Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to ATJ's comment:

     

    Actually, Babe, you repeatedly make this claim but you haven't torn anything to shreds with the possible exception of your own credibility.  Continuing to make baseless claims without any thrid party reference to support your assertions is hardly tearing objective analysis to shreds.

     

    I don't need any third party reference to show these cheesy articles about draft ratings are a joke. The very inept criteria they use to produce their results condemn their conclusions without debate.

    Unlike these articles proffered by the homers, my criteria is irrefutable. The best team builders are winning SBs. That is ironclad and unassailable, unless reason holds no worth, (which is usually the case only with the homer).

    I am quite sure my credibility is fully intact with objective persons. It has never been nor likely will ever be intact with the homers, because the truth and objectivity I provide is anathema to their warped and dishonest views.

    Put up or shut up. Provide a draft analysis you think is credible and thorough and I will destroy it again, as I have every singe one that has reared its ugly head here in the past.

     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    The best team builders are winning SBs. 



    Yeah I'm sure if we win a SB this season you'll be the first in line to call BB one of the best team builders in the NFL.  LMFAO.

    You've already acknowledged that if Welker makes the catch or if Gronk is healthy you think that team wins the 2011 SB yet you have ripped BB for that team repeatedly.  Laughable. 

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:


    Grier??  LMAO!  He was fired for drafting turds in Rd 1 and offering JAGs like Rucci and Lane massive contracts.

     



    ^ Once a fool always the fool. LMAO@U

    "only one NFL executive contacted Carr about Brady....... "Bobby Grier, who was with the Patriots at the time, talked about they were going to draft a quarterback late," Carr said in the documentary. "I just said, 'Bobby, I guarantee you you'll never regret drafting Tom Brady.""(ESPN quoting Lloyd Carr)

    Grier was the ONLY person to contact the Michican coach dumbkoff. And BB let Greir go to bring in his own guy. It happens all the time. You're an imbecile.

     

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    [QUOTE] 

    Actually, Babe, you repeatedly make this claim but you haven't torn anything to shreds with the possible exception of your own credibility.  Continuing to make baseless claims without any thrid party reference to support your assertions is hardly tearing objective analysis to shreds.

    I don't need any third party reference to show these cheesy articles about draft ratings are a joke. The very inept criteria they use to produce their results condemn their conclusions without debate.

    Unlike these articles proffered by the homers, my criteria is irrefutable. The best team builders are winning SBs. That is ironclad and unassailable, unless reason holds no worth, (which is usually the case only with the homer).

    I am quite sure my credibility is fully intact with objective persons. It has never been nor likely will ever be intact with the homers, because the truth and objectivity I provide is anathema to their warped and dishonest views.

    Put up or shut up. Provide a draft analysis you think is credible and thorough and I will destroy it again, as I have every singe one that has reared its ugly head here in the past. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Oh, stop it, Babe.  You've never refuted anything.  Myself and others have posted link after link by objective third parties and your only rejoinder is that you've debunked them yet somehow you never really say how.  Winning a SB you say?  So if a team hasn't won a SB in say 5 or 6 years they, by definition, must be under the stewardship of an 'average' GM.  Any idea how many flaws there are in that assertion?  

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from neinmd. Show neinmd's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    Actually, Babe, you repeatedly make this claim but you haven't torn anything to shreds with the possible exception of your own credibility.  Continuing to make baseless claims without any thrid party reference to support your assertions is hardly tearing objective analysis to shreds.

     

     

     

    I don't need any third party reference to show these cheesy articles about draft ratings are a joke. The very inept criteria they use to produce their results condemn their conclusions without debate.

    Unlike these articles proffered by the homers, my criteria is irrefutable. The best team builders are winning SBs. That is ironclad and unassailable, unless reason holds no worth, (which is usually the case only with the homer).

    I am quite sure my credibility is fully intact with objective persons. It has never been nor likely will ever be intact with the homers, because the truth and objectivity I provide is anathema to their warped and dishonest views.

    Put up or shut up. Provide a draft analysis you think is credible and thorough and I will destroy it again, as I have every singe one that has reared its ugly head here in the past.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Babe, what are your criteria for measuring the success of an NFL GM?

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from CatfishHunter. Show CatfishHunter's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    By page 2 of the thread Jim Brown became an afterthought.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to neinmd's comment:

    Babe, what are your criteria for measuring the success of an NFL GM?



    Winning a SB recently.  Unless we win another.  Then the goalposts will shift.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:

    By page 2 of the thread Jim Brown became an afterthought.



