Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from theshinez. Show theshinez's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola


    ....Letting BB make the final decisions during the draft?

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from jimmytantric. Show jimmytantric's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to jimmytantric's comment:
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    In response to CHAMPSXLVIII's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Picking up Leon Washington and letting Danny Woodhead go

    [/QUOTE]


    I can understand letting Woodhead go due to Vareen-but if the Wes Welker thing was due to an Ego thing between him and BB then it makes it yough to swallow and explain a million or so a year difference between DA and WES-esp. if WW goes on to win a SB with the Broncos?

    [/QUOTE]

    You think Denver and that awful D is a SB D?  What about Gomer 3-9 outdoors in the postseason?  The SB is in NJ.  A blizzard is predicted. Looks like Welkie's agent didn't put Wes in the best position to win a SB. He just took the biggest offer.

    Irony is, Welker in Denver makes their D so much worse.  Never improved the D. 

    [/QUOTE]


    I said "IF" they win a SB - when the playoffs come and the weather turns along with much stiffer competion the TDS will become a lot harder for the Broncos--ask the Pats during their record setting offensive years-I don't think Denver wins it all -the bookies have them favored though?

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from jimmytantric. Show jimmytantric's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to 49Patriots' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to jimmytantric's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to CHAMPSXLVIII's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Picking up Leon Washington and letting Danny Woodhead go

    [/QUOTE]


    I can understand letting Woodhead go due to Vareen-but if the Wes Welker thing was due to an Ego thing between him and BB then it makes it yough to swallow and explain a million or so a year difference between DA and WES-esp. if WW goes on to win a SB with the Broncos?

    [/QUOTE]


    Yeah, it was BB's ego, not Welker and his agent trying to hose the Pats. -_-

    [/QUOTE]


    Not sure who's ego was bruised I wasn't in on the particulars -but someone's ego was pissed off

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    Not too bothered with them moving on from Woodhead. Woodhead is a decent player, but I think there was room to improve at the passing back position, and I think Vereen has the potential to be far more productive in that position, both as a runner and a receiver. 

    I think letting Welker go was a little less justifiable, particularly given the lack of experienced alternatives.  While Amendola is potentially a bit more versatile, I'm not convinced he'd be as productive as Welker even if healthy--and his injury history is not reassuring.  I like Edelman, but I think he's inconsistent.  People complain about Welker's drops, but they were pretty rare.  Edelman seems streaky to me--making some good receptions, then getting the drops for a stretch.  He doesn't seem to separate as well as Welker either.  

    I have absolutely no problem with them letting Lloyd go. I never really liked the Lloyd pick up last year and thought he was a one-dimensional player whose fairly high catch total last year was more a function of his being the only X option rather than anything to do with his own skills. 

    I would have liked to have seen Fells stick . . . but he was expensive and I understand why they may have decided to take the flyer on Sudfeld (who I never liked all that much, even in camp when people were raving about him).

    My biggest gripe with BB's management of the offensive "skill" positions is really the lack of attention to the WR spot in 2010 through 2012.  Not addressing that position a few years ago (after Moss left) left us in a position where we had to completely rebuild this year.  I understand the challenges.  There were lots of other positions to address, there's a cap, there are limited draft picks, etc.  And I also know the situation would have been less dire had Gronk and Hernandez both remained available so we could rely more on TEs rather than WRs for pass receptions. But still, it would have been nice a year or two ago to get at least one longer term option (and not just stop gaps like Branch) at the receiver position so there was better continuity between past years and this year.  That said, I'm pretty happy with the way the rookies are coming along.  It's not perfect yet, but Thompkins and Dobson are showing signs of improvement just about every week and by season end, Belichick may have proven his brilliance in putting an effective team together again.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from anonymis. Show anonymis's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    Happy for Woody that he's being utilized elsewhere. He had a great start w/ the Patriots, but I don't think his last year with us was very good. I give him credit for a couple of clutch plays during his last season, but I thought others were running better on a more consistent basis.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from threejak. Show threejak's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to digger0862's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Being 5-1 I would think we would be talking about the biggest personnel success. To each his own.

