Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from CablesWyndBairn. Show CablesWyndBairn's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    In response to p-mike's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Considered by whom?

    The entire NFL has gone "finesse," in case you haven't noticed, and the Pats are as good at it as just about anyone. As I mentioned in another thread yesterday (and today I see two new threads on the topic), the Pats primary problem is an inability to execute in crunch time. They can't get a stop or a first down when they desperately need one and that is why they have become either (a) a solid contender with legitimate Super Bowl aspirations or (b) a perennial bridesmaid . . .  depending upon your perspective.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    For this reason they've lost the last two superbowls, and despite being outplayed by the Giants for the most part in both games they could've won either.  The Giants made the plays when they had to, and the Pats seems to have lost that ability, at least in the SB.  Despite this flaw they were in the SB and if they made one or two plays in either game we have a different perspective and we're having a different conversation.   

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Iceman4. Show Iceman4's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    I think BB is holding back a little also......looking ahead to the end game.. Only problem is they may have to go to that endgame plan sooner because they are putting themselves behind...I think if they had won some of these games they would be running Woodhead quite a bit for first games of season.......I think that is why Julian is getting more reps right now also.....as the season wears on...as long as they can get winning....you will see them ramp up Ridley and WW's play.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from BubbaInHawaii. Show BubbaInHawaii's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    Woody was a match-up problem......for us.  Like several other posters, not sure why we're not letting Ridley get more play time...and letting him do it all - the blocking, running, play action, and screens.  IMO, it would be harder for opposing teams to defend and figure out the offensive play vs. when a "known" specialist comes in just to run...or just to catch. 

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from sporter81. Show sporter81's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    I think they are trying to become more of a power team.

    A finesse pass happy team will never win the Super Bowl. They look good in the regular season and in the stats but fail in the playoffs. 2001 rams vs Patriots is a perfect example.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from sporter81. Show sporter81's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    Ridley has to get carries. Even if he's not gaining much yardage eventually he will break a long run. Notice that about 1 in 5 runs go over 15 yards. He will take it to the house and wear down defenses. He needs to get carries. Just because the back gets stopped for no gain on a few plays you don't give up on the run.  That's like giving up the passing game after a couple incomplete passes

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from jcour382. Show jcour382's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    its a good question to ask... right now ya ... we cant get yards when we need em(on the ground)...though I think they are trying to establish that... in the day we used to beat teams up physically.. after teams played us they werent the same... well see

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from jcour382. Show jcour382's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    gerry c had a good story saying why were we running when they should have thrown(at the end)...true but they are trying to establish something against a team they could very well see at the end of the year..

     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    This team, whether finesse or not, will not perform to the satisfaction of every fan.  Someone will have an ax to grind.  Such a subjective question which elicits opinions from one spectrum to another.  Whether they win pretty or ugly, if that W column keeps increasing every week, we are happy, yet, grumpy, right?  Even in 2007 there were grumps in the crowd especially at the end of the season when the Pats were barely winning, struggling somewhat when each team they played threw their best game of the year at the Pats.  Many called for the team to fall flat on its face come the playoffs in spite of an undefeated regular season.  Remember?

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from BubbaInHawaii. Show BubbaInHawaii's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    In response to agcsbill's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    This team, whether finesse or not, will not perform to the satisfaction of every fan.  Someone will have an ax to grind.  Such a subjective question which elicits opinions from one spectrum to another.  Whether they win pretty or ugly, if that W column keeps increasing every week, we are happy, yet, grumpy, right?  Even in 2007 there were grumps in the crowd especially at the end of the season when the Pats were barely winning, struggling somewhat when each team they played threw their best game of the year at the Pats.  Many called for the team to fall flat on its face come the playoffs in spite of an undefeated regular season.  Remember?

    [/QUOTE]

    LOL. Too true.  I'd be more happy than grumpy if the end result was a SB win :)

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    ^ - SB wins are the salve for all regular season wounds!!!!  (-;

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from BubbaInHawaii. Show BubbaInHawaii's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    and SB losses are like salt in an open wound.....lol

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Paul_K. Show Paul_K's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    Finesse is a quality, not a definition of a team.  The questions are more properly:

    Does the team like gimmicks? 

    Does the team like smashmouth? 

    Does the team indulge in personal fouls, and in working the refs to perfection so that the refs don't call the aggressor team's personal fouls any more than they call fouls for the other team?

    There are other ways to win a game, but we're talking "finesse".

    - - -

    New England likes gimmicks.   Sometimes Brady hustles to the line and snaps the ball before the other team is set.  You can call that finesse.  It helps to be in shape. 

    New England likes to draft bulked up players, and then New England likes to use its muscle to hit people.  Logan Mankins and Nate Solder have to be singled out as guys that like to hit pretty hard, Mankins because he plays mean, and Solder because he has massive acceleration into people.  When Gronk and Hernandez are both on the field, New England's offense as a whole can  have a field day running the ball and hitting the defense until they all get woozy by the fourth quarter.  Tennessee's run defense just looked awful. 

