Anyone Know Why?

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  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Davedsone. Show Davedsone's posts

    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    Everyone is pushing their wagon, and yours is Bill O'Brien and the Offense.  Many of us think you are focused wrong, even given the point the the offense needs to do better.  So, it's not like your material is LESS silly.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from tcal2-. Show tcal2-'s posts

    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    WHERE THE HELL IS RIDLEY????
     
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    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    In Response to Re: Anyone Know Why?:
    [QUOTE]WHERE THE HELL IS RIDLEY????
    Posted by tcal2-[/QUOTE]

    Like to see him play Sunday
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from BubbaInHawaii. Show BubbaInHawaii's posts

    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    The TEs are to our RB as our DL is to our secondary.

    When the TEs block for our RBs our running game tends to improve. But it's still not quite as simple as that. The plays and offensive looks have to change too, otherwise, the offense is too predictable.

    Defensively, I think Harrison hit it on the nose - our defense is vanilla - either because the players don't get it or because we don't have the type of players we need. Where is the aggressive defense we saw in 1 or 2 games during preseason?  Until our pass rush gets better, I can't see our secondary improving either.

    We need that one aggressive player that can set the tone for the defense, much like what Troy Polamalu does for the Steelers.

    Noone is afraid of our defense.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from palookaski. Show palookaski's posts

    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    In Response to Anyone Know Why?:
    [QUOTE]Anyone know why the D looks better when we actually run the ball as compared to when we don't? LMAO Carry on, kids. Carry on with thread after thread of the same silly material.
    Posted by RidingWithTheKing[/QUOTE]

    RWTK

    Simple but good question RWTK. My answer is simply generic in nature. I agree with you on many things and one of them is establish the run EARLY on regardless of what LQQKS the opposing D reveals even the LQQK changes-up at the snap. The Game is based on the run period!

    In the Pats case - I agree again - that the Pats D line is formidable enough as is but the DB just needs a couple of true playmakers ...it is weak. I don't know what it is with O'Brien as I get frustrated on the playcalling. You answer - I think - Brady is as great with playaction as passing...Brady has the running tools and PA players, Faulk, Woody, Ridley, even Hern and Welker on those PA passes he's able to fake a LB or Safety thinking a run. The run opens up the pass as we all know...basic stuff.

    The Pats are known league wide for striking quick and getting the lead? withe shotgun....change up for gawds sake...makes me uneasy watching the same o'l same. It worked in previous years getting a lead that way but now opposing 'Ds' game plan for it and game plan for our weak secondary on 'O'.

    The effective run and PA-which I feel strongly that the Pats can plan for - is necessary and they CAN perform because they have the TOOLS, Use them!!!!!
    The 'O'Line is built for both Pass and Run and there we have an advantage.

    In the end the 'D' gets off the field more, - they simple have to - the TOP increases for the Pats and with the red zone weapons we have chances are Brady gets a TD if not at least a FG.

    Wishing you well....and all a good evening.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    In Response to Anyone Know Why?:
    [QUOTE]Anyone know why the D looks better when we actually run the ball as compared to when we don't? LMAO Carry on, kids. Carry on with thread after thread of the same silly material.
    Posted by RidingWithTheKing[/QUOTE]

    Let me guess. Is it because they have less chances to screw things up and get shredded if we control TOP?

    Russ...I get your point....Run the ball more..yes, yes, I agree. If we have a weak defense, why expose them to 40 minutes of drubbing, when 20 will do.

    Aren't you now making the case that the Defense has its issues? Or is it still the offense?
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from palookaski. Show palookaski's posts

    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    RWTK

    The game is like chess ....... if one has the greater ability to try to set up a move and scheme an opponent effectively .... Using the pawns as blocks and using your power pieces for attack? Then your opponent goes into 'D' mode ...that hardly ever wins, it gets tiring. 

    I think the Pats have the TOOLS on offense to help the 'D' backfield because its weak and the 'D' Line which I think is much better than average gets a breather.

    I guess my point here to you is ....How much control at the LOS does Brady have to change-up according to what he sees. Is O'Brien pre-game scripted by Bellichick on the 'O' game plan?

    Very hard for me to believe that Brady is a purely a stats man but it has crossed my mind the past couple of years. The spread is old and well planned now by the opposing Team.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from trouts. Show trouts's posts

    Re: Anyone Know Why?

     Last week when we tried to run the ball we looked awful. Early on we had a 2nd and 2 and lost yardage. Sure I'd like to see them run the ball more but often it's the successful passes that set up the run. We stunk it up in just about all phases of the game last sunday and hopefully that will get turned around this week.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from palookaski. Show palookaski's posts

    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    In Response to Re: Anyone Know Why?:
    [QUOTE]The D is so dysfunctional that the less it actually plays the better off we are.
    Posted by BabeParilli[/QUOTE]

    Yes, Babe I agree also BUT the opponents are having a field day with the weak DBacks. The D line I think as already said is good stopping the run and pressure up the middle but lacking one consistent formidable outside pressure rusher -meaning run and pass pressure - that creates mistakes, a strip, a hurry etc.

