BUTLER

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: BUTLER

    Butler just doesn't look like he can cover to me. He's picked on everytime he's out there, so opposing teams know he's weak.  BB will give him another shot to prove himself since he was a second round pick, but I'm not optimistic he'll work out. Wilhite, though, did show some skills at nickel before he was hurt and I suspect he'll be in the mix next season.  Arrington is hard to figure.  I admire the way he stepped up, but it's hard to say he was a great corner. I suspect he stays around because of his versatility, but he may go back to special teams rather than being in the mix at corner/nickel.  I think we need another corner for depth or to play nickel/dime.  If BB picked up a veteran or even drafted someone for the position I wouldn't think it was a bad move.  We have bigger needs elsewhere, but if BB thought he had another McCourty in the first or second round, who could blame him for drafting a corner there?

    Addendum . . .

    If I remember right, Arrington is a free agent.  Will be interesting to see how much money he commands.  That may make a difference on whether he stays or gos.  Having shown he can play corner, his price should go up. It may be too high for the Pats unless they think he's truly capable of being the third corner.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from BBReigns. Show BBReigns's posts

    Re: BUTLER

    Arrington is basically Hobbs.

    The latter should have been kicked inside when he was here, but they never did it, most likely because they felt they could hide him (here are those two words again) with a good pass rush.

    Arrington has shown he can handle zone now as did Wilhite in more of a dime role when called on prior to getting hurt.

    So, they have experience in between the hashes now, which again, they haven't had in years.

    2008 the pass rush started to fade with an aging Seymour and Vrabel not really the same players they once were, and a below average secondary like Lewis Sanders, Jason Webster, Wilhite, Wheatley, etc.

    Stability is the key in this system, but the pass rush effectiveness of course will help any secondary pieces that are newer.

    I think the pay Arrington and he stays. The signed him off the street and he's do a raise.

    Just tell him he'll compete with Bodden.   It would actually be bad if he left. 


     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from CablesWyndBairn. Show CablesWyndBairn's posts

    Re: BUTLER

    Wilhite wasn't the problem last year, I don't know what some people were watching.  He always had the ability to cover but his ability to play the ball in the air needed work.  He was also asked to play on the outside and that's not his strength. 

    Butler may be running short on chances, but Arrington did a commendable job despite being pressed into action.  Butler may or may not work out, he has at least next year to make it work before he is replaced.  I personally am not ready to give up on him yet.  It took Asante Samuel a few years to figure things out. 

    I wouldn't be surprised if the Pats draft a CB in April if there is someone they like out there.  But there are a lot of young guys who've been baptized through fire, and that's a good thing.      
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from BBReigns. Show BBReigns's posts

    Re: BUTLER

    Not to nitpick but Samuel was a good nickel as a rookie.  Butler hasn't shown that yet.

    On the flip side, Samuel came into a locked down tight situation with an all world front 7, a pass rush, depth and time to learn.

    So, to be fair to the CBs people love to bash here, the 2003 Pats D and the 2008 or 2009 Pats D are completely two different animals.

    Samuel, Gay, etc, had the luxury of being coddled a little in a much stronger/supportive context as compared to Wilhite and Butler.


     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Re: BUTLER

    This being his third year, I hope to see something from Butler. Almost everytime I see him out there, he looks almost comletely lost. My biggest issue is I've NEVER seen him find the ball in the air, he strictly face-guards. It seems like a horrible habit he can't break now, or created after being drafted because he's having trouble grasping the D. I don't know, but 2 full off seasons, and 3 trainging camps should be enough to get it. If not now, I don't think ever, but I would absolutely give him a real shot one more season.

    As for Bodden, I was never one of his biggest fans. He was the best corner on a team in 09 that had no good corners. Add to that he's coming off an injury, and he's not exactly a rookie, and I don't know if I should expect much from him. If he can come back and be a solid #2 behind McCourty I will feel I was very wrong about him in 09 and be thrilled to have a reliable corner opposite the budding star.

