Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

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    Re: Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

    All comes down to one of the concrete differences between a conservative and a liberal - if a conservative does not like something, (a SUV, a firearm, etc.) the conservative does not aquire one; if a liberal does not like something, he wants them completely banned for everybody!

     
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    Re: Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

    No disrespect, AZPAT, but I'm done with this thread.  We see the issue differently and I'm fine with that.  

     
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    Re: Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

    Costas could have saved some grief on this thread and did his stump speech on MSNBC (eg; the place where you expect to hear it) as opposed to a football game.

     

    Murders are anomolies. They don`t happên often, therefore when they do, every one is kind of in a state of shock.

     

    Me personally, I have an uncle who owns a gun primarily for hunting critters on his farm and he has never shot anyone.

    This story is just horrorfic all around (orphaned child). And its one that obviously induces some very strident opinions. Not going there.

     
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    Re: Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

    In response to Mike-J-D's comment:

    I'm surprised so many people think the answer to so many guns is more guns.  How about we act like normal human beings and, you know, not point guns at each other?

    What do you think, if she owned a gun, that would have saved her?  You think he would have waited until she got hers to aim at her if she did?

    This is a cultural problem that we as a nation have.  That's the disease.  Guns being pulled are the symptom.




    I hope you feel the same way when 2 dudes on speed or crack break into your home with knives,baseball bats, whatever-good luck fending them off with your cutlery set of knives if you can get to them in your kitchen. I am proud to say I have a 12 gauge pump shotgun,(18 1/2  inch barrel), and a 38 Smith and Wesson,(3 1/2 inch barrel), locked and loaded right next to my bed with defense rounds in both,(along with my Hound/Pointer dog in the living room to sound the alarm),---I welcome the crazies that try and break into my house with bad intentions for me or the wife. Served in the Corps--1970s and am proud to be able to bear arms. I have had weopons all my life, raised 2 children and have never had to fire off at any time and I hope I don't ever have to. But I'd rather be Safe than sorry---and I aint apologizing for it!

     
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    Re: Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

    In response to 49Patriots' comment:

    In response to AZPAT's comment:

    Cultural problems: Abortion, legalization of marijuana, violence in movies and on TV, provacative dressing of young ladies (especially HS kids), more "takers" than "givers" (and society being OK with it), acceptance/multiple "another chance" for DUI (Hey! EVERYONE does it!)

    Which ones do you want to get rid of? Or, is "culture", or what should be acceptable in society, dependent on what you determine it to be?

    Noe, be careful! Some of these have been legislated, sort of like the 2nd amendment. Ought to be interesting.




    When are you guys going to secede?!! God, take Oklahoma, Alabama, Mississippi, Georgia and all those other clown states with you! Funny, the most advocate pro-gun Americans are usually Right-Wingers, but you list Liberal beliefs as the cause of gun violence.

    Abortions is no one's business, if you don't think it's right, don't do it! No one is force you to have an abortion! It's a choice between a woman and her doctor, not you and your bible and Authoritarian style of government!

    Marijuana is no more lethal to your brain than Alcohol, why don't we criminalize Alcohol again while we're at it, huh? How many times have you heard that a guy was so high from Marijuana that he started a fight in a bar...or drove high and killed someone? Why is it illegal? 

    Violence in movies and TV? Yeah, like Football? Should football be illegal?

    Provacative style of dress by young ladies? Dude, we're you born in the 50s or something? It's no one's business what a woman wants to wear! Funny how you're fighting for your second ammendment rights, but you're all for taking away someone's first ammenment rights.

    More takers than givers? The 47% of Americans who don't pay taxes consists of the elderly, veterans and people who manage to take advantage of tax breaks like child tax deductions. Funny how when coperations take advantage of loopholes they're wise. When average joes do it they're takers. The very few who don't pay taxes because they're poor live mostly in the South, Red States pay less in taxes than Blue states! The North East and West Coast keep America a float! The rest of you, red states, are the takers around here!

     

    It's too easy to get a gun, there are too many guns in the United States! Guns don't kill people, people kill people, right? But they kill more people with guns!

     




    That's an assumption--maybe these wackos would get creative and we would be holding our sharpest kitchen knife---LOL!!!

