***2012 Patriots Draft Thread***! THANKS TO ALL WHO PARTICIPATED!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Pats7393. Show Pats7393's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    Here's a video of Hill. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uf-9-fYz-sE You can't see him take the ball away from the defender because of the distance of the camera.  However, what you see is the CB giving Hill 10 yards of cushion.  Hill eats that up in a nano second and is 5 yards past the defender in a heartbeat.  The ball is badly underthrown and the defender is in great position for the pick, however, Hill somehow takes it away. Michael Irvin noted that Hill has strong hands.  Josh McDaniels was shown saying, "4.30" talking to someone off camera.  Belichick was later shown in the stands watching the WR drills.  Hmm, I wonder if he was summonsed up to the field to watch the drills?  The last time I saw BB in the stands, it was last year during the RB drills and he drafted two of them. That damn GT option offense makes it so hard to evaluate.  It took Thomas a couple of years to start making an impact so I wouldn't expect Hill to be an immediate polished receiver but what he can do it knock the top off from day one running 9 routes.  At 6-4, 215 and 4.30 flat, he has Randy Moss size.  While at Florida State, Moss ran a 4.25 40 with only Deion being faster, 4.23.  Hill at 4.30 is close enough, lol.  Anyone see what Criner ran?
    Posted by Faucetman


    See I wasn't getting hopes up or anything and here comes Faucet talking BB might had been watching this kid (and all the others).  So if he watched drill as well he saw a kid that's not a raw, actually looked good at the routes and the gantlet was excellent.  I don't think he moved to either side of the line much, he ran as straight, with speed (some guys run it slower to run straight) caught them all and hands/arm extension was excellent.


     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    I say we double down on Randle and Hill.  31 and 48.  We tag Welker, cut Ocho and bring back Branch to mentor.

    Hill is raw, is going to take some time to learn the route tree but he has something Tate and Slater - more size, speed and better hands.

    We can get our help on D at 27, 63 and in free agency.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18! : See I wasn't getting hopes up or anything and here comes Faucet talking BB might had been watching this kid (and all the others).  So if he watched drill as well he saw a kid that's not a raw, actually looked good at the routes and the gantlet was excellent.  I don't think he moved to either side of the line much, he ran as straight, with speed (some guys run it slower to run straight) caught them all and hands/arm extension was excellent.
    Posted by Pats7393

    Raw in terms of running NFL routes.  He looked very smooth in the drills and his hands were strong and soft.  But he didn't look especially crisp coming in and out of breaks but I don't care much about that at this point.  He'll need to check out in the smarts dept as we saw what happens with dumb receivers in our system. 
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    I say we double down on Randle and Hill.  31 and 48.  We tag Welker, cut Ocho and bring back Branch to mentor. Hill is raw, is going to take some time to learn the route tree but he has something Tate and Slater - more size, speed and better hands. We can get our help on D at 27, 63 and in free agency.
    Posted by Faucetman


    I like Hill and M. Jones but I'm with you on the double down WRs.  Pats needs, they can trade both 1st rnd picks into second and get 
    Hill WR
    Curry OLB
    Reyes DE
    Iloka FS
    M. Jones or Randle WR
    P. Blake OC/OG


     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from WazzuWheatfarmer. Show WazzuWheatfarmer's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    The times that are posted on NFL.com are different; most are significantly slower.  They have Hill at 4.36; Floyd at 4.47; etc.  Must be the official times.  Still a lot to like in this group!
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    I say we double down on Randle and Hill.  31 and 48.  We tag Welker, cut Ocho and bring back Branch to mentor. Hill is raw, is going to take some time to learn the route tree but he has something Tate and Slater - more size, speed and better hands. We can get our help on D at 27, 63 and in free agency.
    Posted by Faucetman

    I'd rather not spend 2 picks on WR's. I saw target either Randle or Hill then go front 7 on the other early picks. This draft has a ton of front 7 in the late 1st-mid 2nd range. That's where I want to be. Ideally I'd like to trade #27 for an early 2nd and a pick next year. Take Curry at #31, grab either Hill or Randle with that 2nd we traded for, then grab Wolfe or Reyes at #48 and see what it would take to get Iloka

     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    The times that are posted on NFL.com are different; most are significantly slower.  They have Hill at 4.36; Floyd at 4.47; etc.  Must be the official times.  Still a lot to like in this group!
    Posted by WazzuWheatfarmer


    And Adams is showing 4.55.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    Just read Hill had a 1.2s 10yrd split with a 39.5 vertical and 11.1 broad.  1.2 10yrd split is insane. It's almost .2s faster then the other 10yrd split times. They'd have to give him a huge cushion or he'd run right past them
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    Yeah, a bit disappointing for Joe Adams.  Not as bad as Kendall Wright.  He posted an official 4.61.  Expected to go much faster than that.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    I have said it already this year. I say it every year and I have not been wrong. I don't care how fast a WR runs "within reason", how tall he is, etc.