    You're right and I am as guilty as anyone of derailing the thread.  Apologies to the OP and those interested in the original topic.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to pcmIV's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

    The best team builders are winning SBs. 

     



    Yeah I'm sure if we win a SB this season you'll be the first in line to call BB one of the best team builders in the NFL.  LMFAO.

     

    You've already acknowledged that if Welker makes the catch or if Gronk is healthy you think that team wins the 2011 SB yet you have ripped BB for that team repeatedly.  Laughable. 

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Not likely. I would credit Brady and BB as coach for a SB win before BB as a GM, because that's where the credit belongs.

     

    The only thing laughable is your lack of understanding regarding this issue. But you're a homer, so your obliviousness is forgiven.

     

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:

    By page 2 of the thread Jim Brown became an afterthought.




    LOL!

    That will teach me to make a nice thread in the future.  Just when I thought this would be one of those nothing could go wrong threads, the drunk rusty clown face comes in and messes it all up.  What a drama queen(ie)!

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to ATJ's comment:

     

    [QUOTE] 

     

    Actually, Babe, you repeatedly make this claim but you haven't torn anything to shreds with the possible exception of your own credibility.  Continuing to make baseless claims without any thrid party reference to support your assertions is hardly tearing objective analysis to shreds.

     

     

    I don't need any third party reference to show these cheesy articles about draft ratings are a joke. The very inept criteria they use to produce their results condemn their conclusions without debate.

    Unlike these articles proffered by the homers, my criteria is irrefutable. The best team builders are winning SBs. That is ironclad and unassailable, unless reason holds no worth, (which is usually the case only with the homer).

    I am quite sure my credibility is fully intact with objective persons. It has never been nor likely will ever be intact with the homers, because the truth and objectivity I provide is anathema to their warped and dishonest views.

    Put up or shut up. Provide a draft analysis you think is credible and thorough and I will destroy it again, as I have every singe one that has reared its ugly head here in the past. 

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Oh, stop it, Babe.  You've never refuted anything.  Myself and others have posted link after link by objective third parties and your only rejoinder is that you've debunked them yet somehow you never really say how.

     

     Winning a SB you say?  So if a team hasn't won a SB in say 5 or 6 years they, by definition, must be under the stewardship of an 'average' GM.  Any idea how many flaws there are in that assertion?  

     

    [/QUOTE]

     

    I'm not going to stop telling it like it is.

    I have thoroughly discredited the criteria those articles used. Further, the articles were written by nobodys, with little stature in the field of punditry.

    Their criteria were things like how many drafted players remained in the league. That is a joke. How many guys that you draft who may be able to hang on as a scrub on some terrible team is no real measure of what builds championship teams through the draft. Ridiculous. And other criteria was the av ratings of PFR. Another joke. As I pointed out those tools give Fetus Head an av of 235 and Brady a 177. You really want to hang your hat on idiocy like that? Other criteria were how many pro-bowls people made. A guy like Brandon Meriweather had 2 pro-bowl years and Ed Reed had 9 (and five 1st team all-pros). You really are going to try to tell us Ed Reed is only worth 4 Brandon Meriweathers??? Another joke.

     

    If a team has not won a SB in the last 8 years despite having the best coach in the game and arguably the best QB, then the GM MUST be average. Point out the flaw in that.

     

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to TFB12's comment:

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    By page 2 of the thread Jim Brown became an afterthought.

     




    LOL!

     

    That will teach me to make a nice thread in the future.  Just when I thought this would be one of those nothing could go wrong threads, the drunk rusty clown face comes in and messes it all up.  What a drama queen(ie)!

    [/QUOTE]


    Let's all remember; the homers started it, not the objectivists.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to pcmIV's comment:

    In response to neinmd's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    Babe, what are your criteria for measuring the success of an NFL GM?

     



    Winning a SB recently.  Unless we win another.  Then the goalposts will shift.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    You always have a shot when you have the best coach and QB, even with a mediocre team created by a mediocre GM. The goalposts are going nowhere unless we win a couple in the next 5 years. Don't hold your breath on that.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to neinmd's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to ATJ's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

     

    Actually, Babe, you repeatedly make this claim but you haven't torn anything to shreds with the possible exception of your own credibility.  Continuing to make baseless claims without any thrid party reference to support your assertions is hardly tearing objective analysis to shreds.

     

     

     

     

     

    I don't need any third party reference to show these cheesy articles about draft ratings are a joke. The very inept criteria they use to produce their results condemn their conclusions without debate.

