***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! THANKS TO ALL WHO PARTICIPATED!

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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    Interesting report from Reiss. This tells me a couple of thing 1) They have a list of players they might be targeting but won't jump up large in order to get one. The reason being that they have targeted 5-6 players that could fall in the 20+ pick range. Though it also tells me that if a player gets within reach they might move up for them 2) They are primarily focused on D first and foremost Now, with Jones I can't see it being anything more then a smoke screen if realized. He's to raw, lack of production, and doesn't have a great burst/fluidity to fit what they typically look for in a OLB/DE Though I hear what people are saying about Smith he's just to much like Chung for me to consider as a coverage FS Here's the report: " ESPN Boston's Mike Reiss feels that Alabama S Mark Barron is atop the Patriots' list as a first-round possibility. Reiss also lists LSU DL Michael Brockers, Syracuse DE Chandler Jones, Alabama DE/OLB Courtney Upshaw, Boise State OLB Shea McClellin, and Notre Dame S Harrison Smith as possibilities. Barron won't make it all the way to the Patriots at pick No. 27, but Reiss suggests they could trade up to the 10-to-13 range. If not, two or three of the other names on Reiss' list should be available. Rotoworld's Evan Silva has New England taking McClellin in his latest mock draft."
    Posted by PatsEng


    re"
    Though I hear what people are saying about Smith he's just to much like Chung for me to consider as a coverage FS
    "

    thanks for acknowledging.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    In assessing team needs at 28, 29 and 30 GB needs safety help.  Charlie Peprah was torched on a weekly basis and Nick Collins' career could be over.  We already discussed BAL needing to find Ed Reed's replacement soon but they would probably take Konz as a more immediate need.  Still, the risk is too great to pass on Smith at 27 hoping he slips through to 31 so I still think we take him. 27.  S Harrison Smith - Notre Dame It's taking me awhile to warm up to Kendall Reyes at 31 because his production wasn't especially impressive against so-so competition.  However, as a 5 technique he will be asked to occupy blockers allowing the LBs to make plays.  Reyes is one of the more athletic guys at the Combine for his size and could develop into something special in time. 31.  DT Kendall Reyes - UCONN We need a pass rusher.  With the loss of Mark Anderson's 10 sacks and possibly loss of Andre Carter's 10 sacks I'm not comfortable that Trevor Scott can get us more than 5 assuming he stays healthy.  We will likely switch back and forth between 3 and 4 man fronts and Vinny Curry to me is a perfect situational pass rusher who may even be able to stand up a little.  With SD on the clock with the next pick, they are a threat to take Curry even with their recent signing of Jarrett Johnson, who is not a pass rusher. 48.  DE/OLB Vinny Curry  - Marshall There is no way we keep both fullbacks as they are too similar and would only fill a situational role on the team and not expected to get many carries.  Woodhead's production was way off last year plus he becomes a F/A after this season.  Vereen hasn't shown he can stay healthy.  40% of our carries from last year went out the door with BJGE and Faulk.  Ridley projects as the starter but if he continues to put the ball on the ground he could quickly find his way to the bench.  I expect Doug Martin to be gone at this point but one of Wilson, Miller and probably LaMichael James will be there at 62.  James is by far the most prolific and most versatile runner of the three as he led the nation with 1,805 rushing yards at an impressive 7.31 average.  James can also return punts which gives him value on special teams.  James was 3rd in the nation with all purpose yards with 2,175 with 210 receiving yards.  James reminds of Darren Sproles so SD could be looking at him before this point but if he makes it here, he could be an electric player making our offense even more lethal.  If he's gone, either Wilson or Miller would fill the need. 62.  LaMichael James - Oregon With Barrett, Brown and Chung all set to become free agents after 2012 and knowing that Steven Gregory is a long shot to start, let alone make the team, a second pick at safety keeps the trend of taking multiple high picks at positions of need going.  In 2011 we took a pair of RBs and in 2010 a pair of TEs, so with our need so big, it makes sense to do it at safety this year.  Taylor is a 3 year starter at SS in one of the elite SEC programs.  He's essentially a box safety who tackles and hits.  He reads and reacts well.  He's a former team captain and would be a steady back-up to the oft injured Chung allowing us to leave Smith at FS should Chung go down again. 93.  SS Brandon Taylor - LSU The Patriots ranked 19th in the kick off return yards last year.  Their leading return man, Danny Woodhead ranked 33rd.  The Pats also have major question marks at slot receiver after this season with Welker likely to move to greener pastures and Edelman set to become a free agent.  TY Hilton fills both of these needs.  Hilton ranked 8th in the NCAA in kick off return average at 18/548, a 30.44 average.  As a receiver he collected 72/1,038/7.  He also has 4.37 speed.  The concern with Hilton is durability, otherwise he'd be a solid 2nd round pick.  If we get him in the weight room and use him only in the return game for one season, hopefully he can add enough bulk to assume some slot duties in 2013 and beyond. 126. WR TY Hilton
    Posted by Faucetman



