BB: Sacks Are Overrated

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  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    Yes, of course you and bb are right. Sacks don't tell the whole story. With that said, I would settle for more pressure. I think that would be a start.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Footballexpert45. Show Footballexpert45's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    Yeah, Sacks, pressure, and good tackling mean nothing in football.  With that kind of logic the Pats D should be right at the bottom again next season.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from crazy-world-of-troybrown. Show crazy-world-of-troybrown's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    There are Defensive Ends who can take a Tackle back into the QB. They can be just as effective with that, as a man who makes spectacular sacks once or twice a game.

    Bill Walsh

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from 42AND46. Show 42AND46's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to DeadAhead2's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I've always said this as well and agree.  Simpleton fans scour for sack totals, but ignore actually watching the games themselves and the player.

     

    9. Belichick has said that he views the sack statistic as overrated, in part because the player who gets the sack often didn’t produce the initial pressure. That’s why Belichick puts more stock in the “pressure” stat, and rookie defensive tackle Chris Jones was extremely impressive in that category in 2013. Because of a run of injuries at the position, Jones was pressed into early-down duties as well, and my view was that the 6-foot-1, 309-pounder wore down at times later in the season. Looking ahead, I could envision Jones in a Jarvis Green-type sub-rushing/fill-in starter role and being even more effective. 

     

    http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4759562/quick-hit-thoughts-around-nfl-patriots-18

     

    [/QUOTE]


    the real question is can you get a sack when you need one? In the Pats case No

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    I bet the Seahawks wish they had defensive linemen as good as Chris Jones.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from crazy-world-of-troybrown. Show crazy-world-of-troybrown's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    You come here to keep saying the Pats are no good.  Whats the purpose? Most Pats fans know our shortcomings.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I bet the Seahawks wish they had defensive linemen as good as Chris Jones.

    [/QUOTE]

    Lol. 

    for a championship caliber team, cjones, vellano, soap, siliga are all backups If, if they could even make the team. 

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to PatsLifer's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I bet the Seahawks wish they had defensive linemen as good as Chris Jones.

    [/QUOTE]

    Lol. 

    for a championship caliber team, cjones, vellano, soap, siliga are all backups If, if they could even make the team. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Assume Vince and Kelly do return. Assume the pats do draft a DT. Thats 3 roster locks. How many do they keep? 4? 5? 

    I assume Siliga is back. That's 4. Does Jones or Vellano even make the team next year? 

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from JimfromFlorida. Show JimfromFlorida's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    Funny how some that have posted just do not understand what BB actually said.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from joepatsfan111111. Show joepatsfan111111's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    I dont care about sacks.

    I care about pressure. 

    are you making the QB uncomfortable and making him throw before he wants? thats important and we havent done that consistently

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to DeadAhead2's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I've always said this as well and agree. 

    [/QUOTE]


    Imagine that!  LMAO!!  This is just plain sad.  We don't need to make fun of you, you do a great job of doing that yourself!!

    Have you washed those BB briefs yet or are they still "Fresh?"

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from stinkman. Show stinkman's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to joepatsfan111111's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I dont care about sacks.

    I care about pressure. 

    are you making the QB uncomfortable and making him throw before he wants? thats important and we havent done that consistently

    [/QUOTE]

    Chandler Jones is the only threat. Yes of course anybody could have a big day of course. With blown line coverages but beating somebody one on one he's the only one.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to JimfromFlorida's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Funny how some that have posted just do not understand what BB actually said.

    [/QUOTE]


    You are right about that Jim.  Looks like Rusty is taking something said and twisting it to fit his agenda.

    Sacks do matter, who is credited for the sack might be over rated, but sacks do matter.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from portfolio1. Show portfolio1's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to 42AND46's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to DeadAhead2's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I've always said this as well and agree.  Simpleton fans scour for sack totals, but ignore actually watching the games themselves and the player.

     

    9. Belichick has said that he views the sack statistic as overrated, in part because the player who gets the sack often didn’t produce the initial pressure. That’s why Belichick puts more stock in the “pressure” stat, and rookie defensive tackle Chris Jones was extremely impressive in that category in 2013. Because of a run of injuries at the position, Jones was pressed into early-down duties as well, and my view was that the 6-foot-1, 309-pounder wore down at times later in the season. Looking ahead, I could envision Jones in a Jarvis Green-type sub-rushing/fill-in starter role and being even more effective. 

     

    http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4759562/quick-hit-thoughts-around-nfl-patriots-18

     

    [/QUOTE]


    the real question is can you get a sack when you need one? In the Pats case No

    [/QUOTE]


    I think the "real" question is whether you can pressure the QB to get rid of the ball before he wants to when you need to force a play. In the Pats case, no.

     

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from JimfromFlorida. Show JimfromFlorida's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to TFB12's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to JimfromFlorida's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Funny how some that have posted just do not understand what BB actually said.

    [/QUOTE]


    You are right about that Jim.  Looks like Rusty is taking something said and twisting it to fit his agenda.

    Sacks do matter, who is credited for the sack might be over rated, but sacks do matter.

    [/QUOTE]


    Yes they matter but how many times do we see a QB rushed from the left only to run into the RDE coming in. Or how Wilfolk can push two guys up the middle while the guy on his left or right gets a free rush to the QB. Bill is just saying a guy that creates havoc is just as important (and maybe more) as the guy that gets the sack. Without the presure you will have no sack.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I bet the Seahawks wish they had defensive linemen as good as Chris Jones.

    [/QUOTE]

    We had more sacks then seattle...without the most dominant NT in the league and a very good DT in Kelly and a top 5 MLB playing behind them.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to JimfromFlorida's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TFB12's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to JimfromFlorida's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Funny how some that have posted just do not understand what BB actually said.

