AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN. Show COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN's posts

    AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    proving that the contrarian was right AGAIN on hindsight, with bb putting the lights out on the party starter, i guess we can call him the party finisher and he put an end to the dreadful and underperforming class of 2007. i got called all the usual names 2 seasons ago when i painstakingly pointed out how dreadful those 2006-2008 drafts were, peaking in mediocrity with the class of 2007. the only THREE left from those 3 drafts of busts are gostkowski your kicker, mayo, and the "immortal" matthew slater. 

    to bill's credit, he made the right adjustments as he often does to keep things right and not keep sinking down the quicksand due to stubborness. whatever criteria they used back then in the draft simply did not cut it. dont waste my time with rookie free agents, talking the guys from 1-7 in the draft who get all the resources, scouting and time built around. 

    theo epstein in baseball is great at finding guys from the trash heap too but it doesnt bypass the reality that he's been dreadful at picking PREMIUM free agents (yep the guys that actually break your bank and resourcees) esp ones named JD as in (JD lackey or jd DREW), i digress.  
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: AND THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007?

    People around here called you names when you questioned the wisdom of BB's picks in 2007? That's very hard to believe. Not this bunch.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from natesubs. Show natesubs's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    we still have welker whom we acquired from those draft picks.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN. Show COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    In Response to Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?:
    [QUOTE]we still have welker whom we acquired from those draft picks.
    Posted by natesubs[/QUOTE]i'm talking ONLY about guys actually DRAFTED, not traded! got that? dont give me the welker nonsense, thats a different reality and context. 
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Plastics017. Show Plastics017's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    If Bill actually picked in the 1st round, he'd have a higher percentage of picking an impact player.  But NO, he continually values quantity of picks over quality, and will trade his 1st rounders for 142 7th rounders, of which 141.5 of them wont be good enough to make the team and will get cut.  Great draft strategy Bill, its one of the MOST FRUSTRATING parts of being a Patriots fan.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN. Show COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    look at these stats.. just think butler wasnt good enough, yet we keep arrington. he's on a very short leash, at least he's good at special teams. 

    2009: 69 targets, 39 receptions, 475 yards, 107 YAC, 2 TD, 3 INT, 69.4 QB rating 
    2010: 49 targets, 30 receptions, 390 yards, 112 YAC, 3 TD, 0 INT, 106.7 QB rating 

    As a means of comparison, here's a glimpse at last year's numbers for rookie cornerbackDevin McCourty, who earned a Pro Bowl nod for his first-year efforts, and Kyle Arrington, who took over Butler's starting job: 

    McCourty: 104 targets, 58 receptions, 614 yards, 174 YAC, 5 TD, 7 INT, 61.1 QB rating 
    Arrington: 75 targets, 49 receptions, 742 yards, 195 YAC, 5 TD, 1 INT, 114.4 QB rating 

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    And the point of this thread is?_____________________________________

    Seriously, what is the point of going back and second guessing the picks?

    Did the team do as well as they could have in the draft in the years in question?  Of course not.  But so what? 

    The thread might have some meaning if you included some objective measurement such as how BB did in comparison with other teams' selections from those years.  Nothing wrong with being a contrarian but broad brush indictments without context don't tell us much.

    And for the record, you'll never find any name calling in anything I post.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from crono420. Show crono420's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    BB CAN'T DRAFT FOR SHITTTTTT. Butler, Merriweather etc cmon man
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from JayShizzle45. Show JayShizzle45's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    Im not gonna pile on as im not as critical about the drafts, but I will say I dont like when people bring up Wes and Moss as draft pics. They are not, because they were not drafted.  So what they found a desperate Raiders team willing to unload Randy for a 4th. he stunk the year before and most gm's thought his legs were shot.

