***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from titletownfan. Show titletownfan's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    Agreed with Wazzu.  I like taking risks in the draft, but would rather us take it on a talented guy with character issues.  I hope the Pats strongly consider Tyrann Mathieu in the 3rd round, or the 4th if they get an extra pick.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from WazzuWheatfarmer. Show WazzuWheatfarmer's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    In response to titletownfan's comment:

    Agreed with Wazzu.  I like taking risks in the draft, but would rather us take it on a talented guy with character issues.  I hope the Pats strongly consider Tyrann Mathieu in the 3rd round, or the 4th if they get an extra pick.



    Agree. Mathieu would be well worth the gamble late 3rd or later.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

     

    i said that all year,

    and then had rhodes as a pick too :) unique big press man (ie seattle defense we need to coverrt to).

    but if we dotn get a legit pass rusher in fa, thats #1 need in draft for me even over getting a 6 3" 215 stud cb

     




    Was just reading up on Reiss' blog.  Tagging Talib is starting to make the most sense.  We lock him up for $10.8MM then try to get a long-term deal done to aleivate that hit.  Word is Pats are 9th in most cap space available so this would be a good insurance policy. 

     


    If we lose Welker, I would have to move Tavon Austin to the top of my board.


    If we lose Vollmer, we have Cannon who should be experienced enough to start but there are other F/A options at RT and we could always address in the 2nd round.  Kyle Long if he's there.

    We could then use our 3rd on a CB but I would not be surprised to see us add a F/A CB. 

     




    I agree that tagging Talib makes the most sense, allowing them to retain a player that clearly made the D better, with a relatively low risk deal.

     

    A couple to Rd 3 CB's to keep on your radar are Houston's DJ Hayden (who I have in Rd 2, but he is coming back from a freak injury that almost cost him his life), who'd come at a relative bargain, IMO and UConn's Dwayne Gratz... another size/speed/quicks/strength kid.

    The thought of Austin is intriguing, though another alternative would be to sign an outside WR like Brian Hartline in FA, then draft a slot kid like Swope or Ace Sanders on Day 2... maybe double up on WR with an other Welker-type player in Mizzou's TJ Moe who won't beat you in a sprint, but is the quick footed, sudden, COD type that they like.

    [/QUOTE]

    I would think you could line Swope up outside too?  He's one of my favorite WRs in this draft.  Austin is just a human missile, IMO.  I think he's better than Percy Harvin without the migraine issues.  Rumor was BB was all over Harvin if he had lasted to 23 but of course MIN took him at 22 which started us trading back and back until we eventually landed Chung at 34.

    Harvin is taller (5'11") and slower 4.4 than Austin (5'9") 4.34.  Moe is an interesting cat, impressed with a 3.96 shuttle and a 6.53 cone, both tops.  Yeah, we really don't need to spend a 1st round pick on a slot receiver. But chances are Welker will be back on a 3-4 year deal as I don't think his value would be as great away from Brady and I heard there won't be a lot of money being thrown around in free agency this year.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    In response to WazzuWheatfarmer's comment:

    Margus Hunt makes me nervous. I really don't like his lack of production @ SMU, and I also don't like that he will be a 26 year old rookie.  I'd be okay taking him late 2nd, but he won't last that long. I hope we don't use our first on him.



    exactly

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    In response to mbeaulieu07's comment:

     

     

    Was just reading up on Reiss' blog.  Tagging Talib is starting to make the most sense.  We lock him up for $10.8MM then try to get a long-term deal done to aleivate that hit.  Word is Pats are 9th in most cap space available so this would be a good insurance policy. 

     


    If we lose Welker, I would have to move Tavon Austin to the top of my board.


    If we lose Vollmer, we have Cannon who should be experienced enough to start but there are other F/A options at RT and we could always address in the 2nd round.  Kyle Long if he's there.

    We could then use our 3rd on a CB but I would not be surprised to see us add a F/A CB. 

     




    I agree that tagging Talib makes the most sense, allowing them to retain a player that clearly made the D better, with a relatively low risk deal.

     

    A couple to Rd 3 CB's to keep on your radar are Houston's DJ Hayden (who I have in Rd 2, but he is coming back from a freak injury that almost cost him his life), who'd come at a relative bargain, IMO and UConn's Dwayne Gratz... another size/speed/quicks/strength kid.

    The thought of Austin is intriguing, though another alternative would be to sign an outside WR like Brian Hartline in FA, then draft a kid like Swope or Ace Sanders on Day 2... maybe double up on WR with an other Welker-type player in Mizzou's TJ Moe who won't beat you in a sprint, but is the quick footed, sudden, COD type that they like.

     



    The more I'm looking at the market the less sense it makes to tag Talib. Here me out on this one. The tag is basd off the previously out of control CB contracts. Now with a flat cap and teams strugling to make or get good enough under the cap to make any moves applying a tag only cost you extra cap space. Considering the amount of similar tier CBs (DRC, Talib, Houston, Robinson, Smith, Grimes, Lewis) contracts should only go down. I think most agents would advise to take a 2 year contract and wait until the cap expands and contracts increase again. I think you can get a good cap friendly deal without the tag this year because the teams have all the leverage and for CB's it's a buyers market

     



    thats wahtg i was trying to say / implying if it was not clear

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from NOISE. Show NOISE's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    In response to mbeaulieu07's comment:

    In response to NOISE's comment:

     

    Hey MB,  your thoughts on dee milliner from Bama?  The cover corner....I think the kid is special, and will go top 10.  I know BB has the inside track to Bama players now, but what if Saban said to him, this kid is beyond exceptional Bill, gotta have him....

