Absolutely Priceless

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from mia76. Show mia76's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    This is a nice article with or without the 'gloating' on the Pats situation. Truth is a bunch of teams boxed themselves into a corner in retaining their own good players and signing expensive FAs. Interestingly a team like Philly while in some cap trouble did do one smart thing which is they did not load up their big contracts with big signing bonuses so they can cut a player like Namdi without incuring a crippling dead money hit.

    Pats fans alway scream about the players cut or traded that 'could have made the difference' in a SB run, but the process of roster churn and salary discipline is necessary to maintain a good team in the cap era.

    And ... I still maintain SB winners almost invariably have 'luck' on their side (including the three SBs for the Pats.) This past year Baltimore had about a .001 chance of getting to the AFC championship game let alone winning a SB with 1 minute left in Denver - they beat the odds and the rest is history. You have to limit critical injuries, get a few calls, or a few bouncing balls to bounce right, or a 1% chance to pay off.

    GMs and coaches can control being a playoff team and a 1 or 2 seed (without a truly catastrophic injury list) but they really cannot control creating a SB victory during the off season. We like to think they have that ability, but the reality does not support that.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from WazzuWheatfarmer. Show WazzuWheatfarmer's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    Great article.  This is a great piece that explains the "method behind the madness" when it comes to salary cap management, FA contracts, etc...  I'll admit that I can be as guilty as anyone when it comes to knee-jerk reactions when NE passes on "Big Name Free Agents" (Peppers, Mario Williams, etc) or when we let quality players walk because they want too much money (Samuel), but this is a great reminder that BB/Kraft always have the Big Picture and long term outlook in mind.  Just an outstanding organization with terrific buisness sense.  This year, we will no doubt let one of our "Big Name Guys" walk to purse more money elsewhere, and many of us fans will no doubt cuss the move and wonder why BB didn't just "Pay the Man!"  Well, the truth is that if you just "Pay the Man!" every time a big name guy hits the market, then you end up with a roster composed of 5 or 6 talented players and 47 or so below-average fill-ins.  In short, you become the Jets or the 2012 Eagles.  Let's be glad that BB understands the cap limitations and how to best fill out a 53 man roster.  Also, be thankful that he can find quality players like Francis, Fortson, Dennard, Love, etc who were drafted late, or not at all and who account for a very minimal cap hit.  These type of contracts all NE the flexibility to make a move for the right guy when that opportunity does present itself.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from WazzuWheatfarmer. Show WazzuWheatfarmer's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    To follow up my previous post (it was getting a little long-winded), I predict that we will come to terms with Welker on a slightly below-market deal.  I bet he will get somewhere around 7 mil per year for 3-4 years.  I also expect us to re-sign Talib.  I think that he will find that no one is willing to offer him 10 mil per year on the open market, and I believe that NE liked what they saw from him last year.  I look for him to sign a similar deal to Welker.  Vollmer is the guy who I think could walk.  He is no doubt a very good player, but the fact is that he is a RIGHT Tackle with back issues.  I just can't see BB throwing top tier money at him, and I think that some other team will.  This would be a move that would enrage many fans, but if it does happen just keep in mind that it will be in the best interest of the team.  We will soon see how this all plays out.  This Free Agency period is shaping up to be more interesting than any other that I can remember.

     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    something funny about this argument.  while kraft and belichick were winning the salary cap battle, the giants, packers, saints, and steelers were winning super bowls. let's not get carried away :-)

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    In response to RidingWithTheKing's comment:

     

    In response to garytx's comment:

     

    Yep, what good is being under the cap if you don't bring in good players.  Last year was terrible.  Why waste one's time?  But Rusty does bring up a good point in that there are a lot of FAs out there and they aren't going to get the money they want.  Half the NFL won't be participating in FA because of salary cap issues.  They need about 8mil in cap space just to sign draft picks.  

    For salary cap hell the Jets are in bad shape.  The distraction is the release of so many underachieving players but they are still high.  That's the reason they are shopping Revis.  Even with the axing of all these players they will not be able to be very active in the FA market.  Baltimore and Pittsburgh are two other teams that are struggling just to maintain.

    FA hell is very real.  The Pats underachieving in FA is very real too.

