CONTRARIAN take: is EDWARD SNOWDEN a hero or a MANGINI?

  1. This post has been removed.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ArmyPatsFan. Show ArmyPatsFan's posts

    Re: CONTRARIAN take: is EDWARD SNOWDEN a hero or a MANGINI?


    Anyone who goes to an unfriendly country and starts giving classified information to their government is a traitor.  People don't understand just how many American and allied lives are put at risk by this degenerate's sleazy act.  I am sorry, but I cannot respect some one who tries to blow the whistle on something and then gives away secrets to an enemy. 

    This guy is just as guilty as Manning.  You don't seem to understand or care how this impacts the lives of Americans abroad, especially servicemen.  Snowden has been telling the Chinese about our hacking, and told them we've been at it for years.  Let me tell you something, the Chinese started hacking us two years prior to when he said we started hacking them.  I know, because their hacks altered how we had to do business in the US military.

    Do us all a favor, and before you start labelling some guy a hero, look at the second and third order of effects of their actions.  This guy, like the Wikileaks kid, is response for comprosing national security and it doesn't even register to you.  That is sad.

     
  3. This post has been removed.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ArmyPatsFan. Show ArmyPatsFan's posts

    Re: CONTRARIAN take: is EDWARD SNOWDEN a hero or a MANGINI?

    In response to ArmyPatsFan's comment:


    Anyone who goes to an unfriendly country and starts giving classified information to their government is a traitor.  People don't understand just how many American and allied lives are put at risk by this degenerate's sleazy act.  I am sorry, but I cannot respect some one who tries to blow the whistle on something and then gives away secrets to an enemy. 

    This guy is just as guilty as Manning.  You don't seem to understand or care how this impacts the lives of Americans abroad, especially servicemen.  Snowden has been telling the Chinese about our hacking, and told them we've been at it for years.  Let me tell you something, the Chinese started hacking us two years prior to when he said we started hacking them.  I know, because their hacks altered how we had to do business in the US military.

    Do us all a favor, and before you start labelling some guy a hero, look at the second and third order of effects of their actions.  This guy, like the Wikileaks kid, is response for comprosing national security and it doesn't even register to you.  That is sad.




    I meant to say "responsible for compromising national security." My apologies for my spelling errors.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from portfolio1. Show portfolio1's posts

    Re: CONTRARIAN take: is EDWARD SNOWDEN a hero or a MANGINI?

    In response to ArmyPatsFan's comment:

    In response to ArmyPatsFan's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     


    Anyone who goes to an unfriendly country and starts giving classified information to their government is a traitor.  People don't understand just how many American and allied lives are put at risk by this degenerate's sleazy act.  I am sorry, but I cannot respect some one who tries to blow the whistle on something and then gives away secrets to an enemy. 

    This guy is just as guilty as Manning.  You don't seem to understand or care how this impacts the lives of Americans abroad, especially servicemen.  Snowden has been telling the Chinese about our hacking, and told them we've been at it for years.  Let me tell you something, the Chinese started hacking us two years prior to when he said we started hacking them.  I know, because their hacks altered how we had to do business in the US military.

    Do us all a favor, and before you start labelling some guy a hero, look at the second and third order of effects of their actions.  This guy, like the Wikileaks kid, is response for comprosing national security and it doesn't even register to you.  That is sad.

     




    I meant to say "responsible for compromising national security." My apologies for my spelling errors.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    I wont dispute your points but I will say that this appears to be (potentially) one of those instances with more than one critical issue in play. Sometimes as possibly here there might be very good AND very bad aspects at the same time.

    When those who are adimant and single minded in their protection of the second amendment and the right to bear arms or those who identify Constitutional abuses of an administration (whether the administration is a Bush or an Obama administration) they sight the need for citizens to have the some means with which to protect against a government that has become tyranical. There is the real potential for dramatic abuse by government in this. Because the issues are by their nature secretive this sort of whistle blowing may be the only way for these sort of things to come out.

    So I am not insisting a stand one way or the other... but instead for us to see both the good and bad in what was done... in this case both by the government and by the whistle blower. These things are not mutually exclusive.

    I think we live in a world where things are often just not black and white and people are often not good OR bad but some mix or the two. We need to recognize that in order to properly deal with these issues. We need to separate, to untangle the different elements.