    [/QUOTE]

    Ya, let's fire 'em....Terrible!  Just terrible....

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49Patriots. Show 49Patriots's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    You guys are being hindsight bias,  easy to attack BB now with Vareen out, but Vareen is a much better prospect. Vareen can run, catch in the flat, and is a match up nightmare for LBs as is Woodhead. But Vareen is faster, quicker, can line up and run up the middle consistently, can play slot and X WR....a most importantly, Vareen is good at picking up the blitz. Woodhead is just awful there.

    Why would Woodhead want to stay a back up when he can start? It was a good decision by BB.

    Also, who cares what Welker is doing? He isnt thinking about New England, why are you guys still thinking about him?

     

     

     

     

     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from msteven. Show msteven's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    The team is 5-1!!!  Every team has misses in free agent and the draft.  This team has had success over the last couple of years in the draft.  Dobson will get better.  Jones and Hightower are staples on the defense.  Vellano and Jones are filling in nicely at the tackle position.  The were both undrafted!  The patriots have 16 undrafted players on their team.  That is a result of good scouting. Woodhead was ok when he was here but Vereen is just as capable.  no one can predict injuries.  Keeping Talib last winter is paying off.  Harmon is coming along nicely at safety.  The offense is starting to turn the corner.  WW wanted out and got what he wanted. 

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from rtuinila. Show rtuinila's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to digger0862's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Being 5-1 I would think we would be talking about the biggest personnel success. To each his own.

    [/QUOTE]


    +2000

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Vereen 589K in 2013

    Woodhead 750K plus incentives in 2013 - 1.75 million in 2014

    Kind of a no brainer, not to mention SD isn't making the playoffs in that division.

    [/QUOTE]

    Agree, and do agree that Vereen > woodhead. However, Washington shouldn't have been signed. Remember they released him and resigned him fully guaranteeing his salary? I would instead have worked Boyce as my KR all summer and rolled with him over Washington as KR. Washington has little value as an rb unless everyone goes down. Pats could have worked Boyce in this way too. use him to run sweeps, stuff outside and catch passes out of the backfield. 

    I don't have any issues with letting woodhead go, my only issue is signing Washington after they had a full summer to work in Boyce as a KR and possible rb/WR. 

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from rtuinila. Show rtuinila's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to PatsLifer's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Vereen 589K in 2013

    Woodhead 750K plus incentives in 2013 - 1.75 million in 2014

    Kind of a no brainer, not to mention SD isn't making the playoffs in that division.

    [/QUOTE]

    Agree, and do agree that Vereen > woodhead. However, Washington shouldn't have been signed. Remember they released him and resigned him fully guaranteeing his salary? I would instead have worked Boyce as my KR all summer and rolled with him over Washington as KR. Washington has little value as an rb unless everyone goes down. Pats could have worked Boyce in this way too. use him to run sweeps, stuff outside and catch passes out of the backfield. 

    I don't have any issues with letting woodhead go, my only issue is signing Washington after they had a full summer to work in Boyce as a KR and possible rb/WR. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Sorry to throw sand in your works but Boyce was injured all summer long and couldn't "work in" as a kick returner. We would have been better off trading for Devin Hester!

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to 49Patriots' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Why keep two 3rd down backs? One would be wasted, BB made the decision to go with Vareen. If Vareen was healthy, Vareen would be having a better season.

    [/QUOTE]

    You answered your own question. When has Vereen been healthy with the Pats?

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    Yeah, I know Boyce was injured but there was time to work him in. how much time do we need to get a player into KR shape? Boyce has the talent and speed to do this. Even now, why the heck is Blount back there? He offers nothing by way of returning kicks. Surely Boyce is the better option?

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to 49Patriots' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    You guys are being hindsight bias,  easy to attack BB now with Vareen out, but Vareen is a much better prospect. Vareen can run, catch in the flat, and is a match up nightmare for LBs as is Woodhead. But Vareen is faster, quicker, can line up and run up the middle consistently, can play slot and X WR....a most importantly, Vareen is good at picking up the blitz. Woodhead is just awful there.