     




    "Terrible"?  See, these are the kinds of words I am talking about.    I am sorry, but there is nothing terrible about steady performers like Lloyd and Gregory and adding them into a very talented, albeit young group.  God forbid Fells didn't shoot right past Gronk and Hernandez too!  The horror!


    I am sorry they couldn't help Brady be better in another AFC Title game.

    This is getting out of control. It really is. YOU BBWs are sick. Asbolutely sick.

    Day after day after day there is evidence how ingenius BB's approach has been, like I said here for years, and you're still looking for execuses or Brady. That's what this is about. If Brady sucks, BB pays for it with the pink hats.

    Sick.

    Thank you, BB. Simply the best GM of all time, hands tied, rules created and he just keeps on keeping on, Brady ready to play well or not.

     

     




    No one ever mentions TB but you, even though he is responsible for 1/3rd of all that cap they have.  YOU are the sick one.

     

    But you are right.  They didn't help Brady.

    A 3rd down stop, a 3 and out, a pick or fumble recovery, a well timed sack and pressure on the opposing QB, one less dropped ball and one less fumble, backs that can punch it in from the 1 yard line,  a goal line stand and not relinquishing the lead time and time again, ect...ect...ect...  WOULD HAVE HELPED BRADY.

    Unfortunately NONE of those things happened.  They sure did help Eli and Flacco, though.

    Maybe they need some players that can help their own QB, instead of the opposing one?????

     
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  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    In response to RidingWithTheKing's comment:

    In response to pezz4pats' comment:

     

    In response to RidingWithTheKing's comment:

     

    In response to garytx's comment:

     

    Yep, what good is being under the cap if you don't bring in good players.  Last year was terrible.  Why waste one's time?  But Rusty does bring up a good point in that there are a lot of FAs out there and they aren't going to get the money they want.  Half the NFL won't be participating in FA because of salary cap issues.  They need about 8mil in cap space just to sign draft picks.  

    For salary cap hell the Jets are in bad shape.  The distraction is the release of so many underachieving players but they are still high.  That's the reason they are shopping Revis.  Even with the axing of all these players they will not be able to be very active in the FA market.  Baltimore and Pittsburgh are two other teams that are struggling just to maintain.

    FA hell is very real.  The Pats underachieving in FA is very real too.

     




    "Terrible"?  See, these are the kinds of words I am talking about.    I am sorry, but there is nothing terrible about steady performers like Lloyd and Gregory and adding them into a very talented, albeit young group.  God forbid Fells didn't shoot right past Gronk and Hernandez too!  The horror!


    I am sorry they couldn't help Brady be better in another AFC Title game.

    This is getting out of control. It really is. YOU BBWs are sick. Asbolutely sick.

    Day after day after day there is evidence how ingenius BB's approach has been, like I said here for years, and you're still looking for execuses or Brady. That's what this is about. If Brady sucks, BB pays for it with the pink hats.

    Sick.

    Thank you, BB. Simply the best GM of all time, hands tied, rules created and he just keeps on keeping on, Brady ready to play well or not.

     

     




    No one ever mentions TB but you, even though he is responsible for 1/3rd of all that cap they have.  YOU are the sick one.

     

    But you are right.  They didn't help Brady.

    A 3rd down stop, a 3 and out, a pick or fumble recovery, a well timed sack and pressure on the opposing QB, one less dropped ball and one less fumble, backs that can punch it in from the 1 yard line,  a goal line stand and not relinquishing the lead time and time again, ect...ect...ect...  WOULD HAVE HELPED BRADY.

    Unfortunately NONE of those things happened.  They sure did help Eli and Flacco, though.

     




    They "helped" Eli and FLacco after our offense sucked its thumb all game. Hey, remember when our All Star D in SB 42 "helped" Eli then? But, they didn't help him at all.  They got caught up in the luckiest play in NFL history because our all world offense barely eeked out 14 freaking points in a SB.

     

    It's like they were stuck in a time warp thinking it was 1967 and 14 points was plenty of points.

    LMAO @ YOU and your Group

    Pathetic.

    Brady is not here to have his butt kissed with BB surrounding Brady with All Pros through the roster like Brady is some special, privileged type.  You're sick.

    PS I can see why this article bothers you. It spells out the truth and just how BADLY Brady and the offense blew their chances in the 4th qtr in SB 46.

