5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. :  All the talk and yammering here, the back and forth over the importance of a running threat was answered last night loud and clear.  Let the naysayer's yell and live in denial all they want, the proof is in the pudding. Deal with it...
    Posted by wozzy[/QUOTE]


    Are you a complete nutbag? It was a preseason game dikwad, complete with a swarm of rookie FAs. Only a delusional fool would think anything was proven by that.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]^ Dude a change of possession does not count as the offense gaining a 1st down. Again, with 27 minutes of game clock remaining the pats had 7 1st downs. 2 on the last 57 second possession. If they could have sustained any of their 2nd, 3rd or 4rth possessions by getting 1st downs we could have held the ball longer and kept our defense and the Gints offense off the field. You recount, and don't count the 1st play of the drive as the offense gaining a 1st down. Only you would try and defend what the offense did in the 2nd half. Only you.
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE]

    Not countin change of possessions That would make it 15.  There was a drive I left off that only had the change of possession down and no other.
    Why on earth are you counting 27 minutes?  There are 30.
    They did score in the second half and their longest drive was a failed drive in the 4th.  They did score on 33% of their 4 possessions which is average,  Allowing the jints to score on 75% of their 4 drives is not.
    If one is acceptable  33%(not great but acceptable) and the other 75% is totally unacceptable, where is the problem?
    Why do you expect the Pats to always score on at least 50% of their drives.
    Not realistic and wouldn't need to happen if the D could hold the opposition to under 50%, which they seldom ever did.
    The league scoring average is 31.66 percent of drives, 50-75% is just nuts!
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : Practice, practice, practice. There's obviously a need to improve the running situation but when the game is on the line and they need to score 2-3Td's from behind at the half.  They're going with the arm.  Hopefully the D doesn't allow them to be 3 td's behind at the half like the past couple of years or blow a 3 score lead. Don't think there going to win many games while running all night and scoring 7 points, Do you? It's practice!  Cannot be stressed enough.  The backs need practice!  That's the only way they are going to be effective when they are called on. It was nice to see the screens again.  BJGE was not effective there.
    Posted by pezz4pats[/QUOTE]

    You like making things up. i can't think of many games where we were behind 2or 3 tds in the 2nd half "like the past couple of years" as you suggest, and the only 3 score lead I remember us blowing was in Buffalo when we threw 4 interceptions with the lead. Another classic case of needing to run the 4 minute offense and take what the defense gives us.


     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : Not countin change of possessions That would make it 15.  There was a drive I left off that only had the change of possession down and no other. Why on earth are you counting 27 minutes?  There are 30. They did score in the second half and their longest drive was a failed drive in the 4th.  They did score on 33% of their 4 possessions which is average,  Allowing the jints to score on 75% of their 4 drives is not. If one is acceptable  33%(not great but acceptable) and the other 75% is totally unacceptable, where is the problem? Why do you expect the Pats to always score on at least 50% of their drives. Not realistic and wouldn't need to happen if the D could hold the opposition to under 50%, which they seldom ever did. The league scoring average is 31.66 percent of drives, 50-75% is just nuts!
    Posted by pezz4pats[/QUOTE]

    In the remaining 27 minutes of the game the offense achieved 7 1st downs. is that good sir? Is it?
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : Zero points in the 4th quarter was particularly impressive... but I've moved on. McDaniel's is bringing back smashmouth and screen passes, say goodbye to offensive inefficiency in the playoff's. I know the fantasy football crew won't attribute any success we have this year or an improved defense on the running game but anyone with half a clue about complimentary football will, McDaniel's will... that's enough for me. I'm giddy over the play selection last night. The execution was crud but the selection was right on.
    Posted by wozzy[/QUOTE]


    Ya, zero points in 3 quarters of last nights practise was impressive too.  They will never rush that much in a non practice game.  They will use it as needed.
    You don't think they're brain storming right now on how to fix the O-lines pass protection?  Can't have TB eating rubber all night.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    I should have let this thread stay dead and buried.  >_>
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : The backs getting reps was something we haven't seen in 4 years... yeah, deal with it, the finesse BS is over. The I-formation, the screen pass, something we haven't seen in years... bye O'Brien, you won't be missed.
    Posted by wozzy[/QUOTE]