    I hope I have said this well enough to give others a reason to allow their take to be deeper and not simply a question of who wears the white hat and who the black.

     

     
  6. This post has been removed.

     
  7. This post has been removed.

     
  8. This post has been removed.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: CONTRARIAN take: is EDWARD SNOWDEN a hero or a MANGINI?

    What exactly did he blow the whistle on? That the government maintains an enormous amount of information on us? What, this is some sort of revelation? 

    This guy is an entitled punk who should be treated like the criminal he is. He didn't do anything heroic, he ran to the enemy. He should be treated medievally, drawn and quartered. 

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from NEGAME2. Show NEGAME2's posts

    Re: CONTRARIAN take: is EDWARD SNOWDEN a hero or a MANGINI?

    In response to Muzwell's comment:

    What exactly did he blow the whistle on? That the government maintains an enormous amount of information on us? What, this is some sort of revelation? 

    This guy is an entitled punk who should be treated like the criminal he is. He didn't do anything heroic, he ran to the enemy. He should be treated medievally, drawn and quartered. 

      


    Thank you Muzwell--I wish I could have expressed it as well as you.  I will just say he's a traitor!

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Brady2Moss07. Show Brady2Moss07's posts

    Re: CONTRARIAN take: is EDWARD SNOWDEN a hero or a MANGINI?

    He's a traitor. I would rather be protected against a terrorist attack. I have nothing to hide anyway

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: CONTRARIAN take: is EDWARD SNOWDEN a hero or a MANGINI?

    In no particular order Edward Snowden is, in my opinion:

    • naive
    • self-absorbed
    • criminal
    • traitorous

    There are, and have been for many years, internal mechanisms in place to voice concerns about processes, procedures, questionable practices, classification levels.  If he didn't want to pursue those avenues he could have written to his Congressman about his concerns.  Were he the patriot that he purports himself to be he wouldn't have hauled his pathetic a ss to Hong Kong.

     
  13. This post has been removed.

     
  14. This post has been removed.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from p-mike. Show p-mike's posts

    Re: CONTRARIAN take: is EDWARD SNOWDEN a hero or a MANGINI?


    A hero?

    I don't know about that, but I certainly wouldn't call him any kind of traitor, either.

    Our government has gone wildly out of control under the guise of "protecting' us from threats it is not willing to identify and if there is one thing I can say for certain about this guy is that -- hero or traitor -- he's either incredibly brave or not particularly bright to thumb his nose at an administration that has shown no compunction against droning its own citizens in foreign countries . . .

     . . .   and don't be too surprised if we start seeing the same thing right here at home in the not-too-distant future.

    I don't know that it's necessarily 1984 already, but leave us not forget that the country this used to be was founded by people who were "traitors."

     

     

    Now you listen here! He's not the Messiah . . .   he's a very naughty boy!



     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: CONTRARIAN take: is EDWARD SNOWDEN a hero or a MANGINI?

    In response to ImagydFanBostononTwitter's comment:

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In no particular order Edward Snowden is, in my opinion:

    • naive
    • self-absorbed
    • criminal
    • traitorous

    There are, and have been for many years, internal mechanisms in place to voice concerns about processes, procedures, questionable practices, classification levels.  If he didn't want to pursue those avenues he could have written to his Congressman about his concerns.  Were he the patriot that he purports himself to be he wouldn't have hauled his pathetic a ss to Hong Kong.



    o really, he's going to contact his jingoistic congress person who voted for the patriot act (most likely) and supports maximal secrecy? come on! thats the problem, when everything's a secret, there is nowhere to open up. u often have to FORCE openness. thats what he has done! whatever happened to all those WMDs that were absolutely in iraq anyways? perhaps someone should have leaked something back then as to what was really going on and the real reasons for imposing that war on the nation.

    [/QUOTE]

    Tough for you I know, but I'm wondering if we could stay on point here.  So I'll set aside the Iraq reference if it's all the same to you.   The issue is Edward Snowden and the actions he's taken.   Taking your argument to its logical conclusion:  so when someone who has been in his highly sensitive position all of 3 whopping months encounters something he disagrees with or does not fully comprehend it is a simply beautiful thing for him to simply go public with it.  This regardless of who he puts at risk, the level of damage that it may cause the nation or ignoring every possible recourse except disclosing highly classifed material to the world.  By that standard any individual, in any position, in any branch of government who holds a security clearance is free to do whatever he wishes with the material he has access to simply because he has become disillusioned and it's ok.  Got it.  Thanks.

