Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from apdynasty23. Show apdynasty23's posts

    Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    It's amazing to me how the Patriots have stockpiled picks for this year while still remaining very competitive in a league that's not designed to allow for both.

    On every draft-related thread someone poses the question of moving up and grabbing this player or that player. Almost immediately someone else replies and says something to the effect of "we need every pick we can get because there are way too many holes to fill on our roster."

    How true is that statement? I don't think we're THAT far off so I don't mind the Patriots giving up a pick or two to move up and grab someone.

    Honestly, how far are we?
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from magicalhobo. Show magicalhobo's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    There are holes at TE, some would argue WR, OLB, and DE. You could make a case for drafting another G,C, or T on the O-line. Another body in each O-line position wouldn't hurt with the aging players getting ready to retire soon. CB and RB might be something to look at too.

    I don't really see any of these as particularly glaring except for TE, OLB, and DE. I wouldn't complain if they moved up to grab an elite player. They still have two first rounders next year too. This team is going to be stacked in a few years.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from MordecaiBloodmoon. Show MordecaiBloodmoon's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    Real needs would be at WR, we need another young guy to groom since they take a while, Moss is in his last year, WW is out and Holt is a stopgap at this point.  At TE, we only have one.  At RB, most are 30+ and break all the time, LM runs like a scared little girl (no offense to any scared little girl pats fans out there).  OLB, ours stink.  No real 3 down OLBs on the team at all.  OL, we can use help at C, RG, RT.  All 3 are weak.  Our center cant handle NTs at all.  Our RG is great, but held together with duct tape. Our RT (Kaz) is adequate at best.  Yes Sea Bass can step in, but I see him as our LT for the next decade.  Lets see what else, we never replaced Big Sey and therefore can use a RDE.  Lastly a Punter can only be better than what we have. 
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Jimmy42Jack0. Show Jimmy42Jack0's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    i once heard a coach asked how many holes he has on the roster

    his reply...did we win it all last year? nope?!?!...then we got holes
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from sday4x45. Show sday4x45's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    not sold on the WR thing......Tate is waiting .....Endellman
    TE we can get in late rounds. Crumpler is fine

    I think we stay careful and try to pick up O-Line and D-line guys....
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from garytx. Show garytx's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    It depends on how you look at things.  If you're looking down the road some there are a lot of holes.  If you look at just next year, no.  Take the OL for example.  The offensive line is set for next year.  One can make the arguement about replacing Koppen but I don't think it's realistic.  Looking down the road we have some issues.   Will Light be around?  Koppen comes up again.  We're pretty much set at guard so Neal becomes a non-factor. 
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    In Response to Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?:
    There are holes at TE, some would argue WR, OLB, and DE. You could make a case for drafting another G,C, or T on the O-line. Another body in each O-line position wouldn't hurt with the aging players getting ready to retire soon. CB and RB might be something to look at too. I don't really see any of these as particularly glaring except for TE, OLB, and DE. I wouldn't complain if they moved up to grab an elite player. They still have two first rounders next year too. This team is going to be stacked in a few years.
    Posted by magicalhobo


    Right on.  We are adequate at every position except RE and TE.  Not all of our players are perfect, but we have an excellent shot to win the division this year if we find a starter at RE and TE. 
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rockdog1293000. Show Rockdog1293000's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    I think if you look around the league that everyone has a lot of holes. The Saints were great last year, but their run D was pathetic. I think it's more about having a team that fits with strengths and weaknesses. Last year the pats did not. Also remember guys like Patten filled holes in 02, so I don't think it's unreasonable to think a guy like Holt could do the same this year. I'm not saying anything about their future WR's, but I think a lot of teams would love to have Moss, Edelman, Holt, Tate, and Welker when he comes back. 

    I would agree with Mord that OLB is a huge, gaping hole that needs to be filled. That's why I hope Graham is available at 22. If they don't pick him in that case I'll be pretty angry.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from btownteamsrking. Show btownteamsrking's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    The reason why we think we have so many holes is because we are expecting solid players at every position.  This refers to any possible way to improve. 