     
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    Re: Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

    In response to 49Patriots' comment:

    In response to TSWFAN's comment:

    In response to 49Patriots's comment:

    In response to TSWFAN's comment:

    Look at the gun violence in Mexico; look at the gun violence in the southside of Chicago; 70% and 90% respectively of those racists voted for Obama. It is obvious we have a culture/ values problem.




    I'm surprised it took one of you this long to pull the race card. Was it "culture and values" when the Colorado shooting happen? What about Columbine, Giffords shooting, Norway shooter or the Oklahoma bomber? No? Right....

     

    P.S... Mexico's crime mostly comes from the Cartel. The Cartel gets money, power, weapons and resources thanks to America's War on Drugs! In fact, the Cartel buys guns from the U.S. it's so easy!

    Typical...-_-




    Not to be cavalier about those massacres which were perpetrated by nuts, the "everyday" killings that I referred to are what passes for "normal" these days. We need some public hangings to " encourage"  people to behave




    Would you knock it off, there are Canadians on this board. They're going to think that all Americans are as silly as you.

    I'm telling you guys, I don't know why you guys hate the Taliban and other Muslim extremists so much. If you guys had your way, this would be the Christian version of Saudi Arabia.




    Owning a weapon doesn't make a person a Taliban type---using it for the wrong reasons does--get your head straight dude-you make NO sense!!!!!!

     
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    Re: Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

    In response to glenr's comment:

    In response to shenanigan's comment:

    In response to Salcon's comment:

    Oh by the way, I've heard every story about why people should own guns.  Other than hunting, they're all pretty weak.



    How about to form a militia.  The founding fathers didn't give a rip about hunting or self defense.  The 2nd amendment exists because of the history of nearly every government in the world becoming corrupt and oppressing the people. 

    When the British didn't like us not paying taxes and decided to march on down with their guns we didn't fight them off with sticks. 




    'well regulated' militia. It's called The National Guard.




    And if your Gov't who controls the Military decides to turn on it's people in the form of oppression-----we will fight them with knives and bats!!  C'mon Glen I know your educated--you have read some History books?

     
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    Re: Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    In response to shenanigan's comment:

    In response to glenr's comment:

    In response to shenanigan's comment:

    In response to Salcon's comment:

    Oh by the way, I've heard every story about why people should own guns.  Other than hunting, they're all pretty weak.



    How about to form a militia.  The founding fathers didn't give a rip about hunting or self defense.  The 2nd amendment exists because of the history of nearly every government in the world becoming corrupt and oppressing the people. 

    When the British didn't like us not paying taxes and decided to march on down with their guns we didn't fight them off with sticks. 




    'well regulated' militia. It's called The National Guard.




    According to you, but the 2nd ammendment existed before the National Guard.  It's safe to assume that if the founding fathers saw the National Guard as their idea of a well organized militia that was so critical to this country they put it in the constitution than they would have just gone ahead and created the National Guard.  They didn't.



    They didn't really like standing armies. The second amendment envisions a society where the military power (the weapons) are in the hands of the people, who are called to duty when war is declared, and then go back to their homes when it is over. We are so far from that vision now that talking about original intent when it comes to military policy or gun policy is absurd. The world just isn't the same as it was in the late eighteenth century. 

     




    Really--I want some of what your on? Are you serious in saying that we are so far from that---oh well you'll be easy pickings----it's ok now go back to sleep.

     
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    Re: Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:


    You keep comparing apples and oranges.

    Japan is 98.5% Japanese. Canada is similarly white. UK is 92% white.

    The racial disharmony in the US cannot be compared to these places. Add in the fact we have half as many illegal immigrants as the entire population of Canada and you are just missing the mark regarding what might work there vs what will work here.



    Now it comes out . . . it's all the blacks and hispanics . . . 

    If everyone was white there'd be no gun violence . . . 

    PS: Toronto is way more racially and ethnically diverse than Boston . . . and has a lower murder rate. 

     




    And also one of the most boring conservative cities in Canada--I prefer Montreal any day---and I've been to both and Toronto-Suks--sorry dude--not trying to hurt your feelings.

     
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    Re: Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

    In response to NY-PATS-FAN4's comment:

    In response to jerh5's comment:

    In response to NY-PATS-FAN4's comment:

    In response to TexasPat's comment:

    In response to NY-PATS-FAN4's comment:

    In response to TexasPat's comment:

    In response to Salcon's comment:

    Oh by the way, I've heard every story about why people should own guns.  Other than hunting, they're all pretty weak.