    13 points this past January only solidifies it.




    Did you not just read that any or ALL of those things that would have secured a win, didn't happen?

    Can you dispute ANY of that? 

    Does Flacco or Eli win without those????  Nope.

    Do you not know that your boy riddley was responsible for 14 lost points?  Couldn't get one yard on the goal line and fumbled.  That's TB's fault?

    TB had the lead in every one of those games.  What happened to it?    SEE ABOVE

    18 million in "dead money", resulting in and because of ineffective players, happened to it.  That's what.

     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from garytx. Show garytx's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    Thanks for putting words in my mouth Rusty.   It proves once again that you're here to start fights without respecting someone elses point of view or in this case making some stuff up.  No wonder you have lost so much credibility here.  I wish I could LMAO at you but all I can do is shake my head.

     
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  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    So, if Brady is the problem, why has salary cap genius Bill Belichick invested so much cap space in him over the past few years?  Your argument, Rusty, doesn't really hold together.  Belichick gets value players to manage the cap, but then pays big dollars to guys like Mankins and Brady whom you continually bash.  I'm not getting it.  If Kraft and Belichick are such a geniuses, why do they, in your opinion, then go out and make 10 and 20 million dollar mistakes overpaying underperformers (in your opinon again) like Mankins and Brady?  

    If Brady is the only reason for the team's collapse in the playoffs, why are they paying him such big money?  If you read your posts, you can only conclude that what should have happened against the Giants is that Brady should have been "reined" in so Ocho and BJGE could have been let loose to terroize the Giants' defense.  Yet neither Ocho or BJGE is with the team anymore . . . and Brady is still throwing from the shotgun.  

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    In response to RidingWithTheKing's comment:

    In response to PatsLifer's comment:

     

    I agree with rkarp on this one. Yes, good work by the pats and bb to manage the cap. However, the lack of signing game changers and going with over the hill or reclamation projects is not doing them any favors. Pony up the cash, bring in a stud or two, and lets get this thing over the finish line. 

     



    Tears!  Are you sure you want to do that?  That's like saying "I enoy being dumb".  Oh my, PatsLifer. Even when it's spelled out for you, you still want to pretend the Jets had it right like RKarp says, huh?

     

    Some people here can be really out to lunch.



    Never, ever have I said that the Jets have done it the correct way. I simply love to point out how wrong you are about how bad off they are and will be. 

    Repeat, no one here is questioning the method, but there are questions of what has been done with the $$$, and how perceived deficiencies have or have not been filled. No one expecting hits every time, but how does a team that manages the cap so well end up with Julian Edelman getting meaning ful snaps in the defensive secondary? Merriwether, Chung, Gregory, Ras, Sanders, Whilhite, Butler.....time to use the cap for an impact player in the defensive secondary. Not Reed, not Wilson, not Woodson....go get a guy in his prime that can make a difference. 

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    I have been saying, but nobody is listening... The playoff collapse has been mainly due to the Patriots coaching and game planning going into the playoffs and SB.  They open up the offense all season long, playing to win... win big, then they get conservative in the playoffs and SB.  They really seem to put the hancuffs on the offense, never seem to make adjustments or have a plan B, and they play to not lose instead of to not win.  Out coached, out gameplanned in the playoffs and SB.

    Of course some injuries hurt, of course there are some bad plays too, and not having a deeper threat at these times out there to spread the D's hurt when so much is on the line.  But again, I put most the blame on coaching and gameplanning.

    Without TFB they don't get there, as great as he is with the gameplanning they have had they need him to have a perfect complete game.  As great as he is, that just not realistic with any QB in games like that.  He tries to do too much, has too much pressure on his shoulders to carry the team because the game plans are terrible. 

    Give him a little more help when putting together the game plan, get a little more depth to take injuries into consideration.

     

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from csylvia79. Show csylvia79's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    In response to TFB12's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    YRusty is about to attack you for puting any blame on BB! It starts and tops with Brady....

     

     
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  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from jimmytantric. Show jimmytantric's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    In response to RidingWithTheKing's comment:

    The timing of this article couldn't be any better. Even the word "warned" in the first paragraph seals the deal and separates myself (and those who agree with me) from the Hurl, TripleOg, Pezzy, Babe and RKrap goup.

