Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from cool-hand-luke. Show cool-hand-luke's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    To me the only stat that matters is points allowed.  Low rankings in pass defense or run defense may indicate weakness, but ultimately it's how many points you allow.  Here's how the Pats stacked up since 2001:

    year, nfl rank in points allowed, playoff finish (pass yards allowed rank, rush yards allowed rank)

    2001 - 6th - won super bowl (24, 19)
    2002 - 17th - missed playoffs (11, 31)
    2003 - 1st - won super bowl (15, 4)
    2004 - 2nd - won super bowl (17, 6)
    2005 - 17th - lost in divisional round of playoffs (31, 8)
    2006 - 2nd - lost in AFC championship game (12, 8)
    2007 - 4th - lost in super bowl (6, 10)
    2008 - 8th - missed playoffs (11, 15)


    Interesting, eh?

    I couldn't easily find stats on turnovers, but that's another area that might provide some information. 
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Caesar1177. Show Caesar1177's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    It is ridiculous how everyone ASSUMES that the losses of Vrabel, Harrison, Bruschi, Seymour will just destroy the Pats' defense. Yes, maybe losing the 2004 versions of those guys, but they have become old and slow (with the exception of Seymour). You don't keep guys around just because they are "proven winners." 

    Moreover, how was the Pats D the first 4 games of 2007? Because it seems to me that Harrison was suspended (for getting caught doing what half the NFL does) and Seymour was on the PUP. 

    The buzz word this year is speed. Speed everywhere. I'd rather have young speed than experienced slow.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]Its funny how when Bruschi, Harrison, Vrabel and Seymour were with the team, all the so called experts could say was "how old this team is". Now that these players are no longer with the team, all I can hear is "the Patriots lost a lot of all pro players on defense as well as leadership". I don't think we are going to be seeing anymore heartbreaking drives like we all saw in the '06 conference game and the '07 super bowl. These moves had to be done. I really don't think they will be as good as the '03 defense but in a couple of years, they may be even better.
    Posted by Rodimus77[/QUOTE]

    Good post, what's funnier still is that with all these losses of old vets, the PAT's still have the oldest team in the league with a 27 year old average. 

    My optimistic outlook for the defense isn't as much guess work rather adding up the parts we had vs. what we have now, with consideration to Bill B's strengths as a talent evaluator and systems coach.  He will always be a defensive and special team's guy, I really hope he gets back to his roots and his coaching replacements can keep up. 

    I'm more concerned about an offensive coordinator; we've never recovered from losing Charlie Weiss who was our greatest loss as an organization during Bill's tenure.  He could always get a first down, controlled the ball and time of possession thereby making our defense much more fresh, attacking and lethal. 

    2007 offense was a fantasy stat geek's wet dream but it wasn't good enough to win in the cold postseason.
     
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    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE] I'd rather have young speed than experienced slow.
    Posted by Caesar1177[/QUOTE]

    I agree. The Leadership card is way over played.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Irkillendem. Show Irkillendem's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE] I'd rather have young speed than experienced slow.
    Posted by Caesar1177[/QUOTE]

    so you're saying you'd rather have a team with no postseason experience even if they're a bit slow? that's like the Raiders or Lions.  

    Speed isn't everything, just look at our old pal Al Davis.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from mosseffect43. Show mosseffect43's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]It is ridiculous how everyone ASSUMES that the losses of Vrabel, Harrison, Bruschi, Seymour will just destroy the Pats' defense. Yes, maybe losing the 2004 versions of those guys, but they have become old and slow (with the exception of Seymour). You don't keep guys around just because they are "proven winners."  Moreover, how was the Pats D the first 4 games of 2007? Because it seems to me that Harrison was suspended (for getting caught doing what half the NFL does) and Seymour was on the PUP.  The buzz word this year is speed. Speed everywhere. I'd rather have young speed than experienced slow.
    Posted by Caesar1177[/QUOTE] its crazy how many think a roster full of unproven young players are gonna be the pats best defense ever.do we want it to be? yes we do,but to assume it will be is ridiculous.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    Speed is overrated.  It doesn't matter how fast you are, if you're out of position, you're not going to outrun the football once it's in the air.  I'd rather have an old slow guy who's always in position than a young fast guy who doesn't know where he's supposed to be. 
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Caesar1177. Show Caesar1177's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003 : so you're saying you'd rather have a team with no postseason experience even if they're a bit slow? that's like the Raiders or Lions.   Speed isn't everything, just look at our old pal Al Davis.
    Posted by Irkillendem[/QUOTE]