    Those include:
    DE
    OLB
    ILB
    RT
    TE
    WR
    RB

    we arent going to be perfect, but those positions could use an upgrade.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    In Response to Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?:
    The reason why we think we have so many holes is because we are expecting solid players at every position.  This refers to any possible way to improve.  Those include: DE OLB ILB RT TE WR RB we arent going to be perfect, but those positions could use an upgrade.
    Posted by btownteamsrking


    Unless you're the 2007 Pats that's going to be the case for every team every year.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from oklahomapatriot. Show oklahomapatriot's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    There are a few. need some help at DL, TE, WR, OL, LB and RB
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    Well the way I see it we have no current starter at P, RDE, ROLB, SILB (McKenzie might fill this role but for right now it's Guyton and I don't consider him a 3 down ILB). We need upgrades or depth at RT (Kaz and Light aren't going to be aruond much longer so need someone next to Vollmer), RG (Neal's got a year or two left), C (need a better run blocker and someone who won't get overpowered by NT's), TE (1 TE on team nogh said), LOLB (I don't view TBC as a 3 down LB more as a 1-2 down rusing LB), RB (running backs +30 and LM need I saymore), and WR (Moss leaving next year and Holt is a stop gap need a strong #1 or #2 to train). Places where upgrades would be nice nickle CB.

    I would say OLB and DE we need to find starters and a couple OL, WR, and TE that could learn would be great and need to be drafted to. Another LB either outside or inside would be nice but not required. That's atleast 6 players that need to work out out of the 12 drafted. Since we only have one 1st, 3 2nd's, one 4th and the rest are 6th's and 7th's that might be asking a lot.  
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from HartLeeDykesEuguneChung. Show HartLeeDykesEuguneChung's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    I think you have to look at the 2010 and not too far in the future.  Sure, eventually the O-Line will need retooling but not in 2010.  RB's are OK, WR looks better with Holt and probably another signing (a Gaffney-type).  On the D, we NEED a replacement for Seymour, and its not Mike Wright.  We NEED a replacement for Adalius.  We NEED another MILB to stop the run, Guyton is just a cover-guy.  The secondary is improving with a chance to be a real strength soon.  And we NEED a TE.  So there aren't that many holes, and since we have 4 early picks, if we hit on 3 of them and someone steps up, like McKenzie or Crable, the Pats are fielding a much better team in 2010 then 2009.  And Mayo is healthly!!!!!
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    I think cornerback is another big hole.  Bodden was solid last year, but the rest of the group was frightening. I'm just not sold on Wilhite or Butler yet; Springs was never on the field; and Wheatley and Arrington seem like special team guys. I think we've got big gaps at the following five positions (listed roughly in order of importance):

    OLB (could use two!)
    CB (need one opposite Bodden)
    WR (need one deep threat)
    OT (need a top guy to replace Kaczur--assuming Vollmer replaces Light)
    TE (Crumpler helps, but we need a receiver there too)

    We also need to improve at DE, C, G (replace Neal, assuming Mankins gets signed), RB, ILB (is Guyton really the answer?), and maybe even Safety (not sure we have two reliable ones). We could use a FB, too, and probably a Punter. Come to think of it, the only positions I like right now are QB, NT, Long Snapper, and Place Kicker.  We do have a lot of good special teamers, but Kick Returner is a bit questionable and without Welker, Punt Returner might be iffy too. So, yeah, we got holes.  Lots of 'em.



     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Cyberknot. Show Cyberknot's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

     Is McKenzie ready to be an effective MLB? Can Guyton's speed make him a pass rushing force on the outside? Is Tate healthy and ready for the WR2 job? Will we see a marked improvement in the young players in the secondary? For every "yes" answer we can cross off a hole. If they are all yes, there aren't many holes and we can afford to move up for a higher  impact player. If they are all no, we would need to move out of the first to fill all of the holes.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    In Response to Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?:
    I think you have to look at the 2010 and not too far in the future.  Sure, eventually the O-Line will need retooling but not in 2010.  RB's are OK, WR looks better with Holt and probably another signing (a Gaffney-type).  On the D, we NEED a replacement for Seymour, and its not Mike Wright.  We NEED a replacement for Adalius.  We NEED another MILB to stop the run, Guyton is just a cover-guy.  The secondary is improving with a chance to be a real strength soon.  And we NEED a TE.  So there aren't that many holes, and since we have 4 early picks, if we hit on 3 of them and someone steps up, like McKenzie or Crable, the Pats are fielding a much better team in 2010 then 2009.  And Mayo is healthly!!!!!
    Posted by HartLeeDykesEuguneChung


