Being very honest about this season

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from bubthegrub2. Show bubthegrub2's posts

    Re: Being very honest about this season

    I see little value in trying to project the defense from a couple preseason games. One thing that gets me are the people who believe (after every preseason) that they are going to a 4-3. BB doesn't like to show much of anything on defense in the preseason. Basically he is testing how the newer guys react to certain situations. Once the games start counting we'll see how well the defense actually looks. sure, there will be some growing pains, there are a lot of new faces. But the offense is good enough to overcome some of the weaknesses that will show up on D. And it always helps when they take a good lead and make the opposing offense one dimensional. Barring the misfortune of multiple season ending injuries (like last season), I'd say the defense should once again be in the top ten. I just do not put too much stock in what we see in August.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from FourthRing. Show FourthRing's posts

    Re: Being very honest about this season

    MVPKilla, do you find anything disconcerting about your mantra?  Our defense killed the hopes of 2007's MVP, TB.  Just like the 16-0 banner, it should be taken down.  It's bad karma.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from mjxg. Show mjxg's posts

    Re: Being very honest about this season

    Lots of talk here. Nice to see a threat with solid info.

    To clarify what "we score more points than the other team" is...

    instead of going in with a gameplan of the defense not allowing any points and the offense scoring on every drive, you go in with the understanding that the other team is going to rack up points on your defense, and your offense needs to keep up and hope that the defense just happens to stop the other team enough for you to outscore them, or that the other team's offense puts themselves out of the game by being horrible.

    it's quite different from going in knowing your defense is good enough to stop the other team's offense and not putting the burden on your offense to score every time they have the ball (as much as everyone practices and prepares for games so that that's the case).

    I do think the defense will eventually step it up in the regular season as everyone has noted. As it's been said, the Patriots pretty much play a vanilla D and vanilla O during the preseason. I definitely expect the trickery to show up on the 14th.

    Keep in mind, though, that the 2007 D was good because we exploded the score and normally had such a huge lead that the D could blitz and do crazy things more since there was less risk involved if it didn't work. It's a wonderful luxury to have, and I truly hope that that situation arises this year.

    My guess is that we go 12-4, but the only way that's going to happen is if the team gels *very* quickly in the first couple games.
     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Jimmy42Jack0. Show Jimmy42Jack0's posts

    Re: Being very honest about this season

    With all due respect, the offense is run and gun and the defense is a hot knife through butter...the pats have emulated the 70's dolphins with their 3 titles and the 80's dolphins with impressive stats and not so impressive results...dont look for that to change...as a dolphins fan...ding do.ng, the witch is dead...she dropped her camera recorder in a puddle
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonnyCorlione. Show SonnyCorlione's posts

    Re: Being very honest about this season

    In Response to Re: Being very honest about this season:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Being very honest about this season : Great point about the running game, We will be consistent and fresh in the run all year. I disagree about the d-line. What does too many DT's really mean? Is that even possible? Just because guys like Seymour and Warren can play DT and play it well does not mean they are not great DE's. With Seymour(top 5 DE's in the game) Warren(top 10-12 DE's) and a pass rushing specialist like Jarvis Green, as well as multiple olb's playing DE(Thomas,Burgess,Woods can rush passer from end,TBC and Crable if he ever plays) I don't understand the point. The reason we could not get sacks last year has little to do with the D-Line and lots to do with the fact that Harrison, was out and our corners needed too much help. You cannot blitz if corners get burned. Plus with AT,Woods,Crable out and Vrabel declining we had little presence.(2008) This defense is upgraded in every way(except maybe playoff experience) from last year. We will be a top 10 D again!
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE]

    Because a DE in a 3-4 is essentially a 3 technique DT, Seymour and Warren are true Tackles lined up at the end but they're not really Ends.  As a result, our best players for the line are all Tackles.  That's why Reiss lists TBC and Burgess as hybrid ends because they're really OLB but it appears but are best suited to put their hand on the ground.  Even Thomas is playing the Sam. 

    They've got a lot of formations they can line up in defensively but have not seemed to line up with ideal personnel groups because they just don't have it available.  Bottom line: the team was built for a 3-4, they're better off in a 4-3, but they don't have the right depth to really be great at either one and we're in a bit of a jam as a result.  It wouldn't suprise me to see one of our much coveted D Linemen traded in favor of a pass rusher if that's what it comes to.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from RomanoCheese. Show RomanoCheese's posts

    Re: Being very honest about this season

    http://westraightpostin.blogspot.com/
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Being very honest about this season

    In Response to Re: Being very honest about this season:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Being very honest about this season : Because a DE in a 3-4 is essentially a 3 technique DT, Seymour and Warren are true Tackles lined up at the end but they're not really Ends.  As a result, our best players for the line are all Tackles.  That's why Reiss lists TBC and Burgess as hybrid ends because they're really OLB but it appears but are best suited to put their hand on the ground.  Even Thomas is playing the Sam.  They've got a lot of formations they can line up in defensively but have not seemed to line up with ideal personnel groups because they just don't have it available.  Bottom line: the team was built for a 3-4, they're better off in a 4-3, but they don't have the right depth to really be great at either one and we're in a bit of a jam as a result.  It wouldn't suprise me to see one of our much coveted D Linemen traded in favor of a pass rusher if that's what it comes to.
    Posted by SonnyCorlione[/QUOTE]

    I understand what your saying sonny, but I respectfully disagree with you or Reiss if you are just echoing his statements. If Seymour did not have the job (as does Wilfork) of eating up double teams he would have 10 sacks a year as a "d-lineman" call him a true tackle or end it doesn't matter because he is suited for both. I agree that Warren maybe is better suited to play inside with Vince, Brace, and Mike Wright but that is the point of having the packages that we play. If we want to rush the passer Seymour Fork are inside and Green/Thomas/Woods/and now Burgess are there for the "Willie Mac" position of defensive end. They are all hybrid ends which is a good thing because thats what BB has based his 3-4 defense on for the last 20 years. Players with the ability to have a hand on the ground or drop back in coverage or play in the run.