    As for Wes, he had success against us, but not even close the numbers he got here and a 2nd rd pick was high at the time but worth it in hindsight, but to say it excuses the draft is bogus. These are seperate things.  Players whom have peformed in the NFL cant be compared w/ rookies.  Fact is Bill had 7 0r 8 pics and you would think he can hit w/atleast one...but either way, we got good production from # 31 for a couple years, but Moss and Wes were not drafted, stop using that as the Pats pics.
     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from shenanigan. Show shenanigan's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    And 13 form 09 and 10.  Well if they cut Brady and put in O'Connell then they'll have another from 08 so then that will mean they are better at drafting. 
    53 players

    26 drafted
    11 UFA
    16 FA or waiver wire
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from hardright. Show hardright's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    2008: Mayo--rookie of the year and an All Pro already; Slater--very good special teamer; Guyton and BJGE as undrafted FAs.

    Most teams would take that draft haul. Sure, there were some big busts included that year, but remember that Wheatley, while officially a second round pick, was tabbed at the END of the second round--what are you realistically hoping to get at that spot? A starter, you hope; a Pro Bowler, you pray. But you're just as likely to draft a guy there that ends up hanging on for two or three years and then getting dumped.

    Anyone who does NOT include the trades for Welker and Moss when not evaluating 2007 is simply not being honest about how the draft works.

    I'll grant that 2006 was putrid. It happens to everyone if they're in the NFL personnel game long enough.

    And 2009 was the ONLY year that BB didn't pick in the first round (not including 2000 when the Jets had NE's first round pick because of the BB "trade" to NE). So I'm not sure where this "he needs to stop trading and start picking in the first round" stuff comes from. He DOES pick in the first round. With the new restrictions on rookie deals, he may even use both first rounders next year. We'll see about that, but you had to factor in salary cap considerations when it comes to "trading out of the first round" moves that he's made.

    I mean, honestly: you people who are ripping the 2008 draft class are funny. Do you think ANY Giants fans remember who else they drafted in 1981 besides Lawrence Taylor at #2 overall? If the Giants missed on all of their other picks that season, wouldn't taking Taylor still make that a great draft?

    I'm not saying Mayo is LT--nobody is. But man, if you can nab a guy who already has "10-time Pro Bowler" stamped on his forehead just three-plus years into his career, that pick alone makes for a successful draft, no matter how many "misses" the team had after that pick.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from rtuinila. Show rtuinila's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    For those with no clue, here is what happened. 2006, the Pats picked the best talent they could that fit their system that year. Same thing for 2007 and 2008, the Pats took the best players they could. Now comes 2009 and a more highly talented group of players entering the draft. Now I know this concept is hard for some of you but there really is a difference in the talent level of every draft. Anyway, the Pats still picked the best they could but that doesn't change the fact that agood number of the UDFA's the last couple of years would have been second and third rounders if they had come out in 2006-2008. Now, if you can wrap your heads around that concept, then you can start to see where, if you pick a better player in the draft, then you don't want to let him go just because the player that wasn't as good was picked at a higher position in an earlier draft.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from hoyle. Show hoyle's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    Gotta laugh at these 2 jokers .. Marxist and his pal Babe

    2006  12-4
    2007 16-0
    2008 11-5
    2009  10-6
    2010  14-2

    So 63 wins and 17 loses the past 5 seasons. Poor Detriot lost 16 games in a season.

    I think BB  and Kraft have done a good job :P
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from fishers5. Show fishers5's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    stupid thread,,,,,,only way to truly evaluate drafting and that is tough to do...is look at all the players drated and are still in league,,,,PLUS what teams drafted where.....pick one is easier than pick 32 in each round....

    Again to all the trolls and in some cases communists....STUPID POST
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonSportsFan111. Show BostonSportsFan111's posts

    Re: AND THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007?

