Commitment to trench play?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Commitment to trench play?

    Another post-season game lost, and another game decided by sub par trench play. 

    New England was essentially dominated on both lines, 

    Not one sack, not one hurry, and not one QB hit. That is right. Manning was NOT touched today. 

    On the other side of the ball, an abysmal 2.3 ypc from the Blount and Ridley, and 2 sacks, 7 hurries, and 3 QB hits. 

    Outside of the obvious spate of injuries New England suffered this season, the need to upgrade their interior offensive and defensive line. Denver, a team that isn't even noted for interior play, dominated both fronts today. 

     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from JohnHannahrulz. Show JohnHannahrulz's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    They need Wilfork back and a young DT/DE. I mentioned Tuitt via the draft. I agree with this assessment ZB. Its almost as though the O Line needs How and Develin to pass block (and occassionally run block). I might also add that the Broncos have superior talent from their receiving corps (both Thomases et al). IMHO without Gronk this receiving corps is slightly above average. My not so educated guess is the management drafts or signs a TE.  I think both Dobson and Thompkins have potential, but this team has to be blatantly healthy to win in the playoffs.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    In response to JohnHannahrulz's comment:

    They need Wilfork back and a young DT/DE. I mentioned Tuitt via the draft. I agree with this assessment ZB. Its almost as though the O Line needs How and Develin to pass block (and occassionally run block). I might also add that the Broncos have superior talent from their receiving corps (both Thomases et al). IMHO without Gronk this receiving corps is slightly above average. My not so educated guess is the management drafts or signs a TE.  I think both Dobson and Thompkins have potential, but this team has to be blatantly healthy to win in the playoffs.



    By blatantly, I'd say average-ly. 

    Denver was missing one player of real, actual consequence. New England was missing three. 

    If I'm drafting I'm taking a Defensive Tackle, a Center, a TE, and a Guard in that order. Then I'm trying to sign a Wide Receiver from the FA pool, and doing what I can to eliminate the botched Danny Amendola contract. 

     

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from tanbass. Show tanbass's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    Bingo!! Lose in the trenches...lose every time regardless of skill players.

    They got smoked in the trenches all day today...on both sides.

    But I'm sure all the blame will go on the QB, RBs & WRs.........

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from joepatsfan111111. Show joepatsfan111111's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    very good points Z. no pass rush at all on Manning. and consistent Denver DLmen in our backfield..

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from m. a. pat. Show m. a. pat's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?


    D line as noted above no pressure on Manning. O line opened no holes for the running game. We've seen this story line the last few years in the playoffs.

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from donrd4. Show donrd4's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    In response to zbellino's comment:

    Another post-season game lost, and another game decided by sub par trench play. 

    New England was essentially dominated on both lines, 

    Not one sack, not one hurry, and not one QB hit. That is right. Manning was NOT touched today. 

    On the other side of the ball, an abysmal 2.3 ypc from the Blount and Ridley, and 2 sacks, 7 hurries, and 3 QB hits. 

    Outside of the obvious spate of injuries New England suffered this season, the need to upgrade their interior offensive and defensive line. Denver, a team that isn't even noted for interior play, dominated both fronts today. 

     


    So Denver sucks because they won with all the injuries Denver  had this year.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from JohnHannahrulz. Show JohnHannahrulz's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    Agree. I actually wanted a DT and guard in the 2012 draft (Jesse Williams in the 4th or 5th round red flag knee problems?). Hernandez was unforeseen. I think with Amendola the idea was a former Texas Tech WR who plays the same role as Welker. Problem is Amendola can't stay healthy and disappears at times (no seperation) and Welker seems to get more YAC.

    As my handle might indicate I am an ardent believer that you build from the line out. With a pocket passer you have to have O Linemen that can protect the QB (thought this since Bledsoe and probably Eason). Do you think the current O Line is better at pass blocking or run blocking?

     

    Naturally both would be ideal.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    The interiors of both lines need to be improved.  We also need receivers--TEs and outside receivers.  Secondary and LBs will need to be solidified too, with possible losses in free agency. 

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from CatfishHunter. Show CatfishHunter's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    Denver completely dominated the trenches the entire game.

    I think Andre Carter may have gotten to PM with a fingernail.   I'll watch the replay and get back to you Z.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:

    Denver completely dominated the trenches the entire game.

    I think Andre Carter may have gotten to PM with a fingernail.   I'll watch the replay and get back to you Z.



