Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to BostonSportsFan111's comment:

    Flacco was the better quarterback on that day, too. Not saying he is better than Brady, but he was very much better in that game. It did not help that Gronk was out and Talib got hurt. Pats were dominating the game for the first 20 minutes, the offense should have put up more than 13 points in that half. Once Talib went down, the defense was cooked.




    Flacco was the benefactor of some awesome receiving performances while Brady was enduring drops. Flacco was feasting on a mickey mouse pass defense once Talib went down. Brady was looking at receivers who could get no separation most of the time.

     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from jgallag1. Show jgallag1's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    Unless the kid from Tennessee falls to the Pats, I think they go D line or S in the first round. I'm hearing a lot of good things about both safeties from Texas and Florida, so if either are available there, I see that working out...but I would love for Jenkins, the DT from Georgia, to fall to them. It's a very deep D-line draft, and him being available is a real possibility. Him lined up next to Wilfork would be nightmarish for opponant's O-lines.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxfan94. Show redsoxfan94's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    flacco outplayed brady in back to back afc championship games, this time his team actually won and outplayed the pats as a whole.

     

    are the ravens built better than the pats overall? yes....but what you are missing is that the ravens havent had to give flacco a good contract yet. its easier to pay for high caliber players when you have more money to spend. just wait and see if its easy for the ravens to keep all of their players once flacco gets his $20 mil per.

     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to 42AND46's comment:

    In response to agcsbill's comment:

     

    If the Pats had simply played better (which everyone agrees they didn't exaxtly bring their A game against the Ravens) would this be a topic?  Ravens were hot at the right time and the Pats got deflated at the wrong time.  What were your feelings in that game at halftime?  The Ravens were better then too or only AFTER the game?


    no the ravens just  beat the pats a**...stop the rationalizing and silly nonsense and tip ur cap to the opponent ie: the better team

    typical pats fan



    So, oh sage and wise one.. you are saying the Pats were playing their "A" game and still got their a**es kicked?  Everyone agrees the PATS did not play well while the Ravens did, not to take away from the better play of the Ravens.  You seem to forget, the Pats' D did pretty well stopping the Ravens in the first half and the Pats' O missed opportunities to get ahead by a wider margin.  Seems you are acting like a typical Pats "hater"!!!

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from 42AND46. Show 42AND46's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to ClarkGriswold's comment:

    What about QB?  This is getting ridiculous. Bdbreu another attempt to deflect from Brady's poor performances in the postseasons of late.

    Last 3 AFC title games at home: 5 TDs, 7 INTs and that includes the 2007 16-0 regular season.

    Every time a deflection from Brady thread arises, I'll be here to remind the BBW of what the truth is.

    NE DOES need to improve the secondary and add another piece along the D Line, but to pretend our offensive failures or the talent on offense somehow is inferior to that of Baltimore's is ridiculous.

    We had the same issues on offense as we did last year. The only difference is, NE's D bailed out the O last year and not this year.

    Gets a little tiring to be blaming our O Line every postseason as a way to deflect from a failed offensive ideology, one that Brady himself prefers.

    Don't turn it over, we in the SB. It's a very simple idea.  Flacco threw 0 INTs the entire postseason.    He actually bailed them out in Denver and in NE. In each case turnovers jump started their ability to win. 

    I would argue health has been a huge reason why NE has faltered the last 2 years, long before the utterly ridicuous premise that "Ozzie Newsome has been kicking our aszs".

    What an absolute joke.   Flacco outperformed Brady. Do we trade Brady for Flacco, Bdbreu?

    One catch by Welker in either of these last two season ending games puts at least 1 SB ring on his hand, Brady's hand and one more for BB's hand.

    Lastly, Baltimore had the win it for Ray thing going and they channeled that well all the way to a SB win.

    Wake me when that fire returns with #12.  Pouting, arms folded, deer in the headlights, etc, isn 't what I want to see.

     




    yep this is definitely Rusty

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to ClarkGriswold's comment:

    What about QB?  This is getting ridiculous. Bdbreu another attempt to deflect from Brady's poor performances in the postseasons of late.

    Last 3 AFC title games at home: 5 TDs, 7 INTs and that includes the 2007 16-0 regular season.

    Every time a deflection from Brady thread arises, I'll be here to remind the BBW of what the truth is.

    NE DOES need to improve the secondary and add another piece along the D Line, but to pretend our offensive failures or the talent on offense somehow is inferior to that of Baltimore's is ridiculous.

    We had the same issues on offense as we did last year. The only difference is, NE's D bailed out the O last year and not this year.