         Err...you think that protecting yourself, your home, and your family from burglars is a weak argument? LOL!!!



    Considering that far, far, far more people are hurt by gun accidents in the home vis a vis burglars shot by homeowners; yes, it is an extremely weak argument.

    Making it even weaker is that the average gun owner in a home, unless s/he has served in the military, has never shot a human being before. Those who have served know it is a VERY different experience than shooting at a range; the target is moving while your blood and adrenaline are pumping out of control.

    Further, if you're home is invaded by a burglar, that burglar is doing it on his time, not yours, while his senses are heightened whereas yours are dull. The intruder has the clear advantage of surprise; even moreso if he had the competence to reconnoiter your house beforehand. You stagger down the stairs in your bright, white T-shirt, while the burglar is dressed head-to-toe in black. If the burglar is armed, he likely does this for a living, which means he is likely to have been in this scenario before; likely to move more skillfully in the dark; likely to be more cool under pressure; and perhaps likely to have more firepower than you.

    If you have kids in you're home, then it is most likely that your weapon is locked away and not loaded. (If this is not the case, you're a damned fool just begging for a home accident, as children, above all else, are curious beyond curious.) While you're fumbling around getting your ammo in the gun, the burglar may get the bead on you. But, let's suppose you are quiet and fast. You run down the stairs and yell, "Freeze!" but the burglar, who is already prepard for a conflict, has scounted out the best defense position from gunfire. He dives; you shoot and miss, creating a big noise. The burglar returns fire from behind the kitchen island.  Bullets are now flying, which of course is when your six-your-old, frightened by strange noise, saunters in the room and calls out, "Daddy?"

     

    Still, most gun advocates on this board--at least, those who have never shot at a human being--will continue to advocate this "protect my home" position. And that, right there, is the biggest problem with guns. Very few of us would pick a fist fight with Brandon Spikes, but a gun gives a man who is overmatched in a fight the false courage to believe he is on equal standing. The sands of Iraq are littered with such Iraqis.

    You are far better off to have a good lock system for your doors and windows; an alarm system with piercing sound; lights illuminating the perimeter of your house...and, if all that fails, a calm demeanor and the good sense to know that your family is more important than your valuables, and you are statistically much more likely to hurt yourself or your family members than to actually take out a skilled burglar.



         Sorry...I'm not going to risk putting the well being of my family in the hands of a "skilled" burglar. I'd much rather shoot the bum right between the eyes...

    And that is noble. But very few people can pull this off. Most end up hurting their families.

    then rely on his humanity. Besides, how many burglars are of the Alexanderl Mundy/skilled persuasion? The majority are thugs belonging to gangs, or drug users.

    Problem is, you don't know who he is. But he may know everything about you.

    With so many servicemen coming home from Iraq/Afghanistan without future prospects, both crime and suicide amongst vets is rising dramatically. If a guy who survived Iraq breaks into your house, chances are, you ain't taking him out, no matter how well intended you are.

     

     


     I can guarantee you my chances would be a lot better with a gun, than without.

     




    Words spoken by many a fallen hero.

     




    And it's those fallen heroes that have given you the freedom to your free speech----May they ALL rest in peace and let's thank them for the Liberties we have in this Country---even if they are being taken away daily by our Greedy Gov't.

     
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    Re: Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

    In response to ccsjl's comment:

    Time to leave this forum for Rimfirecentral....thats right a gun forum...




    Best gut laugh I've had all day--thanks ccsjl-----gotta go now me and the wife need to go to Cabelas and buy some more AMMO for the weapons! Looking at a nice 30-06 also, trying to convince the wife, 5 guns aint enough honey.

     
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    Re: Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

    In response to Quagmire3's comment:

    Only a liberal would automatically assume "gun fight." Just owning a gun may have been deterrent enuff for the fool to think twice before drawing down on her.



    Wow!  So you've pretty much sized me up based on my assessment of your post.  With all due respect you:

    *Know zippo about me except that I responded to your post.  And if I were a liberal (which I am not) so what?  Because I wouldn't think the same way that you do makes me somehow wrong automatically?