    I'll be waiting a LONG time. lol.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    The interiors of both lines need to be improved.  We also need receivers--TEs and outside receivers.  Secondary and LBs will need to be solidified too, with possible losses in free agency. 



    They seriously need to sell their soul this offseason. 

    What, another two, maybe three seasons with Brady out there? And even he is a depreciating asset at this point. 

    Bill Belichik needs to get creative ...  fast. 

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from zeitgeist49. Show zeitgeist49's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    The interiors of both lines need to be improved.  We also need receivers--TEs and outside receivers.  Secondary and LBs will need to be solidified too, with possible losses in free agency. 



    So you're saying the OL and DL need to be improved, we need much better receivers, and the LB corps and secondary needs to be revamped. Other than that we have no needs !  A few people on this board understand that BB has been an abject failure as a GM. Without TB and BB, an elite HC, the dearth of talent Belichick, the GM,  assembles every year would never make the playoffs.  Consider this. If  Brady retires after the 2016 season, he will have received 0 rings during his last 12 years. Not winning a Lombardi before TB retires is not a guarantee. But with our inept GM it sure looks like a good bet.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    This team has so many holes it is virtually impossible to fix them all in the next couple of years. It would take a miracle, and this GM doesn't do miracles (or he used them all up in the 6th round in 2000).

    He basically has been chasing his tail, making pick after pick to try and fix the previous bad picks, and still not fixing them. That's why he specializes in bad boys like Dennard and Talib. He has to go dumpster diving for food because he screws up buying the groceries.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from darwk. Show darwk's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    In response to m. a. pat's comment:


    D line as noted above no pressure on Manning. O line opened no holes for the running game. We've seen this story line the last few years in the playoffs.

     




    Yep. Last year same story wih different supporting cast on d and o.  Smoked.  Not good.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from m. a. pat. Show m. a. pat's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    In response to zbellino's comment:

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    The interiors of both lines need to be improved.  We also need receivers--TEs and outside receivers.  Secondary and LBs will need to be solidified too, with possible losses in free agency. 



    They seriously need to sell their soul this offseason. 

    What, another two, maybe three seasons with Brady out there? And even he is a depreciating asset at this point. 

    Bill Belichik needs to get creative ...  fast. 




    BB may unleash Jake Bequette next year and I think Adrian Wilson is still on the roster.

    I'm just being stupid but it's going to be tough to get the needed pieces in the off season.

     

     

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    In response to m. a. pat's comment:

    In response to zbellino's comment:

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    The interiors of both lines need to be improved.  We also need receivers--TEs and outside receivers.  Secondary and LBs will need to be solidified too, with possible losses in free agency. 



    They seriously need to sell their soul this offseason. 

    What, another two, maybe three seasons with Brady out there? And even he is a depreciating asset at this point. 

    Bill Belichik needs to get creative ...  fast. 




    BB may unleash Jake Bequette next year and I think Adrian Wilson is still on the roster.

    I'm just being stupid but it's going to be tough to get the needed pieces in the off season.

     

     



    No. You are not. It's going to be nearly impossible.

    BB has dug this team into a personnel hole. 

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from m. a. pat. Show m. a. pat's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    In response to zbellino's comment:

    In response to m. a. pat's comment:

    In response to zbellino's comment:

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    The interiors of both lines need to be improved.  We also need receivers--TEs and outside receivers.  Secondary and LBs will need to be solidified too, with possible losses in free agency. 



    They seriously need to sell their soul this offseason. 

    What, another two, maybe three seasons with Brady out there? And even he is a depreciating asset at this point. 

    Bill Belichik needs to get creative ...  fast. 




    BB may unleash Jake Bequette next year and I think Adrian Wilson is still on the roster.

    I'm just being stupid but it's going to be tough to get the needed pieces in the off season.

     

     



    No. You are not. It's going to be nearly impossible.

    BB has dug this team into a personnel hole. 




    Plus we've got an aging QB.

     

     

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctpat. Show ctpat's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    the team is extrremely young and in a very good position. brady is getting old, but with the young players getting experience and the returning injured players, the pats are in a great position. where are the huge holes?

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from m. a. pat. Show m. a. pat's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    In response to ctpat's comment:

    the team is extrremely young and in a very good position. brady is getting old, but with the young players getting experience and the returning injured players, the pats are in a great position. where are the huge holes?