    The question was  " Anyone know why the D looks better when we actually run the ball as compared to when we don't"?

    The only key to that abuse of the Pats Dbacks is to improve the TOP on The 'O' and keep the 'D' Off the field by changing strategy on the 'O' with the run and PA. However, in one valid sentence you said as much as I with many more words. Good show!

     
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    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    A start would be to stop asking Guyton and Spikes to cover WR's

    They spread the field and we had only 2 Cb's to cover and that molden dude.

    Spikes is a good hitter, and he was doing well inside as an attacker the last couple games but we all saw sunday that Spikes shouldnt be asked to cover anyONE!  He was getting beat up by H.Miller, a dam blocking tight end and then they trusted him to cover A.Brown and E.Sanders!?!?!?  Bad gameplanning as a result of losing Bodden and trying to cover w/Backers, so guess what, BIg roles for Phillip Adams and Molden this week. Lets hope they are ready or.....more negative threads next week.....
     
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    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    For once, just for old times sake, I'd love to see the Pats open up the pass by establishing the run instead of it always being the other way around!!

    If we can  establish a violent running game on Sunday while tightening up our pass defense, we'll win by 10+ points - easily.

    Reality is, moving forward, most teams are going to start playing nickle/dime press man coverage - even on early downs..  We need to rip off 3-4 yards + per carry to make them rethink that strategy! 
     
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    Re: Anyone Know Why?


    The answer is..the defense knows you will eat up clock on offense and controll the ball. It emboldens them to put more into every play. If they get off the field they know at least they will be off the field for awhile.

    King..I just ready your full theory here..I must say it sound a bit like sometihng I just posted...I guess I agree with you pretty much.

    The offense is way to dependent on precision..look at the angles on Branches touchdown, the ball was delivered to his arms reaching into the field as he was running toward 11 oclock in realtion to Brady...extremly small room for error. How many times does Welker catch the ball 3 inches from the outstretched arm of the coverage? The offense is very vulnerable to defenses which are good cover, athletic, or just on top of their game on a particular day. THIS IS A SCHEME ISSUE

    The D..is very close to the way it has always been...the yards are excessive but the scoring is not. The D is simply playing it too safe, they need to take more risks on coverage, allowing a bigger play but also get ints. The D line is also going to come together in a big way in the next few games. Know this will all happen...not worried about the D.
     
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    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    In Response to Re: Anyone Know Why?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Anyone Know Why? : RWTK Simple but good question RWTK. My answer is simply generic in nature. I agree with you on many things and one of them is establish the run EARLY on regardless of what LQQKS the opposing D reveals even the LQQK changes-up at the snap. The Game is based on the run period! In the Pats case - I agree again - that the Pats D line is formidable enough as is but the DB just needs a couple of true playmakers ...it is weak. I don't know what it is with O'Brien as I get frustrated on the playcalling. You answer - I think - Brady is as great with playaction as passing...Brady has the running tools and PA players, Faulk, Woody, Ridley, even Hern and Welker on those PA passes he's able to fake a LB or Safety thinking a run. The run opens up the pass as we all know...basic stuff. The Pats are known league wide for striking quick and getting the lead? withe shotgun....change up for gawds sake...makes me uneasy watching the same o'l same. It worked in previous years getting a lead that way but now opposing 'Ds' game plan for it and game plan for our weak secondary on 'O'. The effective run and PA-which I feel strongly that the Pats can plan for - is necessary and they CAN perform because they have the TOOLS, Use them!!!!! The 'O'Line is built for both Pass and Run and there we have an advantage. In the end the 'D' gets off the field more, - they simple have to - the TOP increases for the Pats and with the red zone weapons we have chances are Brady gets a TD if not at least a FG. Wishing you well....and all a good evening.
    Posted by palookaski[/QUOTE]

    Very good..agree
     
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    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    I know the Patriots ran less in 2003 than they did in 2010 2003 pass- 53.1% 2010 pass- 52.7%
     
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    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    In Response to Re: Anyone Know Why?:
    [QUOTE]I know the Patriots ran less in 2003 than they did in 2010 2003 pass- 53.1% 2010 pass- 52.7%
    Posted by shenanigan[/QUOTE]

    Carefull, trolls and irrationals can't handle facts.  
     
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  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: Anyone Know Why?


    Russ,

    "I don't excpect to have this conversation for the rest of the year, because we've been having it since 2009."

    What conversation do you mean? That we will wake up on offense and take the honus off the OL, TB and the WRs by running more and running early?

    OR that BB will slap TB/OB into reality?

    OR, that the defense will correct itself come playoff time?

    As I said in another post...when we play on a short field, our defense does relatively well. When teams spread us out, we stink.
    We just need to stop teams from converting more on 3rd down, and this will be a totally different team. Brady and the Offense will get the ball more, have more chances to score, etc. Now, with that said, OB/TB need to make sure they sustain drives as well, and not call a totally predictable game.

