Baltimore's New Defense.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from patsbandwagonsince76. Show patsbandwagonsince76's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    Crazy as it sounds I think the Ravens defense will get tired out against NE. Despite getting a big stop they were exhausted at the end of the Broncos game even with the benefit of not having to take the field for two series due to the kick returns..

    Even more crazy I really think in the overall game Denver would have been better off if neither kick return happened and the Denver offense got a couple first downs on one drive and a long drive for a TD. Yes, they would have probably played down a TD for some of the game but their offense would of had a chance to take over the game.  Getting the ball and getting into the groove is extremely important  for offenses like Denver and frankly the Ravens would have nothing left by the 4th qtr.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriots. Show themightypatriots's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to pcmIV's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    If you count his fumbles he has turned the ball over more than Brady since 2010 in the postseason despite playing in fewer games and having 2 games in the wildcard round which are the lower tier of playoff teams.

    [/QUOTE]


    That's just mean of you, ruining the troll's fantasy with facts.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to RockScully's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    Do you ever, ever, ever admit to being wrong even when proven wrong?  "Serious question".

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I don't know? How do you feel about the 40 passes from Brady? That's the formula for a loss right?

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to themightypatriots' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to pcmIV's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    If you count his fumbles he has turned the ball over more than Brady since 2010 in the postseason despite playing in fewer games and having 2 games in the wildcard round which are the lower tier of playoff teams.

    [/QUOTE]


    That's just mean of you, ruining the troll's fantasy with facts.

    [/QUOTE]


    I was actually incorrect initially.  I've edited my post accordingly.  Still Flacco has turned it over as much as Brady despite playing twice in the WC round.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriots. Show themightypatriots's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    This is the point where his personal attacks become really nasty, hoping he'll get banned to eliminate the evidence of his wild claims.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from dreighver. Show dreighver's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to themightypatriots' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    This is the point where his personal attacks become really nasty, hoping he'll get banned to eliminate the evidence of his wild claims.

    [/QUOTE]

    Bwahahahaha!

     
  7. This post has been removed.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to themightypatriots' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    This is the point where his personal attacks become really nasty, hoping he'll get banned to eliminate the evidence of his wild claims.

    [/QUOTE]

    Haha.

    You see there is a backlog here. 

    There was a standing bet, no doubt Rusty will deny this now, after the Texans game earlier this season, where NE also passed all over their defense. 

    Rusty literally challenged me about his inane 40 pass rule, loser admits he was wrong, stakes set to the playoffs in a playoff game. 

    Here it is, and here he is pretending it didn't happen.

    But then I don't expect Rusty to be anything but a coward about that anyhow. So I'm not really disappointed. 

     
  9. This post has been removed.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from portfolio1. Show portfolio1's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to agcsbill's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    This forum has to stop focusing on the "No Gronk" issue!  Get past it knowing the Pats have adjusted as clearly shown in yesterday's game in which the O scored ALL 41 points AFTER he was out of the game plus Woody!  Focus on who they have and how they'll win and not who is missing.

    [/QUOTE]


    While I agree everyone needs to "get passed" the fact he is gone for the year his loss is critical in whether the Pats will win the Ravens game and whether they can win the SB. Not critical in that they cant win these games but critical in that he was one of the MOST important players especially in these specific match ups.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriots. Show themightypatriots's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to zbellino's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to themightypatriots' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    This is the point where his personal attacks become really nasty, hoping he'll get banned to eliminate the evidence of his wild claims.

    [/QUOTE]

    Haha.

    You see there is a backlog here. 

    There was a standing bet, no doubt Rusty will deny this now, after the Texans game earlier this season, where NE also passed all over their defense. 

    Rusty literally challenged me about his inane 40 pass rule, loser admits he was wrong, stakes set to the playoffs in a playoff game. 

    Here it is, and here he is pretending it didn't happen.

    But then I don't expect Rusty to be anything but a coward about that anyhow. So I'm not really disappointed. 

    [/QUOTE]

    His posts are very amusing, like reading an Onion article, the way he defends Brady's greatness by carrying the Brady hater arguments to absurdity.

     
  12. This post has been removed.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to zbellino's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to RockScully's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    Do you ever, ever, ever admit to being wrong even when proven wrong?  "Serious question".