    Im not even saying go up n get him, b/c it wud take a lot to jump that high and pats don't have too many picks this yr....I see pats falling out of first rd this yr to gain some picks back.

     

    just curious about your take?

     

     

     




    Hey, NOISE,

     

    Really like Milliner, had him on my radar last year from watching film of Barron, etc... and he sure looked the part again this year...  Looks like a complete CB to me, good size, can run, moves well and very physical... Top CB in this class and one of the best players available.

    I agree that he's gone in the Top 10, so the chances of him landing in Foxboro are highly unlikely.

    A trade back or two is very likely IMO, yeah.



    Thanks MB!  Yeah, he's probably top 5 even.   Who ever gets him, going to hit a homer with him I feel.  Agree on the trade back....lol.   

     
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  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from speedster81. Show speedster81's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    Ideally, this is what the Pats do in the offseason:

    FA:

    1) Make a play for Keenan Lewis CB - Pittsburgh. Anyone watched the two games the Steelers and Ravens played will see what a great job Pittsburgh's corners did in press man vs torrey smith and co. Its no wonder the steelers were able to beat Baltimore in Baltimore with their 3rd string QB. Pay particular attention to the the job Lewis did against Anquan Boldin. He made Boldin look outmatched in a way I have never seen before. At 6ft 210pounds, good strength and elite speed, Lewis can play press man and win against any type of corner.

    2) Sign DT Desmond Bryant or Randy Starks - Both of these guys give you elite Run Defense and Consistent Pressure from the inside. Signing a rookie DT and expecting him to dominate against NFL Veteran O Line men who have  been in Professional Strength and Conditioning programs for years in simply not realistic. It usually takes rookie DT's a few seasons to start playing up to their potential.

    3) Sign Brian Hartline - The case for an outside WR has already been well made on this board. No use beating a dead horse.

    4) Sign Kaluka Maiava OLB Cleveland - Excellent coverage Linebacker who can play on all downs. The past season the stats showed we actually did well covering the opposing No 1 and 2 receivers but ranked close to bottom of the league against The 3 Receiver, RB and TE. Improving speed and athleticism at MLB and SLB would go a long way towards fixing this. I would move Hightower to MLB and PLAY Maiava at SLB. Spikes would rotate with Hightower as needed.

    5) Resign Welker!

    6) Bring back Andre Carter as part of the DE rotation. Had a good season at Oakland and is even further Removed fom his Quad Injury. John Abraham and Dwight Freeney would also be  good albeit more expensive options.

    Draft:

    2a) Pick 1: Trade down to late 30's or early 40's and get an extra 3rder.Pick Larry Warford G Kentucky : Elite run blocking on the level of Chance Warmack and good pass protector. Very good feet and amazing strength. Won his matchups this season against all the DT's he went against. He beat Shariff Floyd, Dominated Sheldon Richardson and Shut out John Jenkins. Going into the season, my hope is that the Pats focus on improving their Perimeter passing game and continue improving their running game. Warford IMO would be a great improvement over Dan Conolly especially in those 3rd and Short situations where we seemed to struggle in the Conference Championship game. Warford has ALL Pro Potential.

    2b) Pick 2: #59: Justin Hunter WR Tennesee: Coming back from an ACL, he had a decent season but I expect him to get better this year as he is further removed from the ACL injury. At 6-4, 196, he has really good body control,leaping ability and route running. Has had a few issues with drops this season but is an issue that can be fixed. Hunter was a consensus first round pick going into this past season.

    3a) Zaviar Gooden LB Missouri: 4.47 40 and superb lateral agility make Gooden an intriguing option as a 3 down player. Expect the Pats to look at lighter LBers like Gooden and Arthur Brown in this draft in an attempt to fix their pass defense when in base. Gooden can keep up with Wide Receivers in the slot, Man up against RB's such as spiller, Bush and Rice in the passing game and even play faster Te's like Hernandez in man coverage. What he may give up in the run game due to his smaller stature can be masked by playing behind bigger DT's like Wilfork. It was widely rumored the Pats were very interested in Lavonte David and Demario Davis in last years draft.

    3b) Marcus Latimore RB South Carolina: Value pick. If he returns to pre injury form then this is undoubtedly the biggest steal of the draft. Lattimore, Ridley and Vereen running behind a Line of Solder, Mankins, Wendell, Warford and Cannon would be extremely formidable . As Brady grows older, its only fair that others should carry more of the responsibility for the teams success much like the late 90's Broncos did with Terell Davis carrying the team to back to back Super Bowls.

    7a) Quanterus Smith DE Western Kentucky.

    7b) Kenny Tate OLB Maryland.