    not bad.
    but i like a bigger receiver.
    do you see james as a 3 down back? talented but... who is our 3 down back?
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    current preferred:

    i'll go d. still (top dl available) or mclellin (versatility)

           jenkins or smith (i think jenkins goes to st louis or indy at top of rd 2)
    i think shutdown corner has greater value than safety so if jenkins checks out for bb, i go jenkins. otherwise smith

           3rd pick trade up from 48 to about 40 for alshon jeffery with a mid/late pick from next year and 48 (excited about the idea of this guy on our team. drew double teams constantly, catches the ball anywhere, huge and uncoverable.

    jeffery, gronk, hern, lloyd
    FA-GET-ABOUD-DIT! no stopping them.

           best olb/de left 4th pick (curry?)

           rd 3 d line (martin?)

     4 maybe o line or opposite jenkins smith pick whoever we get ie safety or corner.
       if broyles is there, take him as welker's future replacement

            udfa rb and slot wr ( if we dont get broyles. one sleeper slot wr junior hemingway)
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    my worst case fear:

     bb does his usual, trades down 3 or 4 times and gets a bunch of jags in mid and late rounds and he hopes a couple of them are better than just jags.

    hope he cures his addiction to acculmulating picks as a "need" (they are a means, not the ends).

    and instead allows himself to use the strategy he has created to actually exploit the gain he's made, ie cash in the chips instead of thinking the chips are what its about. you cant eat chips :) onvet tehm to cach and you can eat.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12! : I'm not overly convinced with Chapman truthfully. Given the level of talent around him he greatly under performed imo. He reminds me of Brace playing next to Raji. I don't think he'll be nearly as good without having the talent around him
    Posted by PatsEng


    I don't know what your criteria is for under performing (assuming sack/TFL #'s etc.), but he's a 34 NT, his job is to eat up blocks, occupy space, be strong at the POA... that's what he does well and what he'd be asked to do here.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from pats-fan-2007. Show pats-fan-2007's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    That's exactly my thinking. Blue chip defensive playmakers don't last past the top 15, usually.

    If you draft a DE/OLB at the bottom of the 1st round, your just as likely to get a bust as you are a playmaker.

    I guess you can hedge your bets by drafting a DE/OLB with each of the 3 picks, but I doubt BB will do that.


    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12! : not a lot of playmakers available at 27 and 31. especially on de. only one may be janoris jenkins. on offense there will surely be playmakers at wr of the de players available, they may be decent, good, busts or a playmaker
    Posted by bredbru
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    my head spinner draft. it may not necessarily mirror what bb eventually does, or you may not necessarily like, but i guarantee the quantity of moving parts will be as confusing as bb's

    #27: traded to colts. colts see fleener available after denver surprisingly takes a pass. nwe gets the colts' 2012 #34 and #112

    #31: mb's draft disciples start pulling their hair as bb pulls another trade. big surprise, neither mia nor cle picked up tannehill. jax suddenly finds value in tannehill as backup to gabbert. they need to swoop in given risk of cle finally picking up tannehill at 37. jax gives up thier 2013 first and 2012 #101

    #34: perry and mercillus are still on the board. nwe chooses perry.

    #40: another surprise move by bb. gives up #48 and #126 to draft b thompson at car's #40. reyes was available but bb chooses the DT who can occasionally play inside on 3-front, just like love did in the payoffs.

    #48: already traded to car

    #62: bb trades down to kcc's #74 + kcc's 2013 fourth rounder

    #74: bb picks up an under the radar kid, small school kid - brandon brooks, og. wendell is their only backup G until mankins comes back. insurance comes in a kid who a lot of "pundits" were surprised to not get an invite to the combine. 346 lbs and pretty athletic and proved he can push people around.

    #93: bb picks up another under the radar, small school kid - josh norman, cb. 6ft kid who can cover and has good ball skills. rated around the same as hosley, but has a little bit more cockiness and nastiness. my be flexible enough to play S every now and then. i'm making this up.

    #97: bb picks up mcnutt, WR

    #101: bb picks up miles burris, LB, and calls it a day.

    In summary, pats pickup 6 kids instead of five.