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I don't know? How do you feel about the 40 passes from Brady? That's the formula for a loss right?

    [/QUOTE]

    I would argue the Pats did a very good job of putting themselves in position to possibly give up that lead by continuing to throw low percentage throws in the 4th quarter with a huge lead.

    Frankly I am surprised more people have not complained about it today but then I have to remember that I am not sure anyone on here coaches and you watch a game very differently as a fan than as a coach.

    No one will convince me it was good game or clock managment by the Pats in the late 3rd Qtr and most of 4th Qtr. 

    People always want to rail about the defense giving up a lead late but I would argue that through the process of a game that just a single rush attempt on every given series, especially when already rushing the ball well AND having a sizable lead would easily wipe out 3 or 4 more minutes off the clock at a minimum.

    To be honest I was pissed that Brady threw that ball to Vereen down the left sideline for the TD. It worked. It's great in hindsite but that instantaneous TD was not needed in that situation after the turnover on downs with an already good lead of 30-13. It could just as easily have been intercepted as well given it's a low percentage throw and not Brady's strongest  attribute in his great skill set.

    What WAS needed was chewing up clock and giving your defense a rest after just leaving the field on the turnover on downs and keeping your kickoff coverage unit off the field as long as possible while having a rough night.

    There was 13 minutes on the clock still. That game took forever because the Pats never burned much clock and gave the Texans more time of posession. Football is a complimentary game and I personally don't think they did a good job with the sizable lead in that game.

    The Pats could have more sytematically tried to work their way down from the 33 to a TD while working clock, continuing to tire and bludgon the Texans D, rest their own D, Maintaining more time of posession, bring the clock ever closer to a time when Texans would need to consider to start using Time outs, prolonging the Texans an opportunity to get their successful KO receiving team on the field, etc, etc.

    Even if the drive failed they would have done most of those things I mentioned as well as still be in FG range with a most likely lead stretching FG that takes it to a 3 possession game with much less time on the clock. 

    Anything can happen with lots of time on the clock no matter how big the lead but when the time runs out game over and nothing bad can happen when you already have the lead with zero time left.

    As it turned out the Pats kicked off and the Texans ran it back to the NE 37 and quickly got the TD right back and still no time barely run off the clock.

    Sorry but the Pats would have indeed been better off running the ball just a lil bit more with the big lead starting earlier in the game.

    Sometimes you win as a coach because your team is just that much better or you made more good decisions than bad but that doesn't mean you made the best decisions in every situation.

    BB knows way more than me obviously but he also has not had the headset on many times when the Offense has the ball and didn't during this scenario but I would be willing to bet when he reevaluates the entire thing as it played out he'll have a few questions for McD.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to Low-FB-IQ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to zbellino's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to RockScully's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    Do you ever, ever, ever admit to being wrong even when proven wrong?  "Serious question".

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I don't know? How do you feel about the 40 passes from Brady? That's the formula for a loss right?

    [/QUOTE]

    I would argue the Pats did a very good job of putting themselves in position to possibly give up that lead by continuing to throw low percentage throws in the 4th quarter with a huge lead.

    Frankly I am surprised more people have not complained about it today but then I have to remember that I am not sure anyone on here coaches and you watch a game very differently as a fan than as a coach.

    No one will convince me it was good game or clock managment by the Pats in the late 3rd Qtr and most of 4th Qtr. 

    People always want to rail about the defense giving up a lead late but I would argue that through the process of a game that just a single rush attempt on every given series, especially when already rushing the ball well AND having a sizable lead would easily wipe out 3 or 4 more minutes off the clock at a minimum.

    To be honest I was pissed that Brady threw that ball to Vereen down the left sideline for the TD. It worked. It's great in hindsite but that instantaneous TD was not needed in that situation after the turnover on downs with an already good lead of 30-13. It could just as easily have been intercepted as well given it's a low percentage throw and not Brady's strongest  attribute in his great skill set.

    What WAS needed was chewing up clock and giving your defense a rest after just leaving the field on the turnover on downs and keeping your kickoff coverage unit off the field as long as possible while having a rough night.