    Unlike these articles proffered by the homers, my criteria is irrefutable. The best team builders are winning SBs. That is ironclad and unassailable, unless reason holds no worth, (which is usually the case only with the homer).

    I am quite sure my credibility is fully intact with objective persons. It has never been nor likely will ever be intact with the homers, because the truth and objectivity I provide is anathema to their warped and dishonest views.

    Put up or shut up. Provide a draft analysis you think is credible and thorough and I will destroy it again, as I have every singe one that has reared its ugly head here in the past.

     

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Babe, what are your criteria for measuring the success of an NFL GM?

     

    [/QUOTE]


    The only criteria that holds water is winning SBs. As we well know, BB has had the luxury of having the best QB in the game (and coach) for over a decade and therefore has not had to expend resources as a GM looking for that franchise QB. Yet he still has not built a team that has won the SB in nearly a decade.

     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

    Babe has become completely unglued, stumbling to the ropes.




    All comers have been bludgeoned into a coma dumbkoff, because I have the facts on my side.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to TFB12's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    By page 2 of the thread Jim Brown became an afterthought.

     

     




    LOL!

     

     

    That will teach me to make a nice thread in the future.  Just when I thought this would be one of those nothing could go wrong threads, the drunk rusty clown face comes in and messes it all up.  What a drama queen(ie)!

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Let's all remember; the homers started it, not the objectivists.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Sadly, that is the case with most of these threads going out of control. 

    Some of our fan base

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to pcmIV's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     


    Not really. It is clear that Rehbein made a pest of himself to get Brady drafted. HE is the man who pushed this. And Brady's head coach at Michigan claims Grier was the one who contacted him about Brady.

    BB's impact on this is very flimsy compared to those two. At best, BB simply went along with what other people were pushing on that pick. There is simply no evidence out there whatsoever that shows BB was the guy who "discovered" Brady.

    Trying to spin this as a BB the GM brilliant move is what is the dumb (homer) stuff.

     

     

    You completely ignored my point.  Rehbein did pester BB about drafting Brady, but he was sent by BB and Pioli to scout Brady in the first place.  How do I know this?  Because Charlie Weis said so in the interviews he gave for that Yahoo! Sports piece written about Rehbein:

    Scott Pioli and head coach Bill Belichick made a list of six quarterback prospects and asked Dick to evaluate them. “Scott and Bill had to find [Brady] first,” Weis says.  


    In addition I like how you ignored the rest of my post which you obviously didn't have a response to.  I'll post it again for you:

    It is insane to not give BB credit for the pick just because Rehbein may have clamored for the team to draft Brady.  I can assure you that tons of scouts and coaches push players they want the team to draft that never get drafted.  More importantly by this logic no GM in the NFL should get credit for any picks their team makes.  Do you think BB is the only guy on the staff that wanted Seymour or Mankins or Wilfork?  Of course not, but ultimately BB gets final say.  That's the point.

    [/QUOTE]


    Why don't you quote the whole article when you tout the Weiss comment? Hunh?

    "But early in the process Dick realized there was something wonderful about Brady."

    Many other sources show it was DR who made Brady happen, not BB. All BB did was ask him to go check out some late round draft prospects.

     

    "Dick returned from Michigan to tell his bride he'd found himself a good one. "Twenty years from now," Dick told Pam, "people will know the name Tom Brady."Draft him, the quarterbacks coach told his bosses. Find a round and draft him.

    "Dick Rehbein, the late quarterbacks coach, gets a lot of credit for Brady ending up with New England. Rehbein's glowing report of a Brady workout in Michigan was significant."

     

    "And Belichick almost didn’t draft Tom Brady.

    In 2000, the Patriots wanted to draft a quarterback in the late rounds to groom as a potential replacement for Drew Bledsoe. They were looking at two quarterbacks, both of which they thought they could get in the sixth or seventh round. They had both of those young quarterbacks rated even.

    One of those two quarterbacks was Tom Brady. The other one was Tim Rattay.

    Had the late Dick Rehbein not picked Tom Brady over Tim Rattay, the entire course of NFL history would have changed. There would have been no Super Bowl victories for the Patriots. There would be no genius Bill Belichick."

    "He was one who stumped noisily for New England to select Tom Brady with a sixth-round pick in the 2000 draft. He met with the kid and promised to help him become an NFL starter some day."

     

    Every search you do will lead you to Dick Rehbein as the driving force that brought Tom Brady to the Pats.