     

     
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  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    In response to Godvernment's comment:

     

    In response to bredbru's comment:

     

    In response to WazzuWheatfarmer's comment:

     

    Margus Hunt makes me nervous. I really don't like his lack of production @ SMU, and I also don't like that he will be a 26 year old rookie.  I'd be okay taking him late 2nd, but he won't last that long. I hope we don't use our first on him.

     



    exactly

     

     



    i concur. ideally i would like him in the 3rd. 

     

     



    WALTER Has him mocked to #34, sf today

    hopkins 41, okaFOR 45, carradine 47, warfoprd 48, t wiliams 55, hunter 56, woods 61, trvis frederick 76, rambo 83, dobson 85, da rick rogers 94 (ie could be had in 3rd if shook out this way)

     

    he gives us syl williAMS AND amerson (simply becaus "bb loves hybrids"-thumbs down) in rd 2, glennon in rd 3 (too soon for a qb replacement, and esp with only 3 picks)

     

    if it turned out like this we could go carradine (even trading down) with first pick, have our choice of a slew of good big wrs from rd 2 on (woods, rogers etc), get a cb and ol (safety option over cb or ol).

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from dwhite1220. Show dwhite1220's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    In response to speedster81's comment:

    Ideally, this is what the Pats do in the offseason:

    FA:

    1) Make a play for Keenan Lewis CB - Pittsburgh. Anyone watched the two games the Steelers and Ravens played will see what a great job Pittsburgh's corners did in press man vs torrey smith and co. Its no wonder the steelers were able to beat Baltimore in Baltimore with their 3rd string QB. Pay particular attention to the the job Lewis did against Anquan Boldin. He made Boldin look outmatched in a way I have never seen before. At 6ft 210pounds, good strength and elite speed, Lewis can play press man and win against any type of corner.

    2) Sign DT Desmond Bryant or Randy Starks - Both of these guys give you elite Run Defense and Consistent Pressure from the inside. Signing a rookie DT and expecting him to dominate against NFL Veteran O Line men who have  been in Professional Strength and Conditioning programs for years in simply not realistic. It usually takes rookie DT's a few seasons to start playing up to their potential.

    3) Sign Brian Hartline - The case for an outside WR has already been well made on this board. No use beating a dead horse.

    4) Sign Kaluka Maiava OLB Cleveland - Excellent coverage Linebacker who can play on all downs. The past season the stats showed we actually did well covering the opposing No 1 and 2 receivers but ranked close to bottom of the league against The 3 Receiver, RB and TE. Improving speed and athleticism at MLB and SLB would go a long way towards fixing this. I would move Hightower to MLB and PLAY Maiava at SLB. Spikes would rotate with Hightower as needed.

    5) Resign Welker!

    6) Bring back Andre Carter as part of the DE rotation. Had a good season at Oakland and is even further Removed fom his Quad Injury. John Abraham and Dwight Freeney would also be  good albeit more expensive options.

    Draft:

    2a) Pick 1: Trade down to late 30's or early 40's and get an extra 3rder.Pick Larry Warford G Kentucky : Elite run blocking on the level of Chance Warmack and good pass protector. Very good feet and amazing strength. Won his matchups this season against all the DT's he went against. He beat Shariff Floyd, Dominated Sheldon Richardson and Shut out John Jenkins. Going into the season, my hope is that the Pats focus on improving their Perimeter passing game and continue improving their running game. Warford IMO would be a great improvement over Dan Conolly especially in those 3rd and Short situations where we seemed to struggle in the Conference Championship game. Warford has ALL Pro Potential.

    2b) Pick 2: #59: Justin Hunter WR Tennesee: Coming back from an ACL, he had a decent season but I expect him to get better this year as he is further removed from the ACL injury. At 6-4, 196, he has really good body control,leaping ability and route running. Has had a few issues with drops this season but is an issue that can be fixed. Hunter was a consensus first round pick going into this past season.

    3a) Zaviar Gooden LB Missouri: 4.47 40 and superb lateral agility make Gooden an intriguing option as a 3 down player. Expect the Pats to look at lighter LBers like Gooden and Arthur Brown in this draft in an attempt to fix their pass defense when in base. Gooden can keep up with Wide Receivers in the slot, Man up against RB's such as spiller, Bush and Rice in the passing game and even play faster Te's like Hernandez in man coverage. What he may give up in the run game due to his smaller stature can be masked by playing behind bigger DT's like Wilfork. It was widely rumored the Pats were very interested in Lavonte David and Demario Davis in last years draft.

    3b) Marcus Latimore RB South Carolina: Value pick. If he returns to pre injury form then this is undoubtedly the biggest steal of the draft. Lattimore, Ridley and Vereen running behind a Line of Solder, Mankins, Wendell, Warford and Cannon would be extremely formidable . As Brady grows older, its only fair that others should carry more of the responsibility for the teams success much like the late 90's Broncos did with Terell Davis carrying the team to back to back Super Bowls.

    7a) Quanterus Smith DE Western Kentucky.

    7b) Kenny Tate OLB Maryland.

     

    I like but I think we need another safety. What do you think ?