    Just throwing safety out there too while we're in the secondary. I love Chung, I think he'll be anywhere fomr a solid starter to regular Pro Bowler. I'm not a fan of Merriweather. He's a lightning rod, I don't think I need to go into reasons, people around here either like him, or loathe him. Put me in the latter. Page and Sanders are ok as 3rd/4th safeties. The one wild card for me is McGowan. He came out of nowhere, played very well towards the end of the season (bumping Merriweather down the chart at times) and got hurt and missed the year. Horrible timing. Again, I never know what to expect form a guy who missed a hole season, but I really liked the way this guy played. Big hitter, but fundamentally sound and didn't seem prone to freelancing. I like the S position for 2011. It's also prove it time for Merriweather. This will be his 5th full season, he's not young anymore and needs to start establishing himself as a leader with words AND actions, or get ready to join Maroney in anonimity.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from viewer222. Show viewer222's posts

    Re: BUTLER

    Arrington though not a pro-bowler is definitely an upgrade over Butler
    IMHO Butler is gone. After being outcoached by Ryan, BB is not going to waste much time with giving players "too much of a break.

     the Response
    to Re: BUTLER:
    [QUOTE]Butler just doesn't look like he can cover to me. He's picked on everytime he's out there, so opposing teams know he's weak.  BB will give him another shot to prove himself since he was a second round pick, but I'm not optimistic he'll work out. Wilhite, though, did show some skills at nickel before he was hurt and I suspect he'll be in the mix next season.  Arrington is hard to figure.  I admire the way he stepped up, but it's hard to say he was a great corner. I suspect he stays around because of his versatility, but he may go back to special teams rather than being in the mix at corner/nickel.  I think we need another corner for depth or to play nickel/dime.  If BB picked up a veteran or even drafted someone for the position I wouldn't think it was a bad move.  We have bigger needs elsewhere, but if BB thought he had another McCourty in the first or second round, who could blame him for drafting a corner there? Addendum . . . If I remember right, Arrington is a free agent.  Will be interesting to see how much money he commands.  That may make a difference on whether he stays or gos.  Having shown he can play corner, his price should go up. It may be too high for the Pats unless they think he's truly capable of being the third corner.
    Posted by prolate0spheroid[/QUOTE]
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from BBReigns. Show BBReigns's posts

    Re: BUTLER

    In Response to Re: BUTLER:
    [QUOTE]This being his third year, I hope to see something from Butler. Almost everytime I see him out there, he looks almost comletely lost. My biggest issue is I've NEVER seen him find the ball in the air, he strictly face-guards. It seems like a horrible habit he can't break now, or created after being drafted because he's having trouble grasping the D. I don't know, but 2 full off seasons, and 3 trainging camps should be enough to get it. If not now, I don't think ever, but I would absolutely give him a real shot one more season. As for Bodden, I was never one of his biggest fans. He was the best corner on a team in 09 that had no good corners. Add to that he's coming off an injury, and he's not exactly a rookie, and I don't know if I should expect much from him. If he can come back and be a solid #2 behind McCourty I will feel I was very wrong about him in 09 and be thrilled to have a reliable corner opposite the budding star. Just throwing safety out there too while we're in the secondary. I love Chung, I think he'll be anywhere fomr a solid starter to regular Pro Bowler. I'm not a fan of Merriweather. He's a lightning rod, I don't think I need to go into reasons, people around here either like him, or loathe him. Put me in the latter. Page and Sanders are ok as 3rd/4th safeties. The one wild card for me is McGowan. He came out of nowhere, played very well towards the end of the season (bumping Merriweather down the chart at times) and got hurt and missed the year. Horrible timing. Again, I never know what to expect form a guy who missed a hole season, but I really liked the way this guy played. Big hitter, but fundamentally sound and didn't seem prone to freelancing. I like the S position for 2011. It's also prove it time for Merriweather. This will be his 5th full season, he's not young anymore and needs to start establishing himself as a leader with words AND actions, or get ready to join Maroney in anonimity.
    Posted by ma6dragon9[/QUOTE]

    I think Page is better than McGowan.  McGowan had a good first half of 2009 and then disappeared.

    I'd like to see more of Page here involved more so than he was. Hopefully, he can stay healthy if they bring him back.

    Good news here is they have guys who know the system and have differing skill sets so BB can mix and match.

    BB likes Merriweather, so unless he's dealt and they go Safety in the draft for future investment, he's likely your starting Safety.

    Don't forget they like Barrett enough to deal for him and IR him and Brett Lockett is still here as well.  





     
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