    Nick Perry, DE/OLB
    Brandon Thompson, DT
    Brandon Brooks, OG
    Josh Norman, CB
    Marvin McNutt, WR
    Miles Burris, LB

    In addition they get..
    JAX's 2013 first rounder
    KCC's 2013 fourth rounder

     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    It is a consensus not just here on this board but throughout New England that the Pats DO NOT need more JAG's but need some serious impact playmakers on defense. If Belichick does his "I'm a genious and can win with anyone" act and trades away or down I swear there will be a rebellion. And Kraft must be sick of it too, paying all these signing bonuses to the likes of Brace and Price and such.
    IT'S IMPACT TIME BB.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    i just realized they do have six picks.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    Faucetman - interesting draft. I would say: 1. Edelman and Woodhead will not command much on the FA market so keeping them would be relatively easy. 2. We just signed an injury prone slot with good speed so not sure BB will be all that excited about adding another 'durability' issue. 3. BB relying on a backfield of 2 second year guys and a rookie is not likely, so if we add another back it will likely be one of the cheap veteran FA we just brought in for workouts or a late preseason cut, unless there is a huge value proposition later in the draft. I will be really surprised if we draft an offensive skill guy that is not at least one round later than he has been projected. So say Martin at 62 or Alshon/Sanu at 93 sort of thing. I would not be as surprised at an OL guy at relatively standard value. I think doubling up at any of the defensive positions is quite possible or going S/CB so what you have at safety makes sense to me - or Reyes/Wolfe, or Curry/Irvin, etc. On the Hoyer trade value discussed elsewhere - I could see a team like Denver who could definitely use an upgraded back-up listening to a #31/Hoyer for #25 swap or something similar to convert 62 to an earlier second rounder and adding in some late round picks. Straight up trade I just don't see anyone paying more than a fourth at most more likely a fifth. He is on a one year contract, so a team taking him either has to work out an extension or is just renting him for a year.
    Posted by mia76

    James was my fun pick.  I don't think BB would do it either.  But I do think James will be a very good pro and I see SD all over him at 49 because they miss Sproles.  I do like the idea of taking 2 safeties, we need them. 

    I don't think you'll see us take an OL type.  At most we will carry 9 OL.  We are already at 9 solid OL types

    Solder
    Gallery
    Connolly
    Waters
    Vollmer
    Cannon
    Wendell
    Mankins
    Koppen

    If we start Mankins and/or Koppen on the PUP list, then okay we have room initially, but once they come off the PUP list, someone will have to get cut.

    As for Hoyer, I think he has almost no trade value, 6th or 7th rounder at most.  As you say, he'll be unrestricted next year so why give up a pick for a back-up QB when he hasn't proven anything at this point?  I think if we keep him, it is for a 1 year insurance policy to give Mallett more time to develop.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    my head spinner draft. it may not necessarily mirror what bb eventually does, or you may not necessarily like, but i guarantee the quantity of moving parts will be as confusing as bb's #27: traded to colts. colts see fleener available after denver surprisingly takes a pass. nwe gets the colts' 2012 #34 and #112 #31: mb's draft disciples start pulling their hair as bb pulls another trade. big surprise, neither mia nor cle picked up tannehill. jax suddenly finds value in tannehill as backup to gabbert. they need to swoop in given risk of cle finally picking up tannehill at 37. jax gives up thier 2013 first and 2012 #101 #34: perry and mercillus are still on the board. nwe chooses perry. #40: another surprise move by bb. gives up #48 and #126 to draft b thompson at car's #40. reyes was available but bb chooses the DT who can occasionally play inside on 3-front, just like love did in the payoffs. #48: already traded to car #62: bb trades down to kcc's #74 + kcc's 2013 fourth rounder #74: bb picks up an under the radar kid, small school kid - brandon brooks, og. wendell is their only backup G until mankins comes back. insurance comes in a kid who a lot of "pundits" were surprised to not get an invite to the combine. 346 lbs and pretty athletic and proved he can push people around. #93: bb picks up another under the radar, small school kid - josh norman, cb. 6ft kid who can cover and has good ball skills. rated around the same as hosley, but has a little bit more cockiness and nastiness. my be flexible enough to play S every now and then. i'm making this up. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SOaybBJezrg #97: bb picks up mcnutt, WR http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzDog7j9ziE #101: bb picks up miles burris, LB, and calls it a day. In summary, pats pickup 6 kids instead of five. Nick Perry, DE/OLB Brandon Thompson, DT Brandon Brooks, OG Josh Norman, CB Marvin McNutt, WR Miles Burris, LB In addition they get.. JAX's 2013 first rounder KCC's 2013 fourth rounder
    Posted by seattlepat70


    i dont hate it.
    glad you got mcnutt to go with the de and o line.
    like my draft better but, yeah i could live with it, esp if norman pans out
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12! : I don't know what your criteria is for under performing (assuming sack/TFL #'s etc.), but he's a 34 NT, his job is to eat up blocks, occupy space, be strong at the POA... that's what he does well and what he'd be asked to do here.
    Posted by mbeaulieu07