     
  17. This post has been removed.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from JimfromFlorida. Show JimfromFlorida's posts

    Re: CONTRARIAN take: is EDWARD SNOWDEN a hero or a MANGINI?


    First let me say I have always known the Gov't is watching us anyone who believes other wise is a fool. Just look at history...back when Lincoln was President they had people on a watch list.

    CC he is NO HERO that I'd want any child to follow.

    He broke an OATH to maintain a TOP SECRET program. That is ILLEGAL a FELONY no if ands or buts.

    If he believed it was wrong going to China made his move, even if honestly/sincerly done, a major mistake. He should have gone to anyone here like a lawyer or congress person, etc....not China.

    If it what NSA was doing ends up being illegal it still will not make him right in what he did.

    If you do not agree with what you are doing or seeing you go through the right channels. As a DoD contractor this is something you learn right away as you are told it right up front. It does not say you go to China and make it public.

    What he has done is no different than what other spies have done over our history and NOT one them is considered a hero and most faced the right ending.

    People like Snowden do not keep the Gov't honest they are part of the problem.

    The only people who keep the Gov't honest are those of us who actually pay attention are involved and vote. To many people today vote the party line and support it even faced with facts that show them to be wrong and even lying. counter them.

    Today we have the IRS stuff and all Dems want us to believe that the guy in charge NEVER said anything about it in his 127 meetings in the WH. How stupid can you be to actually try and defend that. As well as still not knowing why we did not defend the 4 men killed in Benghazi. Hell even the families have not gotten an answer to that situation.

    Look how many supported and fought for Clinton and Bush all the time despite facts to the contrary. It is the US citizens issue to get involved.

     

     BTW comparing this to Mangini and the NFL is absolutely the most ludicrous and dumbest thing EVER POSTED HERE.

     

    Love the Red Sox and enjoy the ride every year

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from ghostofjri37. Show ghostofjri37's posts

    Re: CONTRARIAN take: is EDWARD SNOWDEN a hero or a MANGINI?

    In response to JimfromFlorida's comment:


    First let me say I have always known the Gov't is watching us anyone who believes other wise is a fool. Just look at history...back when Lincoln was President they had people on a watch list.

    CC he is NO HERO that I'd want any child to follow.

    He broke an OATH to maintain a TOP SECRET program. That is ILLEGAL a FELONY no if ands or buts.

    If he believed it was wrong going to China made his move, even if honestly/sincerly done, a major mistake. He should have gone to anyone here like a lawyer or congress person, etc....not China.

    If it what NSA was doing ends up being illegal it still will not make him right in what he did.

    If you do not agree with what you are doing or seeing you go through the right channels. As a DoD contractor this is something you learn right away as you are told it right up front. It does not say you go to China and make it public.

    What he has done is no different than what other spies have done over our history and NOT one them is considered a hero and most faced the right ending.

    People like Snowden do not keep the Gov't honest they are part of the problem.

    The only people who keep the Gov't honest are those of us who actually pay attention are involved and vote. To many people today vote the party line and support it even faced with facts that show them to be wrong and even lying. counter them.

    Today we have the IRS stuff and all Dems want us to believe that the guy in charge NEVER said anything about it in his 127 meetings in the WH. How stupid can you be to actually try and defend that. As well as still not knowing why we did not defend the 4 men killed in Benghazi. Hell even the families have not gotten an answer to that situation.

    Look how many supported and fought for Clinton and Bush all the time despite facts to the contrary. It is the US citizens issue to get involved.

     

     BTW comparing this to Mangini and the NFL is absolutely the most ludicrous and dumbest thing EVER POSTED HERE.

     

    Love the Red Sox and enjoy the ride every year



    That is saying something for this board but I would agree it could be the most laughable analogy made in quite some time in these parts.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rocky. Show Rocky's posts

    Re: CONTRARIAN take: is EDWARD SNOWDEN a hero or a MANGINI?

    So when does training camp open up?

       

                

     
  21. This post has been removed.

     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share