     

    Here's the guy who brought us the greatest player in Pats history. May he RIP. Thanks Dick.


     

    Now if you want to give BB credit for developing Brady, I'm all in on that. When Dick passed away BB and Charlie became the QBs coach. And BB was phenomenal in that role from all I read. The guy brought his superlative knowledge of Xs and Os to these guys and Brady ate it up. BB is probably a better position coach than he is a HC, and he's a great HC.

     

    But in the end, drafting in the 6th round is pretty much pure luck. So the "BB drafted Brady" argument is silly.

     

     

     

     

     

     

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    Babe has become completely unglued, stumbling to the ropes.

     

     




    All comers have been bludgeoned into a coma dumbkoff, because I have the facts on my side.

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    You have no facts.

    [/QUOTE]


    ^ Says the nutjob, after I post quote after quote showing Dick Rehbein was the driving force behind drafting Brady, not BB.

     
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  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to TFB12's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to TFB12's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:

     

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

     

    By page 2 of the thread Jim Brown became an afterthought.

     

     

     




    LOL!

     

     

     

    That will teach me to make a nice thread in the future.  Just when I thought this would be one of those nothing could go wrong threads, the drunk rusty clown face comes in and messes it all up.  What a drama queen(ie)!

     

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Let's all remember; the homers started it, not the objectivists.

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Sadly, that is the case with most of these threads going out of control. 

     

    Some of our fan base

    [/QUOTE]

    You both need a reality check.  This thread was fine until someone decided to inject their agenda about BB the GM into it.  That occurred on the 6th post and the author was none other than our friend BabeParilli.

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    posted at 9/26/2013 6:27 AM EDT

    • BabeParilli
    • Posts: 14747
    • First: 5/29/2008
    • Last: 9/26/2013

    I have little doubt that BB is a great guy; great football coach too. GM? Not so much.

     
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  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Bill Belichick and Jim Brown

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    Why don't you quote the whole article when you tout the Weiss comment? Hunh?

     

    "But early in the process Dick realized there was something wonderful about Brady."

    Many other sources show it was DR who made Brady happen, not BB. All BB did was ask him to go check out some late round draft prospects.

     

    "Dick returned from Michigan to tell his bride he'd found himself a good one. "Twenty years from now," Dick told Pam, "people will know the name Tom Brady."Draft him, the quarterbacks coach told his bosses. Find a round and draft him.

    "Dick Rehbein, the late quarterbacks coach, gets a lot of credit for Brady ending up with New England. Rehbein's glowing report of a Brady workout in Michigan was significant."

     

    "And Belichick almost didn’t draft Tom Brady.

    In 2000, the Patriots wanted to draft a quarterback in the late rounds to groom as a potential replacement for Drew Bledsoe. They were looking at two quarterbacks, both of which they thought they could get in the sixth or seventh round. They had both of those young quarterbacks rated even.

    One of those two quarterbacks was Tom Brady. The other one was Tim Rattay.

    Had the late Dick Rehbein not picked Tom Brady over Tim Rattay, the entire course of NFL history would have changed. There would have been no Super Bowl victories for the Patriots. There would be no genius Bill Belichick."

    "He was one who stumped noisily for New England to select Tom Brady with a sixth-round pick in the 2000 draft. He met with the kid and promised to help him become an NFL starter some day."

     

    Every search you do will lead you to Dick Rehbein as the driving force that brought Tom Brady to the Pats.

     

    Here's the guy who brought us the greatest player in Pats history. May he RIP. Thanks Dick.


     

    Now if you want to give BB credit for developing Brady, I'm all in on that. When Dick passed away BB and Charlie became the QBs coach. And BB was phenomenal in that role from all I read. The guy brought his superlative knowledge of Xs and Os to these guys and Brady ate it up. BB is probably a better position coach than he is a HC, and he's a great HC.

     

    But in the end, drafting in the 6th round is pretty much pure luck. So the "BB drafted Brady" argument is silly.

     


    I'm not debating that Rehbein pestering BB about Brady was a force in him getting drafted.  At the end of the day it is a fact that BB sent Rehbein to scout Brady (despite your claims otherwise) and it is a fact that he chose to draft him given that he had the final say on all personnel decisions.  The fact that Rehbein's input played an important role in his decision doesn't mean he gets all the credit.  By that criteria no GM gets credit for any picks.  You can spin it however you want, but history will show that Bill Belichick drafted Tom Brady.

     

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