***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! THANKS TO ALL WHO PARTICIPATED!

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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    Faucet Don't know if Ryan Broyles will last to pick 93 and be on PUP after his workout at Sooners today. Courtesy of ESPN. Has had an excellent recovery from ACLU apparently........... What round now?
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    Faucet PS .....Pats were listed as having a scout there.............
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    On Jenkins...no way I touch him in the draft unless he does a vontaze burfict and slides all the way to round 7 or udfa.sure he is one heck of a corner but the kid has many a problem that I don't think BB and the pats will be able to manage. Why waste a high pick on him? It's not only talent and scheme fit we should be evaluating but also chemistry and decision making and the kid strikes out on both big time.
    Posted by PatsLifer


    we shall see
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12! : we shall see
    Posted by bredbru

    The latest report from mutliple teams is that Jenkins admitted to continuing to smoke pot at N Ala, contray to what was previous reported. It seems he continued his ways that got him kicked out of Florida. You can point to a number of things BB hates but not learning from your mistakes and continuing to repeat them is a pretty big one. If Jenkins showed that much lack of control after being tossed out of Florida in commiting the same mistakes I don't think BB will take the risk

    "Sources from multiple NFL teams tell NFL Network's Albert Breer that Janoris Jenkins will fall out of the first round due to events following the former Florida star's exit from Gainesville.
    Jenkins has admitted to teams that he continued to smoke pot at North Alabama last season. One AFC personnel director believes Jenkins' biggest problem is that he "doesn't see the error of his ways." Added an AFC scout, "He's not a bad person. He just makes a lot of dumb, dumb mistakes. He just smokes, and (has sex) ... And there's just awful decision-making associated with that." From a pure football perspective, personnel executives rank Jenkins behind only LSU's Morris Claiborne at cornerback"

     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12! : The latest report from mutliple teams is that Jenkins admitted to continuing to smoke pot at N Ala, contray to what was previous reported. It seems he continued his ways that got him kicked out of Florida. You can point to a number of things BB hates but not learning from your mistakes and continuing to repeat them is a pretty big one. If Jenkins showed that much lack of control after being tossed out of Florida in commiting the same mistakes I don't think BB will take the risk " Sources from multiple NFL teams tell NFL Network's Albert Breer that Janoris Jenkins will fall out of the first round due to events following the former Florida star's exit from Gainesville. Jenkins has admitted to teams that he continued to smoke pot at North Alabama last season. One AFC personnel director believes Jenkins' biggest problem is that he "doesn't see the error of his ways." Added an AFC scout, "He's not a bad person. He just makes a lot of dumb, dumb mistakes. He just smokes, and (has sex) ... And there's just awful decision-making associated with that." From a pure football perspective, personnel executives rank Jenkins behind only LSU's Morris Claiborne at cornerback"
    Posted by PatsEng


    Wow, the more that comes out about this kid (close to the draft or not) the more I'm thinking about removing this kid from my board completely.  Thanks, PE.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    I think the resigning of Connolly/Koppen all by ends any chance of BB targeting Konz, will prob remove him from my board now.

     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    If Belichick were to take a flyer on a WR in the 3rd, why not Broyles at this point?  Besides B. Lloyd and Welker, he's got as much a chance at making this team as Gonzo, Stallworth and Edelman.  Even if he's PUP'd, he's a much better WR to carry forward than Tate or C. Jackson ever were. 

     
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    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    If Belichick were to take a flyer on a WR in the 3rd, why not Broyles at this point?  Besides B. Lloyd and Welker, he's got as much a chance at making this team as Gonzo, Stallworth and Edelman.  Even if he's PUP'd, he's a much better WR to carry forward than Tate or C. Jackson ever were. 
    Posted by ShiningWizard


    I'm sure he'll be in the discussion.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    Won't be PUP'd after his workout ......see what he did five months after doing ACL. Love Pats to get him......dunno what round now....
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***