    Why would Woodhead want to stay a back up when he can start? It was a good decision by BB.

    Also, who cares what Welker is doing? He isnt thinking about New England, why are you guys still thinking about him?

     

    [/QUOTE]

    49' am I allowed to comment. Before the season I said both Vereen and Amendola were injury prone and I wanted Woodhead as Vereens main backup because I was really concerned about Vereens durability. I mean we are talking less than $1mil between Woodhead and Washington (who's provided nothing so far). I don't know about you but I'd much rather spend the extra mil for someone who would actually give production to backup an injury prone player than to bank it for later.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to 49Patriots' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    You guys are being hindsight bias,  easy to attack BB now with Vareen out, but Vareen is a much better prospect. Vareen can run, catch in the flat, and is a match up nightmare for LBs as is Woodhead. But Vareen is faster, quicker, can line up and run up the middle consistently, can play slot and X WR....a most importantly, Vareen is good at picking up the blitz. Woodhead is just awful there.

    Why would Woodhead want to stay a back up when he can start? It was a good decision by BB.

    Also, who cares what Welker is doing? He isnt thinking about New England, why are you guys still thinking about him?

     

     

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Well the topic of the thread is about possible mistakes in personnel decisions and letting a highly productive and reliable receiver walk could be considered a mistake, no? 

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from rtuinila. Show rtuinila's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to 49Patriots' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    You guys are being hindsight bias,  easy to attack BB now with Vareen out, but Vareen is a much better prospect. Vareen can run, catch in the flat, and is a match up nightmare for LBs as is Woodhead. But Vareen is faster, quicker, can line up and run up the middle consistently, can play slot and X WR....a most importantly, Vareen is good at picking up the blitz. Woodhead is just awful there.

    Why would Woodhead want to stay a back up when he can start? It was a good decision by BB.

    Also, who cares what Welker is doing? He isnt thinking about New England, why are you guys still thinking about him?

     

     

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Well the topic of the thread is about possible mistakes in personnel decisions and letting a highly productive and reliable receiver walk could be considered a mistake, no? 

    [/QUOTE]

    Depending on ones interpretation of reliable, a case could be made that the Pats didn't let a reliable receiver go!

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from tanbass. Show tanbass's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to digger0862's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Being 5-1 I would think we would be talking about the biggest personnel success. To each his own.

    [/QUOTE]


    A-freaking-men!!

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from tanbass. Show tanbass's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to zeitgeist49's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     The biggest personnel mistake is allowing BB to remain as GM. So many head scratching decisions by Belichick year after year. And b/c we have TB and winning records every year, BB's ineptitude as GM is tolerated. As bad as Belichick's draft record is, his efforts in free agency are even worse. The last several years of Brady's career will be wasted thanks to BB's rigid value approach.

    [/QUOTE]

    Please enlighten us with a better choice.....

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to rtuinila's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     


    Depending on ones interpretation of reliable, a case could be made that the Pats didn't let a reliable receiver go!

    [/QUOTE]

    Considering the historic drop rate of our current WRs (including Amendola) then I would say Welkers hands were more reliable than any we currently have on the roster

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to rtuinila's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to 49Patriots' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    You guys are being hindsight bias,  easy to attack BB now with Vareen out, but Vareen is a much better prospect. Vareen can run, catch in the flat, and is a match up nightmare for LBs as is Woodhead. But Vareen is faster, quicker, can line up and run up the middle consistently, can play slot and X WR....a most importantly, Vareen is good at picking up the blitz. Woodhead is just awful there.

    Why would Woodhead want to stay a back up when he can start? It was a good decision by BB.

    Also, who cares what Welker is doing? He isnt thinking about New England, why are you guys still thinking about him?

     

     

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Well the topic of the thread is about possible mistakes in personnel decisions and letting a highly productive and reliable receiver walk could be considered a mistake, no? 

    [/QUOTE]

    Depending on ones interpretation of reliable, a case could be made that the Pats didn't let a reliable receiver go!