     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from mbeaulieu07. Show mbeaulieu07's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    In response to Faucetman's comment:

     

    i said that all year,

    and then had rhodes as a pick too :) unique big press man (ie seattle defense we need to coverrt to).

    but if we dotn get a legit pass rusher in fa, thats #1 need in draft for me even over getting a 6 3" 215 stud cb

     




    Was just reading up on Reiss' blog.  Tagging Talib is starting to make the most sense.  We lock him up for $10.8MM then try to get a long-term deal done to aleivate that hit.  Word is Pats are 9th in most cap space available so this would be a good insurance policy. 

     


    If we lose Welker, I would have to move Tavon Austin to the top of my board.


    If we lose Vollmer, we have Cannon who should be experienced enough to start but there are other F/A options at RT and we could always address in the 2nd round.  Kyle Long if he's there.

    We could then use our 3rd on a CB but I would not be surprised to see us add a F/A CB. 

     




    I agree that tagging Talib makes the most sense, allowing them to retain a player that clearly made the D better, with a relatively low risk deal.

     

    A couple to Rd 3 CB's to keep on your radar are Houston's DJ Hayden (who I have in Rd 2, but he is coming back from a freak injury that almost cost him his life), who'd come at a relative bargain, IMO and UConn's Dwayne Gratz... another size/speed/quicks/strength kid.

    The thought of Austin is intriguing, though another alternative would be to sign an outside WR like Brian Hartline in FA, then draft a slot kid like Swope or Ace Sanders on Day 2... maybe double up on WR with an other Welker-type player in Mizzou's TJ Moe who won't beat you in a sprint, but is the quick footed, sudden, COD type that they like.



    I would think you could line Swope up outside too?  He's one of my favorite WRs in this draft.  Austin is just a human missile, IMO.  I think he's better than Percy Harvin without the migraine issues.  Rumor was BB was all over Harvin if he had lasted to 23 but of course MIN took him at 22 which started us trading back and back until we eventually landed Chung at 34.

    Harvin is taller (5'11") and slower 4.4 than Austin (5'9") 4.34.  Moe is an interesting cat, impressed with a 3.96 shuttle and a 6.53 cone, both tops.  Yeah, we really don't need to spend a 1st round pick on a slot receiver. But chances are Welker will be back on a 3-4 year deal as I don't think his value would be as great away from Brady and I heard there won't be a lot of money being thrown around in free agency this year.

    [/QUOTE]

    For what it's worth, Harvin ran a 4.39.  It's yet to be seen if Austin is better than Harvin as, when healthy, Harvin is as versatile a weapon as there is in the NFL.  No doubting the kids explosion and big play ability though.


    I don't think Swope is incapable of playing on the outside, but he plays primarily out of the slow or stack formations.  Agree, he's one of my favorite WR's too, believe he was the 2nd player I profiled back on tab 3 of this thread (Dion Jordan was the first), ha.  Bellow is what I posted on 9/5 (I was a bit off on my speed projection, ha):

     

    Prospect Profile

    WR Ryan Swope- 6-0 206- Texas A&M

    Positives:

    *Projects as an excellent slot WR at the NFL level with the size to play outside
    *Good size
    *Hands catcher / excellent hands
    *Good fluidity and RAC ability
    *Good effort player
    *Solid route runner
    *Tempos routes extremely well and knows how to set up his man
    *Solid production against good teams
    *Solid overall career production / 180-2204-16
    *Has some kick return experience
    *Has played special teams

    Negatvies:

    *Doesn't possess elite speed (likely 4.5+ range)
    *Not an elite athlete
    *Likely not a game breaker at the NFL level

    Projection:

    I like this kid a lot... he won't wow you with speed/athleticism, but profiles and an excellent fit for NE's offense due to his route running, his ability get open and catch the football while pickiong up yards after the catch... he's also used frequently in bubble screens/isolation plays.  With the uncertain future of WW, the inconsistency Julian Edelman and the new/yet to produce Greg Salas, slot could be a position to target in the 2013 draft and I think Swope profiles as a solid Day 2 kid.  I'll be interested to see how he performs against better overall comp now that Texas A&M is in the SEC.

     

     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from speedster81. Show speedster81's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    In response to dwhite1220's comment:

    In response to speedster81's comment:

     

    Ideally, this is what the Pats do in the offseason:

    FA:

    1) Make a play for Keenan Lewis CB - Pittsburgh. Anyone watched the two games the Steelers and Ravens played will see what a great job Pittsburgh's corners did in press man vs torrey smith and co. Its no wonder the steelers were able to beat Baltimore in Baltimore with their 3rd string QB. Pay particular attention to the the job Lewis did against Anquan Boldin. He made Boldin look outmatched in a way I have never seen before. At 6ft 210pounds, good strength and elite speed, Lewis can play press man and win against any type of corner.

    2) Sign DT Desmond Bryant or Randy Starks - Both of these guys give you elite Run Defense and Consistent Pressure from the inside. Signing a rookie DT and expecting him to dominate against NFL Veteran O Line men who have  been in Professional Strength and Conditioning programs for years in simply not realistic. It usually takes rookie DT's a few seasons to start playing up to their potential.

    3) Sign Brian Hartline - The case for an outside WR has already been well made on this board. No use beating a dead horse.