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    If you only had pick 27 (31 traded) and these are the guys available which of these do you take? Reyes DE/DT Smith S Hill WR C. Jones DE/OLB McClellin DE/OLB Jenkins CB Why do I keep thinking Reyes be nice but Smith is my choice, I really like the kid.  He IMO falls into the 4 down category BB looks for in 1st rounders the other one McClellin but is he a day one 4 down guy?
    Posted by Pats7393


    the latest USA Today sports weekly had Smith all the way down to  #50 and McCllelein at 31 ... if only this would happen! 
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***:
    Afternoon Boys, Below is my Mock V3, this will be my last projection until Draft Day. As you all probably know by now, Mark Barron is the top player on my board and has been since very early on.  I’m also realistic to the fact that he’ll prob be off the board when NE is slotted to select at both 27 and 31, if he isn’t, he’s my guy.  ü   The top of my Rd 1 Board today looks like this, though I think all too will likely be gone by 27/31:    S- Mark  Barron DL- Fletcher Cox DL- Michael Brockers OLB- Courtney Upshaw CB- Dre Kirkpatrick  ü   I’m also of the belief that when all is said and done, BB will likely have traded one of, if not both of his Rd 1 picks due to some combo of maybe moving up into the early 20’s to draft a player that is sliding a bit and/or to move back to acquire more picks for this year and the future as he seems to do every year. With that being said, below is my projection, not factoring in potential trades:  27- Dont’a Hightower- LB- Alabama - If the others are gone and this kid’s on the board, I think he makes too much sense for them.   A lot of experience against elite competition, has excellent upside as an edge rusher, is well versed in a BB style 34 scheme, kid also has good size, improved movement ability (another year removed from surgery) is versatile and IMO can play any LB position in both 34 & 43 sets and also has some value as a rush end in a 43 set.  Alternative: Stephon Gilmore- CB/S- South Carolina. 31 - Kendall Reyes- DL- UConn - Very good character/team captain, good size and athleticism, scheme diverse and has a big motor.  He’s another kid that fits the Patriot’s player profile and I think he’d be an excellent addition upfront.  Alternatives:  Shea McClellin- OLB/ILB/DE- Boise State. / Doug Martin- RB- Boise State.   48 - Harrison Smith- S- ND - Very good size, moves well, very instinctive and always around the football, good ball skills, good tackler with knockout potential, has the ability to play in the deep half/third as well as down in the box and is very strong is run support.  He’s also a team leader/captain with very good character; another great fit in NE. Alternatives: Josh Robinson- CB- UCF / Brandon Thompson- DL- Clemson.   62 - Jayron Hosley- CB- VT - Elite instincts and ball skills in the passing game, projects as an excellent zone CB at the NFL level and brings added value in the return game…  kid has big play potential as both a defender and return man.  He's not big, but doesn't shy away from contact and gives good effort in run support. Alternatives:  Bobby Massie- OT- Ole Miss / Amini Silatolu- OG- Midwestern State.   93 - Senio Kelemete- OG/OT- Washington - Versatile kid that’s played OT and OG during his time at UW, he’s also an athletic kid that moves very well for his size, plays with aggression and nastiness, can pull/play in space and would look great at OG across from Mankins. Alternatives:  Cam Johnson- OLB/DE- Virginia / Marvin Jones- WR- Cal. / Derek Wolfe- DL- Cincinnati / George Iloka- S- Boise State.   126 - Greg Childs- WR- Arkansas - This would be a great value pick IMO, as the kid has Rd 1/2 talent (he could also be an option in Rd 3).  Very good size/speed combo, good quicks and RAC ability, physical player with upside as a blocker and isn’t afraid to work the middle of the field.  He’s also well schooled in a pro-style offense and BB should be familiar with him due to time spent scouting Ryan Mallet. Alternatives:  Devon Wylie- WR- Fresno State / Ron Brooks CB/S LSU / Jake Bequette- DE/OLB- Arkansas / Joe Adams- WR/RS- Arkansas.
    Posted by mbeaulieu07

    Nice mock but I heard PIT is all over Hightower if he's there at 24.  They lost Farrior and Foote is getting up there and their biggest need is in the middle of their defense be it a NT or MLB.  They might even go with a OLB pass rusher given the value they place on them but everyone in PIT is screaming for Hightower.