    It's just really what my eye is telling me. When I watched him he occupied space well but never really took on a ton of dbl teams. For the most part when he was dbl'd he was washed out of the play moving laterally along the line. He didn't have the penetrating power that we see in most NT's and stayed relatively close to the line. To me that usually translates to being pushed backwards in the pro's. Considering the D he was on I would have expected to see him more aggressive in pushing the pocket and even willingness to shoot the gap when allowed. Instead usually what I saw was OL holding their own against him and holding him close to the line. Typically they ran right at him because of the presence on the outside edge.

    Honestly I don't see him being any better then Love is with a Brace type of downside. 
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    At some point the Pats are going to make a trade so I was wondering who you guys thought were possible trade partners. Now I have my list lets see if it lines up with you:

    #1 Phi - Reid and BB always trade every year. If any trade personified this it would be when they swapped picks moving 1 spot respectfully for no reason but to trade. I fully expect them to trade again this year. Whether that's a couple late round picks or if, imo, Arrington might be a player trade to replace Samuel for some mid-round picks is unknown but I do see a trade coming

    #2 KC - Now with KC this does make sense in the back of the 1st or in the mid rounds. In the back of 1st their target the target could be Weeden at QB or Adams/Sitaolu at RT. The reasoning it that both won't make it back to KC in the 2nd round as Clev will target Weeden with #37 and nether Adams or Sitaolu will make it to the mid 2nd. There also the possibility of KC trading for either Mallett or Hoyer. Either would command a day 2 pick the matter is which round

    #3 TB - Now this might not seem like a likely choice but if Clev takes Richardson then TB might be looking at Martin to fill their RB need. They could also be looking for another WR (Sanu, Jeffery, Wright) if one should fall. But with the Giants, Stl, and Viks all ahead of them they might be looking to jump a couple of spots to get a player they want

    #4 Clev - It doesn't look like anyone will jump ahead of Clev to get Weeden in the 2nd but they still might want to move up from #37 to get the guy they want. They could also be looking for a CB and if Jenkins falls I could see them trying to move back into the 1st and grabbing Jenkins will keeping their #37 pick for Weeden. Actually if Clev trades up it's far more likely they are looking to grab Jenkins then Weeden.

    #5 NO - With no picks in the first 2 rounds NO must be desperate to get anything. We could see them offering their 1st next year and their 3rd and 5th this year to move into the 1st. Now, it's not the brightest move on their part since they'd be in the same position next year but I can see them making this move considering the players they need to replace this year

    Players I think teams could target if they were looking to trade up to the back of the 1st:

    Jenkins CB
    Adams T
    Martin RB
    Hill/Jeffery/Wright/Sanu WR
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    1st round (27)

    Whitney Mercilus*, DE/OLB, Illinois
    Height: 6-4. Weight: 261.
    40 Time: 4.63. 10-Yd Split: 1.56.
    Bench: 27.
    Vertical: 32. Broad: 9-10.
    Arm: 33 7/8.
    Projected Round (2012): 1.


    1st round (31)

    Coby Fleener, TE, Stanford
    Height: 6-6. Weight: 247.
    Projected 40 Time: 4.71.
    Bench: 27.
    Arm: 27. Hand: 10.
    Projected Round (2012): 1-2.


    2nd round (48 from Oakland)

    Kendall Reyes, DE/DT, Connecticut
    Height: 6-4. Weight: 299.
    40 Time: 4.79.
    Bench: 36.
    Vertical: 34.5. Broad: 9-5.
    Arm: 33 1/4. Hand: 9 1/2.
    Projected Round (2012): 1-2.


    2nd round (62)

    Trade for 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, round pick

    276 points= 3rd ~150, 4th ~80, 5th ~35, 6th ~21  for a total of ~286

    3rd from trade

    George Iloka, S, Boise State
    Height: 6-4. Weight: 225.
    40 Time: 4.59.
    Bench: 20.
    Vertical: 34.5. Broad: 10-4.
    Arm: 34 1/2. Hand: 9 5/8.
    Projected Round (2012): 3-4.


