Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from JayShizzle45. Show JayShizzle45's posts

    Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?

    In Response to Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?:
    [QUOTE]Boyer coaches the CB and Patricia the safeties.  I seriously question the coaching these guys are getting.  What is Boyer and Patricia's experience coaching the secondary before they came to the Patriots. Butler, Wilhite, Wheately and Meriweather are prime examples of high picks never developing.  Sergio Brown and James Inhegibo should only be playing on special teams. 
    Posted by David233[/QUOTE]


    Boyer is def. a guy that came out of nowhere and YES he is probably overwhelmed.

    The safeties had Corwin Brown last year and he didnt return so not sure what happened there. I thought our safety play was better was last year but look at the personnel?!

    As far as Patricia is concerned, he is the "D" coordinator and doing well with what he has. Any thing the safeties do falls on B.B. for cutting capable guys.

    Patricia cant coach the defense and babysit the safeties.

    Have you seen Idebgho help out on one pass play yes this year????


    This is why they dont even play him back anymore, they just let him hover around in the line of scrimmage like a RObber scheme. He still isnt making any plays and sad to say, B.B. probably likes him and will resign him...  smh
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?

    In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent? : and play calling is only one part of coaching pal; how about recognizing the bad technique being played and coach it up and fix it;  ...
    Posted by dbincpumpkin[/QUOTE]

    completely agree on the technique part...

    coaching responsibilities...

    strategy and planning from x-o perspective as well as play calling are responsibilities of the coordinators

    position coaches are supposed to coach players on how they can better at their craft (technique)... at executing the game plan well.

    someone asked in one of the threads or post in this thread why not have law or anyone be the dbs coach. if they won't coach, can't the pats bring in law for example to talk tot he DBs and perhaps go over some film to show the new players how they could avoid mistakes over and over again? explain to them what to look for and how to read plays  and react better, why and when
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?

    In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent? : You need to read the post hey DB's turn your freakin heads
    Posted by dbincpumpkin[/QUOTE]

    Actually I'd rather draw my conclusions from watching the games and placing it in the context of the team's overal performance.  This forum is all about observations and opinions.  You make your observations and express your opinions; I do the same.  I don't see it the same way you do. 
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from dbincpumpkin. Show dbincpumpkin's posts

    Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?

    In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent? : Actually I'd rather draw my conclusions from watching the games and placing it in the context of the team's overal performance.  This forum is all about observations and opinions.  You make your observations and express your opinions; I do the same.  I don't see it the same way you do. 
    Posted by ATJ[/QUOTE]

    fair enough, but gotta tell ya, you don't know the game !!
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?

    In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent? : fair enough, but gotta tell ya, you don't know the game !!
    Posted by dbincpumpkin[/QUOTE]

    I beg your pardon?  Because people don't see things the same way that you do they are ignorant?  That's precisely what you just posted. 

    Hope you enjoy Sunday's game and the ensuing playoffs.  I know I intend to, benighted though I may be.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from brdbreu. Show brdbreu's posts

    Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?

    In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?:
    [QUOTE]<<I don't buy it and neither should any Pats fan. />> I say again - WOW!  As I posted earlier in this thread, that's a pretty tough crowd to coach up. You really think that better coaching could turn around the guys who have been playing safety these past few weeks?  Count me among the Pats fans who simply do not agree with you, dbincpumpkin.
    Posted by ATJ[/QUOTE]

    hi atj,

    re that's a pretty tough crowd to coach up. You really think that better coaching could turn around the guys who have been playing safety these past few weeks?

    i agree with your 2nd sentence and....

    this is missing a big point imo.
    coaching wont make the worst guy in the league an all pro. however a good coach can change a players technique from incorrect to correct.
    when this happens it will be observable AND make them better.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?

    In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent? : hi atj, re that's a pretty tough crowd to coach up. You really think that better coaching could turn around the guys who have been playing safety these past few weeks? i agree with your 2nd sentence and.... this is missing a big point imo. coaching wont make the worst guy in the league an all pro. however a good coach can change a players technique from incorrect to correct. when this happens it will be observable AND make them better.
    Posted by brdbreu[/QUOTE]

    Fair point, brdbreu.  My only real point in this posting in this thread has been the coaching isn't perfect but it isn't dreadful either.  And the sense that I've been getting is some are asserting that it is dreadful.  Can it be improved?  Of course.  Could it be worse?  I think so. 
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from brdbreu. Show brdbreu's posts

    Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?

    In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent? : Fair point, brdbreu.  My only real point in this posting in this thread has been the coaching isn't perfect but it isn't dreadful either.  And the sense that I've been getting is some are asserting that it is dreadful.  Can it be improved?  Of course.  Could it be worse?  I think so. 
    Posted by ATJ[/QUOTE]

    atj,
    i'll take your point.

    wont argue it. dont necessarily agree.

    my thought is just that it's the coaches job to get the player to play proper technique. failure there is on the coach in my eyes. and as ive said elsewhere over my time here, i do not believe in coaches in training for my team, as a fan, if i were the owner, gm or coach. i want the best coach (or top tier) at each position.

    and i feel bb is the one making the call here and not for the right reasons.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?

