Can't blame the defense too much here..

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    Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..

    The defense played well.  No complaints.  The offense played well except the Giants have a great defense.  The turning point was all the opportunities that went the Giants way.
     
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    Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..

    Everyone is focusing on the Welker drop.. I have to call out Branch... Hit him in the hands as well. If he caught that .. it was clear sailing to the Endzone.
    Three plays cost us the game; Branch Drop, Welker Drop, Hernadez Drop
    not to mention the potential for three giant turnovers... (12 men on the field  REALLY!!!!!! ???)
     
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    Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..

    In Response to Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Can't blame the defense too much here.. : Agreed. What have I said pretty much all year? They can win if they want to? They didn't want to because Brady threw 41 times and BJGE ran 10. The evidence is overwhelming.
    Posted by RustyGriswold[/QUOTE]

    I totally agree that this offense is a huge reason for this loss. I can't tell you how happy I am that Obrien is gone forever.

    But you must admit, that there are also several flaws on this defense that must be addressed.

    I've been posting the same thing on many threads today....this TEAM is flawed, and it's on both sides of the ball.
     
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    Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..

    In Response to Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Can't blame the defense too much here.. : Come on Bubba. Brady should have learned his lesson from the Ravens game. No need to heave that ball to a hobbled covered Gronk. That was costly.
    Posted by antiqueman1[/QUOTE]
    no, I hear you. Brady should never have thrown the ball to begin with. The reason why it's a bad call by OBIE is because the offense should have been in a running formation, and run the ball at that part of the field, or done play action.

    OBIE is supposed to put the patriots offense in a position to succeed.
     
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    Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..

    The DL got completely manhandled on the last drive.  I know they had been on the field a lot, but with the SB on the line I would have expected a bit better effort.  The offense should have sealed the game on the previous drive but drops killed them.  If they make that play and score a TD then we are all talking about how the Pats dropped 24 on the Giants without Gronk.  Football is a game of inches and both the O and D didn't make the plays when it counted.
     
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    Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..

    In Response to Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..:
    [QUOTE]Everyone is focusing on the Welker drop.. I have to call out Branch... Hit him in the hands as well. If he caught that .. it was clear sailing to the Endzone. Three plays cost us the game; Branch Drop, Welker Drop, Hernadez Drop not to mention the potential for three giant turnovers... (12 men on the field  REALLY!!!!!! ???)
    Posted by ASO9771[/QUOTE]

    totally agree with you. when they coughed up the ball on their own 10 I nearly jumped thru the roof, only to have it overturned because of 12 men on the field. that was the ultimate kick in the nutz for me. and with that said, ya can't say that we didn't have our opportunities do do some major things.
     
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    Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..

    In Response to Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Can't blame the defense too much here.. : Right, but the root cause is based in the offense, not the D.  The root cause being the ideological approach of how they run the offense.
    Posted by RustyGriswold[/QUOTE]

    This is where I slightly disagree with you Rusty. I agree with you that the play calling sucked, and that the running game becomes very important in lower scoring games/or when the passing game is grounded.

    I'm of the opinion that our current pass oriented offense will more often than not beat average and poor NFL teams. I'm also of the opinion that the Patriot pass oriented offense suffers when we go up against teams that can cover and disrupt Brady's timing.

    The key part where I disagree with you is that is that the offense is the root cause of losses like the Giants game - because it seems like you didn't take into account that teams like the Giants, Ravens, and Steelers do a good job defensively against our pass oriented offense. They do two things, disrupt Brady's time...and they did a decent job covering our receivers.

    To me, the offense and defense work synergistically with each other - not independantly.  In games vs. average or poor teams, our pass oriented offense is good enough to win almost all of those games. In close games like the losses vs. the Giants, you're right - the patriots DO need to run more - BUT, it's ALSO when the D needs to be able to shut down the opponents offense and win the game (instead of always counting on the offense carrying the team).

    so, before you go off on a rant - I think the "blame" for these kinds of games are equally attributed to coaching, offense, and defense.
     
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    Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..

    The defense was very good. 

    They could have been great but they didn't cause a single turnover.

    Mayo is never in the right place and he could have had a pick six if he would ever learn the game.
     
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    Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..

    None of this is on the D, they played very well. The offense was once again very inconsistent. Brady played ok but made two big mistakes.

    They should have run BJGE more often, give the line a break and let them hit some guys.
     
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    Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..

    In Response to Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Can't blame the defense too much here.. : Dude, please.  Our offense only scored 1 TD In the first half and it was on the hurry up. Whopdee-doo. We've seen tthis ALL YEAR. You can't walk into a SB and pretend that's going to cut it in this era. It was a good defensive battle, fine.  But, when you throw an INT and then have a chance to simply catch a ball like Welker did, you're putting a D in a dome back on the field very quickly again and again. Do you know Warren, Wilfork and Ellis sat there in shock as Welker dropped it? Because they battled, allowing 13 measly points over 57 minutes. The TOP thing is completely skewed due to a Safety, the INT and the Welker drop. That's not even counting a slew of other missed plays by the offense. The root of his is found in the offensive style, as I've said ALL YEAR.  You just saw it again and you still can't admit it? Even when Moore and CHung got beat on that Manningham play, the coverage was incredible.   I can't really think of one play where the D was bad or off in coverage. They mixed man and zone enough to make wittle Eli a tad timid and our offense piddle with itself again refysing to dictate with our run game. I said here repeatedly: 0 Turnovers, and BJGE with around 20 carries and we win. If Brady simply doesn't have a brain cramp there, it's highly likely we win. It serves as a punt, but what it didn't do is roll more clock. I believe that pick was on 1st down!  Jesus. Just admit reality v.s. pretending NE's D has to be the 2000 Ravens every week. This D outperformed our D in SB 38.
    Posted by RustyGriswold[/QUOTE]

    Dude.  Offensive style is what lost SB 42.  You look at everything in absolutes (how many passes did Brady throw) and set up these ridiculous binaries with no context (Eli also threw 40 passes).  The Giants defense did not stop NE's offense like they did in 2008 where Brady got hit like 20 times.  NE's offense stopped themselves.  They were a couple dropped balls away from winning a Super Bowl and dropping 24 points without their best offensive weapon.  It is a game of inches and the offense DID fail, but we do not agree on the reason.  You have no problem using injuries like you did in the previous Giants' game when it helps your agenda, but no mention of it here.  Whether you like it or not the defense gave up the winning score with a minute left in the game.  Does that change the fact that they played well for 57 minutes?  No, but if you want to harp on the offense for not playing 60 minutes then you can do it for the D as well and it is a fact that the D line left the rest of the D out to dry on that last drive by getting ZERO pass rush.  Both units lost the game.  End of story.  We can argue about who deserves more blame, but you seem to want to absolve the D of all responsibility and I cannot accept that.
     
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    Re: Can't blame the defense too much here..

    The offense did not score in the final 26:20. D's fault?

     
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