Someone get them a beer.

    [/QUOTE]

    Let's take a look at the remaining QB's the Pats will face. Then, you can tell us all abiut "guaranteed" wins, and not caring about regular season wins, and the fact that the Pats will make the playoffs. (Funny, I can remember the time when making the playoffs wasn't the goal.... SB wins was. Wonder why you stop short of predicting another SB victory....). Now, keep in mind how the Pats made the Card's, Bills, and Seahawks QB'd look like HOF candidates, and what Fa\lacco did to them, and how the Pats  DB single handedly revived Sanchize's season.  

    They have the following QB'd on tap: Fitzpatrick, Sanchize (both once more), Schaub (Houston), Luck (Colts) Bradford (Rams), Smith (49'ers), and Tannehill (Fins, 2X's). Even adding Gabbert (Jags) to this collective produces the following averages: 1449 passing yards per QB, 8.5 TD's, 5.75 INT's, 219 YPG, and 59% completion. Undeniable facts: 1) the Pats DB's WILL be facing these guys  2) The Pat's DB's have a proven track record of being gashed on deep routes (check out that they have given up more plays fro 20 or more yards so far this year than ALL of last year)  3) The Pats DB's have the ability to turn a corpse with no arms into a viable HOF candidate  4) the Pats DB's have done nothing to show that they are improving under any circumstances so far this season. All this is just on teh defensive side of the ball. I have't addreessed the matter of the Brady Bunch being "no shows" once the 4th Qtr starts.

    So, you be a delusional as you want to be or as rosey glassed as you can. Realistic Pats fans knows that their performance to date means that it'll be a bumpy ride from here on oiut,a nd the quality of QB's they face, in combination with their deplorable DB play, makes for many heart stopping moments. Hey, look at it this way. Stopping our hearts may be just about the ONKY thing the DB's can stop! Before I put stock in this bunch, they need to PROVE to me that they can get the job done, handily, on both sides of the ball for a full 60 minutes. Until then..... sorry, 4-3 is avg at best (and only a game lead in their division, which is deplorable).

    We'll chat after week 17.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonSportsFan111. Show BostonSportsFan111's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    2012 Patriots Fans . . . Complacent, Soft.  (Mighty and Maine, excepted, of course.)

     

     

    (Actually, complacent is probably better replaced with "hysterical")

    [/QUOTE]

    +100, add WHINY AND ENTITLED. Brady had it right. His little boys probably don't whine as much as some of the posters on here.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

     * 

     

     

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: 2012 Patriots Complacent, Soft

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to BostonSportsFan111's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    +100, add WHINY AND ENTITLED. Brady had it right. His little boys probably don't whine as much as some of the posters on here.

    [/QUOTE]

         Oh yes...please forgive us for getting upset whenever the Pats lose to the likes of the Cardinals and Seahawks, are lucky to eek out a win over the punchless Jets, and show a propensity for tanking in the 4th quarter of games.

         Time for Brady and the boys to stop WHINING about "how hard it is to win in the NFL", and about fan criticism. Time for this team to step up and do something to silence their critics. This team has far too much talent to be a mediocre club. Talk about feeling ENTITLED, it's time for this team to stop thinking that all they have to do to win is just to show up, or to play 3 good quarters of football.        

    /QUOTE]


     
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