i do note, rangs new mock does hav the 4 qbs (4-5 im looking/hoping go) in the top 18 picks (and its not even february.....!

he has JORDAN MAKING IT ALL THE WAY TO 30 (ive seen him at 5 recently) while ansah at 21!

got me thinking mb,

how far would you be willing to trade up for to get jordan and what ammo would you use?

we have got to get a legit pass rusher in fa AND OR teh draft.

assume you still like jordan over ansah?

lastly if jordan and ansah are there 25, woudl you trade up for jordan or wait for ansah to fall to you?

In response to bredbru's comment:

Not sure where you think I didn't say we needed to add a pass rusher because I've been saying all along that we do, however it's where the rush is coming from that makes the difference between our arguments. I think the edge rush will be fine and I like our current edge DE's but I think the interior rush is what's really lacking. They are stacking layers on Wilfork and almost ignoring whatever guy they put next to him. This D is built for pressure up the middle but they can't generate it. If you add a Williams or Jenkins next to Wilfork then the opponents are going to be in for a rough day, because you can't double Wilfork, Williams/Jenkins, and Jones. Not to mention pressure up the middle is usually more effective than pressure from the edge

In response to bredbru's comment:

At the end of the day, I don't see Jordan and Ansah there at 25 nor do I anticipate a ton of moving up in Rd 1 as they really don't have a ton of ammo.

Ideally, I'd love to see them get the big DT in Rd 1 (Williams/Jenkins or maybe Sylvester Willams) and maybe target a Tank Carradine or Margus Hunt or Alex Okafor, etc. towards the end of Rd 2.  IMO, Carradine could potentially provide the best value in this draft as he's a Rd 1 talent (IMO) that will drop due to a late injury.  Love his size, length & motor, has the athleticism to play in space, has some strength at the point, shows awareness and looks assignment sound... just a very good fit for what NE looks for in its edge players.

In response to mbeaulieu07's comment:

see him lsited at 6 4 and 6 5.

how much of his 11 sacks due to being paired with werner?

in teh end, i ve speculated that ansaha and jordan would rise maybe too high as well.

agree on ammo, though i persobnally wouldnt rule out 2014 picks as ive stated (how much youth can a team have? and id raher have 3 or 4 studs over 8 new jags.)

syl williams could be a move.

carradien might make end of rd 2 with injury. okafor i doubt

hunt small chance (probably not).

odds say get the pass rushing de in fa.

hwat do you think about getting a penetrator over a run stuffer like jesse williams or even jenkins?

In response to bredbru's comment:

I don't see BB leveraging 2014 unless there is a must have kid or two, personally I don't see a must have player or need at this point.

BB generally runs a gap control defense, especially with his interior DT's.  With that said, he seems to prefer the big wide body types to man the middle, players that can eat up blocks, control the double/gaps etc. (thus freeing up the edge players to make more plays)... a skill set that both Williams and Jenkins can provide at a high level.  This doesn't mean they can't push the pocket and pressure from the interior, they're just not expected to throw up huge sack totals... for example VW's career high in sacks for a season is 3.5 (he only has 16 in 138 regular season games over 9 seasons). 

I don't think either player is incapable of penetrating (both have pretty good quicks/movement ability for their size), they're just not the types of players that use quickness to shoot gaps like some smaller, quicker 43 DT's.

Do you think there's any chance the Pats take a TE?  Seeing how the Pats have brought in many FA over the years and also how Gronk and Hernandez have missed playing time over the past 2 years leads me to believe there's a chance they spend a pick in this area.

Thoughts?

Do you think there's any chance the Pats take a TE?  Seeing how the Pats have brought in many FA over the years and also how Gronk and Hernandez have missed playing time over the past 2 years leads me to believe there's a chance they spend a pick in this area.

Thoughts?

I don't know about you guys but it seems like every mock draft has the Patriots taking WR Tavon Austin from WV.  As a player I really like Austin but I really don't think the Pats draft him seeing that they have guys like Demps coming back and Vareen/Woodhead.  Austin is extremely dynamic and can do a lot of things however I feel like he'll break down quickly in the NFL.  One guy I would go after in 2nd/3rd round is Austin's teammate Stedman Bailey.  Seems like a more traditional WR but can play on the outside and in the slot.  He's been tremendously productive and looks like a good route runner.  I would love to hear everyone's thoughts. 