    In Response to Re: AND THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007?:
    [QUOTE]People around here called you names when you questioned the wisdom of BB's picks in 2007? That's very hard to believe. Not this bunch.
    Posted by BabeParilli[/QUOTE]

    In 2007, the Pats picked at number 24 and got Merriwether, who was a starter for 4 straight years. After that they did not pick again until number 127, but they used the picks they had between those spots to get Wes Welker and Randy Moss. Did the picks lower than #125 work out? No, but how many picks that low do? Seriously, do your homework on this, it is not many. The Pats are not picking top 10 or usually even top 20 players. It is much more difficult to hit a home run with picks 25-32 than it is when you are picking in the top 15 every year. Go back and look at what other teams got out of the 2007 draft. Here is the Colts got that year, would you rather this group than what Merriwether, Moss and Welker gave the Pats for the past 4 years?

    2007 1 1 32 32 Anthony Gonzalez WR Ohio State
      2 2 10 42 Tony Ugoh G Arkansas
      3 3 32 95 Daymeion Hughes DB California
      4 3 35 98 Quinn Pitcock DT Ohio State
      5 4 32 131 Brannon Condren DB Troy
      6 4 37 136 Clint Session LB Pittsburgh
      7 5 32 169 Roy Hall WR Ohio State
      8 5 36 173 Michael Coe DB Alabama State
      9 7 32 242 Keyunta Dawson DE Texas Tech
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from patsordie. Show patsordie's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    If a team keeps all (or most) of the players it drafted each year, then what is the point in having a draft every year? You draft somebody you think is the best option this year and if you find a better talent at the same position in the next draft, you obviously have to let the one you picked this year go. You can't predict what the future drafts are gonna offer. I am not saying Pats havent made mistakes during drafts but, keeping majority of your draft picks for a long time doesn't make sense.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from hardright. Show hardright's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    In Response to Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?:
    [QUOTE]PLUS what teams drafted where.....pick one is easier than pick 32 in each round.Posted by fishers5[/QUOTE]


    Thank you.

    I've been trying to make this point for three days, at least, with all the BB draft-bashing threads out there.

    The Pats' success naturally has dictated lower draft slots every year. The only times they've picked inside the top 20 since 2004 is due to previous trades. Prior to that, they had the 32nd pick in 2002, because they won the Super Bowl the year before (and then traded up to 21 to draft Graham); and the 13th pick (traded up a few slots to draft Warren) in 2003 because they had just missed the playoffs the year before. Since then, all of their "assigned" picks have been been #21 or worse. It's a lot harder to hit homeruns drafting in that slot.

    I'll once again make the Bill Polian comparison: his best picks as Colts' GM, arguably, have been Manning, Edgerrin James and Freeney. They were picks #1, #4 and #11 overall, respectively.

    His other very good first rounders have been Dallas Clark (24th) and Reggie Wayne (30th).

    All five of those excellent first rounders occurred either in 2003 or earlier.

    The rest of his first rounders since then have ranged from "good" (Addai) to worse than that.

    Why? Because the Colts have been in the playoffs every year since 2002, and the NFL punishes success, that's why.

    Note, also, that the two picks Polian's really nailed late in the first round were both receivers (1 TE, 1 WR). It's easier to hit on receivers in the modern-day NFL given the pass defense rules, and also when Peyton Manning is your QB.

    BB's had his share of misses at WR and TE, to be sure, but he also drafted Deion Branch and David Givens, as well as Gronkowski and Hernandez (and we'll see about Taylor Price, but he looks like he might be able to play a little; ditto for Edelman).


     
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  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from msteven. Show msteven's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    Almost 1/3 of the roster changes every year.  At that average, 2007 players should be long gone.  Look around the league.  Not many teams have a better record than the patriots.  Few teams draft as well.  No team hits on all their draft picks.  There are 7 rounds in the draft.  This equates to at least 7 new players each year fighting for a spot on the team.  That does not include undrafted free agents, trade and free agent signings.  The Patriots have a strong team and have drafted well.  Look when a player is released, in a matter of hours they are picked up.  This tells me that they drafted well and are the Patriot roster is talented. 
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from JayShizzle45. Show JayShizzle45's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    Everyone assumes there were no players available in the 07' draft and Bill didnt care for it, but that would support my claim that sometimes Bill asks too much of young players or has too high of standards , because I see alot of good players from then still playing at high levels.