    You don't think some of that had to do with the QB's getting killed cuz the O line sucked?  Tunnel vision at it's finest.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : You like making things up. i can't think of many games where we were behind 2or 3 tds in the 2nd half "like the past couple of years" as you suggest, and the only 3 score lead I remember us blowing was in Buffalo when we threw 4 interceptions with the lead. Another classic case of needing to run the 4 minute offense and take what the defense gives us.
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE]

    LOL the D gave up 32 pts in the second half of that game.  Pics don't always have to lead to 7's. 
    They were behind in the Miami game, I think the 2nd Bills game, Steeler, Giants.  Off the Top of my head.  Almost lost the lead against the Clots and Skins after a good lead.  That's 7 right there.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE] " Tom Brady was quick to point out to me that the Pats need a better four-minute offense, and need to take the run when the defense is playing the pass" he doesn't say we need a better runningback, he doesn't say we need to improve the running when the defense is playing the pass. He says we need to "take" the run when the defense is playing the pass. But that won't stop you now will it?
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE]


    That's a football cliche idiot. As if they know what the D is doing on every play, pffft.

    Okay Truechump. We all agree. We will "take the run", "when the defense is playing the pass". Happy now? So from here on, on 3rd and 12, we will run. Dufus.

    You cling like a drowning man to the phoney life preserver of that statement because you think somehow in your twisted mind that it means we should run more. It doesn't mean that at all.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : yes but to be fair, if you throw 4 pics in one game, you will more likely than not, lose.
    Posted by TheGreenMonstah[/QUOTE]

    I think the Bills also had 3-4 pics.  They scored 31 points despite those 4 picks.
    The D gave up that many points in the second half alone.
    Not Brady's best game but not the D's either. 
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : yes but to be fair, if you throw 4 pics in one game, you will more likely than not, lose.
    Posted by TheGreenMonstah[/QUOTE]

    That is true. But of you score the tying points late and the D collapses in the last minutes I guarantee you will lose.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : You cling like a drowning man to the phoney life preserver of that statement
    Posted by BabeParilli[/QUOTE]

    The number of hilarious similes you come up with when you argue is unbelievable.  Do you just have a list of these lying around somehwere?  I almost spit out my coffee onto the keyboard when I read this one.  I will say this.  Regardless of whether I agree with you or not I can't help but laugh.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE] " Tom Brady was quick to point out to me that the Pats need a better four-minute offense, and need to take the run when the defense is playing the pass" he doesn't say we need a better runningback, he doesn't say we need to improve the running when the defense is playing the pass. He says we need to "take" the run when the defense is playing the pass. But that won't stop you now will it?
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE 

    “As I said earlier, part of the passing game is seeing what they’re taking away, then doing something different. That’s the running game too. If they want to play pass and double coverage and who we’re bracketing, then you have to run it. I think we have some guys that we can really make some big plays with – between Woody and Rid and Shane, to see what they’re able to do. They’re out here working hard. That’s part of what the offense needs to be. It can’t be 2 yards, 3 yards. You have to make them pay. Some of the best offenses that we’ve ever had here, the running game was a huge part of what we did, especially situationally. You’re not always going to be able to pass it. When it’s third-and-1, you have to be able to run it. When you’re on the goal-line, you have to run it. When you’re backed up, you have to run it. Four-minute offense at the end of the game with the lead, you have to run it – they know you’re running it and you still have to make yards. That’s part of being a great running team, too.” 


    Here's what he actually said.  He was talking about execution at least as much as he was talking about taking the run when the run was available.  Most important, he was talking about executing effectively in the running game even when the run was completely predictable.  

    You and Wozzy forget that, just for an example, the BJGE run right before the infamous Welker drop in the Super Bowl was an I-formation play with a fullback.  It wasn't the only time they tried to run BJGE in the I formation.  Those "smashmouth" plays unfortunately got yardage like -1, 2, etc.  Smashmouth is wonderful if--as Brady is saying--it gets more than 2 or 3 yards. Getting those extra yards isn't about the play call--it's about the execution on the call.  Too bad, BJGE's I-formation run produced a negative gain.  If it hadn't maybe Brady wouldn't have been throwing to Welker on second down.



     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : The number of hilarious similes you come up with when you argue is unbelievable.  Do you just have a list of these lying around somehwere?  I almost spit out my coffee onto the keyboard when I read this one.  I will say this.  Regardless of whether I agree with you or not I can't help but laugh.
    Posted by pcmIV[/QUOTE]

    No list. I have to give credit where it is due. Truechump's inspirational quality in this regard is mighty.