    We don't have a team with no postseason experience. Last I checked, we still had Brady, Faulk, Light, Koppen, Neal, Wilfork, Warren, etc. And also last I checked, the defense that we had the past few years was the achilles heel of this team. See 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008. Don't care what the stats said about the 2006 and 2007 defenses, they failed in the clutch. So yes, I will take my chances with a d that is fast and doesn't run out of gas. 
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Caesar1177. Show Caesar1177's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003 : its crazy how many think a roster full of unproven young players are gonna be the pats best defense ever.do we want it to be? yes we do,but to assume it will be is ridiculous.
    Posted by mosseffect43[/QUOTE]

    How is this a roster full of unproven players? Didn't Mayo lead the team in tackles? Isn't the d-line achored by established veterans? Isn't Sanders a fifth year player and Merriweather a third year player? Springs, Bodden? Are they rookies? What about A.D. What round was he drafted last year. We have NO ROOKIES starting on defense. They have proved it to Belichick and the Pats staff so I'm not sure how they are unproven. Because this particular unit hasn't proven anything to YOU? 


     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from blead2121. Show blead2121's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]Well at least we won't have any rookies starting at D this season, unless Brace or Pryor fill in on the D-Line, but that's probably the easiest position for a rookie to learn.  The way I see our defenders: Elite:  Wilfork Very Good:  Warren, Green, Thomas Good:  Merriweather, Mayo, Wright Adequate:  Sanders Unproven in our system:  Burgess, Springs, Bodden Unproven in NFL:  Wilhite, Guyton, Wheatley, Chung, Butler, Brace, Pryor  Sub-par:  Woods, Alexander, McGowan, TBC, Ninkovich We only have 4 very good/elite defenders, and 3 are on the D-Line.  Merriweather and Mayo may blossom this year.  We've got 5 unproven starters and 5 unproven backups, and 5 sub-par backups.  In sum ... this D is nothing like 2003.
    Posted by themightypatriotz[/QUOTE]


    Mayo is very good and so is Merriweather. Woods I would put in the unproven category. How can you call him subpar? He hasn't proven anything either way. Burgess and Bodden could jump to the very good category as they have been in past years. This defense is exponentially better than it has been since 2003. Bruschi was too old to play anymore. Harrison was always hurt and too old. Vrabel got old quickly last year. Seymour was always hurt. If that defense last year can almost get them into the playoffs with Cassell as the QB. This one with Brady should be an easy trip to the Super Bowl.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    "Don't care what the stats said about the 2006 and 2007 defenses, they failed in the clutch."

    Just about all our defenses this decade failed in the clutch.  The truth is that we won our first two super bowls because our O happened to be the one with the ball at the end of the game. 
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Caesar1177. Show Caesar1177's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]"Don't care what the stats said about the 2006 and 2007 defenses, they failed in the clutch." Just about all our defenses this decade failed in the clutch.  The truth is that we won our first two super bowls because our O happened to be the one with the ball at the end of the game. 
    Posted by themightypatriotz[/QUOTE]

    Yes, that is very true re: the first two super bowls. But didn't our O have the ball at the end of the Indy game in 2006? What about the Super Bowl?

    And keep in mind something about those first two super bowls. Our defense played out of its mind for three quarters against the Rams. They didn't so much "fail" in the fourth quarter as the Rams adjusted. Against Carolina, the two starting safeties went out injuries right as the Panthers fourth quarter run was starting.