    It is NO longer speculation about Brady and WR's. Piolis comments confirmed what everyone already believed.

    It also will not matter if Brady throws to WR's. He would not be able to know until he starts doing 11 on 11 work with site adjustments against a defense.

    It won't matter if the WR can fly, If he has great hands. If he will not "INSTANTLY" read what Brady reads and be "EXACTLY" where he wants him to be he will not throw him the ball. Worse yet, he will just write him off as not being capable to "get it".

    I am not doing ANYTHING special in the draft to grab WR's and I still certainly do not want them to take TWO WR unless then end up with an extra late pick from some earlier maneuvers.

    Hill comes from an option offense. That would make as much sense to me as the Patriots taking Taylor Price from another running offense. Would make absolutely NO logic to me.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    Yeah, a bit disappointing for Joe Adams.  Not as bad as Kendall Wright.  He posted an official 4.61.  Expected to go much faster than that.
    Posted by WazzuWheatfarmer


    Wow, didn't see Wright at 4.61, he's another "football fast" kid.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from cantstopme. Show cantstopme's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    brandon lloyd is looking better and better.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    I have said it already this year. I say it every year and I have not been wrong. I don't care how fast a WR runs "within reason", how tall he is, etc. It is NO longer speculation about Brady and WR's. Piolis comments confirmed what everyone already believed. It also will not matter if Brady throws to WR's. He would not be able to know until he starts doing 11 on 11 work with site adjustments against a defense. It won't matter if the WR can fly, If he has great hands. If he will not "INSTANTLY" read what Brady reads and be "EXACTLY" where he wants him to be he will not throw him the ball. I am not doing ANYTHING special in the draft to grab WR's and I still certainly do not want them to take TWO WR unless then end up with an extra late pick from some earlier maneuvers. Hill comes from an option offense. That would make as much sense to me as the Patriots taking Taylor Price from another running offense. Would make absolutely NO logic to me.
    Posted by Low-FB-IQ

    And yet they took Price.

    McDaniels loved Thomas (another GT WR) so much he traded up to get him. Hill looks like the better of the 2 WR's and I'm sure McDaniels has some saw in it. Not to mention I think Brady will have more faith and leeway in a WR if McDaniels gives his approval.

    Brady also gave up on Tate because Tate couln't catch the ball. Hill has extremely soft hand and has a big catch radius.

    It's true you might never know if Brady will trust a WR but usually you find better WR's in the earlier rounds and it's had to turn down a guy of Hill's size, speed, and hands

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from WazzuWheatfarmer. Show WazzuWheatfarmer's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18! : Wow, didn't see Wright at 4.61, he's another "football fast" kid.
    Posted by mbeaulieu07


    Good point.  Anyone who has seen Wright play knows that the guy can fly.  Just another reminder not to put a ton of stock in these 40 times.  Some guys can look great in shorts on a track, but really lose a step when the pads come on.  Others don't even notice the weight of their pads.  Film trumps all, but these combine workouts are still fun to follow.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    Wow, Doug Martin weighs in at 223 pounds... impressive.  IF NE goes RB early (which I don't think will happen), this has to be the kid.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    Impressive time for Utah State RB Robert Turbin, 4.44 UO at 222pounds... kid has some fr/ggin guns too.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    I'm really waiting to see Rainey run. I think he'd make a great return man and provide us with excellent field position
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    I'm really waiting to see Rainey run. I think he'd make a great return man and provide us with excellent field position
    Posted by PatsEng


    4.37 UO.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18! :

    And yet they took Price.
    And yet they wasted a pick. I was right they were wrong. I 've been wrong plenty. I didn't like Solder last year but he did much better than I thought he would. Have no problem being wrong and will be many more times before long no doubt.