    There was 13 minutes on the clock still. That game took forever because the Pats never burned much clock and gave the Texans more time of posession. Football is a complimentary game and I personally don't think they did a good job with the sizable lead in that game.

    The Pats could have more sytematically tried to work their way down from the 33 to a TD while working clock, continuing to tire and bludgon the Texans D, rest their own D, Maintaining more time of posession, bring the clock ever closer to a time when Texans would need to consider to start using Time outs, prolonging the Texans an opportunity to get their successful KO receiving team on the field, etc, etc.

    Even if the drive failed they would have done most of those things I mentioned as well as still be in FG range with a most likely lead stretching FG that takes it to a 3 possession game with much less time on the clock. 

    Anything can happen with lots of time on the clock no matter how big the lead but when the time runs out game over and nothing bad can happen when you already have the lead with zero time left.

    As it turned out the Pats kicked off and the Texans ran it back to the NE 37 and quickly got the TD right back and still no time barely run off the clock.

    Sorry but the Pats would have indeed been better off running the ball just a lil bit more with the big lead starting earlier in the game.

    Sometimes you win as a coach because your team is just that much better or you made more good decisions than bad but that doesn't mean you made the best decisions in every situation.

    BB knows way more than me obviously but he also has not had the headset on many times when the Offense has the ball and didn't during this scenario but I would be willing to bet when he reevaluates the entire thing as it played out he'll have a few questions for McD.

    [/QUOTE]


    Great post!!!

     

     
  15. This post has been removed.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to RockScully's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to zbellino's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to RockScully's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    Do you ever, ever, ever admit to being wrong even when proven wrong?  "Serious question".

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I don't know? How do you feel about the 40 passes from Brady? That's the formula for a loss right?

    [/QUOTE]

    No, it's an approx baromter that I used based on my research. I never said it was definitive. I said the odds go up we lose against good or great Ds, when he gets past 35 pass attempts.

    40 or above, the odds go up higher, because in those games he's had 1 or 2 INTs.

    He didn't last night, obviously.  Success. Great job, as I said. He needs to do that or something similar to that TWO MORE TIMES.

    It's what he did in 2003 and 2004.  He hasn't done it consistently in 2007, 2010 or last year.

    I think he has a big game, wants to atone, and I think it's next to impossible to ignore what Ridley provides for our offense. Vereen's skills are just an advantage.  If they line him against a Balt LB, the defense you're currently raving about, what do you think that does?

    Ray Lewis, your buddy, at age 37 is going to play man against Shane Vereen? Bart Scott couldn't do it. Barrett Ruud couldn't do it last night.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Ray Lewis isn't my buddy. I hate him, and I think he is a thug. I think Baltimore's defense is populated with loud mouth punks. Yeah, he isn't what he once was in man coverage, but he is still an amazing set of eyes out there, great in zone, and great tackling. 

    But they can play. 

    Second. 

    That isn't a "barometer."

    That was a set of cold hard words you repeated again and again ... moreover, you said you bet they will lose in the playoffs if Brady goes over 40 and were ready to make a big show about it then, but now you are a church mouse. 

    Now you are talking about how it's what you wanted all along. 

    You dish out a whole lot here, usually I don't even have anything to say about it. 

    But this is too fun to pass up because you are pretending like a.) that didn't happen, and b.) you weren't wrong. 

    Which is fine, I can still chuckle. I didn't think you would man up and just admit .... there are dozens of ways to "skin a cat."

    I really don't care how often they run or pass it next week, week after that. You do what the matchups dictate. 

    Last, if your team requires that your QB throw 3 TDs, 300 yards, and not turn the ball over once to win every game, then you have flaws outside your QB that need to be addressed. 

    No player is going to be that perfect all the way through a cadre of playoff defenses. 

    Yeah in 2004 Brady was perfect. But be real. In 2001 and 2003 he threw 6TDs and had 3 INT and two fumbles. That is a worse TD to turnover ratio than he's had down the stretch these last few seasons. The difference was that NE had a defense that was just flat out dominant. They were a more well rounded team. 

    This team is NOT as good. I think they are good enough to win a Superbowl, but the long and short of it is they are not as good. 

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to Low-FB-IQ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to zbellino's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to RockScully's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    Do you ever, ever, ever admit to being wrong even when proven wrong?  "Serious question".