    On the defensive side we find more bulked up players that probably shouldn't be playing in the pee-wee league.  Walrus Wilfork often starts the season at 375 pounds.  BB starts three big guys on the line.  In a league where linebackers weigh 240 pounds, BB starts Hightower at 270, Spikes at 255 and Mayo at 250.  Nobody is as cussed mean as Rodney Harrison these days, but BB keeps looking for that type of defensive player.  The truth is that the Patriots defense has damaged a bunch of quarterbacks over the years, but part of that is attacking quarterbacks every play while the opponent is falling way behind.  The defense is pretty smashmouth.  Even their punter is no shrimp at 230 pounds.  So, if smashmouth is the opposite of finesse, then the Patriots aren't a finesse team. 

    How are they on personal fouls?  Usually the Pats give as good as they get, but no, they don't live and die by the personal fouls.  Split decision here.

    So are they a finesse team?  If it's used as some opponent's taunt that the team shies away from personal foul wars, not exactly.  If it means that the Patriots shy away from smashmouth (passing the ball gets them wide open first downs all day so what does the opponent expect), no, notably false.  If it means the Patriots like all sorts of gimmicks and they like to pick on another team's weak links all day, yes, true.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rerun85. Show Rerun85's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    When they lineup Spread or empty they certainly are. On Defense I can't tell you what they are because I've seen 2 different defenses this year.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Brad34. Show Brad34's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    Yes unfortunately they are since the retirement and loss of Bruschi,Vrabel,Harrison,Mcginiest and big Ted Johnson. They went to this air it out high powered offense like the colts used to be and like the Colts used to when they played a tough defence they struggle.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from ccnsd. Show ccnsd's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    In response to sporter81's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I think they are trying to become more of a power team.

    A finesse pass happy team will never win the Super Bowl. They look good in the regular season and in the stats but fail in the playoffs. 2001 rams vs Patriots is a perfect example.

    [/QUOTE]


    Yeah like the New york Giants in 2011, the 32nd ranked rushing offense. The Green Bay Packers in 2010, the 24th ranked rushing offense or the 2008 Steelers with the 23rd ranked rushing attack.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from LazarusintheSanatorium. Show LazarusintheSanatorium's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    Here's the exact instant when I'll completely & totally stop regarding my team, as a "finesse team":  When the Offense is on the field and Brady calls an audible...  An audible which, rather than moving TB out from under center and into the shotgun...Moves him from the shotgun, to being under Center.  Tell'ya what- After 1 game, IF I saw even just 1 instance of the latter occuring more than the former...I'll never regard my club as a "finesse team" ever again.  I'll stop viewing them, as a team whom likes to pass the ball first and foremost, TO: A team that trully wishes above anything else, to execute the best possible play at any given moment against any given opponent.  

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from BubbaInHawaii. Show BubbaInHawaii's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    In response to sporter81's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Ridley has to get carries. Even if he's not gaining much yardage eventually he will break a long run. Notice that about 1 in 5 runs go over 15 yards. He will take it to the house and wear down defenses. He needs to get carries. Just because the back gets stopped for no gain on a few plays you don't give up on the run.  That's like giving up the passing game after a couple incomplete passes

    [/QUOTE]


    it would be interesting to see what would happen if they used Ridley as the #1 back....and woody to provide relief/change of pace...and actually, if Vereen ever gets healthy - for him to be the #2

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from BubbaInHawaii. Show BubbaInHawaii's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    In response to Rerun85's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    When they lineup Spread or empty they certainly are. On Defense I can't tell you what they are because I've seen 2 different defenses this year.

    [/QUOTE]


    I think it's hard to assess the defense. Certainly, the front 7 does not seem to be finesse.  Did you see the Raiders/Steelers game?  It just seemed like both of those teams, defensively, were hitting hard.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from BubbaInHawaii. Show BubbaInHawaii's posts

    Re: Are Patriots Considered A Finesse Team?

    In response to LazarusintheSanatorium's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Here's the exact instant when I'll completely & totally stop regarding my team, as a "finesse team":  When the Offense is on the field and Brady calls an audible...  An audible which, rather than moving TB out from under center and into the shotgun...Moves him from the shotgun, to being under Center.  Tell'ya what- After 1 game, IF I saw even just 1 instance of the latter occuring more than the former...I'll never regard my club as a "finesse team" ever again.  I'll stop viewing them, as a team whom likes to pass the ball first and foremost, TO: A team that trully wishes above anything else, to execute the best possible play at any given moment against any given opponent.  

    [/QUOTE]


    Sup, Laz?  Good to hear from you again.


    On offense, the more unpredictable....the better. To me this is for the coaches to figure out and the players to execute.

    Defensively, It would be nice to see our defense become more aggressive - try to get opponents off the field sooner rather than later, not end up in cover-2 as much - that never seems to end well for the team.

     

     

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