    3rd pick 93

    Isaiah Pead, RB, Cincinnati
    Height: 5-10. Weight: 197.
    40 Time: 4.41. 10-Yd Split: 1.50
    Vertical: 33. Broad: 9-8.
    Arm: 31. Hand: 8 5/8.
    Projected Round (2012): 3-4.


    4th round pick (126)

    Jake Bequette, DE/OLB, Arkansas
    Height: 6-5. Weight: 275.
    40 Time: 4.78. 10-Yd Split: 1.72.
    Vertical: 34. Broad: 9-5.
    Arm: 32. Hand: 9 1/4.
    Projected Round (2012): 4.


    4th round (from trade)

    Kashif Moore, WR, U Conneticut
    Height: 5-9. Weight: 194.
    40 Time: 4.41.
    Vertical: 43.5.
    Projected Round (2012): 4-5.

    5th round from trade

    Coryell Judie, CB, Texas A&M
    Height: 6-0. Weight: 194.
    40 Time: 4.44. 10-Yd Split: 1.51.
    Vertical: 37. Broad: 10-6.
    Arm: 30 1/4.
    Projected Round (2012): 4-5.


    6th round (from trade)

    Ryan Miller, G, Colorado
    Height: 6-7. Weight: 321.
    40 Time: 5.27.
    Bench: 32.
    Arm: 33 1/8.
    Projected Round (2012): 6

    7th round (trade for with philly)

    Louis Nzegwu, DE/OLB, Wisconsin
    Height: 6-4. Weight: 253.
    40 Time: 4.54.
    Bench: 22.
    Arm: 33 3/4.

    41.5” vertical jump!
    Projected Round (2012): 7-FA

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from fishers5. Show fishers5's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    Lets call Seattle.....if BB has a favorite player ie Barron....Cox....Brockers, and give Seattle both #1's ..in return get their 1st round and a second.... would luv Barron ...This team needs playmakers... and change philosophy from passive  to aggressive

    1  Barron
    2a Thompson (from seattle)
    2b zeitler
    2c another safety or T Johnson
    3   Adams
    4   Mcnutt or childs
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    I'm going to tweak my previous mock with just a few days left till the draft. 

    #11 (From KC) Mark Barron  Safety  Bama   BB sends picks 31, 62, and Backup QB Brian Hoyer to KC in order to grab the best Safety in this draft, and probably the best Safety prospect since Eric Berry.  Having Barron paired with Chung gives NE arguably the best young Safety tamdem in the NFL.  This is a bold move by BB, but the new rookie salary cap makes it much more practical. NE also gets KC's 6th rounder back in this deal.

    #37 (From Clev)  Alshon Jeffery WR South Carolina  This pick could be the "steal of the draft."  Last September, going into the 2011 CFB season, Jeffery was a consensus Top 10 pick, with many experts predicting him to come off the board ahead of Blackmon. Through the season, S. Car suffered from terrible QB play, consequently limiting Jeffery's opportuinites. Then his off-season was marred by rumored weight fluxuation, although he was in good shape at the combine.  Bottom line is that Jeffery is an elite pass catcher. No one in this draft goes up and gets it better than Jeffery, and while he isn't a blazer, he has good speed and has shown the ability to get open on the perimeter against SEC defenses. Cleveland sends NE pick #37 & a 2013 2nd in exchange for #27, where they select QB Brandon Weeden.

    #51 (From Philly)  Derek Wolfe  DE/DT Cinncy.  PatsEng has been right about this guy all along.  He will be an effective 3-4 DE in NE's defense.  Terriffic motor, great awareness, and above average pass-rush potential for his size.  He has also bulked up close to 300 lbs.  He's been mentioned as a late first rounder, but I think that he ultimately comes off the board mid-second round.  BB keeps the annual trade streak with Andy Reid alive here, as Philly jumps up to grab Bobby Wagner, giving NE this pick (51), and a 2013 5th.


    #93 Josh Chapman DT Bama. I think this could be a classic BB "plan for the future" value pick. I think Chapman is an under-rated prospect in this class. He looks like he could fit perfectly as a NT in a 3-4, and I believe NE could draft him with the idea that he could be the replacement for Wilfork when the sad day comes when Big Vince hangs it up. Love the value here.

    #126  Oliver Vernon OLB/DE Miami    From a pure talent stand-point, Vernon is among the best 3-4 OLB in this draft.  He has explosive pass rush ability and has shown the willingness and ability to play in coverage. Just a tremendous all-around athlete. So why is he still on the board in the 4th round? He is pretty raw, and was involved in the player payment scandal at The U. Questionable charater, but worth the gamble here.