    Babe had the best 1 sentence answer to this whole thing..."The D is so dysfunctional that the less it actually plays the better off we are. "

    That infers the offense holds the ball longer, scores more, the defense sees the field less....and, the defense stops teams on 3rd down more, meaning we get off the field faster and give the ball back to the offense.

    We've been all over this problem back and forth, and it really comes down to both sides doing their respective jobs....and, lets not forget the coachign staff and ST's. They need to take it up a notch as well.
     
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  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from palookaski. Show palookaski's posts

    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    In Response to Re: Anyone Know Why?:
    [QUOTE]Also, finally: The 2007 season has completely duped some fans with how to win football games. That season is now more of a complete misrepresentation of how this team can win football games and a SB. It's not about stats, video games and bragging to people about how Brady had 4 TDs. I swear, if that season never occurred we'd have less irrationals.
    Posted by RidingWithTheKing[/QUOTE]

    RWTK

    I understand and agree with your constant wish for establishing the run early, as most. Also what happened to the Play Action with which Brady is also excellent? Where is Woody and Ridley on PA lately? If the DB or coverage LB takes the fake it opens up for good gainer as we have seen this year at fewer times than I would like. With PA  it creates more D'fense mistakes.

    We'll see Sunday perhaps on the first O series. Hope they do a PA - real or fake -on every down, more effective under Center. You mention the 2007 Team? 18-0; Yes, they have us duped because That team STILL had some of the Original Playmakers on D: Harrison, Seymour, Tedy, Vrabel, Samuel, Gay, Sanders, Warren, Green, Wright, Wilfork etc. Yes, a complete different D from present!!

    I also would like to see the Pats use A Deep WR on most plays, switching out between Price, Slater, even Edelman to keep em fresh - whether they use them OR NOT - because it does soften up the middle for the run or pass. Brady reads the field better than all with his only equal P. Manning wih Brady having a bit quicker release. I hopefully LQQK for an improved TOP games in the future as that is this D's best friend. Nothing new here but only my slant view.....

    Enjoy all the great comments on the forum .... Keep up the good work all...Smile
    Have a Good day all ....
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from hardright. Show hardright's posts

    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    In Response to Re: Anyone Know Why?:
    [QUOTE]I know the Patriots ran less in 2003 than they did in 2010 2003 pass- 53.1% 2010 pass- 52.7%
    Posted by shenanigan[/QUOTE]

    This is true, but remember that the 2010 team won a LOT of blowouts and was quite often running the ball at the end of games just to kill the clock. In 2003, their running game was historically bad for a Super Bowl winner. In fact, it was the second-worst YPC average for a Super Bowl winner in history (only the 1970 Colts were worse than the 3.4 YPC the 2003 Pats averaged). Even though they couldn't run the ball very effectively, they still tried to run it 47% of the time and that, in turn, kept the defense honest and made Brady's play action passes extremely effective.

    Also, I believe King's point is that the Pats, since Weiss left, really, have become a pass first, pass second, run third type of offense. And even though this team clearly has the ability to run the ball consistently and successfully, they often don't do it enough.

    It would be interesting to see the "situational" breakdown of the 2010 team's running plays. For instance, how many running plays were called when they were up in the 4th quarter by 2 TDs or more? It wouldn't surprise me if, of that 47.% (running plays called in 2010), better than half of them occurred when the Pats were in "kill the clock late with a big lead" mode.

    Interesting discussion here, for sure.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: Anyone Know Why?

    In Response to Re: Anyone Know Why?:
    [QUOTE]The conversation that the source of this problem is the OFFENSE.  That conversation. Dude, you just don't get it. You don't. Everything you just listed is tied to the offense's style. Do you realize our STs are weaker because of this offense? Go to the source.
    Posted by RidingWithTheKing[/QUOTE]


    Russ,
    I do get it. My point earlier was it's on each unit to help itself and the other. I'm not going to buy "it's all on the Offense"...

    I'll specify my point....It is on in part the Offenses style (pass 1st, etc.), but it's also on the Defenses style (bend don't break, opportunitistic, wait and see, don't attack)...

    Actually, what's more telling is our style of Defense. Meaning, if we had a more attacking style defense, one that was able to make the big stop, bring consistent pass rush/pressure, etc., we would probably be in a better posiiton offense wise to score and have more scoring opportunities. WHen you have a defense that is predicated on sitting back and waiting for the opponent to make a mistake, and the offense sputters as it does from time to time, it makes for a long day like in Pitt. Especially when you go up agaisnt a QB/Offense that doesn't make many mistakes.

    Conversely, when you have an offense predicated on passing, and utilizing the short/middle part of the field, and an opposing defense shuts it down or severly limits it, the offense can't score and we see more 3 and outs, putting our bend don't break defense on the field.

    Like I said, it's on both units. That's my point. I don't think its as simple as you are making it sound Russ.
     

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