    Cannot be made up. The timing of these articles are hilarious.  The Jets failed for what I had predicted 3 years ago and patience was needed for how BB wisely chose to build this thing in and out of the lockout.

    What's even funnier is how Carolina is in trouble now because they never dealt Peppers in 2009 to get those 2 2nd rd picks like they needed to do. Hurley is unemployed, BB dealt Seymour for a 1st and here we are. I could go on and on and on.   Teams overpaying in and out of the lockout, Mt Hurl and others falling for the Jets Way, only to be totally embarrassed as the mocked BB. I can see why Babe has left and why Hurlie, RKrap and TripleOG (with an assist from Pezzy Pink Panties) are hanging by a thread.

    Reiss and other media heads who didn't have it nailed, should send me a check for writing their pieces for them.  Mazz and Felger exposed and done for good:

     

    Commentary

    Patriots managed money well Robert Kraft, Bill Belichick planned ahead with static salary cap in mind Updated: March 8, 2013, 9:42 PM ET By Mike Reiss | ESPNBoston.com

     

    Not long after owners and players ended the NFL lockout in 2011, New England Patriots owner Robert Kraft had warned that the economics of the league were changing and teams that prepared in advance would be in the best position to capitalize.

    Specifically, Kraft said that the salary cap would remain relatively flat for several years. Gone were the days when clubs could rely on a dramatic spike from one year to the next to provide financial flexibility.

    Not everyone bought it, including some of Kraft's fellow owners who kept spending and spending. Now those doubters are paying a different kind of price, forced to release players to get under the slow-growing salary cap (hello, Carolina Panthers). Every day, it seems, more quality players are being cut, creating a buyer's market for clubs that were disciplined in not writing out too many big checks over the past two post-lockout seasons.

    [+] EnlargeBrady Elsa/Getty ImagesTom Brady's cap-friendly extension was a key component to the Patriots' financial plan.

     

    We're now 20 months removed from the lockout and it's clear that Kraft wasn't blowing smoke about the changing economic landscape. It's also clear that the Patriots have strategically positioned themselves as well as almost any team in the NFL to benefit from others' missteps -- both this offseason and next, when a similar dynamic is expected.

    New England currently has about $24 million in salary-cap space, among the top 10 in the NFL, with quarterback Tom Brady's recently executed three-year contract extension a centerpiece of the master plan.

    The next part of the plan comes into play Saturday at 12 a.m. ET, when all NFL teams can begin negotiating with free agents. The Patriots plan to be active, but they won't be reckless. They'll be looking for value, even though that still could mean a big-ticket item (perhaps at cornerback, where the market is loaded).

    Contracts with free agents from other teams can't be finalized until Tuesday at 4 p.m. ET, and while the Patriots don't have to wait to sign any of their own free agents, it appears that is the course they will take with most of them.

    One agent of a Patriots player scheduled for free agency said that the club relayed that it would hold back on making an offer until it gains a clearer understanding of the marketplace. That could be a nice way of saying that the Patriots believe the market is going to be slow, and they don't want to insult a player with their offer. It's easier to let the market do the insulting.

    As the action is set to unfold, it's timely to revisit some of Kraft's remarks about "strategically planning" for this time, which has been 20 months in the making.

    "In this age of the salary cap, what's going to happen in the next few years with the cap, you have to have a core group of players that you can plan around as the foundation of your team," he said last June.

    That is why the Patriots stepped out of character a bit and extended the contracts of tight ends Rob Gronkowski and Aaron Hernandez last year even though each had two years remaining. If the cap was growing at what had been its standard rate, perhaps the approach would have been to wait and have them play out their cheaper rookie contracts, which is how the Patriots typically have handled business with others, such as defensive lineman Vince Wilfork and offensive lineman Logan Mankins.

    But by dishing out a little more money now, and keeping the salary-cap charges reasonable over the years in which the cap wasn't expected to grow much, the Patriots got ahead of the curve. Just as coach Bill Belichick takes pride in his teams playing situational football, one might call this "situational management" -- adjusting to the changing financial landscape proactively.