    Gets a little tiring to be blaming our O Line every postseason as a way to deflect from a failed offensive ideology, one that Brady himself prefers.

    Don't turn it over, we in the SB. It's a very simple idea.  Flacco threw 0 INTs the entire postseason.    He actually bailed them out in Denver and in NE. In each case turnovers jump started their ability to win. 

    I would argue health has been a huge reason why NE has faltered the last 2 years, long before the utterly ridicuous premise that "Ozzie Newsome has been kicking our aszs".

    What an absolute joke.   Flacco outperformed Brady. Do we trade Brady for Flacco, Bdbreu?

    One catch by Welker in either of these last two season ending games puts at least 1 SB ring on his hand, Brady's hand and one more for BB's hand.

    Lastly, Baltimore had the win it for Ray thing going and they channeled that well all the way to a SB win.

    Wake me when that fire returns with #12.  Pouting, arms folded, deer in the headlights, etc, isn 't what I want to see.

     


    Hey, Rusty!!

     
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  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    Defensive line is the only glaring difference between the two teams.  Pats get bigger and better along the front three, then all these other position groups become equal.  

    Returner is instantly better with Demps assuming he knows how to hold on to the ball.  DB's with a healthy Talib we're as good or better at corner and free safety, weaker at SS; wash.  WR's if we're including Hernandez in that group is probably a wash though they obviously have better outside threats on the whole.  O Line we are equal to or even better than them.

    The Ravens won because we came out in the 2nd half complacent, they came out with double the intensity and mental toughness... a trait built from losing in the post season year after year and with the added Ray Lewis incentive.  The Pats have to get tougher both physically and mentally.

    When we're winning everybody crows about how good our talent is, when we lose it's because of a lack of talent.  Coaching, schemes, luck and desire play a large part in winning and losing.

     

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxfan94. Show redsoxfan94's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to ClarkGriswold's comment:

    In response to redsoxfan94's comment:

     

    flacco outplayed brady in back to back afc championship games, this time his team actually won and outplayed the pats as a whole.

     

    are the ravens built better than the pats overall? yes....but what you are missing is that the ravens havent had to give flacco a good contract yet. its easier to pay for high caliber players when you have more money to spend. just wait and see if its easy for the ravens to keep all of their players once flacco gets his $20 mil per.

     




    The other difference is that they've had two HOF players down the middle with a very good player in Ngata in place there for years. It's a veteran D. They're at where NE was at in 2007. Even with Lewis and Reed as older players, their instincts and experience make up for that. It's no different than a slower and older Bruschi in 2007 or Rodney in 2007, each on their way out.

     

    Difference is, their offense and QB played better in SB 47 than ours did in SB 42.

    That simple.  Baltimore was much further along with their defense, obviously.  NE doesn't field the youngest D in the league by accident.

    If you want to fault the D for not bailing out the offense, that's fine.  But, when is the offense going to be the thing that takes charge in AFC title games or SBs? An offensive era and Flacco had no problems doing it.   Last time I checked our own QB has to at least match the other guy.

    The other thing is, Flacco actually realizes the benefits of playaction and uses it.  The first play of the SB was a checkdown to Vonta Leach. Brilliant.  Or, is it not really brillian, but just something we don't do? Tom Brady, this era's version, would never in a million years want to start a game these days with a methodical play like that. It's boring to him, apparently.

    That whole play design is set up to immediately get SF's D thinking. SF's D allowed 27 points.  Are SF fans talking about how their team is weaker in all those spots on the field that little kid Bdbreu points out?

    Likely not.

    NE was easily as competitive as SF or Balt, but costly mistskes and lack of execution proved fatal. Same issue, different postseason.

     




    definitely, i agree. ive made some of the same points as you have just made. its ridiculous how people drool over defense's like the ravens and 9ers, but yet mock the pats defense....imagine this place if the pats defense had played like either of those defenses' in the super bowl....

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to dapats1281's comment:

    So pretty much improve everything but QB, RB, and TE



    about. 

    just looking at what we do against top competition

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to kansaspatriot's comment:

    I think those are the areas. TB needs a beefier o-line to protect him since he's not very mobile outside the pocket.

    and i would like a couple megatron type WRs to go with out big TEs



    a couple, id take one.... :)

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to dreighver's comment:

    Quite an astute observation. 



    which post? :) about having megatrons?