    They have not lined up in these formations not because they are not available but due to the fact that it is preseason and BB will never give away his formations like that in a meaningless game.

    My point here is that we have the personel.(IMO) We have the scheme and I can't wait until we use it on September 14th when Trent Edwards feels the rush of our new improved and healthy front 7!
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from socalpatsfan12. Show socalpatsfan12's posts

    Re: Being very honest about this season

    thanks for starting this discussion.  I am also a lifelong pats fan, but watching Jason Campbell carve up our defense worried me.  I know you cannot put to much stock into preseason, but i don't see any pass rush except when blitzing, and the secondary seems marginal at best.  They will give up big plays, and the front line seemed slow when trying to catch Mccoy in the Eagles game.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Olsonic. Show Olsonic's posts

    Re: Being very honest about this season


    19-0


    :)
     
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  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from JordanFromMontreal. Show JordanFromMontreal's posts

    Re: Being very honest about this season

    There are a few problems with the D. When we won our championships we won them built on Defence. Now we are built the opposite. Not only did we loose the leadership in alot of players like Bruschi, Harrison, Vrabel, and put in hobbs in there if you like. But we lost its idenity. We need Playmakers, we need guys to make that key interception, Key sack or BIG third down stop. Its going to be fun to watch the torch has been passed on defence, Its time for the players to step up and show to eachohter, that they can carry on this winning tradition.

    We know the DL linemen are solid. we know we have a rock in the middle in mayo. But it comes down to team play. having pressure on the qb, good coverage, run stopping, unslefish play, fundamental football, postioning and tackling. I more then anyone want to see out defence thrive become a force on third down, not give up the big play, and FORCE TURNOVERS. No body knows for sure what will happen so all the arguing and bashing is obviously pointless, lets just hope for a healthy season for all our players, and watch as it unfolds!!!
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonnyCorlione. Show SonnyCorlione's posts

    Re: Being very honest about this season

    In Response to Re: Being very honest about this season:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Being very honest about this season : I understand what your saying sonny, but I respectfully disagree with you or Reiss if you are just echoing his statements. If Seymour did not have the job (as does Wilfork) of eating up double teams he would have 10 sacks a year as a "d-lineman" call him a true tackle or end it doesn't matter because he is suited for both. I agree that Warren maybe is better suited to play inside with Vince, Brace, and Mike Wright but that is the point of having the packages that we play. If we want to rush the passer Seymour Fork are inside and Green/Thomas/Woods/and now Burgess are there for the "Willie Mac" position of defensive end. They are all hybrid ends which is a good thing because thats what BB has based his 3-4 defense on for the last 20 years. Players with the ability to have a hand on the ground or drop back in coverage or play in the run. They have not lined up in these formations not because they are not available but due to the fact that it is preseason and BB will never give away his formations like that in a meaningless game. My point here is that we have the personel.(IMO) We have the scheme and I can't wait until we use it on September 14th when Trent Edwards feels the rush of our new improved and healthy front 7!
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE]

    OK, fair enough.  Belichick may just be tinkering with the D without revealing anything and I also think the talent is there to do whatever.  That's what is so valuable about a 3-4 base scheme; you have flexibility.

    On Seymour, I would just be much more comfortable see him in the 3 technique and not at the End (for a variety of reasons) but I realize this is preseason and you just can't judge based on that.  The good thing is nobody knows what they're going to see Week 1 so this team will be very difficult to scout for the first few weeks of the season and, by the time teams have a better grasp, the unit will be working better together as they adapt to the new formation.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Being very honest about this season

    In Response to Re: Being very honest about this season:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Being very honest about this season : OK, fair enough.  Belichick may just be tinkering with the D without revealing anything and I also think the talent is there to do whatever.  That's what is so valuable about a 3-4 base scheme; you have flexibility. On Seymour, I would just be much more comfortable see him in the 3 technique and not at the End (for a variety of reasons) but I realize this is preseason and you just can't judge based on that.  The good thing is nobody knows what they're going to see Week 1 so this team will be very difficult to scout for the first few weeks of the season and, by the time teams have a better grasp, the unit will be working better together as they adapt to the new formation.
    Posted by SonnyCorlione[/QUOTE]

    Agreed! That is why we will always use a 3-4 and 4-3 mixed in. Just as you said, Keep teams guessing.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from hammonkey. Show hammonkey's posts

    Re: Being very honest about this season

    its pre-season.  Get a grip.  How many people said the colts were done when they couldn't stop the run during the mid season push on their SB winning season.  How many of us thought Cassel should have been cut during the pre-season last year.  Please... can't win?  Have some faith.  Root for your team.  I bet you also thought nobody could beat the Cavs in the NBA finals last season. 
     
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