    "When your salary cap has been pretty flat for three or four years in a row, it is tough to keep a high number of salaries," New York Giants general manager Jerry Reese said. "Sometimes you have to make some tough decisions."

     

    Patriots Blog

    ReissMike Reiss (pictured), Mike Rodak and Field Yates have you covered throughout the season. Blog.
    • Send mailbag question
    • ESPNBoston.com
    • AFC East blog

     

     

    The Patriots are no exception, and that's probably a main reason why an extension for receiver Wes Welker has been elusive. They want him, naturally, but the sides haven't yet found a middle ground that works for them. Even in the unanticipated event it doesn't work out, the Patriots' core would still be strong, looking good both on the field and on the balance sheet.

    Somewhat remarkably, outside of Wilfork ($6.5 million) and Mankins ($5.75 million), the Patriots don't have another player with a 2013 base salary higher than $2.5 million. So what they've been able to do is maintain a strong enough middle class of the roster at a time when the middle class is being squeezed out for many teams, while drafting and developing enough talent to remain a Super Bowl contender.

    Brady's recent extension ensures that the Patriots' strong economic outlook should continue. It freed up $8 million in space this season, lowering his salary-cap charge from $21.8 million to $13.8 million, which is still the highest total on the club and currently 16th highest in the NFL as of Friday. Brady's base salary for 2013 is just $1 million.

    So now, as the Patriots prepare to execute their free-agent strategy, they won't be restricted by the financial handcuffs that are locked on a significant number of their competitors. That's the good news.

    The bad news is that if they don't capitalize -- last year's signing of defensive lineman Jonathan Fanene comes to mind -- they will have blown a terrific opportunity to improve an already strong roster at a time when the clock is ticking on Brady's career (can he play at a high level for another five years?).

    The Patriots' strategic planning has positioned them well economically at a time of change in the NFL, which is no surprise.

    Now it's time for them to go to work.




    I agree--Say what you will about BB but the one thing you gotta hand the guy is he knows how to handle the CAP. I know he's missed on draft picks but who hasn't - it's a coin toss with most of these guys coming out of college-BIG step up to the pros and if a kid,(thats what they basically are), doesn't have discipline and structure to go along with the millions of dollars he all of a sudden gets watch out? Wouldn't want another coach - Pats are lucky to have Bill-check around the league and see who some of these teams have running their mult-milion dollar bussines?

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    In response to pezz4pats' comment:

     

    People scream about 18M in cap money for a QB.  Well you should be incessed with 18M lost money due to failure because theres not a single thing to show for it.

    These low risk, high reward guys, that recently haven't worked out, cost money.  Money that could go to proven, young and productive players.

     



    One game from the Super Bowl is a world away from "nothing to show for it."

     

    Again these proven, young, productive players are WHO exactly, besides figments of your imagination or players that would have put us so far over the cap we would be forced to cut important players like other team are now doing and will continue to do this off season? 

    You're also not taking into account that besides overpaying for these players they can choose where to play, free will, Red Bryant wanted to stay in Seattle but we attempted to get him, he was the premier defensive tackle available, he didn't want to come here and we couldn't afford to get into a bidding war.  Was Seattle in the Super Bowl?

    Overpaying is why some teams don't sniff the playoffs or come by a Super Bowl once a decade, not overpaying is why we've won 3 and been to 5. 

    Again you people think winning a Super Bowl is easy, you've been spoiled by success that you can't remember the 80's or before when we were the league doormat year after year.  Even if you do everything right, you need to be lucky, healthy and streaking.  The 49ers, Ravens, Steelers and Giants are the only consistant teams over the past decade and they haven't had our success.

    If I had to be critical about the Pats being cheap it would be about them paying for top coaches, that's all.

    Just think what it would be like to be a Browns or Jaguars fan, imagine the griping and arm chair expertise from the bleachers then...

     

     

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    PROBLEM starts here!  Who from this list panned out?  How much did it cost?  How much time and resources and $$$$$ WASTED?  Staggering.