    I don't see Harrison Smith lasting until 48.  I don't think there is a snow ball's chance of that happening given the lack of good S in this draft.  I have real concerns that he get past BAL but they will probably take Konz if he's there. 

    BB tends to "get his player" which makes me think he'll take him at 27 or 31 and trade the other pick or at least move it back to get Smith.  Our needs are too great IMO not to take a real S and I won't be surprised if we took a S and a CB, Jenkins and Smith at the top of our board.
     
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    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** : Nice mock but I heard PIT is all over Hightower if he's there at 24.  They lost Farrior and Foote is getting up there and their biggest need is in the middle of their defense be it a NT or MLB.  They might even go with a OLB pass rusher given the value they place on them but everyone in PIT is screaming for Hightower. I don't see Harrison Smith lasting until 48.  I don't think there is a snow ball's chance of that happening given the lack of good S in this draft.  I have real concerns that he get past BAL but they will probably take Konz if he's there.  BB tends to "get his player" which makes me think he'll take him at 27 or 31 and trade the other pick or at least move it back to get Smith.  Our needs are too great IMO not to take a real S and I won't be surprised if we took a S and a CB, Jenkins and Smith at the top of our board.
    Posted by Faucetman


    Thanks, Faucet.

    Wouldn't suprise me at all to see Hightower off the board at 24 or Smith land in NE in Rd 1 (kid's a Top 50 player in this class)... I'm as high on both players as anyone.

    I'm in agreeance that (based on their current roster) they really do have to come out of this draft with one of the top S, or atleast one of Barron, Smith or Iloka... maybe Martin.

    I'm still holding out hope that Barron is in play in the 20's and they make a move to get him.  We'll soon know, ha.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

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    Faucet Don't know if Ryan Broyles will last to pick 93 and be on PUP after his workout at Sooners today. Courtesy of ESPN. Has had an excellent recovery from ACLU apparently........... What round now?
    Posted by sydpat

    We could get him for sure at 62 but there are other options for the slot.  I love TY Hilton.  I could see the kids from Arkansas, Joe Adams and Jarius Wright, being effective in the slot and return game.  Then there's Wylie from Fresno.  We don't have use a high draft pick for a slot receiver, heck the two best in the game today were undrafted.

    I'm also back in love with LaMichael James.  Woodhead will be a free agent after this season and his production was way down last year and he was not effective in the return game.  I'd rather get James at 62 then one of the other guys I mentioned at 93.

    I think the signing of Koppen for that big of a deal means we are set on the OL.  The most we would carry on the 53 man roster is 9 and we are already there, 10 if you count Light, so even though we have a couple of old dudes, I think we have enough depth and youth to not go there in this draft because we don't have a place to put a draft pick. 

    I also believe we are set at WR except for a slot guy who can play special teams.  I don't see us getting a big body receiver this year.  We are set at QB and TE so really we should only be looking at slot receiver and perhaps RB for offense, our other 4 picks should go defense.

    So, if we are talking Offense, Slot and RB.  If we don't go with a guy like James then a big back that can help pound it between the tackles and catch, like Doug Martin.  But I think it a long slot we take a RB at all.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    If Belichick were to take a flyer on a WR in the 3rd, why not Broyles at this point?  Besides B. Lloyd and Welker, he's got as much a chance at making this team as Gonzo, Stallworth and Edelman.  Even if he's PUP'd, he's a much better WR to carry forward than Tate or C. Jackson ever were. 
    Posted by ShiningWizard