    6th round (From KC) Tom Compton OT South Dakota 6'6" OT who has pretty good footwork. Fits the mold for what BB like in OTs as far as size. Pretty raw coming from a small program, but Scar could coach this guy up really well.  Likely a Practice Squad kid to begin with, but likely would develop into a valuable reserve OT with Light gone and Vollmer's back a constant worry.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    current preferred: i'll go d. still (top dl available) or mclellin (versatility)        jenkins or smith (i think jenkins goes to st louis or indy at top of rd 2) i think shutdown corner has greater value than safety so if jenkins checks out for bb, i go jenkins. otherwise smith        3rd pick trade up from 48 to about 40 for alshon jeffery with a mid/late pick from next year and 48 (excited about the idea of this guy on our team. drew double teams constantly, catches the ball anywhere, huge and uncoverable. jeffery, gronk, hern, lloyd FA-GET-ABOUD-DIT! no stopping them.        best olb/de left 4th pick (curry?)        rd 3 d line (martin?)  4 maybe o line or opposite jenkins smith pick whoever we get ie safety or corner.    if broyles is there, take him as welker's future replacement         udfa rb and slot wr ( if we dont get broyles. one sleeper slot wr junior hemingway)
    Posted by bredbru

    Neither Jeffrey or Sanu can separate in college, how are they supposed to do it in the pros?  If you watch the tape, they win by using their size and bodies to gain position.  Both have great hands which is a plus making them nice red zone targets but both lack explosiveness and ability to separate which will be a huge problem for them against NFL corners.  In the case of Jeffrey, I don't think he's intelligent enough to get our system plus he has questionable work ethic as evidence by his weight fluctuations.

    They both remind me of a kid a lot of us liked a couple years ago, Brandon LaFell out of LSU.  Highly productive in college but very pedestrian as a pro so far.  He looks to be a #3 receiver which is what I think these guys will be.   

    I don't see us going with a receiver with all our F/A signings unless it is a return guy in the later rounds, 3rd-4th or beyond. 

    Lloyd
    Welker
    Edelman
    Branch
    Stallworth
    Ochocinco
    Gonzales
    Slater

    We already have to cut two from the above.  I think it could be Gonzales if he gets hurt but if he's healthy, he's pretty darn good.  Ocho needs to show he's learned the playbook even with the reworked contract.  Stallworth has proven he can play in our system.  We might be able to count Slater as a DB but the most WRs we'll carry is 6, unless we only carry 4 RBs or 2 QBs.  So, if we draft a receiver we will either have to cut another WR or go thin at RB/QB.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    1 st round (27) Whitney Mercilus*, DE/OLB, Illinois Height: 6-4. Weight: 261. 40 Time: 4.63. 10-Yd Split: 1.56. Bench: 27. Vertical: 32. Broad: 9-10. Arm: 33 7/8. Projected Round (2012): 1. 1 st round (31) Coby Fleener, TE, Stanford Height: 6-6. Weight: 247. Projected 40 Time: 4.71. Bench: 27. Arm: 27. Hand: 10. Projected Round (2012): 1-2. 2 nd round (48 from Oakland) Kendall Reyes, DE/DT, Connecticut Height: 6-4. Weight: 299. 40 Time: 4.79. Bench: 36. Vertical: 34.5. Broad: 9-5. Arm: 33 1/4. Hand: 9 1/2. Projected Round (2012): 1-2. 2 nd round (62) Trade for 3 rd , 4 th , 5 th , 6 th , round pick 276 points= 3 rd ~150, 4 th ~80, 5 th ~35, 6 th ~21   for a total of ~286 3 rd from trade George Iloka, S, Boise State Height: 6-4. Weight: 225. 40 Time: 4.59. Bench: 20. Vertical: 34.5. Broad: 10-4. Arm: 34 1/2. Hand: 9 5/8. Projected Round (2012): 3-4. 3 rd pick 93 Isaiah Pead, RB, Cincinnati Height: 5-10. Weight: 197. 40 Time: 4.41. 10-Yd Split: 1.50 Vertical: 33. Broad: 9-8. Arm: 31. Hand: 8 5/8. Projected Round (2012): 3-4. 4 th round pick (126) Jake Bequette, DE/OLB, Arkansas Height: 6-5. Weight: 275. 40 Time: 4.78. 10-Yd Split: 1.72. Vertical: 34. Broad: 9-5. Arm: 32. Hand: 9 1/4. Projected Round (2012): 4. 4 th round (from trade) Kashif Moore, WR, U Conneticut Height: 5-9. Weight: 194. 40 Time: 4.41. Vertical: 43.5. Projected Round (2012): 4-5. 5 th round from trade Coryell Judie, CB, Texas A&M Height: 6-0. Weight: 194. 40 Time: 4.44. 10-Yd Split: 1.51. Vertical: 37. Broad: 10-6. Arm: 30 1/4. Projected Round (2012): 4-5. 6 th round (from trade) Ryan Miller, G, Colorado Height: 6-7. Weight: 321. 40 Time: 5.27. Bench: 32. Arm: 33 1/8. Projected Round (2012): 6 7 th round (trade for with philly) Louis Nzegwu, DE/OLB, Wisconsin Height: 6-4. Weight: 253. 40 Time: 4.54. Bench: 22. Arm: 33 3/4. 41.5” vertical jump! Projected Round (2012): 7-FA
    Posted by natesubs