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I don't know? How do you feel about the 40 passes from Brady? That's the formula for a loss right?

    [/QUOTE]

    I would argue the Pats did a very good job of putting themselves in position to possibly give up that lead by continuing to throw low percentage throws in the 4th quarter with a huge lead.

    Frankly I am surprised more people have not complained about it today but then I have to remember that I am not sure anyone on here coaches and you watch a game very differently as a fan than as a coach.

    No one will convince me it was good game or clock managment by the Pats in the late 3rd Qtr and most of 4th Qtr. 

    People always want to rail about the defense giving up a lead late but I would argue that through the process of a game that just a single rush attempt on every given series, especially when already rushing the ball well AND having a sizable lead would easily wipe out 3 or 4 more minutes off the clock at a minimum.

    To be honest I was pissed that Brady threw that ball to Vereen down the left sideline for the TD. It worked. It's great in hindsite but that instantaneous TD was not needed in that situation after the turnover on downs with an already good lead of 30-13. It could just as easily have been intercepted as well given it's a low percentage throw and not Brady's strongest  attribute in his great skill set.

    What WAS needed was chewing up clock and giving your defense a rest after just leaving the field on the turnover on downs and keeping your kickoff coverage unit off the field as long as possible while having a rough night.

    There was 13 minutes on the clock still. That game took forever because the Pats never burned much clock and gave the Texans more time of posession. Football is a complimentary game and I personally don't think they did a good job with the sizable lead in that game.

    The Pats could have more sytematically tried to work their way down from the 33 to a TD while working clock, continuing to tire and bludgon the Texans D, rest their own D, Maintaining more time of posession, bring the clock ever closer to a time when Texans would need to consider to start using Time outs, prolonging the Texans an opportunity to get their successful KO receiving team on the field, etc, etc.

    Even if the drive failed they would have done most of those things I mentioned as well as still be in FG range with a most likely lead stretching FG that takes it to a 3 possession game with much less time on the clock. 

    Anything can happen with lots of time on the clock no matter how big the lead but when the time runs out game over and nothing bad can happen when you already have the lead with zero time left.

    As it turned out the Pats kicked off and the Texans ran it back to the NE 37 and quickly got the TD right back and still no time barely run off the clock.

    Sorry but the Pats would have indeed been better off running the ball just a lil bit more with the big lead starting earlier in the game.

    Sometimes you win as a coach because your team is just that much better or you made more good decisions than bad but that doesn't mean you made the best decisions in every situation.

    BB knows way more than me obviously but he also has not had the headset on many times when the Offense has the ball and didn't during this scenario but I would be willing to bet when he reevaluates the entire thing as it played out he'll have a few questions for McD.

    [/QUOTE]

    Sorry. 

    Don't agree at all. 

    You are talking about trying to sit on a 30 point score with ten minutes to go. 

    Well, no tricky bounces ... Texas ended up dropping 28 points on the defense. 

    Now crunch those numbers ... if one bad unlucky bounce happens, an onside kick works, Texas could have easily won it with NE sitting on that lead. 

    That throw, not the highest, but certainly not a 50/50 proposition was a mismatch that NE spotted and exploited. It put the game a-w-a-y. Over. 

    Maybe you missed it but BB plays aggressive and he always has. He literally said, just last week ... you don't win games by sitting in foxholes. 

    Moreover, his thinking was justified. Texas almost got the score they needed, and grinding 2 off the clock was about the only thing slowing the game down there guarantees. And grinding 2 off the clock does less to guarantee a win than a FG or TD. 

    It's basic win probability. 

    The next two drives, then they started running because it was over. 

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to RockScully's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to pcmIV's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to RockScully's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Since 2010, he has 12 TDs and 2 INTs.  I would expect his stats to not be as strong when he was a rookie or earlier in his postseason career.

    I go by patterns.  The last TWO, more recent postseasons are more relevant to the now than his 6 INTs he threw in the postseason early in his career, Bellino.

    WHat happened? BB just finished a masterful rebuild in 2010 and 2011, with the youngest D in the league that is BETTTER right now than this "terrific" and old Baltimore D that you're so enamored with.