    [/QUOTE]

    I think Welker was reliable in every sense of the word.  The drops are exaggerated. He had very low drop rate given the frequency with which he was targeted.  And he took a lot of hits without getting hurt.  Hernandez was actually far less reliable, with worse hands, more injuries, and far less reliable character.  He was, however, younger and more versatile, which is why his signing probably signaled the death knell for Welker. 

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    Before, you are wise; after, you are wise.  In between you are otherwise.

    Would I like to have Woodhead on the roster in retrospect, of course, but then I would also have preferred we didn't sign Hernandez and/or traded him when he still had value, I would like to have bought Apple stock back in the late eighties, wish I could go back and live my life over knowing what I know now... that's why it's called hindsight.

    At 5-1 why don't we focus on what's right instead of turning our hair grey worrying about what could have been.  Tommy Kelly, Talib, Gregory and whoever has yet to emerge and produce were some good signings.  Woody could not return kickoffs, Washington has a history of staying healthy, so did Adrian Wilson etc... these guys weren't "high risk" signings.

    Wish in one hand and sht in the other, see which fills up first.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to wozzy's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Before, you are wise; after, you are wise.  In between you are otherwise.

    Would I like to have Woodhead on the roster in retrospect, of course, but then I would also have preferred we didn't sign Hernandez and/or traded him when he still had value, I would like to have bought Apple stock back in the late eighties, wish I could go back and live my life over knowing what I know now... that's why it's called hindsight.

    At 5-1 why don't we focus on what's right instead of turning our hair grey worrying about what could have been.  Tommy Kelly, Talib, Gregory and whoever has yet to emerge and produce were some good signings.  Woody could not return kickoffs, Washington has a history of staying healthy, so did Adrian Wilson etc... these guys weren't "high risk" signings.

    Wish in one hand and sht in the other, see which fills up first.

    [/QUOTE]

    And the bottom line is that the defense is clearly better than any we've had over the past three years or so, if it can stay healthy.  And while the offense is clearly worse now, it has far more upside potential than it did last year.  Last year, one or two injuries would cripple the offense, with no one to really step in.  This year, we've got lots of young players with the potential to get better and make the offense more productive as the season progresses.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    reliable hands aside, welker has played in every game this year while Danny has been hobbled and concussed. Welker has proven more reliable As he is on the field.

    this aside, bb's plan was clear, but it has Ben derailed due to injury and missing ah. We wouldn't be having this discussion if everyone was healthy and ah was here. The main point is investing and building the roster around players more injury prone and more productive when healthy vs players with no injury history and potentially less productive in the system bb was trying to create With clearly more versatility. It was a risk bb was willing to take and so far its backfired BUT, the pats keep winning. I thought it would be exposed when we played the saints, but the young wrs stepped up and are filling the void. 

     

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to PatsLifer's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    reliable hands aside, welker has played in every game this year while Danny has been hobbled and concussed. Welker has proven more reliable As he is on the field.

    this aside, bb's plan was clear, but it has Ben derailed due to injury and missing ah. We wouldn't be having this discussion if everyone was healthy and ah was here. The main point is investing and building the roster around players more injury prone and more productive when healthy vs players with no injury history and potentially less productive in the system bb was trying to create With clearly more versatility. It was a risk bb was willing to take and so far its backfired BUT, the pats keep winning. I thought it would be exposed when we played the saints, but the young wrs stepped up and are filling the void. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Always keeping in mind that the Patriots offered Welker more money than he's making now the season before last, before they invested the resources to sign Amendola.  There's only so much money you can allocate to the slot receiver position.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Biggest Personnel Mistake Besides Amendola

    In response to wozzy's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    Always keeping in mind that the Patriots offered Welker more money than he's making now the season before last, before they invested the resources to sign Amendola.  There's only so much money you can allocate to the slot receiver position.

    [/QUOTE]

    If it was just a slot position I would agree Wozzy but we are talking a #1 receiver, not just a slot guy. Since we ended up spending nearly as much on a guy who can't even stay on the field it does say that per production value they spent more on Amendola than Welker got from Den so they are actually spending more to get less as of right now. That's not to mention if they decide to cut Amendola for any reason in the next 2 years the dead money they will incur because of it.

     
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