    This weak 2007 draft is the same one that produced Calvin Johnson, Adrian Peterson, Joe Thomas, Pat Willis, Darrele Revis, Dwayne Bowe, Jon Beason, Greg Olsen, Anthony Gongalez,  all in the 1st round, and 6 of those guys are all -pro's and 2 of them pro bowlers and 2 starters.

    in the 2nd rd , there were guys like Paul Ploznowski(sp), Eric Weddle(highest paid safety), Zach Miller, Chris Houston, Tony Ughoh, Sidney Rice, Lamarr Woodley, David Harris, Justin Durant, Steve Smith, Brian Leonard, Eric Wright,
    Josh Wilson, Ryan Kalil, Gerald Alexander, Brandon Jackson,

    3rd round, Quincy Black, Jacoby Jones, Yamon Figures, Matt Speath, Mike-Sims Walker, Jay Alford, Jonathan Wade, Stewart Bradley, Trent Edwards, Johnny lee Higgins, Michael Bush, Isiah Stanback(lol, j/k), Tanard Jackson,

    The 4th round, produced gems like Dashon Goldson who Bill just tried to steal from San fran and whom we picked Kareem Brown one pick after Goldson!! Yikes!!!  Antwarne Barnes, Clint Sessions, Leron McLain, Chris Davis

    The 5th rd, Jay Richardson, Brandon McDonald(could use him now), Steve Breaston, David Jones, tarelle Brown, Kevin Boss, David Clowney, Brent Celek, Kevin Payne, William Gay(drafted one spot b4 the Pats who took Clint Oldenburg), Legadu Nanee,

    Now look I can go on, but you have to get my point...there was certainly a lot of talent if the 07 draft, to say Bill didnt like it, is pretty dumb.  Now you can argue maybe no spots on a veteran laden team for rookies, but dont go w/ the no talent arguement, if anything I'll give Bill a pass and say maybe his scouting department is looking at the wrong players and trying to hard to find "Patriots Players" but c'mon, there were all pros in that 1st round list and all other players I have mentioned are very good to good players but none our out the league ans most we had a a shot at as specified in parenthesis...so PLease tell me how you make the argument that it was a weak draft??


    Not stirring the Pot, but have to tell both sides, so Russ, doesntgo crazy with Bill's accomplishments....He gets more pics every year, True , but why not go balls out when you have extra picks instead of looking for verstaile players that can do a million things and waste a whole draft?
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from JayShizzle45. Show JayShizzle45's posts

    Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?

    In Response to Re: AND THEN THERE WERE NONE.. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLASS OF 2007 AND MOST OF 2006-2008?:
    [QUOTE]Almost 1/3 of the roster changes every year.  At that average, 2007 players should be long gone.  Look around the league.  Not many teams have a better record than the patriots.  Few teams draft as well.  No team hits on all their draft picks.  There are 7 rounds in the draft.  This equates to at least 7 new players each year fighting for a spot on the team.  That does not include undrafted free agents, trade and free agent signings.  The Patriots have a strong team and have drafted well.  Look when a player is released, in a matter of hours they are picked up.  This tells me that they drafted well and are the Patriot roster is talented. 
    Posted by msteven[/QUOTE]


    Look at my post,  all those are 2007 players who are still here and playing some dam good football,  try again.  Also we picked up Justin Rogers in the 6th when Desmond Bishop was still there ...Yikes!!!!   Rogers never suited up and played for SMU in college!!!....who the hell was in the war room w/BIll in 07', is this Piolo's doing?, I dont think so...we have seen what he goes for in K.C.....had some nice drafts as well as Billy the last 2 years..so diff. philosphy that works independently, but apparently didnt work with B.B. and Pioli combined....
     

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