    2008 Additions:

    WR Sam Aiken FA

    WR Robert Ortiz FA

    TE Marcus Pollard FA

    T/G Lav Bauta FA

    T Anthony Clement FA

    G/T Jimmy Martin FA

    G/C Gene Mruczkowski FA

    DE/NT Titus Adams FA

    NT Steve Fifita FA

    DE/NT Kenny Smith FA

    ILB Victor Hobson FA

    CB Fernando Bryant FA

    CB Lewis Sanders FA

    CB Jason Webster FA

    SS/ILB Tank Williams FA

    T/G Oliver Ross FA

    RB Lamont Jordan FA

    T Mark LeVoir WAIVERS

    CB Deltha O’Neal FA    Replaced Assante.  LOL  Remember him?

    T/G Barry Stokes FA

    G/T Jacob Bender FA

    2008 Subtractions:

    WR Troy Brown

    WR Donte Stallworth

    TE Kyle Brady

    NT Rashad Moore

    ILB Junior Seau

    SS Willie Andrews

    CB Randall Gay

    CB Asante Samuel

    FS Eugene Wilson

    OLB Rosevelt Colvin

    ILB Oscar Lua

    FS Mel Mitchell

    OLB Kyle Bissinger

    WR Bam Childress

    CB Tim Mixon

    TE Jason Rader

    CB Gemara Williams

    2009 Additions:

    RB Fred Taylor FA

    WR Joey Galloway FA

    WR Greg Lewis TRADE

    TE Chris Baker FA

    TE Alex Smith TRADE

    C Al Johnson FA

    DE/OLB Tully Banta-Cain FA

    DT Steve Williams FA

    ILB Vinny Ciurciu FA

    OLB Paris Lenon FA

    CB Leigh Bodden FA

    FS Herana-Daze Jones FA

    FS Brandon McGowan FA

    LS Nathan Hodel FA

    CB Shawn Springs FA

    TE Michael Matthews TRADE

    G Kendall Simmons FA

    DE/OLB Derrick Burgess TRADE

    OLB/DE Rob Ninkovich FA

    RB Chris Taylor FA

    QB/WR Isaiah Stanback FA

    2009 Subtractions:

    QB Matt Cassel TRADE

    RB LaMont Jordan

    WR Jabar Gaffney

    WR Kelley Washington

    OLB Rosevelt Colvin

    ILB Larry Izzo

    ILB Junior Seau

    OLB Mike Vrabel TRADE

    CB Ellis Hobbs TRADE

    CB Deltha O’Neal

    FS/CB Lewis Sanders

    FS Antwain Spann

    LS Lonie Paxton

    SS Rodney Harrison

    ILB Bo Ruud

    DE/NT Kenny Smith

    T/G Barry Stokes

    OLB Angelo Craig

    SS Mark Dillard

    WR Maurice Price

    OLB Darrell Robertson

    2010 Additions:

    RB Thomas Clayton FA

    WR Torry Holt FA

    WR David Patten FA

    TE Alge Crumpler FA

    DE Damione Lewis FA

    OLB Marques Murrell FA

    ILB Tracy White TRADE

    SS Jarrad Page TRADE

    SS Josh Barrett WAIVERS

    T/G Quinn Ojinnaka TRADE

    CB Tony Carter FA

    2010 Subtractions:

    WR Isaiah Stanback

    TE Chris Baker

    TE Ben Watson

    DE Jarvis Green

    ILB Junior Seau

    OLB Adalius Thomas

    CB Shawn Springs

    P Chris Hanson

    WR Tyree Barnes

    FB Eric Kettani

    WR Shun White

    TE Robbie Agnone

    OLB Bruce Davis

    WR Nick Moore

    WR Robert Ortiz

    QB Jeff Rowe

    2011 Additions (Non-rookie players signed or traded for before Week 1 of the regular season):

    DE Marcus Stroud FA

    WR Tyree Barnes FA

    RB Eric Kettani FA

    WR Chad Ochocino (Trade)

    DL Albert Haynesworth (Trade)

    DL Steve Williams FA

    OL Chris Morris FA

    OL Jonathan Compas FA

    DE Mark Anderson FA

    DE Andre Carter FA

    DE Shaun Ellis FA

    LB Niko Koutouvides FA

    S James Ihedigbo FA

    LB Ricky Brown FA

    TE Garrett Mills FA

    WR Tiquan Underwood FA

    LS James Dearth FA

    CB Antwaun Molden (Waivers)