In response to Faucetman's comment:

In response to bredbru's comment:

Not sure where you think I didn't say we needed to add a pass rusher because I've been saying all along that we do, however it's where the rush is coming from that makes the difference between our arguments. I think the edge rush will be fine and I like our current edge DE's but I think the interior rush is what's really lacking. They are stacking layers on Wilfork and almost ignoring whatever guy they put next to him. This D is built for pressure up the middle but they can't generate it. If you add a Williams or Jenkins next to Wilfork then the opponents are going to be in for a rough day, because you can't double Wilfork, Williams/Jenkins, and Jones. Not to mention pressure up the middle is usually more effective than pressure from the edge

In response to Homecheese's comment:

In response to Homecheese's comment:

"In the NFL, technique is more important than any physical skillset an athlete has. Players can’t get by with just their physical talent. This is the concern that lies with the Gators’ Elam and he has to clean it up once he gets into the pros or he will be picked apart."

can gators S elam cover in the NFL?

http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/cfb/42288/321/can-gators-s-elam-cover

Below is my updated Big 32 Board:

Rd 1

DT- Jesse Williams

*S- Matt Elam

*DE/OLB- Sam Montgomery

OG- Jonathan Cooper

DT- John Jenkins

S- Kenny Vaccaro

OL- Barrett Jones

Rd 1-2

*CB- Logan Ryan

DT- Sylvester Williams

CB- Jordan Poyer

*WR- DeAndre Hopkins

CB- Xavier Rhodes

Rd 2

DE/OLB- Tank Carradine

DE/OLB- Alex Okafor

DE/OLB- Margus Hunt

WR- Robert Woods

C/OG- Travis Frederick

Rd 2-3

OLB/DE- Brandon Jenkins

CB- Melvin White

CB- Micah Hyde

S- Shawn Williams

Rd 3

WR- Ryan Swope

WR- Markus Wheaton

S- Zeke Motta

Rd 4-7

WR- Conner Vernon

LB- Kiko Alonso

DL- Kapron Lewis-Moore

TE- Travis Kelce

DT- Cory Grissom

DL- Quinton Dial

S- John Boyett

WR TJ Moe

*Denotes Underclassmen

In response to Army2LT's comment:

next year we carry 4 of 5 (INCLUDING ballard) we have should be enough except for practicve squad maybe

In response to bredbru's comment:

I'm not saying thy should spend a 1st or 2nd on one but I like this TE class and think it wouldn't hurt to add a guy like Michael Williams or Jake Stoneburner

In response to mbeaulieu07's comment:

You expecting "all" of the guys you have listed under Rd1 to be available at 31/32 if Pats make SB? Seems many early mocks have some of them long gone by that point??

In response to Homecheese's comment:

In looking at the DTs in our range, Williams and Jenkins, neither appear to be the type of player that will get pressure up the middle on a QB.  Below are scouting reports I saw:

WILLIAMS:

WEAKNESSES: Bit of a one-trick pony as Williams does not possess the quickness or the agility to collapse the pocket as a pass rusher. Must do a better job of protecting his knees as he is susceptible to cut blocks. Too often raises his pad level at the snap, negating some of his power and making him all the more vulnerable to cuts, as he possesses only moderate flexibility.

Has to do a better job of getting his hands up in passing lanes as he rarely gets home as a pass rusher (just three passes broken up in 25 career starts at Alabama).

JENKINS:

WEAKNESSES: Provides little in terms of an interior pass rush. Is simply too wide to not get slowed down while squeezing through tight gaps in the interior line and has only phone booth quickness.

Wears down quickly and will need to be substituted often to be fully effective in the NFL. Allows his pad level to rise as he tires, which negates his strength.

So, if gaining interior pressure from these guys is the prime motivator to take them with the eye to replace Love/Deaderick next to VW, it doesn't appear either athlete will provide the hoped pass rush.

I'm still leaning towards big physical CB or Strong Safety as my top desire but still would like to see more speed and pass coverage ability at MLB.  When teams hurry up against us, Spikes is exposed.  He is not a 3 down LB in my opinion.  I am wondering how Hightower would do if moved inside since he is faster (not sure if quicker or more instinctive) than Spikes and we could then either add an OLB or MLB to improve our speed at the second level.

I do think we are limited in our depth at LB in general.  I don't want to see Ninkovich back there.  He was a disaster when he played for Spikes in Week 17.  Tracy White and Niko Koutouvides are UFAs after the season and Dane Fletcher is restricted and coming off a knee.  This leaves us just Rivera after starters Hightower, Spikes and Mayo.  Dropping a DE back like Ninko or Cunningham only slows us down.

What do you guys think of Stanford's Chase Thomas?  6-4, 248 with some speed seems to be a good play maker and shows ability to get in the back field and make plays.  I remember being impressed with him against Cal where he had 4 TFLs, 1 sack, 1 FF and 1 FR.  Seems like an end of Round 2 type and I would think be a smart player.  I don't see him on Mb's board.