     

     [/QUOTE]

    If you count his fumbles he has turned the ball over more than Brady since 2010 in the postseason despite playing in fewer games and having 2 games in the wildcard round which are the lower tier of playoff teams.

    [/QUOTE]

    That's fair.  I am not even arguing Balt's D being better than ours in 2010.  Or even last year.

    Keep in mind, I am talking THIS YEAR about our D and theirs.  Bellino is babbling about how good Balt's D is schematically right now acting as if Ray is physically a force, so I countered as to why there is proof, with two sources, as to why they're not.

    He's wrong.

    Anyway, it got off track because he thinks the Balt D is still the 2009 level D. It's not.

    That's the point. He's one who has completely under-appreciated this D here, while overrating Baltimore playing better the last 2 games on this win it for Ray wave they have.

    BB just put together a masterful rebuild on this D to the point many fanbases are going to be JEALOUS for years to come, including Baltimore, and he's praising Balt's old D and ignoring what's right under his nose here.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I didn't say Ray was "physically a force". In fact, I was quite clear saying it was likely the effect of intellectual leadership. The ILB is the QB of the defense. 

    I know you think just about any player that plays for the opponent is terrible .... unless it's Alex Smith or Joe Flacco in which case we should trade Brady for them or something ... but I hate Lewis and those thugs, but they are a great collection of talent.

    The fact that they all missed massive chunks of the year with injuries (all of them at one point or another but Ngata) doesn't take away from the fact that Baltimore's defense has been elite when all hands are on deck. 

    And no, NE's defense is obvisouly improved ... since they added Talib statistically they are much better than they were last season or through the first 8.

    But they still aren't as good as the Ravens when fully healthy. The Ravens have better DBs end to end, though not to the degree it was last season. And they have a better pass rushing outfit, though not to the degree, again, as it was last season. 

    I take NE as a team but based on defense (not character) I would take the Ravens defense. Sorry. 

    And they have far better safety play ... though not for much longer because I can't see Reed continuing to be this good too long. 

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from oklahomapatriot. Show oklahomapatriot's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    their defense has played against crap offenses. denver really only score 21 points on offense, indy had alot of execution problems.

    TB will be run the high efficiency offense like we've never seen it.

    actually they have some beef up front, but i see the patriots getting 40 points again

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to kansaspatriot's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    their defense has played against crap offenses. denver really only score 21 points on offense, indy had alot of execution problems.

    TB will be run the high efficiency offense like we've never seen it.

    actually they have some beef up front, but i see the patriots getting 40 points again

    [/QUOTE]

    I don't know. 

    The thing that makes them tick is Ngata. NE doesn't match up well inside against him. He is a freakish force of nature. 

    I would be surprised if NE dropped 40 on them, especially after dropping 30 on them earlier this season. What are the odds?

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from oklahomapatriot. Show oklahomapatriot's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to zbellino's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to kansaspatriot's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    their defense has played against crap offenses. denver really only score 21 points on offense, indy had alot of execution problems.

    TB will be run the high efficiency offense like we've never seen it.

    actually they have some beef up front, but i see the patriots getting 40 points again

    [/QUOTE]

    I don't know. 

    The thing that makes them tick is Ngata. NE doesn't match up well inside against him. He is a freakish force of nature. 

    I would be surprised if NE dropped 40 on them, especially after dropping 30 on them earlier this season. What are the odds?

    [/QUOTE]


    i think the ray lewis hype train runs out of gas, just like the peyton manning one did and the houston texans one did.

    only train left will be the patriots bullet train

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to zbellino's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Low-FB-IQ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to zbellino's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to RockScully's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    Do you ever, ever, ever admit to being wrong even when proven wrong?  "Serious question".

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I don't know? How do you feel about the 40 passes from Brady? That's the formula for a loss right?

    [/QUOTE]

    I would argue the Pats did a very good job of putting themselves in position to possibly give up that lead by continuing to throw low percentage throws in the 4th quarter with a huge lead.

    Frankly I am surprised more people have not complained about it today but then I have to remember that I am not sure anyone on here coaches and you watch a game very differently as a fan than as a coach.

    No one will convince me it was good game or clock managment by the Pats in the late 3rd Qtr and most of 4th Qtr. 