    And yes, you could bring the injuries card up for the 2006 AFC championship game, but the bottom line is that the defense took a step back in 2005 and never really recovered. Best to jettison the old guys and get younger. 
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from jader. Show jader's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]It might be, but that's if the Pass rush can get to the QB. I have full faith in the Patriots' defense. What scares me is the lack of pressure. I love Merriweather out there, he has hands of Reed (Ed Reed) and can hit like Taylor (Sean Taylor), Sanders learned from Rodney and Bill is always talking about how much he would love to have 53 of him. Bodden looks good to me, Wilhite will be better than Asante Samuel in the very near future, Guyton is a speed demon (runs the 40 in 4.45. That's the fastest time for any active LB, I believe.) Mayo is the future franchise guy, Adalius was a beast before his injury last year, and the D-line has always been the corp of guys that I'm the least worried about. If we had Shawn Crable this year play to the potential he has, the Pats' D would've been elite, but we'll have to wait till next year to see. 
    Posted by 49Patriots[/QUOTE]
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from jader. Show jader's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    Wilhite bette ha Samuel? What ae you smoking, ause I want some.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from mosseffect43. Show mosseffect43's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003 : How is this a roster full of unproven players? Didn't Mayo lead the team in tackles? Isn't the d-line achored by established veterans? Isn't Sanders a fifth year player and Merriweather a third year player? Springs, Bodden? Are they rookies? What about A.D. What round was he drafted last year. We have NO ROOKIES starting on defense. They have proved it to Belichick and the Pats staff so I'm not sure how they are unproven. Because this particular unit hasn't proven anything to YOU? 
    Posted by Caesar1177[/QUOTE] mayo had a good year.can he repeat it?thomas,and wilfork,warren are solid.many are waiting on merriweather to show up,he has been average so far,as sanders.springs we dont know what we are getting yet.bodden had the one good year in cleveland,again we dont know what we are getting.burgess again we dont know what we are getting.the rest are unproven.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from cowtherabbit-. Show cowtherabbit-'s posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]"Don't care what the stats said about the 2006 and 2007 defenses, they failed in the clutch." Just about all our defenses this decade failed in the clutch.  The truth is that we won our first two super bowls because our O happened to be the one with the ball at the end of the game. 
    Posted by themightypatriotz[/QUOTE]

    Dude,our defense shut down"The Greatest Show on Turf" in our first SB win.Our offense let us down with the SB loss to the Giants.You can't possibly think that 14 pts. should be enough to win a Superbowl. Especially after the numbers we put up in the regular season.Holding a SB opponent to 17 pts. should gaurantee a win.
     
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    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003 : Dude,our defense shut down"The Greatest Show on Turf" in our first SB win.Our offense let us down with the SB loss to the Giants.You can't possibly think that 14 pts. should be enough to win a Superbowl. Especially after the numbers we put up in the regular season.Holding a SB opponent to 17 pts. should gaurantee a win.
    Posted by cowtherabbit-[/QUOTE]

    Both the offense and the defense are to blame, but neither is to blame.  Some games you win, some you lose.  The Giants had something to say about it.  All that said, the offense handed the game over to the defense with a lead with about 2.5 minutes to go, and the defense could not come up with a stop.  Some of this was bad luck, of course.  But if the defense manages to make one big play, people would be talking about how Brady had added to his legend with a big end of game touchdown drive. 
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from noncallcity. Show noncallcity's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    I know I'm not a regular and thus get no respect, but like I've been saying: I have little doubt the D will be their best in a looong time. I can't imagine how anyone could look at their roster ("on paper") and not see the most talent we've ever had under the flying Elvis. I believe they want it enough to get it. Sorry if you're looking for stats and comparisons, that's not football to me, and that's not how the Pats won their trophies.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003 : Dude,our defense shut down"The Greatest Show on Turf" in our first SB win.Our offense let us down with the SB loss to the Giants.You can't possibly think that 14 pts. should be enough to win a Superbowl. Especially after the numbers we put up in the regular season.Holding a SB opponent to 17 pts. should gaurantee a win.
    Posted by cowtherabbit-[/QUOTE]