    I have a secret crush on Mercilus too.  I know he's a one year wonder but I think he's the real deal.  He didn't just lead the nation in sacks, 16.5.  The next closest was 12.5.  He was also 2nd in the country in TFL at 22.5, 18 of them solo.  This tells me he is effective stopping the run and is very disruptive to be in the back field so often.  Let's not look past his 9 forced fumbles, also tops in the nation.  BB places a huge emphasis in creating turn overs and to have 9 of them in a season isn't a fluke.  He has a nose for the ball and a talent for separating players from the ball. 

    If I knew Harrison Smith will last to 31 and Mercilus is there at 27, I'd take him.  There are plenty of DT options all the way through the 3rd round.  I know there are a lot of DE/OLB types too but none with the production Mercilus had.  But I think some team will take him well before 27.  Finding pass rushers is hard to do and his production, one year or not, won't be discounted as much as people think. 

    As for the rest of your post, there is no way we take a TE now with Daniel Fells on board and I don't see any team giving up 4 picks, albeit late rounders, to get one pick.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    For whatever it's worth,mi am going on record to say I like Harrison smith, but believe a better option is to grab a kid like trumaine Johnson and convert him into a fs, or stick moore there and Johnson on the outside. I like smith, I just don't think this kid is a first rounder and he is being elevated so because there is lack of quality and depth in this years safety class. I have seen numerous posts by some here giving smith a first round grade...I don't know if it is warranted or based on our need for a safety, others thinking the same, and smith getting dropped into round 1? Basically, I am on the fence with smith with 4 days to go. Someone help me here. Does he deserve a first round grade, and would a kid like Johnson provide a better option at fs based on value and skill set? I know smith has some coverage skills but from everything I read, they are not elite. If we want a SS to play in the box more and back up Chung, what about the kid from lsu in round 3 or 4? I guess my point is I am not sold on smith as a complete package. I like him overall, but want someone back there with Chung who is more cover and less run. Is he that guy? Faucet...on merciless, I like him, but I think his 1 year production might discount his value on BB' s board. He has a tendency to draft more proven, 3 or 4 year talent and not sue merciless qualifies. For me, it's a real crapshoot on the olb position. Same with de. Beyond the elite kids going 1 st half of round 1, I see good players with lots if questions. Example, I love Wolfe like many do, but does he have the size to play on the end? Perry, good to above pass rusher but gets knocked on run support. Los of questions after the elite which is probably same in every year, however, I am more convinced now to possibly package to grab 1 elite, and then sit still for some solid kids like Wolfe, curry, etc. So, if you do it, is it brockers or Barron?
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    For whatever it's worth,mi am going on record to say I like Harrison smith, but believe a better option is to grab a kid like trumaine Johnson and convert him into a fs, or stick moore there and Johnson on the outside. I like smith, I just don't think this kid is a first rounder and he is being elevated so because there is lack of quality and depth in this years safety class. I have seen numerous posts by some here giving smith a first round grade...I don't know if it is warranted or based on our need for a safety, others thinking the same, and smith getting dropped into round 1? Basically, I am on the fence with smith with 4 days to go. Someone help me here. Does he deserve a first round grade, and would a kid like Johnson provide a better option at fs based on value and skill set? I know smith has some coverage skills but from everything I read, they are not elite. If we want a SS to play in the box more and back up Chung, what about the kid from lsu in round 3 or 4? I guess my point is I am not sold on smith as a complete package. I like him overall, but want someone back there with Chung who is more cover and less run. Is he that guy? Faucet...on merciless, I like him, but I think his 1 year production might discount his value on BB' s board. He has a tendency to draft more proven, 3 or 4 year talent and not sue merciless qualifies. For me, it's a real crapshoot on the olb position. Same with de. Beyond the elite kids going 1 st half of round 1, I see good players with lots if questions. Example, I love Wolfe like many do, but does he have the size to play on the end? Perry, good to above pass rusher but gets knocked on run support. Los of questions after the elite which is probably same in every year, however, I am more convinced now to possibly package to grab 1 elite, and then sit still for some solid kids like Wolfe, curry, etc. So, if you do it, is it brockers or Barron?
    Posted by PatsLifer