    People always want to rail about the defense giving up a lead late but I would argue that through the process of a game that just a single rush attempt on every given series, especially when already rushing the ball well AND having a sizable lead would easily wipe out 3 or 4 more minutes off the clock at a minimum.

    To be honest I was pissed that Brady threw that ball to Vereen down the left sideline for the TD. It worked. It's great in hindsite but that instantaneous TD was not needed in that situation after the turnover on downs with an already good lead of 30-13. It could just as easily have been intercepted as well given it's a low percentage throw and not Brady's strongest  attribute in his great skill set.

    What WAS needed was chewing up clock and giving your defense a rest after just leaving the field on the turnover on downs and keeping your kickoff coverage unit off the field as long as possible while having a rough night.

    There was 13 minutes on the clock still. That game took forever because the Pats never burned much clock and gave the Texans more time of posession. Football is a complimentary game and I personally don't think they did a good job with the sizable lead in that game.

    The Pats could have more sytematically tried to work their way down from the 33 to a TD while working clock, continuing to tire and bludgon the Texans D, rest their own D, Maintaining more time of posession, bring the clock ever closer to a time when Texans would need to consider to start using Time outs, prolonging the Texans an opportunity to get their successful KO receiving team on the field, etc, etc.

    Even if the drive failed they would have done most of those things I mentioned as well as still be in FG range with a most likely lead stretching FG that takes it to a 3 possession game with much less time on the clock. 

    Anything can happen with lots of time on the clock no matter how big the lead but when the time runs out game over and nothing bad can happen when you already have the lead with zero time left.

    As it turned out the Pats kicked off and the Texans ran it back to the NE 37 and quickly got the TD right back and still no time barely run off the clock.

    Sorry but the Pats would have indeed been better off running the ball just a lil bit more with the big lead starting earlier in the game.

    Sometimes you win as a coach because your team is just that much better or you made more good decisions than bad but that doesn't mean you made the best decisions in every situation.

    BB knows way more than me obviously but he also has not had the headset on many times when the Offense has the ball and didn't during this scenario but I would be willing to bet when he reevaluates the entire thing as it played out he'll have a few questions for McD.

    [/QUOTE]

    Sorry. 

    Don't agree at all. 

    You are talking about trying to sit on a 30 point score with ten minutes to go. 

    Well, no tricky bounces ... Texas ended up dropping 28 points on the defense. 

    Now crunch those numbers ... if one bad unlucky bounce happens, an onside kick works, Texas could have easily won it with NE sitting on that lead. 

    That throw, not the highest, but certainly not a 50/50 proposition was a mismatch that NE spotted and exploited. It put the game a-w-a-y. Over. 

    Maybe you missed it but BB plays aggressive and he always has. He literally said, just last week ... you don't win games by sitting in foxholes. 

    Moreover, his thinking was justified. Texas almost got the score they needed, and grinding 2 off the clock was about the only thing slowing the game down there guarantees. And grinding 2 off the clock does less to guarantee a win than a FG or TD. 

    It's basic win probability. 

    The next two drives, then they started running because it was over. 

    [/QUOTE]

    I knew you would go to the fox hole thing. Clearly you took from my post what you wanted and didn't read it since I never said anything about not going for a TD and just trying to sit on anything, least of all a lead.

    Also no one said to run exclusivley at any point in time or become ultra conservative. We'll agree to disagree since it was obviously lost on you or not written well by me. I am not a great writer, apologies.

    Never said to not take advantage of Brady, your best player. I said to do it in a way that was better game and clock management. Being agressive does not mean exclusively taking the path of quickest results or lower probability of success.

    I'll have to assume you are insinuating you need to do one or the other. Try and score with bombs and lower percentage throws down the field to consider it NOT sitting in a fox hole? ...or try and mix in some runs with higher percentage throws moving the chains on your way to trying to score a touch down, while purposely using a bunch of clock (sitting in the fox hole as you put it).

    I'll take the clock rolling away, my defense off the field, their defense taking more abuse, etc etc WHILE I am trying to score the TD. You're in control of the game, starting already in field goal range. It's a luxury to be able to work clock as you extend your lead from 2 possession to three, even if it ended in a FG and not TD. In that situation I will easily live with the result of 3 points instead of 7 if 4 minutes or more were also taken off the clock in the process. 