    4) Sign Kaluka Maiava OLB Cleveland - Excellent coverage Linebacker who can play on all downs. The past season the stats showed we actually did well covering the opposing No 1 and 2 receivers but ranked close to bottom of the league against The 3 Receiver, RB and TE. Improving speed and athleticism at MLB and SLB would go a long way towards fixing this. I would move Hightower to MLB and PLAY Maiava at SLB. Spikes would rotate with Hightower as needed.

    5) Resign Welker!

    6) Bring back Andre Carter as part of the DE rotation. Had a good season at Oakland and is even further Removed fom his Quad Injury. John Abraham and Dwight Freeney would also be  good albeit more expensive options.

    Draft:

    2a) Pick 1: Trade down to late 30's or early 40's and get an extra 3rder.Pick Larry Warford G Kentucky : Elite run blocking on the level of Chance Warmack and good pass protector. Very good feet and amazing strength. Won his matchups this season against all the DT's he went against. He beat Shariff Floyd, Dominated Sheldon Richardson and Shut out John Jenkins. Going into the season, my hope is that the Pats focus on improving their Perimeter passing game and continue improving their running game. Warford IMO would be a great improvement over Dan Conolly especially in those 3rd and Short situations where we seemed to struggle in the Conference Championship game. Warford has ALL Pro Potential.

    2b) Pick 2: #59: Justin Hunter WR Tennesee: Coming back from an ACL, he had a decent season but I expect him to get better this year as he is further removed from the ACL injury. At 6-4, 196, he has really good body control,leaping ability and route running. Has had a few issues with drops this season but is an issue that can be fixed. Hunter was a consensus first round pick going into this past season.

    3a) Zaviar Gooden LB Missouri: 4.47 40 and superb lateral agility make Gooden an intriguing option as a 3 down player. Expect the Pats to look at lighter LBers like Gooden and Arthur Brown in this draft in an attempt to fix their pass defense when in base. Gooden can keep up with Wide Receivers in the slot, Man up against RB's such as spiller, Bush and Rice in the passing game and even play faster Te's like Hernandez in man coverage. What he may give up in the run game due to his smaller stature can be masked by playing behind bigger DT's like Wilfork. It was widely rumored the Pats were very interested in Lavonte David and Demario Davis in last years draft.

    3b) Marcus Latimore RB South Carolina: Value pick. If he returns to pre injury form then this is undoubtedly the biggest steal of the draft. Lattimore, Ridley and Vereen running behind a Line of Solder, Mankins, Wendell, Warford and Cannon would be extremely formidable . As Brady grows older, its only fair that others should carry more of the responsibility for the teams success much like the late 90's Broncos did with Terell Davis carrying the team to back to back Super Bowls.

    7a) Quanterus Smith DE Western Kentucky.

    7b) Kenny Tate OLB Maryland.

     

     

    I like but I think we need another safety. What do you think ?


     



    If we did this we should be ok as pertains to safety. Zaviar Gooden run better than almost all the safety prospects at the combine and tested better than they did in the lateral agility drills. He would provide similar coverage skills as a strong safety and superior run defense than any safety could. 

    Additionally Kenny Tate started out as safety before moving to OLB. He would also act as a strong safety.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    Where I am at right now:

    Rd 1 pick #20-23 - trade up from 29 with our 3rd rd pick... take WR Keenan Allen, get TB that big rangy target at WR he has missed (keep Welker and Lloyd, devestating 3 man group)

    Rd 2 pick #61 -  C/G Barrett Jones or Travis Frederick, either would be thrown into a mix to start at C (battle Wendell and Connolly in camp) or RG (battle Thomas and Cannon), regardless of who wins, interior becomes deep and young

    *trade* Mallett and a 7th rd pick to Cleveland for the Browns 3rd, 4th and 6th rd picks

    3rd rd pick #68 - a safety, move on from Chung, hopefully bring in Ed Reed and have him groom a guy you draft here like Rambo, Reid, Swearinger, Thomas...

    4th rd pick #101 - get a speedy ILB, Jon Bostic, Gooden, A.J Klein, Kiko Alonso... someone who can backup all 3 positions when we are in a 4-3 better than White and someone who can play for the slow Spikes on 3rd down when we are in a 3-4.

    6th and 7th rd's - best availabe player, maybe a brusier of a FB/big RB and a 3rd string QB

    I think the team will be fine on the D-line if they address it through free agency, add Cullen Jenkins or Randy Starks (Sey is prob not coming back) and assume that with one of those guys starting with Big Vince you have the depth (Love, Francis, Deaderick, Armstrong) to keep them fresh. Then at DE you start Jones and Nink... bring in a veteran like Osi or Freeny to sub in pass rush for Nink and you have Bequette and Cunningham around for depth.

     

     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    In response to rameakap's comment:

    Where I am at right now:

    Rd 1 pick #20-23 - trade up from 29 with our 3rd rd pick... take WR Keenan Allen, get TB that big rangy target at WR he has missed (keep Welker and Lloyd, devestating 3 man group)

    Rd 2 pick #61 -  C/G Barrett Jones or Travis Frederick, either would be thrown into a mix to start at C (battle Wendell and Connolly in camp) or RG (battle Thomas and Cannon), regardless of who wins, interior becomes deep and young

    *trade* Mallett and a 7th rd pick to Cleveland for the Browns 3rd, 4th and 6th rd picks

    3rd rd pick #68 - a safety, move on from Chung, hopefully bring in Ed Reed and have him groom a guy you draft here like Rambo, Reid, Swearinger, Thomas...