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to dapats1281's comment:

    In response to kansaspatriot's comment:

     

    In response to dapats1281's comment:

     

    In response to kansaspatriot's comment:

     

    I think those are the areas. TB needs a beefier o-line to protect him since he's not very mobile outside the pocket.

    and i would like a couple megatron type WRs to go with out big TEs

     



    Why do people keep saying this like there's an abundance of them in the NFL? You'd be lucky just to have one, let alone a couple.

     

     



    ever hear of the draft?

     

     



    Yeah, I have. How many have come by the 29th pick or later?

     



    there are big talented wrs that will be available throughout this draft. 

    you just cant be daft at picking the 1 or 2 busts wrs

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    The Ravens have a good team around a good Flacco. We have a MEDIOCRE team around a great Brady. That puts both teams in the mix and the Ravens happened to pull it off this time. We almost pulled it off last time.

    But if you want a high chance to pull it off put a good team around a great Brady. If that had been the case we probably would have at least 4 Lombardis since 2005 and would be talked of as the greatest dynasty by far in the history of the game.

    "We have a MEDIOCRE team around a great Brady. "

    concur with this assessment. (and the rest of your post generally).

    i think that is what my original post indicated ...along with the solution

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to agcsbill's comment:

    If the Pats had simply played better (which everyone agrees they didn't exaxtly bring their A game against the Ravens) would this be a topic?  Ravens were hot at the right time and the Pats got deflated at the wrong time.  What were your feelings in that game at halftime?  The Ravens were better then too or only AFTER the game?



    again, ravesn have a beter o line, better d line, better wr, better dbs. no question.

    and very importantly off. coordinator.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to dapats1281's comment:

    In response to kansaspatriot's comment:

     

    In response to dapats1281's comment:

     

    In response to kansaspatriot's comment:

     

    In response to dapats1281's comment:

     

    In response to kansaspatriot's comment:

     

    I think those are the areas. TB needs a beefier o-line to protect him since he's not very mobile outside the pocket.

    and i would like a couple megatron type WRs to go with out big TEs

     



    Why do people keep saying this like there's an abundance of them in the NFL? You'd be lucky just to have one, let alone a couple.

     

     



    ever hear of the draft?

     

     



    Yeah, I have. How many have come by the 29th pick or later?

     

     




    how about #199? remember Ton Brady?

     

     



    Brady Is the biggest draft steal in NFL history. You don't go into draft expecting to find your next franchise Qb or Calvin Johnson type WR in the sixth round

     

    There are more Qb busts in the 6th round than hits.

    same thing with WR. For every TO there's like 30 Chad Jackson's. And most of the late WRs take time to develop. Unless the Pats are eextremely lucky, you're not going to find a "couple of Megatron type WRs" that late in draft. If they do, it's even more unlikely they're rookie contributors. There's a reason why the Falcons gave up so much to get Julio...those WRs are rare



    there are several top big wrs availabel this draft. throw megatron out. you wont knwo any of theat for yerars. but talented guys who can help you NOW.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to BostonSportsFan111's comment:

    Flacco was the better quarterback on that day, too. Not saying he is better than Brady, but he was very much better in that game. It did not help that Gronk was out and Talib got hurt. Pats were dominating the game for the first 20 minutes, the offense should have put up more than 13 points in that half. Once Talib went down, the defense was cooked.



    YES BUT FACTOR IN josh. he does very poorly calling a game against better defenses

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to seattlepat70's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

     

    weve got areas we have to improve through draft and fa. to get to promised land

    newsome gm been kicking our @ss.

    specifically need big outside wr who can separate (draft)

    pass rusher to complement jones (no pressure against better o line like ravens)

    big cb to go along with talib, dennard, dowling.

    cover lineabcker

    improve o line runblock/and passblock

    luxury ss upgrade who cna also cover (cnat have safeties in current nfl who cant cover even ss)

     




     

    To me, it's the complement to VW that is the missing link. Ninkovich was slightly more productive than Jones. What they need is another guy inside who either has the strength or athleticism that would force the opposing OLine to decide who to double team.



    that wont hurt, its at eh back of my list (started as top 3 before end of draft)

    nink gets stoned most of the time against big o lineman. a sdid rest of our d line against better o lines. zero pressure on flacco.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    To the team's needs, the O line is one of the best in the league. Could it be better?  Of course but it doesn't need an overhaul.  D-line could use an inside pass rusher and some depth.  Deep threat wideouts aren't stocked in a supply closet.  The team could use a deep threat but to suggest that it's just a matter of going out and finding the next Megatron is a bit of a reach.  Hardly a news flash that a strong safety and a cover corner would signficantly beef up the D.  