    PUP-inghim to start makes him that much more attractive since we don't need to count him against the 53.  We've got Welker for this year, then Broyles with a year of learning and rehabing.  I think it has merit.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12! : The latest report from mutliple teams is that Jenkins admitted to continuing to smoke pot at N Ala, contray to what was previous reported. It seems he continued his ways that got him kicked out of Florida. You can point to a number of things BB hates but not learning from your mistakes and continuing to repeat them is a pretty big one. If Jenkins showed that much lack of control after being tossed out of Florida in commiting the same mistakes I don't think BB will take the risk " Sources from multiple NFL teams tell NFL Network's Albert Breer that Janoris Jenkins will fall out of the first round due to events following the former Florida star's exit from Gainesville. Jenkins has admitted to teams that he continued to smoke pot at North Alabama last season. One AFC personnel director believes Jenkins' biggest problem is that he "doesn't see the error of his ways." Added an AFC scout, "He's not a bad person. He just makes a lot of dumb, dumb mistakes. He just smokes, and (has sex) ... And there's just awful decision-making associated with that." From a pure football perspective, personnel executives rank Jenkins behind only LSU's Morris Claiborne at cornerback"
    Posted by PatsEng

    Didn't see this until I wrote about Jenkins.  Yeah, this drops him like a stone.  2 round drop minimum then the value becomes too great that someone will take him in the 3rd.  If Mallett, a first round pick, dropped to the 3rd because of pot and Hernandez, a 2nd round pick that went in the fourth, Jenkins in the mid 3rd seems about right.  Hmm, we seem to not mind the pot part of it so much.  Jenkins at 62 even would be a steal if we can straighen him out.

    One of BB's best friends is Bon Jovi.  You can't tell me old Bill and he didn't light up a big Bob Marley on the "V Rings" off Nantucket once or twice with no one around, LOL
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    Smith wont go out of the 1st round. Kid is good, one of my favorites. Watched tape on him, just what we need. Pats dont need another Cornerback in the 1st round, we need a a great Safety. Whether its Barron, or Smith. This is important to this team.
    Posted by bobbysu


    i am going to go on record and say that 1st round is too high for him. he has some physical talent, but i don't think he is a good S, at least not yet, especially against the passing game.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12! : Why? Im not debating you, just a a good way of playing something that looks like you might not be interested. Maybe he falls, because other team look at boards, and say Pats wont go for him. Thats when you make your move. Just saying. Always like reading this stuff here. Faucetman , you, everybody. Thanks.
    Posted by bobbysu


    My opinion is based on the fact that they have resigned both of their centers and Konz will likely be off the board at or before pick 48.  He's the clear cut top center in this class so I don't see him dropping far.  I like the kid a lot and have had him on my board for quite a while, but I've removed him to make room for another player that may make more positional/roster sense on Day 1/2.  I'm trying to keep my Rd 1-4 board at or below 40 prospects. 

    Welcome, happy to contribute.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12! : Didn't see this until I wrote about Jenkins.  Yeah, this drops him like a stone.  2 round drop minimum then the value becomes too great that someone will take him in the 3rd.  If Mallett, a first round pick, dropped to the 3rd because of pot and Hernandez, a 2nd round pick that went in the fourth, Jenkins in the mid 3rd seems about right.  Hmm, we seem to not mind the pot part of it so much.  Jenkins at 62 even would be a steal if we can straighen him out. One of BB's best friends is Bon Jovi.  You can't tell me old Bill and he didn't light up a big Bob Marley on the "V Rings" off Nantucket once or twice with no one around, LOL
    Posted by Faucetman


    It's more then just the pot though. It's multiple arrests and fail tests over 3 yrs, being kicked of a Florida team (something Hern never came close to), walked out on his team after a post game speech by his coaching, fought on the field getting suspended (ala Meri), fought off the field to get arrested, has 4 kids with 3 women (ala Cro which is the reason he was tossed off SD and contract issues with the Jets).