    McDaniels loved Thomas (another GT WR) so much he traded up to get him. Hill looks like the better of the 2 WR's and I'm sure McDaniels has some saw in it.
    Yep and Thomas has had 22 and 32 catches and McD got fired. Not exactly sure how much site adjustment he's been asked to do and exceeded at either. Heck I think he's a MUCH better receiver than Brandon Tate(not even one any more) too but Tate still had more receptions and a much higher avg in each of their 1st seasons. QB having a lot to do with that obviously.

    Not to mention I think Brady will have more faith and leeway in a WR if McDaniels gives his approval.
    That makes absolutely NO difference. Unless it's a known quantity like Llyod. There is no basis for any such assumption.

    Brady also gave up on Tate because Tate couln't catch the ball.
    No he gave up on Tate because he didn't trust he knew what he was doing? Who had more spectacular catches than Tate with his very limited attempts? He doesn't seem to know how to play WR as a position, not that he can't catch. You could argue catching punts and kickoffs is as hard or harder than catching passes. People like to remember that one crossing pattern Tate was wide open and he dropped an easy one right in his hands but I remember that ridiculous catch in freezing weather outstretch down the sideline in Chicago. Or that laid out catch for a TD in the endzone from Hoyer. Or the one Brady almost threw it out of bounds on Tate in the endzone and Tate made an unbelievable catch to stay in bounds. Personally I think the throw was off because Tate wasn't where he was supposed to be. There was also a reason Kraft had come out and said they were very excited about Tate during training camp his rookie year. Just watching athleticism is very easily intoxicating.

    Hill has extremely soft hand and has a big catch radius. It's true you might never know if Brady will trust a WR but usually you find better WR's in the earlier rounds
    True, with the Blue chippers

    and it's hard to turn down a guy of Hill's size, speed, and hands
    Why? You don't build a "team" by just collecting the best athletes.

    Non of the above is to say the Patriots won't draft Hill. I simply have absolutely no interest in him simply based on athleticism. If we were not talking about the Patriots, and their and Brady's very clear history. Then yes I would be all for it. I would Never gamble any high picks on such a hit or miss proposition of a position as WR seems to be for their system, if I was the Patriots. That's all I am saying.
    Now if you can tell me they have developed a more tried and true way of being certain they are identifying a WR capable of reading a defense then sure I have no problems. They have shown me they have no ability to do that as an organization.

    How does that saying go? If you ignore history you are doomed to repeat it?

    Earlier on this board you made a valid point based on Cox and Reyes. Similar type guys, not exactly but why not take the guy later with more value right? So you could make the same argument with the WR, especially given the hit of miss nature of the position for the Pats. Heck go look at Greg Childs, 40, vert, bench, etc, height, coming off an injury so under the radar, coming out of a PRO style offense in Arkansas, etc etc. Same argument.

    Posted by PatsEng
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    Doug Martin 4.47 at that size, impressive.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    Impressive time for Utah State RB Robert Turbin, 4.44 UO at 222pounds... kid has some fr/ggin guns too.
    Posted by mbeaulieu07


    Had missed his first, and you are right that kid got some guns on him.  4.44 and 4.47, that's really impressive for a guy over 220 lbs.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18! : Had missed his first, and you are right that kid got some guns on him.  4.44 and 4.47, that's really impressive for a guy over 220 lbs.
    Posted by Pats7393


    you mean the black Incredible HULK?
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from mbeaulieu07. Show mbeaulieu07's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18! : Had missed his first, and you are right that kid got some guns on him.  4.44 and 4.47, that's really impressive for a guy over 220 lbs.
    Posted by Pats7393


    Bigtime, I've added him to the Rd 5-URFA portion of my board... could be a solid later round get for some team.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from mbeaulieu07. Show mbeaulieu07's posts

    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18! : you mean the black Incredible HULK?
    Posted by Low-FB-IQ


    Reminds me of former FSU RB Greg Jones.
     
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    Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!

    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18!:
    In Response to Re: ***2012 Patriots Draft Thread*** MOCK V2 ADDED 2/18! : Bigtime, I've added him to the Rd 5-URFA portion of my board... could be a solid later round get for some team.
    Posted by mbeaulieu07


    With that speed and size this guy is a sure upgrade over Benni pending he can run with a football in his hands.  Time to go see what this kid is all about.  Know next to nothing about him.
     
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