    You could just look at this year but that's not how the Pats generally operate. They are looking long term so saying they would be looking at WR and OL to replace someone next season I feel would be a given. Esp considering how many picks in the early rounds they have this year. The other issue is that most players need a full year to get use to the NFL pace, so drafting for next year is just as important as drafting for this year.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from btownteamsrking. Show btownteamsrking's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    In Response to Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?:
    In Response to Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster? : Unless you're the 2007 Pats that's going to be the case for every team every year.
    Posted by themightypatriotz


    That is what I am saying.  We cant have stars at every position. 

    We say WR is a hole despite the fact we have:
    Moss, Holt, Edelman, Welker (injurred), Tate.  fact is, not many teams have 4 solid WRs. 
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from BubbaInHawaii. Show BubbaInHawaii's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    Yes, only because we need C, RT, RG, DEs, OLBs, punter, mebbe a shut-down corner, TE......

    I think we need to think about developing younger players on our OL and DL.....
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from carawaydj. Show carawaydj's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    No, there are not as many holes to win a SB as there are to have a perfect team.  What do I mean by that?  When us fans and so-called experts talk holes, they discuss every weak position on the team where a need exists.  You do not need to plug every hole on the team to win the SB, and definitely not to just be respectable in the playoffs.  This is evident every year when a few teams make drastic improvements merely by adding a couple of players.  Have there been many/any SB champs that didn't have holes as determined by the pundits before the season, during the season, and even into the playoffs?  

    There will always be holes on the team.  I guess figuring out which holes need to be filled first to be competitive is the secret sauce to being a successful franchise.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49Patriots. Show 49Patriots's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    NEEDS: 

    RDE- The Ravens showed that Seymour needs to be replaced by a starter, not back-ups. 

    ROLB - We need to rush the passer, we need to keep his legs moving, we need to slow down elite QBs-- Peyton, Drew, Rivers.

    OT- I don't want Kaczur starting. I can count three games where he gave up game ending sacks or hurries last year. He's a bum!

    WR- Was a major need pre-Holt, still a need for NE, but they can wait till round 5-7 to draft Scott Long. 


    Wants - 

    TE - Alge Crumpler is Belichick's dream TE. Our TEs are asked to block more than catch the ball. I'm all for drafting a young HB-TE, but I won't take one till round 6.

    SILB - Personally, if Guyton adds some pounds, and we get a bull-rushing DE who can draw double coverage, Guyton would make a really good ILB. I'm all for drafting Sean Lee in round 2 and having him compete with McKenzie and Guyton. 

    CB - I have faith in Butler, and Bodden can be a shutdown corner with a pass-rush, but I still think Wilhite suks @5s. We need depth at this position. 

    RB - I would keep Maroney, but the other backs, 30 + RBs = done. 


    Positions of strength- 

    QB - Stay away from Tebow, or any other QB till round 7 or as a RFA. We have the best in the biz. 

    NT - Unless we are drafting a DT to transfer them to an End position, stay away from them. 

    S - Meriweather is a star in the making, Chung will be a really good SS. 