    4th rd pick #101 - get a speedy ILB, Jon Bostic, Gooden, A.J Klein, Kiko Alonso... someone who can backup all 3 positions when we are in a 4-3 better than White and someone who can play for the slow Spikes on 3rd down when we are in a 3-4.

    6th and 7th rd's - best availabe player, maybe a brusier of a FB/big RB and a 3rd string QB

    I think the team will be fine on the D-line if they address it through free agency, add Cullen Jenkins or Randy Starks (Sey is prob not coming back) and assume that with one of those guys starting with Big Vince you have the depth (Love, Francis, Deaderick, Armstrong) to keep them fresh. Then at DE you start Jones and Nink... bring in a veteran like Osi or Freeny to sub in pass rush for Nink and you have Bequette and Cunningham around for depth.

     

     



    only one glaring problem i see with this rame, cb. we need a #1 and a #2 cb for me (inlcuding or replacing talib.add this to the above (inludign the freeney or osi deal and im on board.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    I'm fine with Talib, Dennard, Arrington and Ras-I... with the safety depth to move McCourty back if needed and a veteran added at the min or a 6th rd pick used on depth

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from braunzy. Show braunzy's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    I think the biggest Riser in the draft will be Carradine. I think he is very high on the patriots board. And we would be lucky if he "falls" to us. I believe he fills a need as a LDE and would be great fit for the pats.  

    The way the accelerated ACL rehab process is going with these football players, I am not real worried about his knee for the 2013-2014 season.

    He is my number one pick for the pats and think he would do VERY well here

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    In response to mbeaulieu07's comment:

    In response to Faucetman's comment:

     

     

    i said that all year,

    and then had rhodes as a pick too :) unique big press man (ie seattle defense we need to coverrt to).

    but if we dotn get a legit pass rusher in fa, thats #1 need in draft for me even over getting a 6 3" 215 stud cb

     




    Was just reading up on Reiss' blog.  Tagging Talib is starting to make the most sense.  We lock him up for $10.8MM then try to get a long-term deal done to aleivate that hit.  Word is Pats are 9th in most cap space available so this would be a good insurance policy. 

     


    If we lose Welker, I would have to move Tavon Austin to the top of my board.


    If we lose Vollmer, we have Cannon who should be experienced enough to start but there are other F/A options at RT and we could always address in the 2nd round.  Kyle Long if he's there.

    We could then use our 3rd on a CB but I would not be surprised to see us add a F/A CB. 

     




    I agree that tagging Talib makes the most sense, allowing them to retain a player that clearly made the D better, with a relatively low risk deal.

     

    A couple to Rd 3 CB's to keep on your radar are Houston's DJ Hayden (who I have in Rd 2, but he is coming back from a freak injury that almost cost him his life), who'd come at a relative bargain, IMO and UConn's Dwayne Gratz... another size/speed/quicks/strength kid.

    The thought of Austin is intriguing, though another alternative would be to sign an outside WR like Brian Hartline in FA, then draft a slot kid like Swope or Ace Sanders on Day 2... maybe double up on WR with an other Welker-type player in Mizzou's TJ Moe who won't beat you in a sprint, but is the quick footed, sudden, COD type that they like.

     



    I would think you could line Swope up outside too?  He's one of my favorite WRs in this draft.  Austin is just a human missile, IMO.  I think he's better than Percy Harvin without the migraine issues.  Rumor was BB was all over Harvin if he had lasted to 23 but of course MIN took him at 22 which started us trading back and back until we eventually landed Chung at 34.

     

    Harvin is taller (5'11") and slower 4.4 than Austin (5'9") 4.34.  Moe is an interesting cat, impressed with a 3.96 shuttle and a 6.53 cone, both tops.  Yeah, we really don't need to spend a 1st round pick on a slot receiver. But chances are Welker will be back on a 3-4 year deal as I don't think his value would be as great away from Brady and I heard there won't be a lot of money being thrown around in free agency this year.

    For what it's worth, Harvin ran a 4.39.  It's yet to be seen if Austin is better than Harvin as, when healthy, Harvin is as versatile a weapon as there is in the NFL.  No doubting the kids explosion and big play ability though.


    I don't think Swope is incapable of playing on the outside, but he plays primarily out of the slow or stack formations.  Agree, he's one of my favorite WR's too, believe he was the 2nd player I profiled back on tab 3 of this thread (Dion Jordan was the first), ha.  Bellow is what I posted on 9/5 (I was a bit off on my speed projection, ha):

     

    Prospect Profile

    WR Ryan Swope- 6-0 206- Texas A&M

    Positives:

    *Projects as an excellent slot WR at the NFL level with the size to play outside
    *Good size
    *Hands catcher / excellent hands
    *Good fluidity and RAC ability
    *Good effort player
    *Solid route runner
    *Tempos routes extremely well and knows how to set up his man
    *Solid production against good teams
    *Solid overall career production / 180-2204-16
    *Has some kick return experience
    *Has played special teams

    Negatvies:

    *Doesn't possess elite speed (likely 4.5+ range)
    *Not an elite athlete
    *Likely not a game breaker at the NFL level

    Projection:

    I like this kid a lot... he won't wow you with speed/athleticism, but profiles and an excellent fit for NE's offense due to his route running, his ability get open and catch the football while pickiong up yards after the catch... he's also used frequently in bubble screens/isolation plays.  With the uncertain future of WW, the inconsistency Julian Edelman and the new/yet to produce Greg Salas, slot could be a position to target in the 2013 draft and I think Swope profiles as a solid Day 2 kid.  I'll be interested to see how he performs against better overall comp now that Texas A&M is in the SEC.