    OG Brian Waters FA

    OL Matt Kopa FA

    OL Nick McDonald FA

    OL Thomas Welch FA

    LB A.J. Edds FA

    TE Dan Gronkowski FA

    2011 Subtractions (free agents who were not resigned and players cut before training camp):

    LB Tully Banta-Cain

    CB Tony Carter

    TE Alge Crumpler

    OL Nick Kazcur

    DE Marcus Stroud

    DE Ty Warren

    LB Ryan Coulson

    RB Fred Taylor

    OL Quinn Ojinnaka

    S Jarrad Page

    K Shayne Graham

    2012 Additions

    QB Mike Hartline

    FB Eric Kettani

    FB Tony Fiammetta

    FB Spencer Larsen

    WR Anthony Gonzalez

    WR Brandon Lloyd

    WR Donte Stallworth

    TE Daniel Fells

    T/G Robert Gallery

    DT Marcus Harrison

    S Steve Gregory

    DE/OLB Trevor Scott

    DE Jonathan Fanene

    CB Will Allen

    CB Marquice Cole

    LB Bobby Carpenter

    WR Jabar Gaffney

    2012 Subtractions

    OL Rich Ohrnberger

    LB Christian Cox

    DE Mark Anderson

    RB BenJarvus Green-Ellis

    WR Tiquan Underwood


    2013????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

    •  

     LOL.  List does not include wasted draft picks with 3 year contracts, All replaced with more of the same.  

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    In response to wozzy's comment:

     

    In response to pezz4pats' comment:

     

    People scream about 18M in cap money for a QB.  Well you should be incessed with 18M lost money due to failure because theres not a single thing to show for it.

    These low risk, high reward guys, that recently haven't worked out, cost money.  Money that could go to proven, young and productive players.

     



    One game from the Super Bowl is a world away from "nothing to show for it."

     

    Again these proven, young, productive players are WHO exactly, besides figments of your imagination or players that would have put us so far over the cap we would be forced to cut important players like other team are now doing and will continue to do this off season? 

    You're also not taking into account that besides overpaying for these players they can choose where to play, free will, Red Bryant wanted to stay in Seattle but we attempted to get him, he was the premier defensive tackle available, he didn't want to come here and we couldn't afford to get into a bidding war.  Was Seattle in the Super Bowl?

    Overpaying is why some teams don't sniff the playoffs or come by a Super Bowl once a decade, not overpaying is why we've won 3 and been to 5. 

    Again you people think winning a Super Bowl is easy, you've been spoiled by success that you can't remember the 80's or before when we were the league doormat year after year.  Even if you do everything right, you need to be lucky, healthy and streaking.  The 49ers, Ravens, Steelers and Giants are the only consistant teams over the past decade and they haven't had our success.

    If I had to be critical about the Pats being cheap it would be about them paying for top coaches, that's all.

    Just think what it would be like to be a Browns or Jaguars fan, imagine the griping and arm chair expertise from the bleachers then...

     

     

     

     




    LOL, see list!  Don't you think TENS OF MILLIONS in Dead money(caused by failed signings) could have upgraded any of those 5 years of failures?

     

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    In response to pezz4pats' comment:

     

     LOL.  List does not include wasted draft picks with 3 year contracts, All replaced with more of the same.  

     



    And what was our combined record since 2008..?

     

    Exactly, case closed...

    I don't like to deal in absolutes but if you don't like it go be a Bengal's fan and tell me how that works out for you, they sign big name players to huge contracts on the regular. 

    All those players above don't add up to Asante Samuel's inflated contract and how many rings did the Eagles win with his addition or Nnamdi Asomugha for that matter?

     

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Absolutely Priceless

    In response to wozzy's comment:

    In response to pezz4pats' comment:

     

     LOL.  List does not include wasted draft picks with 3 year contracts, All replaced with more of the same.  

     



    And what was our combined record since 2008..?

     

    Exactly, case closed...

    I don't like to deal in absolutes but if you don't like it go be a Bengal's fan and tell me how that works out for you, they sign big name players to huge contracts on the regular. 

    All those players added above don't add up to Asante Samuel's inflated contract and how many rings did the Eagles win with his addition?

     



    Wozzy, you hit the nail on the head. Some fans are very happy with 12 wins against a weak division year in and year out. Other fans have SB expectations.

     

     
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