    The young players are not blue chip players with the possible exceptions of maybe Jamie Collins and Dobson.

    I don't see Chris Jones, Vellano, Harmon, Thompkins, etc. as being difference makers.

    There are huge holes in the middle of the O line and D line. Can anyone count on either Talib or Gronk being injury free? Pats still need a better safety than Gregory and Amendola has been a big disapointment.

    Can Wilfork be expected to return to form from an achilles injury or Tommie Kelly still play as a 33 year old DT?

     

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    In response to ctpat's comment:

    the team is extrremely young and in a very good position. brady is getting old, but with the young players getting experience and the returning injured players, the pats are in a great position. where are the huge holes?



    Mankins is 31. Vollmer is chronically injured now. Ridley has been benched at least 3 times for fumbling. Vereen drops too many passes. Brady is going to be 37. Wilfork is to be 33 and trying to come back from a dreadful injury. Amendola is a disappointment. Edelman is a FA and extremely risky to throw big money at. Gronk has a blown out knee and has been an injury nightmare for years now. We need a better center. Talib is a china doll that may require big $$$ to keep. Dennard has been exposed this year. Arrington is a disaster. Spikes is as good as gone. Hightower is far from proven. Jones disappeared late in the season. The 3 rookie receivers were unreliable.

    Did I miss something? 

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from m. a. pat. Show m. a. pat's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?


    ^ +1 for what Babe said.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctpat. Show ctpat's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    i disagree i think chandler jones, collins, hightower, dennard, and ryan will be above average to elite players. mayo will be back, mccourty is very good, nink is as solid as they come. wilfork and kelly will be back.  i believe they bring talib back. we'll finally see what we have in armtead. the young d-line players thrown into the fire can serve as backups.

    i believe they could try to upgrade gregory who is a good back-up, not an ideal starter.

    I also agree wilfork's return to form is not a sure thing. 

    however, on the whole with the d really should be a strength of the team if they get talib back.

     

     

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctpat. Show ctpat's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to ctpat's comment:

    the team is extrremely young and in a very good position. brady is getting old, but with the young players getting experience and the returning injured players, the pats are in a great position. where are the huge holes?



    Mankins is 31. Vollmer is chronically injured now. Ridley has been benched at least 3 times for fumbling. Vereen drops too many passes. Brady is going to be 37. Wilfork is to be 33 and trying to come back from a dreadful injury. Amendola is a disappointment. Edelman is a FA and extremely risky to throw big money at. Gronk has a blown out knee and has been an injury nightmare for years now. We need a better center. Talib is a china doll that may require big $$$ to keep. Dennard has been exposed this year. Arrington is a disaster. Spikes is as good as gone. Hightower is far from proven. Jones disappeared late in the season. The 3 rookie receivers were unreliable.

    Did I miss something? 



    typical over-reaction. i agree brady's window is closing and wilfork's return to form is far from certian. however, i don't think dennard was "exposed," arrington is good when he is a 3rd corner, hightower appears to be getting better, jones made a big jump from year one and the three rookie wr's got valuable experience. 

     

    No question they had terrible injuries and the young players didn't always play like proven veterans, but assuming they all improve and we get back 3-4 starters next year, its hard to imagine them not being a much improved team. keeping in mind they were one game away from the superbowl.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from m. a. pat. Show m. a. pat's posts

    Re: Commitment to trench play?

    In response to ctpat's comment:

    i disagree i think chandler jones, collins, hightower, dennard, and ryan will be above average to elite players. mayo will be back, mccourty is very good, nink is as solid as they come. wilfork and kelly will be back.  i believe they bring talib back. we'll finally see what we have in armtead. the young d-line players thrown into the fire can serve as backups.

    i believe they could try to upgrade gregory who is a good back-up, not an ideal starter.

    I also agree wilfork's return to form is not a sure thing. 

    however, on the whole with the d really should be a strength of the team if they get talib back.

     

     




    Wilfork has 3 things going against him: age, severe injury and salary for next year. He's due 11.5 million next year but the Pats could save 8 million by releasing him. His roster spot next season is no guarantee by any means.

    Armstead is a big question mark as to whether he can even play at the NFL level.

    I don't think Nink scares any offense as a pass rusher. You've got higher expectations for Dennard and Ryan than I do.

    Talib will cost big money next year and with his injury history and past attitude issues can you trust him to be on the field for a whole season.

     

     
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