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    You may or may not have been. He might have run a high 4.3 in pajamas but does not mean he doesn't play the game closer to 4.5 as you suggested.

    I have no idea but you never know.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    In response to speedster81's comment:

    Ideally, this is what the Pats do in the offseason:

    FA:

    1) Make a play for Keenan Lewis CB - Pittsburgh. Anyone watched the two games the Steelers and Ravens played will see what a great job Pittsburgh's corners did in press man vs torrey smith and co. Its no wonder the steelers were able to beat Baltimore in Baltimore with their 3rd string QB. Pay particular attention to the the job Lewis did against Anquan Boldin. He made Boldin look outmatched in a way I have never seen before. At 6ft 210pounds, good strength and elite speed, Lewis can play press man and win against any type of corner.

    2) Sign DT Desmond Bryant or Randy Starks - Both of these guys give you elite Run Defense and Consistent Pressure from the inside. Signing a rookie DT and expecting him to dominate against NFL Veteran O Line men who have  been in Professional Strength and Conditioning programs for years in simply not realistic. It usually takes rookie DT's a few seasons to start playing up to their potential.

    3) Sign Brian Hartline - The case for an outside WR has already been well made on this board. No use beating a dead horse.

    4) Sign Kaluka Maiava OLB Cleveland - Excellent coverage Linebacker who can play on all downs. The past season the stats showed we actually did well covering the opposing No 1 and 2 receivers but ranked close to bottom of the league against The 3 Receiver, RB and TE. Improving speed and athleticism at MLB and SLB would go a long way towards fixing this. I would move Hightower to MLB and PLAY Maiava at SLB. Spikes would rotate with Hightower as needed.

    5) Resign Welker!

    6) Bring back Andre Carter as part of the DE rotation. Had a good season at Oakland and is even further Removed fom his Quad Injury. John Abraham and Dwight Freeney would also be  good albeit more expensive options.

    Draft:

    2a) Pick 1: Trade down to late 30's or early 40's and get an extra 3rder.Pick Larry Warford G Kentucky : Elite run blocking on the level of Chance Warmack and good pass protector. Very good feet and amazing strength. Won his matchups this season against all the DT's he went against. He beat Shariff Floyd, Dominated Sheldon Richardson and Shut out John Jenkins. Going into the season, my hope is that the Pats focus on improving their Perimeter passing game and continue improving their running game. Warford IMO would be a great improvement over Dan Conolly especially in those 3rd and Short situations where we seemed to struggle in the Conference Championship game. Warford has ALL Pro Potential.

    2b) Pick 2: #59: Justin Hunter WR Tennesee: Coming back from an ACL, he had a decent season but I expect him to get better this year as he is further removed from the ACL injury. At 6-4, 196, he has really good body control,leaping ability and route running. Has had a few issues with drops this season but is an issue that can be fixed. Hunter was a consensus first round pick going into this past season.

    3a) Zaviar Gooden LB Missouri: 4.47 40 and superb lateral agility make Gooden an intriguing option as a 3 down player. Expect the Pats to look at lighter LBers like Gooden and Arthur Brown in this draft in an attempt to fix their pass defense when in base. Gooden can keep up with Wide Receivers in the slot, Man up against RB's such as spiller, Bush and Rice in the passing game and even play faster Te's like Hernandez in man coverage. What he may give up in the run game due to his smaller stature can be masked by playing behind bigger DT's like Wilfork. It was widely rumored the Pats were very interested in Lavonte David and Demario Davis in last years draft.

    3b) Marcus Latimore RB South Carolina: Value pick. If he returns to pre injury form then this is undoubtedly the biggest steal of the draft. Lattimore, Ridley and Vereen running behind a Line of Solder, Mankins, Wendell, Warford and Cannon would be extremely formidable . As Brady grows older, its only fair that others should carry more of the responsibility for the teams success much like the late 90's Broncos did with Terell Davis carrying the team to back to back Super Bowls.

    7a) Quanterus Smith DE Western Kentucky.

    7b) Kenny Tate OLB Maryland.

     



    I am glad that you mentioned Warford. I am mixed about picking up an OLman this year, but I like that kid a lot.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from WazzuWheatfarmer. Show WazzuWheatfarmer's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    nepatriotsdraft.com has the best non-trade scenario that I have seen for NE. (I still feel that we would be best suited to trade back from 29 into early 2nd, but may not be possible...)They have NE getting Trufant, Robert Woods, and Mathieu with their first 3 picks.  I'd take that haul all day long as long as DL, WR, & S are addressed in FA.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    In response to braunzy's comment:

    I think the biggest Riser in the draft will be Carradine. I think he is very high on the patriots board. And we would be lucky if he "falls" to us. I believe he fills a need as a LDE and would be great fit for the pats.  