    Glad you got a chuckle out of it. We can't take this football talk too seriously.

    My favorite simile was to Laz when I told him reading through one of his posts to find something of worth was like searching through a complex of warehouses full of dung desperately seeking one small gold nugget. I think they deleted that one. Wink
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : You don't think some of that had to do with the QB's getting killed cuz the O line sucked?  Tunnel vision at it's finest.
    Posted by pezz4pats[/QUOTE]

    The second play of the game was I Formation after opening with 5 wide, no the QB hadn't gotten "killed" at that point.  And they continued to run I Formation, I'd say close to half of the offensive plays last night were I or single back two tightend running sets. 

    Tunnel vision? Lol you just got smacked in the face with the power running game and your only retort is "we won't see it except in practice," brilliant.

    I-Formation used to be common practice, we won three rings running it and scored more than a measly 7 points a game from 2001-2008.  Oh yeah and we won a close game last night...

    I swear you pretend like the three championship year's offense never happened, you act like we've always been a finesse team. That's not our roots, not how we won three rings and we've gone back to our roots... it must be a blow to the ego but living in denial certainly won't help.  Accept it and move on...
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : this is true. but you shouldnt even be put into that situation when you are up by that big of a margin at halftime. i just think that game is a bad example to prove any point because both the offense and defense blew the whole second half. 
    Posted by TheGreenMonstah[/QUOTE]

    There certainly is plenty of blame to spread around on both sides of the ball through the course of that game.

    But what happens when it's late and the game is on the line is the stuff where champions are made. Almost every time Brady gets that job done. But the defense has a long history of not getting that job done.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : In the remaining 27 minutes of the game the offense achieved 7 1st downs. is that good sir? Is it?
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE]

    Oh, Sorry!  I thought when you said 2nd half, you meant the Whole second half.  My Bad!

    Oh,  wait?  Why are we leaving out the 1st scoring drive of the second half again?  You know the one with all those !st downs? 
    You been hanging with Rusty too much, my friend.
    Defiantly Rusty logic.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : [QUOTE] " Tom Brady was quick to point out to me that the Pats need a better four-minute offense, and need to take the run when the defense is playing the pass" he doesn't say we need a better runningback, he doesn't say we need to improve the running when the defense is playing the pass. He says we need to "take" the run when the defense is playing the pass. But that won't stop you now will it? Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE   “As I said earlier, part of the passing game is seeing what they’re taking away, then doing something different. That’s the running game too. If they want to play pass and double coverage and who we’re bracketing, then you have to run it. I think we have some guys that we can really make some big plays with – between Woody and Rid and Shane, to see what they’re able to do. They’re out here working hard. That’s part of what the offense needs to be. It can’t be 2 yards, 3 yards. You have to make them pay. Some of the best offenses that we’ve ever had here, the running game was a huge part of what we did, especially situationally. You’re not always going to be able to pass it. When it’s third-and-1, you have to be able to run it. When you’re on the goal-line, you have to run it. When you’re backed up, you have to run it. Four-minute offense at the end of the game with the lead, you have to run it – they know you’re running it and you still have to make yards. That’s part of being a great running team, too.”  Here's what he actually said.  He was talking about execution at least as much as he was talking about taking the run when the run was available.  Most important, he was talking about executing effectively in the running game even when the run was completely predictable.   You and Wozzy forget that, just for an example, the BJGE run right before the infamous Welker drop in the Super Bowl was an I-formation play with a fullback.  It wasn't the only time they tried to run BJGE in the I formation.  Those "smashmouth" plays unfortunately got yardage like -1, 2, etc.  Smashmouth is wonderful if--as Brady is saying--it gets more than 2 or 3 yards. Getting those extra yards isn't about the play call--it's about the execution on the call.  Too bad, BJGE's I-formation run produced a negative gain.  If it hadn't maybe Brady wouldn't have been throwing to Welker on second down.
    Posted by prolate0spheroid[/QUOTE]

    Wow are you referring to the play right before three straight drops by the "high powered" passing attack that ended the game with our offense scoring zero points in the 4th quarter?

    Last night's smash mouth offensive running game averaged 4 yards a carry and was about the only positive thing we saw offensively.  Our starter averaged 5 yards a carry. The fullback's and their blocking was superb and can only get better.  You act like this is a bad thing because it doesn't fit in with your fantasy football ideal.
     