    Now to this ongoing, never-ending, self-flagellating, and to my way of thinking, pointless analysis of the why the Pats got their a$$es kicked by the Ravens:  The Ravens got hot at the right time, came into the AFCCG on a roll and outplayed the Pats in the second half badly in every phase of the game.  Pats O sputtered in the Ravens end of the field.  Ravens O in the second half put the ball in Flacco's hands and he produced.   It is no more complicated than that.  Was there a talent mismatch in the secondary?  Anyone who's ever watched a football game with his or her eyes open could see that.  Did Flacco outplay Brady in this game?  As a matter of fact he did.

    Rant complete.  Thank you.



    " the O line is one of the best in the league"

    really. must say i diagree. against better des, brady has 0-2 seconds way too often.

    compare to balt. no comparison.

    re wrs have you evaluated teh wrs fcoming out? there are a very good number of big fast outside wrs

     

    "Pats O sputtered in the Ravens end of the field."

    agreed. and it happened all year because josh is a bit limited as an oc. 

    flacco did outplay brady, WITH A BETTER O LINE, BETTER WRS AND BETTER OFF COORDINATOR.

    balts de did stop a limited o.c, a better de line than our o line and as you mention, a better def backfield.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to BostonSportsFan111's comment:

     

    Flacco was the better quarterback on that day, too. Not saying he is better than Brady, but he was very much better in that game. It did not help that Gronk was out and Talib got hurt. Pats were dominating the game for the first 20 minutes, the offense should have put up more than 13 points in that half. Once Talib went down, the defense was cooked.

     




    Flacco was the benefactor of some awesome receiving performances while Brady was enduring drops. Flacco was feasting on a mickey mouse pass defense once Talib went down. Brady was looking at receivers who could get no separation most of the time.

     

     



    agreed

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to jgallag1's comment:

    Unless the kid from Tennessee falls to the Pats, I think they go D line or S in the first round. I'm hearing a lot of good things about both safeties from Texas and Florida, so if either are available there, I see that working out...but I would love for Jenkins, the DT from Georgia, to fall to them. It's a very deep D-line draft, and him being available is a real possibility. Him lined up next to Wilfork would be nightmarish for opponant's O-lines.



    so many dts, one good one could fall, ditto wrs, cbs

    if we dont get a pass rusher in fa, id love ezekiel ansah in rd 1.

    if we get a fa pass rusher, i like xavier rhodes (have cb higher need than safety. like safety in fa)

    go big fast wr in rd 2 (could reverse these 2, but more risky cb pick in rd 2, and no size unless you go much lower in draft-even more risky)

    if we drafted a safety in rd 1, i like vaccaro (texas guy) but to me a waste of our higher priorities.

    rd 3,improve o line, or fast cover lb, or safety baccari rambo (option cyprien) if we dont get one in fa

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to wozzy's comment:

    Defensive line is the only glaring difference between the two teams.  Pats get bigger and better along the front three, then all these other position groups become equal.  

    Returner is instantly better with Demps assuming he knows how to hold on to the ball.  DB's with a healthy Talib we're as good or better at corner and free safety, weaker at SS; wash.  WR's if we're including Hernandez in that group is probably a wash though they obviously have better outside threats on the whole.  O Line we are equal to or even better than them.

    The Ravens won because we came out in the 2nd half complacent, they came out with double the intensity and mental toughness... a trait built from losing in the post season year after year and with the added Ray Lewis incentive.  The Pats have to get tougher both physically and mentally.

    When we're winning everybody crows about how good our talent is, when we lose it's because of a lack of talent.  Coaching, schemes, luck and desire play a large part in winning and losing.

     



    "When we're winning everybody crows about how good our talent is, when we lose it's because of a lack of talent."

    my observations have been consistent win or lose. have you not seen teh resposnes to my posts, ie what are you complaining about look at how many pointgs we scored. you can do great against most of the league, but not be good enough against the top teams.

    we clearly disaagree on a lot of teh balt - ne cmpariosons. 

    our o line is as good as theirs?

    huh?

    brady was running often and often in a second or 2 or 3. flacco did not sweat and had forever to set and just watch guys open up.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/10/24/offensive-line-rankings/2/

    The Pats O line ranks 7th in the league.  Not the best O line but one of the best. 

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: Balt. better O line, D line, WRs, DB's, Returner than pats, Why they won.

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    our o line is as good as theirs?

    huh?

    brady was running often and often in a second or 2 or 3. flacco did not sweat and had forever to set and just watch guys open up.



    This says more about their D line than it does our O Line, we lack the pass rush, they clearly don't.

     
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