    I'm with you on Smith. I like the kid but he's being elevated to a late 1st rounder when I think he's more like a Chung which would be a mid-late 2nd round talent. A kid who will be a solid starter and make few mistakes but I just don't see a pro-bowler in Smith and that's what I'm looking for in the 1st, a potential pro-bowler. I wouldn't reach for him either. I'd rather try to convert a CB to FS and get an extra 1st round pick for next year, where it's a much deeper and talented draft in terms of S.

    With Wolfe, the guy is up to 295lbs and might still be able to add another 5-10lbs, so I think he is 34 DE size right now with someone like Nin behind him, who can set the edge.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from teegee. Show teegee's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    On ESPN Blogger Mock Draft Pats trade 27 and 31 to Seattle for # 12 and 106. Pick Barron with #12. This after Dallas refused 27 and 48.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    On ESPN Blogger Mock Draft Pats trade 27 and 31 to Seattle for # 12 and 106. Pick Barron with #12. This after Dallas refused 27 and 48.
    Posted by teegee


    If that happened I wouldn't be to happy. Either #31 or #27 will most likely turn into a 3rd and a 1st next year anyways so the question becomes would you rather have Barron or a late 1st and a 1st next year. If that late 1st was turned into Upshaw, Curry, Brockers, Perry, Branch, Reyes I'd think I'd rather have the the later then just Barron truthfully

    Not to mention that I love Barron but I've had him graded as a late 1st pick (talent wise) since Jan and my opinion hasn't changed. Just because he's the best S in the draft doesn't change my opinion that compared to other years he's a late 1st pick. Moving up to a top 15 pick to grab him just seems like a reach for the kid. I'd rather trade one of the picks straight up to a team like Stl, Colts, Was, Clev, TB which should give us a top 15 next year with better talent at the S position. We can survive with McCourty at FS for a year to have a shot at a better FS in next years class imo
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12! : If that happened I wouldn't be to happy. Either #31 or #27 will most likely turn into a 3rd and a 1st next year anyways so the question becomes would you rather have Barron or a late 1st and a 1st next year. If that late 1st was turned into Upshaw, Curry, Brockers, Perry, Branch, Reyes I'd think I'd rather have the the later then just Barron truthfully Not to mention that I love Barron but I've had him graded as a late 1st pick (talent wise) since Jan and my opinion hasn't changed. Just because he's the best S in the draft doesn't change my opinion that compared to other years he's a late 1st pick. Moving up to a top 15 pick to grab him just seems like a reach for the kid. I'd rather trade one of the picks straight up to a team like Stl, Colts, Was, Clev, TB which should give us a top 15 next year with better talent at the S position. We can survive with McCourty at FS for a year to have a shot at a better FS in next years class imo
    Posted by PatsEng

    i too would not be happy if they use both first rnd picks to trade up. after seeing bb's mo a decade i am convinced that you should come to every draft with two first rounders. that's what gives him the flexibility to maneuver around get the players he wants, despite finishing each year near the top of the league.



     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Critter23. Show Critter23's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    I love to read the last week of this site as you guys really focus in.  Most of you are letting go of your favorites and focusing on the practical and what BB really needs and usually does.  Every year I feel like I really am informed when the draft arrives--and of course then BB does something none of us expect.  Thanks all!

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from mia76. Show mia76's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! UPDATED W/ MOCK V3 4/12!

    Just don't see BB valuing a Safety that highly. If he moved up that high I would think it would be for Cox. I could more easily see him moving up to around 20 for Gilmore/Kirkpatrick and converting someone from CB to safety, or for Brockers.
    I think both Barron and Smith are being way overvalued because everyone is saying there will be no safety available in the second round. It wasn't long ago that Barron was seen as a late first/early second rounder, and Smith was a late second/early third rounder.
    The whole reason BB signed Gregory was so he wouldn't have to find a starting safety in a weak draft class. He started last year for SD and no one was complaining about SD's 31st ramked defense against the pass. He doesn't have the upside we may want, but he has a lot more experience and doesn't have the downside of an untested player either.
     
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