    *Posted the words 'defend herself'.  That's not deterrence that's using the firearm for its intended purpose - killing another individual.

    *Presuming rational thought on Belcher's part otherwise you wouldn't have used the term 'deterrent' in your last post.



    A firearms intended purpose is not to kill another individual but rather for hunting, target shooting, clay busting, and self defense, as well as just plain exercising your 2nd Ammendment right to protect yourself against any and all oppressors/aggressors. Let me put it in a simple form for you. Lets say there were two cities side by side: city A nobody is allowed to own a gun, city B everyone must own a gun for protection. Now  lets say you are a thief and break into houses for a living. Which city are you going to burglarize? City A where posessions are ripe for the taking or city b where you may get your head blown off by a homeowner protecting his property? Obviously the "Peoples Republic of Massachusetts" would be city A. 

     




Very well stated Quagmire-and if anti-gun people on this board can't understand your point they never will. BTW stop dissing Mass - I was born there-left in 1978 and moved to Montana and now live in Idaho--fell in love with the West after visiting my brother in Montana upon getting released from the Marine Corps. Believe it or not there are people in Mass that own shotguns and rifles,(pistols you need a concealed permit which is almost impossible to get). I've been trying to convince my two other brothers to buy some guns-but to no luck--hey I tryed---at least my brother in Kalispell Mt gets it and has multiple guns. Go Pats -- this has been a great topic to kill time before the big Monday game!

 
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    Re: Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    In response to ccsjl's comment:

    Nobody here mentioned the fact that Arab owned convienience stores have the lowest robbery rate, simply because they have a reputation for having an arsenal under the front counter. If a criminal knows he may face an armed store or home owner, he is not coming to rob you... 

    P.S. Where is the NY guy answering my response that I have no problem with Bill Koch and his Sherman tank in the driveway a few miles down the road???



    Where do you get your data?




    Prolax--good luck with all those Muslims that Canada has been so liberally letting into your Country. When they decide to go all Jihad on your as_ because you won't pray to Mecca 6 times a day and make your wife wear a face covering mask, your going to wish you had something besides a butter knife. Ehh!

     
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    Re: Costas uses the Jevon Belcher tregedy to preach gun control at halftime........

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

     

     I'll just add that I think it's rather callous to say "it's a small price to pay for our liberty" or "it's nothing to wring hands about."  If it was your daughter who was murdered in front of you or mowed down in a movie theatre, I suspect you'd feel a bit differently. If the US could get its firearms death rate more in line with the firearm death rates of similarly advanced nations, there'd be about 15,000 or 20,000 fewer parents every year in the situation Ms. Perkins is in.  Is that trivial? I think not. 

     

    If you can come down of your high horse for a minute you might realize that it just apparently isn't sinking in to you that the situation in the USA is simply not the same as it is in Austria for example. Considering the profound difference between the structure of the legal system in the US and those countries you champion the difference is in fact trivial. The ability of the federal government to shove gun control down a states throat is questionable legally and not well supported in principle.

    If Alaskans through their representatives want lax gun laws then I as a Bay Stater am going to honor that because I believe in states rights and do not possess the liberal agenda to homogenize the nation and expand federal oppression.

    You can moan all you like about the freedom the several states are allowed to have in determining how the people there want to do things, but it won't change the fact that 1.7 more homicides per 100k is a trivial number when weighed against the right to self determination. Are Arizonans stupid to not have stricter gun laws? Maybe so. But I sure as hell defend their right to determine that rather than have it dictated to them by a guy from Toronto.



    I know those 1.7 homicides are trivial to you, but I have a 19 year-old nephew who's doing 20 years right now.  The kid he shot two years ago is dead.  Honestly my nephew isn't really a bad kid.  Just too much testosterone and a too easily available high-capacity firearm. 

     




    Right. Convicted murderers aren't "bad kids". It's the evil gun that did it.

    I'm saying the 1.7 are trivial in relation to the larger issue of allowing states to determine their own laws.

     

    I'm also saying you repeatedly compare apples and oranges.



    I'm just saying there are real people behind those statistics. 




    You just made the point for guns--"there are real people behind the statistics". And all the while I thought the gun shot by itself with no person pulling the trigger! How stupid of me! LOL

     
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