  19. This post has been removed.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : Wow are you referring to the play right before three straight drops by the "high powered" passing attack that ended the game with our offense scoring zero points in the 4th quarter? Last night's smash mouth offensive running game averaged 4 yards a carry and was about the only positive thing we saw.  Our starter averaged 5 yards a carry. The fullback's and their blocking was superb and can only get better.  You act like this is a bad thing because it doesn't fit in with your fantasy football ideal.
    Posted by wozzy[/QUOTE]


    No, no, I think it's a good thing.  I like it when they can get 5 yards a carry.  That means running becomes feasible to re-incorporate into the game plan in a serious way.  Like Brady, though, I don't think that two and three yard gains cut it.  What you don't get is that I like running . . . I just don't think we were very good at it last year. 


     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : ridley and vereen are much more explosive runners than BJGE could have ever hoped to have been....vereen looks like he could be a stud and ridley already proved that he could play last year with that 5 YPC average....i like josh mcdaniels offensive philosophy.....this offense should be a well oiled machine.
    Posted by TheGreenMonstah[/QUOTE]


    I hope so.  I love the fact that it looks like they've got two backs who might be capable of breaking long runs periodically, getting around the corner, and catching passes.  It means the screen game can be re-vitalized and the running game won't have to rely so much on deception and can be more a power and speed game.  I also love what I saw from Lloyd and Gaffney. There's still work to be done to get the timing right, but you can see that both Lloyd and Gaffney can force safeties and corners away from the middle of the field.  That will open up space for the short passing game to Gronk, Hern, Welker, and the backs and also create more space for the runners.  This really could be a special offense--as long as the O-line gets in shape.  





     


     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : You might want to get out more if you're spitting out coffee over that mish mash of imagery and word choices.
    Posted by CliffordWasHere[/QUOTE]

    Says the guy who has more posts on this board in a month than I have ever had and references diapers, j1zz, various serial killers and blowup dolls in hundreds of those posts.  I don't even know why you felt the need to come at me for.  Maybe you just can't help yourself anymore.
     
  23. This post has been removed.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday. : The second play of the game was I Formation after opening with 5 wide, no the QB hadn't gotten "killed" at that point.  And they continued to run I Formation, I'd say close to half of the offensive plays last night were I or single back two tightend running sets.  Tunnel vision? Lol you just got smacked in the face with the power running game and your only retort is "we won't see it except in practice," brilliant. I-Formation used to be common practice, we won three rings running it and scored more than a measly 7 points a game from 2001-2008.  Oh yeah and we won a close game last night... I swear you pretend like the three championship year's offense never happened, you act like we've always been a finesse team. That's not our roots, not how we won three rings and we've gone back to our roots... it must be a blow to the ego but living in denial certainly won't help.  Accept it and move on...
    Posted by wozzy[/QUOTE]

    Only thing I got smacked in the face with is stoopid.
    I said some of it was due to the O line sucking, the other was preparational PRACTICE.   If they are not efficient, they won't be able to use all those precious running formations.
    Just like last year when they weren't very efficient and you rarely saw sweeps and I formations because they rarely worked.
    We don't want a repeat of last years inefficiency, do we?
    Couldn't take another year of you blaming the coaches and the rusty wheel blaming TB for being selfish.
    Ridiculous!   It's PRACTICE!
    Remember the 1st pre-season game last year when they went sack happy and every one was wearing tents for about a week?  Tents fell immediately after that, never to be pupped again.   LOL.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.

    In Response to Re: 5 Questions from Kirwan and his camp visit on Sunday.:
    [QUOTE]I think Waters returns.  It seems odd if he was going to retire that he would wait it out like this, knowing he's under contract. Something tells me it's a wink-wink type thing and he'll return shortly before the opener. That would put Connolly back to his better spot at Center and help stabilize the line more. Obviously, Vollemer is the other key, but it smells like BB is just maximizing his nagging inuries (back and foot). Same deal with Fanene and Spikes on D.  These guy are all locks, so why bother giving them reps if they aren't 100%?
    Posted by CliffordWasHere[/QUOTE]

    I hope you're right.  All of those guys add a lot to this team.  With BB as coach, though, it's impossible to tell what the real injury situation is. 
     

Share