    [/QUOTE]


    You are right about that Jim.  Looks like Rusty is taking something said and twisting it to fit his agenda.

    Sacks do matter, who is credited for the sack might be over rated, but sacks do matter.

    [/QUOTE]


    Yes they matter but how many times do we see a QB rushed from the left only to run into the RDE coming in. Or how Wilfolk can push two guys up the middle while the guy on his left or right gets a free rush to the QB. Bill is just saying a guy that creates havoc is just as important (and maybe more) as the guy that gets the sack. Without the presure you will have no sack.

    [/QUOTE]

    ^ this

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from 42AND46. Show 42AND46's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to portfolio1's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to 42AND46's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to DeadAhead2's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I've always said this as well and agree.  Simpleton fans scour for sack totals, but ignore actually watching the games themselves and the player.

     

    9. Belichick has said that he views the sack statistic as overrated, in part because the player who gets the sack often didn’t produce the initial pressure. That’s why Belichick puts more stock in the “pressure” stat, and rookie defensive tackle Chris Jones was extremely impressive in that category in 2013. Because of a run of injuries at the position, Jones was pressed into early-down duties as well, and my view was that the 6-foot-1, 309-pounder wore down at times later in the season. Looking ahead, I could envision Jones in a Jarvis Green-type sub-rushing/fill-in starter role and being even more effective. 

     

    http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4759562/quick-hit-thoughts-around-nfl-patriots-18

     

    [/QUOTE]


    the real question is can you get a sack when you need one? In the Pats case No

    [/QUOTE]


    I think the "real" question is whether you can pressure the QB to get rid of the ball before he wants to when you need to force a play. In the Pats case, no.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    my point is there are times you need a sack not just pressure...can u get the QB in those spots? Pressure consistently is the key of course but there are times its its not enough...can ur personnel get there then

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    I love how Rusty rags on ESPN but then post a article from there when it supports his agenda.  FRAUD!

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I bet the Seahawks wish they had defensive linemen as good as Chris Jones.

    [/QUOTE]

    We had more sacks then seattle...without the most dominant NT in the league and a very good DT in Kelly and a top 5 MLB playing behind them.

    [/QUOTE]

    Yes, and yet Seattle's line rattled Manning while ours got absolutely no pressure on him.

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to joepatsfan111111's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I dont care about sacks.

    I care about pressure. 

    are you making the QB uncomfortable and making him throw before he wants? thats important and we havent done that consistently

    [/QUOTE]

    +1 it's all about pressure and our DT's stunk at it this year. To get an idea Vellano and Jones both averaged ~5% pressure per down. Vellano was actually better at it than Jones but 5% is horrible unless your job is to be a anchor and control 2 gaps (ala what Vince does). To put it in perspective Vince holding two gaps and not meant as a 1 gap pressure DT/NT still generated pressure on 4.83% of snaps over his career and Kelly in 4 games last year averaged 10.5% pressure/snap which again isn't great but is about average for starting DTs. So in comparison both Vellano and Jones generated next to no pressure and of Jones pressure, it was greatly assisted by the 6 sacks of which 4 were coverage sacks. We need a real DT who can generate pressure up the middle and need it badly. Funny thing is if they keep Vince, Kelly, Armstead, and draft a kid or pick one up in FA (I'm thinking they might bring a guy in and draft one) it might end up coming down to a single spot for Jones, Vellano, and Siliga to fight for.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    What Belichick is trying to say is that the guy getting the sack may be overrated, when in actuality it is the other guy who is providing the pressure. I agree with this. A good example is Nink, half of his sacks come from someone else applying the pressure while he cleans up. If the other guy is not providing pressure (Jones) then Nink won't get within shouting distance of that quarterback (see AFC Championship game). I think a big part of what is wrong with our defense is we don't have enough guys who can pressure - I see Chandler Jones doing it, but little else. I can see Jaime Collins being a pressure player, but that's on the outside and it's pretty obvious he's valuable in coverage...Chris Jones looks like he gets a little bit of pressure on the inside from hustle, playing low and his quickness, but we need much more than that.

    I'd love to see this team get someone dominant opposite Jones and then have Nink rotate in. I'm glad nink put together two seasons of back to back 8 sacks, but when you talk about sacks being overrated, this guy is textbook.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to mthurl's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    What Belichick is trying to say is that the guy getting the sack may be overrated, when in actuality it is the other guy who is providing the pressure. I agree with this. A good example is Nink, half of his sacks come from someone else applying the pressure while he cleans up. If the other guy is not providing pressure (Jones) then Nink won't get within shouting distance of that quarterback (see AFC Championship game). I think a big part of what is wrong with our defense is we don't have enough guys who can pressure - I see Chandler Jones doing it, but little else. I can see Jaime Collins being a pressure player, but that's on the outside and it's pretty obvious he's valuable in coverage...Chris Jones looks like he gets a little bit of pressure on the inside from hustle, playing low and his quickness, but we need much more than that.

    I'd love to see this team get someone dominant opposite Jones and then have Nink rotate in. I'm glad nink put together two seasons of back to back 8 sacks, but when you talk about sacks being overrated, this guy is textbook.

    [/QUOTE]

    Sound theory...except that Nink lead us in QB pressures. 

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: BB: Sacks Are Overrated

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I bet the Seahawks wish they had defensive linemen as good as Chris Jones.

    [/QUOTE]

    We had more sacks then seattle...without the most dominant NT in the league and a very good DT in Kelly and a top 5 MLB playing behind them.

    [/QUOTE]

    Yes, and yet Seattle's line rattled Manning while ours got absolutely no pressure on him.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    But you do realize you made a sarcastic comment about seattle wishing they had a player like Jones when we actually got to the QB more then they did after we lost the most dominant NT and his very solid back up for most of the season? 

     

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