     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from btownteamsrking. Show btownteamsrking's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    In Response to Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?:
    NEEDS:  RDE- The Ravens showed that Seymour needs to be replaced by a starter, not back-ups.  ROLB - We need to rush the passer, we need to keep his legs moving, we need to slow down elite QBs-- Peyton, Drew, Rivers. OT- I don't want Kaczur starting. I can count three games where he gave up game ending sacks or hurries last year. He's a bum! WR- Was a major need pre-Holt, still a need for NE, but they can wait till round 5-7 to draft Scott Long.  Wants -  TE - Alge Crumpler is Belichick's dream TE. Our TEs are asked to block more than catch the ball. I'm all for drafting a young HB-TE, but I won't take one till round 6. SILB - Personally, if Guyton adds some pounds, and we get a bull-rushing DE who can draw double coverage, Guyton would make a really good ILB. I'm all for drafting Sean Lee in round 2 and having him compete with McKenzie and Guyton.  CB - I have faith in Butler, and Bodden can be a shutdown corner with a pass-rush, but I still think Wilhite suks @5s. We need depth at this position.  RB - I would keep Maroney, but the other backs, 30 + RBs = done.  Positions of strength-  QB - Stay away from Tebow, or any other QB till round 7 or as a RFA. We have the best in the biz.  NT - Unless we are drafting a DT to transfer them to an End position, stay away from them.  S - Meriweather is a star in the making, Chung will be a really good SS. 
    Posted by 49Patriots


    excellent analysis.  I would argue though that we could use an RB.

    I really want Dexter McCluster on this team.  A WR/RB hybrid who will fill in exactly what we need.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from jedinate. Show jedinate's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    Roster? Philosophy? Talent?

    No run Blocking? Not great, pass blocking?

    Old, Injury prone OR young, scared running backs?

    An injured, but trying Moss (that back was never right). An overly relied upon Welker? No passes to the tight ends?

    No pass rush? No secondary leadership? no push up front...

    No Holes?

    okay...
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from jedinate. Show jedinate's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    I liked 49Patriots analysis. For the most part (we do need a stud RB), agreed.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    In Response to Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?:

    Good analysis 49Patriots. A few thoughts:

    RDE- The Ravens showed that Seymour needs to be replaced by a starter, not back-ups.  

    I'm hoping one of the guys on the roster (maybe Pryor or Lewis) will step up this year and fill this hole. With better LBs the DE position might not be as much of a liability either.

    ROT- I don't want Kaczur starting. I can count three games where he gave up game ending sacks or hurries last year. He's a bum! 

    Kaczur just isn't starting tackle material and LeVoir is even worse.  We can put Vollmer at RT and Light at LT, but I'd prefer to see Vollmer at LT and a talented young guy drafted for the RT spot.  (I sometimes wonder if Kaczur could be converted to RG--he looks more like a G to me and maybe could be the answer there. I don't think he's a bum--I think he works hard enough, but he just lacks the skills to be a tackle.)

    WR- Was a major need pre-Holt, still a need for NE, but they can wait till round 5-7 to draft Scott Long.  

    They need someone who can stretch the field and draw coverage away from Moss.  Maybe Holt will do that, but I'd like a young fast guy here.  Tate could be this guy if he comes back from the knee injury and proves he can catch.  But I would like them to draft someone to at least compete at this spot.

    CB - I have faith in Butler, and Bodden can be a shutdown corner with a pass-rush, but I still think Wilhite suks @5s. We need depth at this position.  R

    I wish I saw more from Butler.  We were burned repeatedly last year by good QBs because our corners (other than Bodden) are pathetic man-on-man. I think it's a long season if we don't fix the corner position.

    RB - I would keep Maroney, but the other backs, 30 + RBs = done.  

    I think Maroney is serviceable for another year, particularly if our OTs get better.  This is a position to work on next year I think.

    S - Meriweather is a star in the making, Chung will be a really good SS. 
    Posted by 49Patriots

    I'm still not confident about the safety position.  Merriweather has talent, but he doesn't always play smart and disciplined.  I do think Chung may turn out to be good.  What we need, though, is a good signal caller back there--someone who can control the DBs like Harrison did and make sure everyone is in position. What we lack most at this position is leadership. 



     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdoggg. Show underdoggg's posts

    Re: Are There Really THAT Many Holes on the Roster?

    I've got to admit that the idea of having a serious need at receiver even if welker was healthy is curious to me.  It doesn't make any sense to me that when you have 2 of the best receivers in the game that their presence on the field cannot or does not create openings for the 3rd WR or TE. 

    Just doesn't make sense to me.
     
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