    In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent? : atj, i'll take your point. wont argue it. dont necessarily agree. my thought is just that it's the coaches job to get the player to play proper technique. failure there is on the coach in my eyes. and as ive said elsewhere over my time here, i do not believe in coaches in training for my team, as a fan, if i were the owner, gm or coach. i want the best coach (or top tier) at each position. and i feel bb is the one making the call here and not for the right reasons.
    Posted by brdbreu[/QUOTE]

    Thought provoking and I do see your point and agree that it is up to the coaches to prepare the players and put them in the best possible position to win.  Given the level of talent at the safety position (not particularly high with Chung out) and the lack of depth at CB (approaching or at zero) I'm not sure that much more could be done. 

    That said, this is a discussion that could go on infinitum. 

    For the record, brdbreu, appreciate the approach you have taken in outlining your points, particularly on the points in which we disagree.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from gmbill. Show gmbill's posts

    Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?


    It amazes me this year how we have sucked our way to the top. According posters here our Offense is all wrong and set for disaster in the payoffs (just ask RideontheKing), Our OC needs to go and now our DC's can not coach.

    People have been talking about Tebow and his in with God, dam I think we must be the most blessed team to be such a complete mess and still be at the top.

    God Bless Us One and All!
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmcintosh. Show andrewmcintosh's posts

    Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?

    In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent? : I disagree 1000%.  A big part of the Pats problems in the secondary is coaching.  I offer the following; (1) the consistently poor technique played by DMC, both tackling and especially in defending the pass;  he hardly ever locates the ball in flight and takes bad angles in defending the run (e.g. end around by Don Brown Colts in 3rd quarter results in touchdown; (2) Cornerbacks never play up on the line and try to keep receivers from getting a free release; this is especially importnt in short yardage situations like happened yesterday when MCD let his receiver catch a 6 yd pass for 1st down on 3rd and 9; he was so far off the line of scrimmage he didn't have a chance to stop the play (3) constant poor play from the safeties in helping out. I do not believe for one minute that this is all the fault of the personel;  For one DMC is a first round draft choice who was a probowler his 1st year; secondly, there are two many defensive backs weve going thru over the last two years, for it to be all the talent level.  I don't buy it and neither should any Pats fan. I say, get a defensive coordinator in here that can do the job because the current crop of coaches simply cannot!!
    Posted by dbincpumpkin[/QUOTE]
    I didn't mean to imply that it is 100% a talent problem, but I just think overall fans tend to place arbitrarily high value on "coaching" "adjustments" and "schemes".  Don't get me wrong-all three of those things are vital to winning football.  BUT they can all be undermined by poor talent and execution, and I think anyone objectively looking at the Pats secondary has to conclude that they have a deficiency of talent.  Sergio Brown can't seem to play even the most basic deep zone concepts, he is always late to the party so to speak.  I'm just not sure what coaching can do to rectify that, if the guy can't play he can't play.  The technique issues with Dev are concerning, he has been pretty miserable this season no doubt.  But last season he showed tremendous ball skills and understanding of outside/inside leverage, so again i'm not entirely convinced that coaching has made him worse.  I *believe* the secondary coaches are the same as last year, minus Corwin Brown.  And as a whole they stunk last year, and continue to stink this year.  2012 is huge imo, at the risk of looking ahead too much the Pats have got to figure out what they have with McCourty and Ras.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from brdbreu. Show brdbreu's posts

    Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?

    In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent? : Thought provoking and I do see your point and agree that it is up to the coaches to prepare the players and put them in the best possible position to win.  Given the level of talent at the safety position (not particularly high with Chung out) and the lack of depth at CB (approaching or at zero) I'm not sure that much more could be done.  That said, this is a discussion that could go on infinitum.  For the record, brdbreu, appreciate the approach you have taken in outlining your points, particularly on the points in which we disagree.
    Posted by ATJ[/QUOTE]

    thanks for the feedback atj.

    to me the most important thing here on this board is HOW we speak to (or treat each other). we're just fans, our posts do not serve the poor, disenfranchised or disabled here. what we say is less important in my mind than how (that has an impact in the lives of all the people here.

    peace.

    ps you may have asked in jest, but since you asked some examples are, turning for the ball, playing the ball, proper jam technique, and we could go on.
    poor techniques havent changed. no matter how low skill thse guys have, unless developmentally disabled, they should be able improve at least their techniques.

    i believe i see your point as well.

    peace
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from expertmike. Show expertmike's posts

    Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?

    Lets see... Boyer's responsibilities are limited to that of CB's Coach - not DB's Coach. In fact the Pats prefer having no (dedicated) coach for safteys rather than turn the safties over to Boyer.  Last year Boyer gets "help" from Brown, and I see significantly better quality of play, from DMC especially, last year as opposed to this year.

    Come on, many of us work in organizations where someone who is limited in what they can contribute has their responsibilities limited. For Boyer, that writing is on the wall for anyone willing to read it.

    I'm sure Boyer is doing his best. But the question is whether a team can be championship caliber with coaching that is far below championship caliber?  Does coaching matter?  How can BB have no coach for safty's after cutting his veteran safety's

    I dwell on this because I think last year's playoff loss to the Jets was mostly lost on the sidelines.  





     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from DavidSeattle. Show DavidSeattle's posts

    Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?

    In Response to Re: Are our Secondary Coaches Competent?:
    e
    The DB Mantra is When the receiver   looks back you look
     back. Many instances of multiple players making the same miscue
    Terrible Coaching 
     
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