    The average person thinks game or clock management comes down to the final possession of two of a game. When it's predicatable. Let me assure you it doesn't. It especially doesn't when you have a comfortable lead. Coaches know better.

     

     
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  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Baltimore's New Defense.

    In response to Low-FB-IQ's comment:
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    In response to zbellino's comment:
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    In response to Low-FB-IQ's comment:
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    In response to zbellino's comment:
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    In response to RockScully's comment:
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    Do you ever, ever, ever admit to being wrong even when proven wrong?  "Serious question".

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I don't know? How do you feel about the 40 passes from Brady? That's the formula for a loss right?

    [/QUOTE]

    I would argue the Pats did a very good job of putting themselves in position to possibly give up that lead by continuing to throw low percentage throws in the 4th quarter with a huge lead.

    Frankly I am surprised more people have not complained about it today but then I have to remember that I am not sure anyone on here coaches and you watch a game very differently as a fan than as a coach.

    No one will convince me it was good game or clock managment by the Pats in the late 3rd Qtr and most of 4th Qtr. 

    People always want to rail about the defense giving up a lead late but I would argue that through the process of a game that just a single rush attempt on every given series, especially when already rushing the ball well AND having a sizable lead would easily wipe out 3 or 4 more minutes off the clock at a minimum.

    To be honest I was pissed that Brady threw that ball to Vereen down the left sideline for the TD. It worked. It's great in hindsite but that instantaneous TD was not needed in that situation after the turnover on downs with an already good lead of 30-13. It could just as easily have been intercepted as well given it's a low percentage throw and not Brady's strongest  attribute in his great skill set.

    What WAS needed was chewing up clock and giving your defense a rest after just leaving the field on the turnover on downs and keeping your kickoff coverage unit off the field as long as possible while having a rough night.

    There was 13 minutes on the clock still. That game took forever because the Pats never burned much clock and gave the Texans more time of posession. Football is a complimentary game and I personally don't think they did a good job with the sizable lead in that game.

    The Pats could have more sytematically tried to work their way down from the 33 to a TD while working clock, continuing to tire and bludgon the Texans D, rest their own D, Maintaining more time of posession, bring the clock ever closer to a time when Texans would need to consider to start using Time outs, prolonging the Texans an opportunity to get their successful KO receiving team on the field, etc, etc.

    Even if the drive failed they would have done most of those things I mentioned as well as still be in FG range with a most likely lead stretching FG that takes it to a 3 possession game with much less time on the clock. 

    Anything can happen with lots of time on the clock no matter how big the lead but when the time runs out game over and nothing bad can happen when you already have the lead with zero time left.

    As it turned out the Pats kicked off and the Texans ran it back to the NE 37 and quickly got the TD right back and still no time barely run off the clock.

    Sorry but the Pats would have indeed been better off running the ball just a lil bit more with the big lead starting earlier in the game.

    Sometimes you win as a coach because your team is just that much better or you made more good decisions than bad but that doesn't mean you made the best decisions in every situation.

    BB knows way more than me obviously but he also has not had the headset on many times when the Offense has the ball and didn't during this scenario but I would be willing to bet when he reevaluates the entire thing as it played out he'll have a few questions for McD.

    [/QUOTE]

    Sorry. 

    Don't agree at all. 

    You are talking about trying to sit on a 30 point score with ten minutes to go. 

    Well, no tricky bounces ... Texas ended up dropping 28 points on the defense. 

    Now crunch those numbers ... if one bad unlucky bounce happens, an onside kick works, Texas could have easily won it with NE sitting on that lead. 

    That throw, not the highest, but certainly not a 50/50 proposition was a mismatch that NE spotted and exploited. It put the game a-w-a-y. Over. 

    Maybe you missed it but BB plays aggressive and he always has. He literally said, just last week ... you don't win games by sitting in foxholes. 

    Moreover, his thinking was justified. Texas almost got the score they needed, and grinding 2 off the clock was about the only thing slowing the game down there guarantees. And grinding 2 off the clock does less to guarantee a win than a FG or TD. 

    It's basic win probability. 