    The way the accelerated ACL rehab process is going with these football players, I am not real worried about his knee for the 2013-2014 season.

    He is my number one pick for the pats and think he would do VERY well here



    He'll be on the 6 week PUP, if he is there in rd 2 consider him for sure

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from braunzy. Show braunzy's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    In response to rameakap's comment:

    In response to braunzy's comment:

     

    I think the biggest Riser in the draft will be Carradine. I think he is very high on the patriots board. And we would be lucky if he "falls" to us. I believe he fills a need as a LDE and would be great fit for the pats.  

    The way the accelerated ACL rehab process is going with these football players, I am not real worried about his knee for the 2013-2014 season.

    He is my number one pick for the pats and think he would do VERY well here

     



    He'll be on the 6 week PUP, if he is there in rd 2 consider him for sure

     



    He would be a great pick in the 2nd it seems. I have a funny feeling he is going to be gone before our first round pick though. Especially if he is able to work out for teams before the draft, but his knee is questionable. Without the injury I don't think we would've had any shot at him

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    In response to WazzuWheatfarmer's comment:

    nepatriotsdraft.com has the best non-trade scenario that I have seen for NE. (I still feel that we would be best suited to trade back from 29 into early 2nd, but may not be possible...)They have NE getting Trufant, Robert Woods, and Mathieu with their first 3 picks.  I'd take that haul all day long as long as DL, WR, & S are addressed in FA.



    I don't like that draft, honestly. The mention Trufant as a CB who can play inside and out which is good but if he's going to replace Talib then we are in trouble. Historically young secondaries don't perform well because they don't have the experience to communicate with each other in every situation. If it's to learn from a vet CB to eventually take over but imagine a CB core of 2 rooks and a player who might not be their at the beginning of the year and only has a 1/4 of a season as a starter. Not very appealing in my mind.

    It's funny they mention that Trufant lets them concentrate on DL at some point but they never address it in the draft instead the take a very talent slot receiver in Woods. Now normally I'd love Woods but what's the biggest issue wth our receiving core? They are all the same players over and over again. Short to intermediate WR's who can get YAC but generally all work the middle. None really have size to give mismatches or speed to create downfield separation. Frankly all you have to do is bump our WR's at the line and clog the middle. Now that's easer sad then done but SB caliber D's do it and we aren't aiming at just making the playoffs here. With the Pats they need to diversify the receiving core and stretch the field either vertically or horizontally. Bigger WR's can stretch it horizontally, quicker WR's can stretch it vertically.

    Mathieu I like a lot but maybe not in the 3rd. If they can trade back at some point imo Mathieu can e had in the 4th or early 5th. But, he's exactly the CB type we should target. He's a slot CB, as we know slot CB's can step in and play almost immediately. With Dennard on one end and signing a vet to play the other the slot CB position is the best spot to add a rook and let them grow. Mathieu might be one of the best slot CB's in the draft so this would be an easy choice. If they can't trade back I'd still be happy with Mathieu in the 3rd.

    All in all I'm happy with the players they took individually but I don't think they are the right players for the team. Imo if you add a WR it should be something you are missing not the same players you already have otherwise you are staying the same not changing. If you add a CB with an already extremely young DB core you target a position that is almost plug and play, which is slot, you don't add more youth as starters across every position. You need a vet to solidify the core not put together inexperienced players and hope they gel and a leader emerges

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from JohnHannahrulz. Show JohnHannahrulz's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    I mentioned that I like Rhodes. But I doubt the Pats have a realistic shot, he sort of has to fall a little bit. I like swope and could see him as a Shipley/Decker type wr. My main issue with some of these mocks is that I am seeing too many players ( Lattimore) that could fall to the pats because of injuries. I'd rather grab some draftee on his way up the board than player who is on his way down.  TaLib is the big issue Imo because CB is the big need if the pats don't sign him and Dennard misses time. Also if Mallet is traded the Pats will draft a qb in first 4 rounds.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from jjdbrasil. Show jjdbrasil's posts

    Re: ***2013 Patriots Draft Thread V2***

    I think nepatriotsdraft.com scenario addresses some needs.  Of course without the FA complement we really don't know.  CB would save money but I agree with PatsEng we need Talib or a veteran.  I would like to see them build from the lines out. This draft has the DTs available. It seems DTs are being pushed down and Edge Pass Rushers are moving up.  I think S. Williams or J Hankins will be hanging around at 29. (hankins has been dropping)  I also think J Jenkins or Hunt may be 33-40 range. They could also drop back to the top of the third and Pick up B. Williams or K Geathers.    I would also like a WR and Safety.  One of Woods, Patton, Hopkins, Hunter or Austin if Welker leaves. Safety could be Cyprien, Elam, Reid, Rambo, Williams in the 2nd or 3rd.  The other wild card is OG.  We may need some depth there.

    Again FA should tell us something, then of course, what we think is right BB does the opposite.

     
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