    Our D collapsed against the Greatest Show on Turf at the end of the game, giving up a TD to let the Rams tie the game with a minute left.  The 2001 D, giving up 17 points, was certainly no better than the 2007 D.  And the 2003 D did much worse.    The performance of the Titans last night, and the Steelers in the Super Bowl, should convince us all that it's unrealistic to expect any D to do anything other than keep the game close if the offense is struggling.  If both teams play well, it will probably come down to which team has the ball with 2:00 to go.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from cowtherabbit-. Show cowtherabbit-'s posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003 : Our D collapsed against the Greatest Show on Turf at the end of the game, giving up a TD to let the Rams tie the game with a minute left.  The 2001 D, giving up 17 points, was certainly no better than the 2007 D.  And the 2003 D did much worse.    The performance of the Titans last night, and the Steelers in the Super Bowl, should convince us all that it's unrealistic to expect any D to do anything other than keep the game close if the offense is struggling.  If both teams play well, it will probably come down to which team has the ball with 2:00 to go.
    Posted by themightypatriotz[/QUOTE]                                         
    So you think a team that gives up 17 pts. has a bad defense? Man,either you are a spoiled fan or you're setting unrealistic goals.It's not about when they give it up it's about how much they give up.A football game is 4 quarters.Every snap counts.If we gave up an avg. of 17 pts. a game last year we would be ranked 4th in the NFL for scoring defense.The last time a team won a SB by scoring 17pts. or less was the 1975 Steelers.32 years before our 2007 SB loss.Considering we had a 50+ TD regular season from Brady,seriously ask yourself who let who down.BTW, Ty Law's INT gave us 7 of our 20 pts. in our first SB win but I guess that doesn't count because they gave up 2 TD's in the 4th quarter. Would you like to comment on the whopping 6 pts the offense put up in the 2nd half (7 pts first half)of that same game or how the Rams(31.4 pts./gm avg.) didn't enter the red zone until the 4th quarter?                                                                                                           You really need to start appreciating the team you have instead of complaining about every little flaw you can dig up.The other teams get paid to play too and we're not going to be #1 in every stat in every year.The New England Patriots have been an elite team for this entire decade,what more can you reasonably expect from a salary cap era team?The way it seems is that I enjoyed our team more when they just covered the spread during the days when Buffalo dominated the AFC than you are enjoying this golden age of Patriots history.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlemaslow. Show seattlemaslow's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003 :                                           So you think a team that gives up 17 pts. has a bad defense? Man,either you are a spoiled fan or you're setting unrealistic goals.It's not about when they give it up it's about how much they give up.A football game is 4 quarters.If we gave up an avg. of 17 pts. a game last year we would be ranked 4th in the NFL for scoring defense.The last time a team won a SB by scoring 17pts. or less was the 1975 Steelers.32 years before our 2007 SB loss.Considering we had a 50+ TD regular season from Brady,seriously ask yourself who let who down.BTW, Ty Law's INT gave us 7 of our 20 pts. in our first SB win but I guess that doesn't count because they gave up 2 TD's in the 4th quarter.                                                                                         You really need to start appreciating the team you have instead of complaining about every little flaw you can dig up.The other teams get paid to play too and we're not going to be #1 in every stat in every year.The New England Patriots have been an elite team for this entire decade,what more can you reasonably expect from a salary cap era team.The way it seems is that I enjoyed our team more when they covered the spread during the days when Buffalo dominated the AFC than you are enjoying this golden age of Patriots history.
    Posted by cowtherabbit-[/QUOTE]

    Totally agree! Pats give up only 17 PPG and there will be more duckboats on Boylston in February.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from croc. Show croc's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    They've got potential either way.  My guess is BB and staff will coach them into being at least respectable 2nd tier D...which is better than last yaers.

    Even with Big C gone I think the D-line is solid.   Green had started about a dozen games in lieu of Big C, 7 of them in '07.  Per Reiss's game log Big C was also off the field a lot last year.  They will defintely get by.  I'm sure Brace & Pryor will be brought along.

    They've got half a solid LB corps in Mayo & Thomas.  I'm not sold on Guyton, or Burgess even though I think they won't be horrible.  I don't particularly like Woods or Alexander. At least one of Guyton or Burgess has to become a solid contributor. Don't lose Seau's phone number. ...Overall my biggest are of concern is the LBs.

    The secondary has Boddens who's better than Hobbs, not as good as Samuel.  Ok starting S's, nothing outstandingly bad or good about Sanders/Meriweather.  Chung has P made rookie mistakes and some very bright spots. The other CB spot is a big ?. In pre-season Springs didn't play, Wilhite was so-so, Wheatley was pourous and Butler also had P some very good/bad plays....It all may come down to how Chung and Butler mature if they are really good or just ok in the secondary. I'm guessing they'll be good enough IF the LB corp is okay.
     