    If it was just pot then to me not a big deal but a pattern has emerged and it points out a number of flaws that BB tends to stay away from:

     - Lack of self control
     - Inability to understand the consequences of ones actions
     - Inability to learn from ones mistakes
     - Inability to prevents ones mistakes
     - Immaturity
     - Self centered
     - Lying (told media he gave up smoking pot after Florida for his kids when he really didn't)
     - Not a team player (from suspension for fighting as well as walking out after post game speech on teammates and coach)

    those are some big character concerns that BB doesn't typically except, esp never learning from his own mistakes and repeating the same mistakes
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    Smith wont go out of the 1st round. Kid is good, one of my favorites. Watched tape on him, just what we need. Pats dont need another Cornerback in the 1st round, we need a a great Safety. Whether its Barron, or Smith. This is important to this team.
    Posted by bobbysu

    Looks like Gregg Bedard agrees with us.  Been saying this for a few weeks now.

    27. Patriots (from New Orleans): S Harrison Smith, Notre Dame - Figure the Patriots to trade one of their two picks to continue collecting draft picks in perpetuity. Smith fits everything the Patriots look for in a safety and they need the depth this season and beyond.


    The biggest weakness on this team is our secondary and it wasn't addressed in F/A.  I think Harrison Smith is exactly what we need since Barron will be long gone.  Too early at 27, perhaps?  I think we could get him at 31 but BAL is a risk to take him so what are 4 spots to ensure you get the guy who can help you most? 

    Like many or you, I like other guys more too but I don't see a bigger hole on this team than S.  I haven't watched as many ND games as a lot of you, especially Mb, but watching the kid move at the Combine, listening to Mayock raving about him and reading up on him as a person has sold me.  We do so many different things on defense and we have been missing a big physical presence back there since the other Harrison (Rodney) retired, that I think Smith is the logical, albeit, not popular choice.

    The kid hits, he's smart, he's an emotional leader, he is an absolute tackling machine and is better in coverage then people give him credit for.  He can cover the TEs, which is huge because we got burned a lot last year by even average TEs. 

    I like Smith at 27 to ensure we fill our biggest hole.  I would then take Jenkins at 62, pot and all, if he's there.  Those two picks which are totally reasonable would dramatically improve our 2nd worst passing defense in the history of the NFL. 
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    Jenkins is falling, and no team wants him. Pats will not grab this guy. Moore is better. At least at this point. Geez College to Pros, wake up Kirkpatrick another story.
    Posted by bobbysu

    I hear you but not so sure about that.  Mallett, Hernandez?  See a pattern there?

    If this kid is there at 62 it would be hard to pass on him.  He's the best cover corner in the draft and we don't have any corners that can cover.  Late 2nd for a mid 1st talent represents a lot of value/risk v. reward.  I bet we could even trade 62 down to about 75 and still get him. 
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12! : It's more then just the pot though. It's multiple arrests and fail tests over 3 yrs, being kicked of a Florida team (something Hern never came close to), walked out on his team after a post game speech by his coaching, fought on the field getting suspended (ala Meri), fought off the field to get arrested, has 4 kids with 3 women (ala Cro which is the reason he was tossed off SD and contract issues with the Jets). If it was just pot then to me not a big deal but a pattern has emerged and it points out a number of flaws that BB tends to stay away from:  - Lack of self control  - Inability to understand the consequences of ones actions  - Inability to learn from ones mistakes  - Inability to prevents ones mistakes  - Immaturity  - Self centered  - Lying (told media he gave up smoking pot after Florida for his kids when he really didn't)  - Not a team player (from suspension for fighting as well as walking out after post game speech on teammates and coach) those are some big character concerns that BB doesn't typically except, esp never learning from his own mistakes and repeating the same mistakes
    Posted by PatsEng

    Those are serious matters but most of it stems from smoking weed and covering it up.  The kid is immature.  He needs a mentor.  Maybe he'll fall to 93.  If he does, certainly he's worth the chance.  We haven't had any luck in the 3rd round for awhile.  Having a bunch of kids isn't that unusual with some of these guys, not intended to be a racist remark but a bunch of players coming out of college already have kids and with multiple women.

    I was very critical of the kid if you go back and look.  I said no way in the first round but late 2nd or better yet, late 3rd, he's worth rolling the dice.
     
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