    The next two drives, then they started running because it was over. 

    [/QUOTE]

    I knew you would go to the fox hole thing. Clearly you took from my post what you wanted and didn't read it since I never said anything about not going for a TD and just trying to sit on anything, least of all a lead.

    Also no one said to run exclusivley at any point in time or become ultra conservative. We'll agree to disagree since it was obviously lost on you or not written well by me. I am not a great writer, apologies.

    Never said to not take advantage of Brady, your best player. I said to do it in a way that was better game and clock management. Being agressive does not mean exclusively taking the path of quickest results or lower probability of success.

    I'll have to assume you are insinuating you need to do one or the other. Try and score with bombs and lower percentage throws down the field to consider it NOT sitting in a fox hole? ...or try and mix in some runs with higher percentage throws moving the chains on your way to trying to score a touch down, while purposely using a bunch of clock (sitting in the fox hole as you put it).

    I'll take the clock rolling away, my defense off the field, their defense taking more abuse, etc etc WHILE I am trying to score the TD. You're in control of the game, starting already in field goal range. It's a luxury to be able to work clock as you extend your lead from 2 possession to three, even if it ended in a FG and not TD. In that situation I will easily live with the result of 3 points instead of 7 if 4 minutes or more were also taken off the clock in the process. 

    The average person thinks game or clock management comes down to the final possession of two of a game. When it's predicatable. Let me assure you it doesn't. It especially doesn't when you have a comfortable lead. Coaches know better.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I think there is a cross up here. I did think you were talking about going 3 yards cloud of dust. 

    1.) It's not a low percentage play, it's a go route to the pylon against Cover-1. Vereen is matched against Barrett Ruud, which was a mismatch. While it's not the highest percentage to make the catch, it's low percentage to be intercepted. If this is cover-2, he probably isn't throwing the pass because there would be a safety there, but then if it is cover 2 there is liekly one less guy on the other side, so you'd have wiggle room there. 

    2.) It's not a designed play, there is a route tree. That route comes from presnap reads by both players. The concept that most people don't know is that routes are flexible. They change based on what the defense is showing. They didn't come out thinking they are going to wing it deep. On a play like that, and I'm sure you know this, the RB split wide is probably your 3rd or fourth read. Brady saw the safety cheating inside, saw the matchup and took it. Every other route on the play was short, on the other side of the field.

    This is akin to the half ending TD by Branch a couple years back, when the play is obviously meant to be a safety type play, but he and Brady see the "go" there, and they hook up for a quick seven before the half.  

    It's a saavy heads up play by Brady to spot it, and make that throw. It's a heads up play by Vereeen to spot the safety cheating the other way and make his route into a 'go.' 

    If the play fails, they chip away. But when you see Vereen, then with steps on Barrett Ruud, you take your chance to ice the game with another score. You don't sit on the matchup and wait just in case you can string together another 9-12 plays and chew clock and score.

    It's not like they are out there calling for designed fly patterns to 

    I take that every single time.  

    Second, I have coached. Clock managment is a game long thing. People also don't know that BB probably tries to extend games as long as he can. It's a myth that you want every game to end as quickly as possible. If you have an offensive advantage you want to press that advantage as much as you can. 

    That means giving your offense as many times to score as possible to increase likelihood that your talent advantage pans out. Think about it like a billiards matchup. If you are a clearly superior shooter, you actually want the best out of 3 or 5 ... not one shot for the title. You also want to play 8 ball or straight pool as opposed to 9 ball. 

    You want the largest sample because it reduces the impact of anomaly. 

    This obviously isn't something they are doing in this situation, but it's a key component to calling/managing a game. 

    In this particular situtation ... you just take the extremely fortuitous matchup because it could mean points. You don't look off Vereen v Ruud naked on the sideline in the hopes that a string of plays later on might work out. 

    I'm not against ball control running or passing. In fact, I think the way Ridley has been so effective late in games has been a sea change compared to how relatively ineffective BJGE was in those spots (3.4 yard average here in the 4th). 

    But I don't think you look away obvious mismatches that can result in scores. Points are always better than time off the clock. 

    Sorry. But if you think you do you are entitled to think that, but that is a fundamental disagreement. 

     
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