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    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]I think the "bend but don't break" mentality works somewhat, but it gives us 3 weaknesses: 1) giving the opposing offense too high of an average YPC in running situations 2) giving the opposing offense the little dunk passes that go for 6-7 yards a pop 3) less physicality with the opposing QB We do a good job of limiting the big plays once in a while, but the D just needs time to gel to limit and eventually remove those weaknesses. When I think of the defense of the Steelers, Ravens, or even the Vikings and Titans of the past two years, one phrase comes to mind.... "angry, pissed off, and mean". When we had Seau sacking the QB with fire and anger, that was the type of passion I'm talking about. When I think of the Pats defense now, words like "angry", "pissed off", "mean", etc. don't come to mind. I'm not saying the defense is bad - we have some of the best players in the league in their positions, I'm just saying that the defense doesn't strike the fear and punishment you normally correllate with the best defenses in the league. I can't wait for the day when that does get correllated with us. When the Pats defense comes in breathing fire with one thing in mind...destroy the QB and anyone that gets in between. We have the personnel for it. We have the youth and speed for it. I think at this point it's a mental change that has to happen between the players and the coaches - moreso the coaches. Start calling some crazy stuff. Let the players rip up the offense. Blitz like there's no tomorrow. Get pumped. I want to see the defense on the field fired up and screaming. I want the camera to zoom in on one of our defensive players after a stop and see them yelling with anger and excitement instead of the bland look. You see the look on Ed Reed, James Harrison, or Ray Lewis' face for the pre-game warmup and during the entire game? That's the intensity we need. If we have that, our defense IS the best in the league.
    Posted by mjxg[/QUOTE]

    You are SO right....you couldnt of put it better! I wanna see Mayo slam Sanchez to the ground and SCREAM at him!
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003 :                                           So you think a team that gives up 17 pts. has a bad defense? Man,either you are a spoiled fan or you're setting unrealistic goals.It's not about when they give it up it's about how much they give up.A football game is 4 quarters.Every snap counts.If we gave up an avg. of 17 pts. a game last year we would be ranked 4th in the NFL for scoring defense.The last time a team won a SB by scoring 17pts. or less was the 1975 Steelers.32 years before our 2007 SB loss.Considering we had a 50+ TD regular season from Brady,seriously ask yourself who let who down.BTW, Ty Law's INT gave us 7 of our 20 pts. in our first SB win but I guess that doesn't count because they gave up 2 TD's in the 4th quarter. Would you like to comment on the whopping 6 pts the offense put up in the 2nd half (7 pts first half)of that same game or how the Rams(31.4 pts./gm avg.) didn't enter the red zone until the 4th quarter?                                                                                                           You really need to start appreciating the team you have instead of complaining about every little flaw you can dig up.The other teams get paid to play too and we're not going to be #1 in every stat in every year.The New England Patriots have been an elite team for this entire decade,what more can you reasonably expect from a salary cap era team?The way it seems is that I enjoyed our team more when they just covered the spread during the days when Buffalo dominated the AFC than you are enjoying this golden age of Patriots history.
    Posted by cowtherabbit-[/QUOTE]

    I was defending the 2007 Defense against the thousands of posters on here who have been complaining that it let us down, and against everyone who says Willie Mac would always make a big play back in the day to close out a game.  Obviously our Defense all decade has been terrific, and the 2001, 2004 and 2007 defenses did a great job in the Super Bowl.  My only point is that it's unrealistic to expect any D to completely shut down an opposing O in any game, especially the Super Bowl, and the performance of all our Ds this decade, and the Steelers last year, proves it. 

    Bottom line:  Don't expect our D any year to keep an opposing playoff team out of the endzone for all 4 quarters, and more times than not games between two super bowl contenders will come down to which team gets the ball with 2:00 to go.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from BSII. Show BSII's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    NFL Films played the 2001 Superbowl last night.  Pats D that year featured guys like 36 Yr. old Otis Smith, Tebucky Jones, Pudding Harris, Bobby Hamilton, Anthony Pleasant, Terrell Buckley, Matt Stevens, Chris Sullivan.  Vrabel was a nobody before the season, Seymour was a rookie.  Milloy, Law, Bruschi, Big Willie and Phifer were the core. 

    Is the 2009 defensive less talented on paper then that? 
     
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